'Attack of the AI' III
- Thread starter Ian Phillips
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This is just plain wrong.
They absolutely do have mods - just not *weapons* mods (they can still have up-rated thrusters, shields, shield boosters, armour etc).
"The only action that we’ve taken so far has been to remove the engineer weapons to allow us to investigate the issue and address a key bug. "
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Being mainly a trader I was happy with the old system, where I could just burn away and low wake out in the past. Granted, it was *too* easy, but these new chain interdictions are wayyyy over the top. People may define "fun" differently, and it seems the l337 combat pros have most fun when people who are NOT into combat have a miserable experience so they can tell them to learn to play, but I don't define trying to get away from pimped uber-NPC-pirates who don't even accept me dropping cargo for them as fun (or insist on me dropping cargo when I am empty...). Make NPCs that you actually seek out to kill as hard as you like. Add insane rewards there, too, for all I care. Just don't spoil the game for the casual non-combat people for no other reason than "*I* think *you* have it too easy".
I know, I know, everyone *has* to like combat, and has to like it your way, but I still don't. I am happy being rated harmless.
There's some sound escape tactics in this thread though which I'll try. So far my best bet was to just log out and back into a different game mode whenever I saw a "Hurr hurr, I'll keel you!" message.
I know, I know, everyone *has* to like combat, and has to like it your way, but I still don't. I am happy being rated harmless.
There's some sound escape tactics in this thread though which I'll try. So far my best bet was to just log out and back into a different game mode whenever I saw a "Hurr hurr, I'll keel you!" message.
hold your horses fella - try the suggested things before you claim we're all top guns - we're really really really not.
Please don't be disingenous - no one's said "everyone *has* to life combat, and has to like it your way" - people are doing their best to be productive and helpful
It is kinda confusing :/ I've taken it as all mods - and that's what I've experienced in game pretty much
Please don't be disingenous - no one's said "everyone *has* to life combat, and has to like it your way" - people are doing their best to be productive and helpful
yet also
It is kinda confusing :/ I've taken it as all mods - and that's what I've experienced in game pretty much
Personally I don't flee from a damn thing when I'm in a combat ship. Well OK maybe a wing full of Elite Vultures with railguns or something but not a single ship. However I don't think it's remotely reasonable for me to expect to get interdicted by something like an Elite FDL or FAS and just rinse it when I'm flying my trade Anaconda, my exploration Asp or any number of other ships which aren't combat fitted.
This is actually the heart of the whole problem - that the game did unfortunately make that scenario possible for way, way too long.
I can't begin to grasp how people can feel that a situation where supposedly full combat build ships flown by supposedly Elite rated npc pilots were basically just bags of credits floating in space waiting for us to pick up in whatever banged-up old junker we might have been flying at the time. They were never supposed to be just a bit of scenery to make you feel more involved whilst flying around.
As I said last night I had a total of four interdictions whilst flying back into the bubble in a lighlty shielded ship with no weapons and one of them nearly resulted in disaster and a rebuy. I actually commented to a mate in chat that at last the game is providing the experience it's supposed to - it felt much more realistic, I had a sense of genuine danger. I still haven't lost a ship since 2.1 went live, but that was the closest I've come to losing once since about February this year.
You say running is boring - I'd have to counter that by saying that my previous feeling of near-immortality wasn't particularly thrilling.
You know how people post that infuriating 'git gud' nonsense? I won't do that, I don't really think much of people who just decry other players abilities without trying to help them. What a lot of people do need to do though, judging from the complaints I see on the forums is 'git tactically aware'.
Something else I don't have time for though is people who expect to be able to fly around in a type 7 full of valuable cargo and expect to be just left alone, or presented with what amounts to a 60 second animated sequence in which they see themselves effortlessly destroy an npc and collect a gold star. There's a difference between being a super-ace pilot and being just adequate at the game, not everybody can be the ace (I sure as hell aren't) but everybody can be adequate and that's all it needs to avoid these constant rebuys.
People have offered loads of advice in this thread and others. I'm hitting the point now where the remaining players who just refuse to take it are increasingly less of a concern to me and my inclination to continue trying to provide some help is diminishing by the day because we seem to be down to the ones who really do think they're playing Euro Truck sim. This game is set in a fairly brutal galaxy over 1,000 years in the future. That's your starting point for working out what is and isn't reasonable in terms of gameplay mechanics. If you have valuable stuff in your ship bad people want to kill you and steal it.
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Believe me, do what I suggested in my post on the previous page (or if you feel brave, the suggestion in the post after mine) and you'll never get chain interdicted again.
I definitely don't think everyone has to like combat by the way. I do think everyone has to accept that it's present in the game though, which is exactly why it's important to learn the techniques to avoid and survive it if it's not the focus of your own gameplay. Good luck.
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But you're still near-immortal as long as you're not in a Sidey (or a Type9). You submit and hi-wake, usually you survive, just like before.
And to be clear, the issue is not about being interdicted by an Elite FdL which forces your trade conda to flee.
The issue is that you're constantly being interdicted.
It's okay to flee if you're in a trade ship. But it's still not fun to process the same escape routine at (almost) every jump. It's just boring.
This constant interdiction has been there from pretty much day one. It's just that 1/ before 1.4 you could try to break the interdiction, 2/ if in a not too badly fitted ship, you could try to fry your interdictor from time to time, to break escape the routine. Like "okay, it's an Asp, my Cobra should be able to take it".
Now unless it's a novice Sidey you're in for a world of hurt. I've seen Cobras (Mk3) break 450mj of 4pipped shields in 5 seconds. This is artificial difficulty as its finest, and as much as you may like it, many people don't find it fun in the slightest.
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But you know how to fly your ship and probably deserve that Elite ranking. ^^
Flying skill has nothing to do with it. HBK is claiming that 450mj of shields with 4 pips will drop in under 5 seconds, there is not a single NPC Cobra build that can do that, no matter what the rank, an Elite Vulture NPC build couldn't even pull that off.
I would agree If he said 0 or even 2 pips.
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What are you calling 'constant'. I'm assuming that you don't mean chain interdictions by the same npc as a result of repeatedly going back to supercruise but separate interdictions by different npcs?
I had cargo in my Asp (so to speak) last night and had a total of five interdictions in I think 35 jumps. I don't think that's excessive, so are you seeing a higher proportion than that? Are you always carrying high value cargo? Always flying through anarchy systems with wars raging in them? Pledged in powerplay?
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Exactly. And they have it "configured proper" too, their common phrase.
Basically, here are where many of us that are complaining are at ...
- Worth only 50-150M total
- Ranked around Competent, no higher than Expert or Master at best, because
- We are not doing combat, but getting hit before we can even start to react
- We have little to no engineering upgrades yet, still
- Grinding up on upgrades, as well as for money to get to your level, also ...
- Running with 5-6 components for mining and/or trading, which you're not, while ...
- Even if internals are largely A-spec, plus we have good weapons, and ...
- Running with around shields 300-450, which ...
- Can very much be taken down in well under 5 seconds!!!
- Yes, 2.1.02 ... it was only around 1 second prior to 2.1.02, and we're ...
- Still seeing heat and impulse attacks when we logon in 2.1.02
- All before a cell can be used, which takes even longer to work now
- And cell banks for miners/traders take away from other components, plus
- Required heat stinks take away from Shield Boosters, so we usually only have a single 0A
- Because we also carry Point Defense and other things, because we'd prefer to run
- All while our jump range keeps going down so "loaded up"
- And we lose not only have a 5M+ insurance claim when destroyed, which we cannot afford, but
- Lots of lost cargo (trading) or time (mining)
It's great you have lots of size and space in those larger ships, as well as the money to afford the insurance. It's great that you used the first 1-2 years to grind up to those levels, and we're "pathetic" in comparison. So for those of us "pathetic" players who spend 1+ years to get to 100M, and we're still there, because we play infrequently and don't grind as hard as you guys.
We've checked out.
It's your game now ... not ours.
That's the one thing we can both agree on!
You guys have totally made your point ... you don't care about us at all.
Case-in-point ...
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i dont know what the fuss is about... i fly a conda.. no shields and no weapons and a single chaff all the time taking powerplay documents etc to destinations... i get interdicted countless times.. sometimes i win the interdiction mini game sometimes i dont... during normal space where the FSD cooldown is at maximum i still manage to out-manuovre and limit the damage to 20%-75% against a FAS.. and escape... as annoying as the interdictions are... i certainly dont CRY about it being too hard.. or throw all my toys out of the COT like some...
I never have my back to a Enemy, im constantly turning towards the opponent, to get myself into a blindspot til the cooldown is finished, this is a simple tactic a sensible pilot would do...
and yes i have died twice... not with my Conda but in a civil-war with a decent rated Python... but heLL i expected it.. in a
combat zone and paid the price for going in alone trying to complete missions for factions,
But this Whole Crybaby attitude toward the game simply being to hard im not playing anymore, NEEDS TO STOP
I never have my back to a Enemy, im constantly turning towards the opponent, to get myself into a blindspot til the cooldown is finished, this is a simple tactic a sensible pilot would do...
and yes i have died twice... not with my Conda but in a civil-war with a decent rated Python... but heLL i expected it.. in a
combat zone and paid the price for going in alone trying to complete missions for factions,
But this Whole Crybaby attitude toward the game simply being to hard im not playing anymore, NEEDS TO STOP
OH so that's why people have spend EIGHTY PAGES trying to help people work out what's going wrong.
Seems well founded in fact. You still don't seem to be listening at all though as it's been repeatedly explained to you why you're still seeing heat/impulse attacks and you've just ignored it.
I'm still flying an asp, still under 100Mcr including kit, still no combat expert and still not died since first week of play. Still never used a SCB.... tried a booster, meh. There's thread after thread now of people who have adapted. Lost interest in repeating the same advice, which is a shame as people with genuine problems may miss out
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Try a Python, be Expert and Mine/Trade where you're giving up components, and a 5M+ insurance claim every time you die (sorry, but the Asp barely 1-2M).
I've watched 10+ hours of video just the past week, got on, and I'm still having the marginalized experiences that people like yourself don't want to admit. Python 6A+0A Booster shields down in 4 seconds, FSD taken out within 1 second after shields down, dead in another 3-4. Too many insurance claims to count now.
This will be my last post, as I won't be attempting the game until later in the year. I have very limited time to game, and the last 12 hours have been pure frustration with nearly half of my total worth lost in insurance claims and not 1 mission completed.
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If that's happening to you every time then is there a bug report thread if you believe you're experiencing super-weapons/NPCs?
They can tell you how to put on the verbose logging and npc tracking, then you can shut all of us up and laugh in our faces as we apologise.
Case-in-point? He has no point... Despite playing the game since release I fly in a 480mj equipped Type-9, my combat rank is only expert despite playing this game for so long, have posted videos showing that the freighter build can successfully fight back and destroy Elite ships.. Let's put fighting aside before someone starts complaining about being told to 'Git Gud' The point of the videos I posted was to demonstrate that 400mj + shielding with 4 pips can not only survive a high wake, but can handle a tremendous amount of punishment for a prolonged period.
I have posted numerous videos to prove it, the majority of 'NPC's are OP' posts here just pull things out of the air and claim it as fact.
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I haven't said anything about configuring or upgrading your ship. I haven't even said something along the lines of 'learn how to fight properly'.
Believe it or not, but some of us actually fly smaller and medium ships, too. So we can understand the struggle of smaller ship owners, too.
I lost my Corvette and my Python several times to the new AI, simply because I wasn't used to the AI.
But you can evade up to 80% of the damage an NPC does with the corkscrew while you're charging your FSD. If the ship masslocks you either highwake or if the factor is low enough, take the risk and lowwake.
I never said you're pathetic because you have 'only' 100 million after owning the game for one year. What's pathetic is a guy getting destroyed by the AI while flying in a straigt line and then crying on the forums afterwards.
You have lateral thrusters, USE them. It's not like the AI has an aimbot or 100% accuracy if you actually try to dogde.
Edit: What about chaff or ECM? They're probably more useful than shieldboosters if your ship has weak shields anyway.
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This was pretty much my only change to flying in 2.1. I'd done it before by instinct, learnt that I didn't have to as the NPCs were so stupid you could just fly in a straight line and not worry - and the first few post-buff attacks went badly wrong for me as I failed to dodge, then tried dodging by just changing direction - then I started using my thrusters and rolling and it became pretty much easy again
With the xbox controller setup I have no horizontal thruster control so learning roll+thrust was critical, and so far entirely satisfactory
Heres something for the ones losing Millions on Insurance-rebuys..
The more expensive the module you have attached to your ship, the higher the cost of insurance rebuy, this also applies to ships..
If one decides to upgrade and have ALL A-rated modules onboard, expect to be paying the cost in Insurance..
if you wish to mitigate your losses, you have 2 choices
1 dont get Killed in expensives ships
2 Learn to be a better Pilot
The more expensive the module you have attached to your ship, the higher the cost of insurance rebuy, this also applies to ships..
If one decides to upgrade and have ALL A-rated modules onboard, expect to be paying the cost in Insurance..
if you wish to mitigate your losses, you have 2 choices
1 dont get Killed in expensives ships
2 Learn to be a better Pilot
And you had the money to replace them, right? Because if you can afford a Corvette, you're well beyond us.
Apparently not in my case. Chaff and corkscrew doesn't work for me. Furthermore ...
I use lateral thrusters, but it also takes away from forward speed, so I have to vary. Trying to keep the enemy 2km away at the same time as boosting and corkscrewing means lateral is going to let him get closer. So I cannot keep lateraling all the time.
Also doesn't matter if I'm mining and he jumps and and takes my shields down in seconds, well before I can even get away from the mass lock of the field. I don't think you guys realize that we're dead any more, even if we're 0.1Ls away from the nearest RES. They find us, and take us out. We can never, ever escape!
I know, but some people have been saying most of us should be well beyond that. I'm running into a lot of anecdotal evidence that those of us with 50-150M credits, who have upgraded to a Python or similar ship beyond an Asp, but not quite an Anaconda, are seeing a lot of constant Dangerous/Deadly/Elite combat ships on us over and over again.
Which explains the problem. You guys assume that's what we do. I've lateraled all over the place, rolled, kicked off chaff, and saw him close. So I try to pace my laterals now, but it really doesn't matter.
Keeping him 2km+ away just means it takes him 10-15s to take down my shields, instead of under 5s. Usually that's not enough for the FSD cool down, or if I submit, to cool down faster and jump back out, whether local system (mass lock, although if I can keep him 2km+ away, usually not) or far (no mass lock). Either way, I die ... and the RNG/chance is almost beyond laughable.
I think my favorite will be getting nearly full FSD charge and him hitting my FSD at 89% hull.
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