BAN THE FSS OR MAKE AN ALTERNATIVE

[-VR- Max Factor]

Just like the "Advanced Discovery Scanner" functioned; just add it to the FSS.

I've tried doing exploration with the "Basic Discovery Scanner" in the first few months of Elite (where you have to watch for parallax and move close in to honk again) and that lasted for one system until I had to stop exploring due to agony and boredom.
What the ADS did was, upon a honk, reveal all bodies in the starsystem on the system map, and their locations in your lefthand in-cockpit navigation pane - but no detail information like planet type, terraformability, or a description -- just the basic mass/radius/period/semi-major axis.
You had to learn to match the texture of the planets for each type, and guesstimate if you wanted to spend time moving over to it to discover it properly.
And, of course, pros at exploration could eyeball the "goldilocks zone" for ELW's and TF'ables based on semi major axis and star class.


Just adding back in the ADS functionality that, upon a honk, will get us a system map filled in with the planet's images - and their locations added in the left-hand navigation pane won't change how the FSS works. It's not a negative in any way.
Folks that just honk and look at the map will miss out on the FSS gameplay and not being able to quickly find out all the new interesting stuff -- but that's their problem.

The OP is not really into playing Elite (nor the ADS/FSS debate) but rather into getting the largest pagecount on his troll threads - and the OP is especially into mining NaCl from the comments and/or rage within these threads.


The more then I think about it, analyzing my own current exploration flow, is that adding back in the ADS feature would be an excellent move.
It really does add a lot to augment the FSS gameplay. I'd love to have it back in. That single ADS feature makes exploring much faster.

It's trivial to implement, it adds back in the visual overview of the system prior to the FSS detail hunt.
It's a win-win to implement - those who prefer to the old system get to have their old gameplay back, and it doesn't impact the new gameplay at all!

---

And yes, as Varonica mentioned, the FSS should quickly tell us if there are or aren't bio/geo/other POIs. It shouldn't crunch the quantity of POIs - that aggravatingly slows gameplay down by a lot.
It needs to hide the BIG zoom errors; because it blocks visual information that is crucial for quick gameplay.

Fixing these two issues would polish the FSS experience to a mirror shine, and adding the ADS basic functionality to the FSS would instantly placate those that have issues with the FSS while aiding those that don't.

No, I like the idea of adding back in the baseline ADS functionality: It serves everyone and harms noone.

For you yes. For me it would ruin the whole idea of using the FSS which is actually finding these places myself. What would be the point in finding stuff with the FSS if your nav computer already has the pin point locations of each body. It would destroy it in one fell swoop, so that is a massive no from me.

I would be happy with a mutually exclusive system. Have an ADS or the FSS, but not both. Having both over powers both systems. I am also happy to have the BDS/IDS/ADS added with some funtionality, but they have some drawbacks. So the people that don't have those will get some kind of benefit.

 

[O'Roarke]

You are WRONG.

This is what the OP wants, Old Duck!
They're probably eating their Cheetos and guzzling their Mountain Dew as they're reading this exchange of emotions!

---

I have stated I all wanted to state, and explained my point of view in detail.

It's clear as glass that adding in the ADS functionality...

• Doesn't negatively impact the FSS gameplay at all
• Can only enhance FSS gameplay (if one takes a look at the system map post honking)
• Fits the "polish phase" of Elite in 2019-2020
• Is a win-win scenario
• Putting this in the first polish update would be perfect!

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

This is what the OP wants, Old Duck!
They're probably eating their Cheetos and guzzling their Mountain Dew as they're reading this exchange of emotions!

---

I have stated I all wanted to state, and explained my point of view in detail.

It's clear as glass that adding in the ADS functionality...

• Doesn't negatively impact the FSS gameplay at all
• Can only enhance FSS gameplay (if one takes a look at the system map post honking)
• Fits the "polish phase" of Elite in 2019-2020
• Is a win-win scenario
• Putting this in the first polish update would be perfect!

You are wrong. Sorry.

It maybe good for you, but would completely destroy the FSS for me. Using the FSS would become busywork.

 

[Red Anders]

Using the FSS would become busywork.

> implying that it's something other than busywork now

 

[Old Duck]

This is what the OP wants, Old Duck!

And I want world peace and a Tesla Roadster

They're probably eating their Cheetos and guzzling their Mountain Dew as they're reading this exchange of emotions!

I'm scanning planets with the FSS while reading all this nonsense. Your point?

It's clear as glass that adding in the ADS functionality...

• Doesn't negatively impact the FSS gameplay at all
• Can only enhance FSS gameplay (if one takes a look at the system map post honking)
• Fits the "polish phase" of Elite in 2019-2020
• Is a win-win scenario
• Putting this in the first polish update would be perfect!

It DOES negatively impact the FSS. The current system of showing planets that are "in the database" (previously discovered) while leaving undiscovered, unscanned planets invisible is a very valuable tool! To the person who knows what they are doing, the absence of planets in the system map tells us just as much as the presence of planets.

Now for me and many others, making the ADS a separate, optional module gives the OP what he wants while allowing me to keep what I want. People who want the entire system map revealed, like a tourist grabbing a map from a gas station, can have this by installing the ADS (if Frontier chooses this), while people like me who use the "fog of war" to actually enhance our exploration gets to keep this very valuable feature.

So your original statement "It serves everyone and harms noone." is wrong by the very fact that I say it is wrong - it hurts me, and that alone is enough to invalidate your claim.

 

[Burke]

Now for me and many others, making the ADS a separate, optional module gives the OP what he wants while allowing me to keep what I want.

Which is the obviously correct way to fix this. If only FD were listening.

Red Anders if you want the ADS back go tell them in the announcemnt thread. They asked for feed back and questions, go tell your opinion. For what its worth. Same thing, O'Roarke.

 

[Burke]

Nice try, but more rubbish.

I read this far and stopped caring. I came to my conclusion by reading peoples posts on here. So many people praising the FSS had to be told how it actually worked outside the bubble.

When we ask "who is to blame" yes we must look outside this forum. Gratz to a carefully managed reddit thats manged to scew up a game. Not the first time is it?

 

[O'Roarke]

For you yes. For me it would ruin the whole idea of using the FSS which is actually finding these places myself. What would be the point in finding stuff with the FSS if your nav computer already has the pin point locations of each body. It would destroy it in one fell swoop, so that is a massive no from me.

How the ADS functioned prior to the last update was that it shows the baseline data like mass/size/semi-major axis/orbital period and show the location for you in the nav panel.
But it wouldn't tag those bodies as discovered. This information won't be sold to Universal Cartographics either; it's only visible to you, the player who honked.
You had to fly near them and focus them for a while - before you properly discovered them and got them tagged.

Now the FSS is a massive improvement on that; and really aids you in quickly tagging a complete system.
That's the advantage of the FSS over the old system. The other "advantage" is that the FSS is required to find all the juicy new stuff like NSPs or POIs.

And the addition of those NSPs and POIs to the game, incidentally, are the reason people are "exploring MORE systems and flying to more planets" today -- not the FSS. It's just the tool to expose them. Which the ADS won't ever do.

No, it's clear as glass to me, on a rational level, that the ADS and FSS can be merged without any drawback.
I understand that there will always be folks that disagree. I can only agree on the fact that we disagree.

And exposing the ADS functionality with an optional internal module, like it used to be, sure. That would be a pain to re-implement because afaik FDev deleted the module from the game and from thus from everyone's ship. So explorers out there with, from their POV, a "broken game" will need to have that ADS module magically returned to them.

Now I'll have to get back to my exploration run in Kepler's Crest, into the Formidine Rift.
Where I really could've benefitted from the merging of ADS and FSS! o7

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

> implying that it's something other than busywork now

Ere for me yes.

Busywork means: work that keeps a person busy but has little value in itself.

Whether you get any value from it from a gameplay view is purely subjective. The information you get from using the FSS is most certainly valuable if you want to explore the system, so in that regard it is most certainly not busywork.

But if you mean monetary value, then all games are busywork as all they do is take money away from you and are of not any real monetay value for the average gamer.

Personally I get a lot of gameplay value from using the FSS, so no it isn't busywork for me, and I find the information I get from it very useful in the way I want to explore the system, so again not busywork for me.

Anything else you want to be put straight about?

 

[O'Roarke]

And I want world peace and a Tesla Roadster

I'll take 0-100kph in 1.9s, but prefer it for a lot less then 250k€!

The current system of showing planets that are "in the database" (previously discovered) while leaving undiscovered, unscanned planets invisible is a very valuable tool!

I think this is the baseline issue between the ADS/FSS groups.
The ADS exposes all bodies in a system to your nav panel and your system map.
It does not tag them, or expose them, for any other commander.

What I mean with my "clear as glass" suggestion is that this data does not get shown in your FSS.
You still get to do the FSS dance with finding signals and teasing them open like you do now.

It's not like you get everything handed to you on a platter in the FSS, as if it were a prediscovered and tagged system.

If that's the issue FSS proponents and anti-ADS folks have with my line of reasoning I hope the above clears that up.
Because having that ADS functionality spoil the joy of teasing things open in FSS is something that I don't want either.

 

[Burke]

Either that or somebodys pride is dented that we dont all love the monsterous thing

I tire of tiptoeing around it considering the pointed lack of acknowlagement over the last few months. We know who is to blame and by the sour look on his face at that gentle ribbing im just gonna say, cant take the critisim. Well its terrible, boring poor quality work and having been given the choice of "adapt or leave" it is so bad that i have infact left the game, but not yet the forums.

 

[Old Duck]

I tire of tiptoeing around it considering the pointed lack of acknowlagement over the last few months. We know who is to blame and by the sour look on his face at that gentle ribbing im just gonna say, cant take the critisim. Well its terrible, boring poor quality work and having been given the choice of "adapt or leave" it is so bad that i have infact left the game, but not yet the forums.

So what you're saying is, it's safe for the rest of us to add you to our ignore list, since you're not playing the game and your only purpose is to tell the world over and over and over again (system scan complete) that the FSS is "terrible, boring poor quality work" and a "monsterous thing".

 

[Burke]

So what you're saying is, it's safe for the rest of us to add you to our ignore list, since you're not playing the game and your only purpose is to tell the world over and over and over again (system scan complete) that the FSS is "terrible, boring poor quality work" and a "monsterous thing".

Will that mean you stop replying?

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

I tire of tiptoeing around it considering the pointed lack of acknowlagement over the last few months. We know who is to blame and by the sour look on his face at that gentle ribbing im just gonna say, cant take the critisim. Well its terrible, boring poor quality work and having been given the choice of "adapt or leave" it is so bad that i have infact left the game, but not yet the forums.

It may be terrible, boring and poor quality work, but it is a million times better then what we had before, which was no quality at all as it had no substance to it.

 

[space voyager]

All you people posting "no" and variations of, why do you take such delight in dumping on somebody who just wants the choice? Sinse this is the suggestions forum i have to assume its for FDs benefit. Very sad.

No delight there, trust me. But I will definitely not take any chances for FD to think we all want what OP suggested. So I take it as my responsibility to respond.

When you post a suggestion, don't expect only those who agree to post.

 

[Kenpachi85]

The fss's biggest appeal to me (besides being easier/faster to use) is that it makes sense and gives me a sensation that I'm actually exploring stuff when I find new systems outside the bubble. The ads was a hocus pocus magic tool that somehow revealed every planet with a simple honk and its appearance/location and that just didn't make any sense. We should have to use instruments and scan for where those undiscovered bodies are and not have it just given to us after a magical honk. Oh and how ridiculous was it that the ads could somehow penetrate through the body of a star and scan planets on the other side that really made no sense at all. I remember fuel scooping and routinely scanning planets on the other side straight through massive stars.

I got to elite with the ads and after time it became a mundane exercise and the tedious flying to every body that I wanted to scan was a incredible time sink. At least with the fss I feel like I'm actually exploring(even if the graphics are lacking) and that im using actual instruments to find things and not a magical star penetrating sonar radar or whatever the ads was supposed to be.

The idea that only people that stay in the bubble like the fss is wrong and actually the opposite of the reality in my case at least. With the old ads making complete system scanning a very arduous process I stayed close to the bubble. I relied on r2r route generators to give me routes with systems that only had a few valuable planets that I had to fly to and scan as complete system scanning was taking incredible amounts of time.

After getting the fss I started making multi thousand light year trips and soon after I get tired of beating up npcs I plan on trying to circle the galaxy with it. I'm sorry this was such a game killer for you burke and wish you had the ads as a option still. But I doubt it will be reinstated and the fss is not the horrible piece of garbage you and a minority of explorers profess it to be.

Btw burke why did you quote yourself in the post at the top of this page? That's kinda weird man what's going on there? And if you really want fdev to hear you out it's probably not a good idea to keep saying that you already quit the game. If I was fdev I'd wouldn't care much about the opinion of somebody who keeps trashing my product and who rouintenly says he doesnt even play anymore. Just my 2 cents there

 

[Burke]

After getting the fss I started making multi thousand light year trips and soon after I get tired of beating up npcs I plan on trying to circle the galaxy with it. I'm sorry this was such a game killer for you burke and wish you had the ads as a option still. But I doubt it will be reinstated and the fss is not the horrible piece of garbage you and a minority of explorers profess it to be.

Btw burke why did you quote yourself in the post at the top of this page? That's kinda weird man what's going on there?

I challenge you to scan every planet in every system you cross on your next trip. Reveal the full system map every time and then you will be in a position to judge between the FSS and the old ADS. Might offer you insight into why dont like it. You mustnt try and talk about hocus pocus when the FSS scans all the stars in a system like it does.

I was continuing my previous thought.

 

[Kenpachi85]

I challenge you to scan every planet in every system you cross on your next trip. Reveal the full system map every time and then you will be in a position to judge between the FSS and the old ADS. Might offer you insight into why dont like it. You mustnt try and talk about hocus pocus when the FSS scans all the stars in a system like it does.

I was continuing my previous thought.

I just got back from omega mining and did just that and it was stupid easy and painless. It's so easy that I even scanned systems that had no valuable planet signals just for the hell of it and to put my name on them. Went to omega mining and back all in one day using the fss had no troubles at all. We are beating a dead horse with this thread though I've said my piece I'm out. Peace dude I'm out good luck finding a new game.

Ps Stars are much larger and many times more energetic than planets so it's not unreasonable that a combo radio/optical telescope could be engineered to auto detect those. Stars aren't worth much either so fdev probably saw no need for us to work to reveal them.

 

[Burke]

omega mining

So you went somewhere already explored and it filled the system map for you? Is this another case of somebody praising the FSS who doesnt know how it works or am i wrong?

Edit: ill explain. When you go somewhere somebody else has been you get the system map. When you go to a virgin system you get nothing. This is why "tourists" (politely) dont mind it but explorers hate it.

Edit2: You going to find that out if you circumnavigate, take me up on my challenge

 

[Kenpachi85]

So you went somewhere already explored and it filled the system map for you? Is this another case of somebody praising the FSS who doesnt know how it works or am i wrong?

You are wrong and tbh after just this thread I'm tired of responding to your complaints and your blanket assumptions about the people who like the fss(most of us). I had omega mining as my destination just because I was curious as to what the place was after a recent community goal event. I started my trip 500ly away from the bubble so I wouldn't be following a well worn path and the vast majority(99%) of systems I hit were unexplored. Keep assuming the world about us fss users though and attempt to insult our explorer credentials that's a really good way to earn support for your case. I'm done for real though peace dude and if you really quit the game then move on and stop complaining about something you don't even take part in anymore that's asanine.