Building a new PC for Elite: Dangerous Odyssey (hardware discussion)
- Thread starter Alec Turner
- Start date
My previous pc was intel/nvidia, when I last upgraded I went amd/amd. Nothing in it really to me. Whatever is the bang for buck. I also usually go for last gen to save some $$$. But your new specs look great and should serve you well for years.
If I built new I would probably go for Amd 5800x3d/6800xt for amd and for Intel 13700k/3080. I would get 32gigs system ram either way in a 2x16 setup for dual channel. Good Luck with the new build.
If I built new I would probably go for Amd 5800x3d/6800xt for amd and for Intel 13700k/3080. I would get 32gigs system ram either way in a 2x16 setup for dual channel. Good Luck with the new build.
rootsrat
Volunteer Moderator
Lush!I've had my current i5 / GTX 1080 based PC for 8 years now. I got it from PCSpecialist, really liked their service and have been extremely happy with the build.
Recently tho' I've been casually toying with the idea of upgrading (I see detail in videos from people like @Rheeney and @Buur that I'm not seeing in my own game, the machine definitely struggles with framerates for the on-foot stuff and I've definitely had to wind down Odyssey quality settings when playing on my new Quest 2). I can't deny I've also been jealous hearing the experiences of Lave Radio's @Phoenix_Dfire whose new 4070 Ti has allowed him to play in VR with everything on Ultra.
A completely unexpected pay bonus has kinda clinched it so I've started putting together a new build.
While I know a little bit I'm still mostly clueless when it comes to putting a build together so I've also been in contact with @Morbad who's provided me with some excellent advice and really helped me make some wiser decisions.
Anyway, I thought I'd share the build here (along with some of the reasoning behind it) and open it up for discussion because I find this process really enjoyable and can hopefully share, learn from, and enlighten others who similarly enjoy their PC hardware discussions.
Oh, and while it feels a bit crass I suppose it is a key factor so I should probably state that my budget is around £2k.
So, here's what I've got so far ..
CaseFRACTAL NORTH TG GAMING CASE (WHITE)Processor (CPU)Intel® Core™ i7 20-Core Processor i7-14700KF (Up to 5.6GHz) 33MB CacheMotherboardGIGABYTE Z790 UD (LGA1700, DDR5, PCIe 5.0)Memory (RAM)32GB Corsair VENGEANCE DDR5 6000MHz (2 x 16GB)Graphics Card12GB NVIDIA GEFORCE RTX 4070 Ti - HDMI, DP, LHR1st M.2 SSD Drive1TB SOLIDIGM P44 PRO GEN 4 M.2 NVMe PCIe SSD (up to 7000MB/sR, 6500MB/sW)1st Storage Drive2TB Samsung 870 QVO 2.5" SSD, SATA 6Gb/s (up to 560MB/sR | 530MB/sW)External DVD/BLU-RAY Drive8x Slim USB 2.0 External DVD-RWPower SupplyCORSAIR 850W RMx SERIES™ MODULAR 80 PLUS® GOLD, ULTRA QUIETProcessor CoolingPCS FrostFlow 200 Series High Performance CPU CoolerThermal PasteARCTIC MX-4 EXTREME THERMAL CONDUCTIVITY COMPOUNDExtra Case Fans3 x Corsair LL120 RGB LED Fan + Controller KitSound CardONBOARD 6 CHANNEL (5.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)Network CardONBOARD LAN PORTUSB/Thunderbolt Options2 PORT (2 x TYPE A) USB 3.0 PCI-E CARD + STANDARD USB PORTSOperating SystemWindows 11 Home 64 Bit - inc. Single Licence [KUK-00003]
Let's go down the spec' and I'll talk about my reasoning and what I've learned so far.
The Fractal North Case? I mean come on, it's just gorgeous! Beauty is in the eye of the beholder of course but I adore it and it's non negotiable! I gather the mesh version might be preferable from a cooling perspective (but PCSpecialist don't offer that option) and it's depth also means sub optimal placement of a cooler for the GPU I've chosen. That said, it's pretty much the same size as my current PC and so will fit very nicely in my existing desk arrangement. It also gets good reviews.
CPU - I'll confess I'm biased towards Intel and away from AMD. Can't really justify that (and I know a lot of folks will be biased one way or the other) but frankly I'm glad to have my choices halved. I've gone for i7 over i9 partly because of heat concerns with the latter inside this case but also because general wisdom seems to say that i7 is the right choice for a gaming PC. That said I've gone for a high spec cpu because I went too conservative with my existing PC and have regretted it slightly (it's definitely the bottleneck for Odyssey rather than the 1080 GPU). The K suggests overclocking options. In fact I'm not interested in overclocking (again, a bad experience with my current PC where I had to turn all overclocking off in order to prevent Half Life Alyx from crashing has made me favour reliability over a few extra fps). However, K parts also tend to have higher clock speeds generally. The F unit has no integrated GPU and saves a bit of money for something I'm unlikely to need.
Motherboards are a bit of a mystery to me frankly but choice of the highish speed DDR5 ram plus no need for built-in wifi (PC will be connected to a network cable) kinda landed me on this after I decided to save £100 by not going for the Asus ROG STRIX Z790-F board that originally caught my eye.
RAM - I had a bit of to and fro' on this. I originally had doubts about DDR5 after reading stuff about latency issues on the internet but Morbad was pretty confident that I should go the DDR5 route. I had originally picked 3200MHZ but in fact the price difference to step up to the 6000MHZ was only about £40 (although it did mean a motherboard change when the PC Specialist site said that wasn't strictly compatible with my original choice). Despite 32GB being on the lower end of the options offered by PCS my brief reading still suggests that's more than enough for gaming (and the price increases significantly with more). I believe common wisdom is that 2x16 is better than 1x32 (to do with increased bandwidth?).
GPU - choice of the 4070Ti is almost entirely @Phoenix_Dfire's fault but in fact it does sit in quite a nice place on the upper end of the diminishing returns, price/performance curve. Oh, and I like Nvidia stuff and additionally have heard so many issues about ED Odyssey not working well with AMD cards that I didn't really stop to even consider the alternative.
For storage a mix of M.2 and conventional SSD just seemed like a reasonably balanced choice (not sure hard disk is worth considering these days is it unless you need HUGE amounts of capacity). I originally had less but we always underestimate what we'll need in the future right? Think of a figure, double it and then add some more. I'm aware of lots of internet discussion about frequently written M.2 degrading over time but there's as many "experts" dismissing the problem as there are those warning us about it. I think it'll be fine.
An external DVD writer is a must (because I burn home video DVDs once a year for my son) but certainly no need in this day and age to have a drive built-in.
Power Supply - strictly speaking I think I could get away with 750W (there's a lot of recommendations out there for that with a 4070 GPU) but I'm really not comfortable with "get away with" when it comes to the power supply so I'd always tend to go up one.
Cooling is another mystery to me. I mean, I know what cooling is, but what's necessary and/or good? No idea. I picked what I think is quite a lot (partly due to the case choice and partly 'cos you definitely don't want to mess around with this stuff) and as for a little bit of RGB? Sure, why not! (I dare say this will cause more controversy than anything else here). Oh, and I'm not interested in messing around with water cooling. I'm sure people will tell me it's fine but water and electronics in the same box? No thank you!
Errr what's left?
Audio I'm not that fussed. I like decent quality sound and I have a nice Steelseries Arctis Pro headset that connects via USB and which I love so I don't need anything fancier in that regard.
And USB connectivity - you can never have enough right? so I threw in a few more on top of the decent amount the mobo is already giving me.
And that's it.
I'm sure I've missed off all sorts of wisdom I got from @Morbad so I'll either throw that in to the discussion later on or he will. But otherwise have at it. Ask questions, make suggestions and also maybe tell me what you've got and what you like about it and what you don't (it'll still be a while before I actually pull the trigger on this).
One last thing I suppose I'll add is that I'm not interested in this turning into any kind of slanging match. Happy to chat about stuff and discuss the pro's and con's and be guided by what I learn but please try to be respectful of other opinions and let's make this fun!
Congrats (in advance?) and let us know how it plays
like an ace kipper smokin wet dream I should co co (with out going to a monster like the founders 24gb 4090)
or a "TK421 why aren't you @your post?"
"because I have blazed past the Power On Self Test"
low budget users can always go the GeForce now root for a score per month for premium rig usage rental via streaming which will put you @the helm of a 4080 RTX based rig
with your basic device...……..
heat & air duster free which could prove advantageous during the heatwave major sunspot activity 3 months if air con not an option either but you really should be out an about enjoying the fine weather as muchaspos when it comes imo -.-. --- --- .-.. as if in the UK blink an you may miss it entirely just like raxxla
or a "TK421 why aren't you @your post?"
"because I have blazed past the Power On Self Test"
low budget users can always go the GeForce now root for a score per month for premium rig usage rental via streaming which will put you @the helm of a 4080 RTX based rig
with your basic device...……..
heat & air duster free which could prove advantageous during the heatwave major sunspot activity 3 months if air con not an option either
but you really should be out an about enjoying the fine weather as muchaspos when it comes imo -.-. --- --- .-.. as if in the UK blink an you may miss it entirely just like raxxla
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Nice build!
Out of curiosity, why did you opt for the 4070ti and not the 4080? Money?
Out of curiosity, why did you opt for the 4070ti and not the 4080? Money?
Yeah, pretty much (the 4080 drives the price up by nearly £300). I'd heard good things from a couple of people re: the 4070Ti and it just stuck in my mind as the one to go for. I think I might give some more thought to that tho' as I haven't actually done a huge amount of research on the differences so I may yet change my mind there.
Out of curiosity I just did some quick googling on comparisons between the Intel i7-14700KF and the Ryzen 7 7800X3D.
The i7 does seem to beat the Ryzen on most benchmarks (and supports more/faster DDR5) but that's quite possibly because of the 12 additional cores?
But the Ryzen does have nearly three times as much L3 cache and I gather that counts for a lot where Odyssey is concerned. So what's going on here? Do AMD generally favour more L3? Is the 7800X3D just unusual? or does the architecture of the newer Intel chip reflect some kind of move away from having a big L3 cache? (does access to faster DDR5 make it less important perhaps? - and I appreciate I may be talking complete nonsense when I say that).
Not sure I'm swayed yet but there sure is a lot of love out there for that AMD chip!
The i7 does seem to beat the Ryzen on most benchmarks (and supports more/faster DDR5) but that's quite possibly because of the 12 additional cores?
But the Ryzen does have nearly three times as much L3 cache and I gather that counts for a lot where Odyssey is concerned. So what's going on here? Do AMD generally favour more L3? Is the 7800X3D just unusual? or does the architecture of the newer Intel chip reflect some kind of move away from having a big L3 cache? (does access to faster DDR5 make it less important perhaps? - and I appreciate I may be talking complete nonsense when I say that).
Not sure I'm swayed yet but there sure is a lot of love out there for that AMD chip!
yes, the Amd CPUs that features the X3D suffix are special in the way they feature extra L3 cache - which seems to help alot in Gaming, less in other areas.
So, if building a gaming rig, it makes sense to go for a such special AMD cpu.
If building a mixed use rig - like productivity and gaming, there are certain areas where an Intel does better or much better than an AMD.
Also, the AMDs that have more than 8c16t will feature the extra L3 cache only on one of the cpu dies.
For example R9 7945HX3D features 16c/32t split in 2 dies, each featuring 8c/16t, but only one die will have the extra L3 cache, which means you kinda need to do some magic with tools like process lasso to make sure your game runs only on the cores that have the extra L3 cache.
I remember during the early beta days FD ran an in game competition somewhere in the game in space there where two times titan black nvidia cards to be found...….
that alone made me stick with nvidia rather than amd gpu's which proved a kinda correct logic with the 6000 series amd gpu driver problems with this game
that's not to say FD favour nvidia over amd but I just assumed they develop using intel\nvidia so less likely of having issues going that route
which is probably a totally unfounded logic but there you are
that alone made me stick with nvidia rather than amd gpu's which proved a kinda correct logic with the 6000 series amd gpu driver problems with this game
that's not to say FD favour nvidia over amd but I just assumed they develop using intel\nvidia so less likely of having issues going that route
which is probably a totally unfounded logic but there you are
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This is my PC running ED (4K Ultra + Upscaling=None @ 60Hz, even EDO settlements/Spires etc)
The high points on the graph (3rd down aka Load) are ED running about 18h before I grabbed the screenshot. Blue = CPU, Green = GPU (TL;DR CPU lower)
Source: https://i.imgur.com/nBmqfB0.png
This is some other game, similar graph
Source: https://imgur.com/a/IMK4km2
That's an i5-8400 + 3080 (Full build), it works the CPU hard (its only 65w with 100w peaks), but it copes (admittedly after 6yrs, its next on my upgrade list), i.e. So my experience I think you can get away with a lower CPU (for this use case, unless you want it for other uses?)
Next, You've got a Z-series motherboard. Great for overclocking (you aren't). You could use a B-Series for a few less ports
e.g. https://www.asus.com/uk/product-com...&LevelId=motherboards-components-motherboards
So, I'd recommend spending less on the CPU and Motherboard and getting the better GPU for almost the same price, but I don't think PC Specialist let you configure that
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I'll second that. I'm using a pair of Noctuas... silently. At least I think I am..... Yeah they are running, just cannot hear them
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whilst odyssey proved a bit more taxing cpu wise the game heavily uses the gpu so I have always gone for what I can afford in that regard all else being secondary protocol when it comes to this game build your pc around the gpu is my advice
when it comes to this game build your pc around the gpu is my advice
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I went with an Asus B series motherboard with my 12900k, in retrospect I regret the decision as I haven't been able to reliably undervolt the CPU. I'm not much for overclocking as I prefer a completely stable system instead of one running at the edge for just a small fps difference.
Another slant on this would be what I'm running. it's not latest gen but I play in 4K without issue, even in a busy high CZ.
I have (basically) a 5800x, RTX 3080 and 32GB.
I have (basically) a 5800x, RTX 3080 and 32GB.
Definitely worth upgrading from a "get away with" PSU, the output will degrade over time and you never know when you might want to add more disc drives to the system, and USB devices connected directly to the MB will also take some power as well.
agreed
"better to have it and not need it
than to need it and not have it!"
the same is true for almost everything in life...…….
(don't forget your limpets )
"better to have it and not need it
than to need it and not have it!"
the same is true for almost everything in life...…….
(don't forget your limpets
)
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Yeh, 4070TI seems like a nice amount of umph before the prices get really silly! Plus the power requirements are still relatively modest at that point in the 40 series range … I’m hoping for some deals come end-of-month to upgrade from a 3070!
Almost entirely because of the extra cores. More cores, even E-cores, are a big deal...for anything that will actually use them (e.g. not most games).
It counts a lot for a significant number of games and a fair number of other memory sensitive tasks. CPUs only need to reach out to main memory if they cannot find what they need in local cache, and more than 90% of work is done on less than 10% of data. Increasing cache size increases cache hit rates which means fewer cycles wasted waiting on main memory. It takes ~40 cycles to get something in the L3. It takes 300+ to get something out of main memory.
AMD's v-cache parts are, so far, outliers. They have three times the L3 cache of their standard equivalents, but run at lower clock speeds and are more locked down.
Some prior CPUs have had unusually large last level caches, relative to their contemporaries, which has occasionally had similar effect on gaming performance. The AMD K6-II/III+ (one of the first consumer CPUs with a significant integrated L2 cache), the Pentium IV EE Galatin (a rebranded Xeon with a 2MiB L3 cache) and the 5th Generation Core i5/7 Broadwell-C parts (with a 64MiB eDRAM L4 cache) are some examples.
SRAM is expensive and does not scale well (logic is still shrinking with newer manufacturing nodes, but SRAM is largely stagnant), which is why to get larger amounts of it economically, it has to be stacked. Intel has no stacked caches, yet.
More last level cache makes up for slower memory, to an extent, and faster memory makes up for less cache, again, to an extent. Intel's consumer CPUs are monolithic and have lower memory latency because of it. AMD's chiplet CPUs have the memory controller on package, but not on the same die as the CPU cores, which makes comparable main memory performance harder to achive...and is one of the reasons the cache helps AMD CPUs so much.
Because it's the same gaming performance for less total platform cost and one third of the power.
CPUs cost the roughly same, but you cannot cheap out on an i7 motherboard because it will throttle heavily, or fail early, if you do. Likewise you cannot get by without a high-end CPU cooler because the i7 will throttle. Nor can you really cheap out on memory, because the platform scales very well with memory.
The 7800X3D will run as fast as it's going to run (outside of the hands of an extreme OCer) on a $125 motherboard with a $40 cooler, plus whatever 2x16GiB kit of DDR5 that can be had for 90 bucks. You can also run it with a PSU 100-200w less than would be recommended for an i7 or i9, all other things being equal. All in all, this is typically enough to sping for the next step up in GPU, which is a huge deal for gaming.