C&P notoriety is trash for 100 reasons...

[FrogsFriend]

... Does being notorious really mean you have to have the game open but can't do anything? That seems unlikely.

Because it's not true. You just can't pay off the Bounty at an Intersteller Factor or hand yourself in at a station until the Notoriety has decayed. Two hours of in-game time per point. It in no way stops you playing the game.

Plus you only get notoriety for murdering clean ships anyway.

 

[[VR] Marrs]

Thanks for clearing that up. I've just been reading up on it. It doesn't sound like an unreasonable system. Maybe one day I'll go bad, it might force me to improve my combat skills

 

[Stigbob]

Thanks for clearing that up. I've just been reading up on it. It doesn't sound like an unreasonable system. Maybe one day I'll go bad, it might force me to improve my combat skills

As long as you either embrace the darkside or sort minor problems quickly nothing can go wrong, the people who struggle are the ones who try to ignore a little fine, ignore wanted status and switch modules about in wanted ships or get sniffy at their own mistake and kill a space cop/innocent.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Notoriety +1 for running from cops[down]
Notoriety +2 for killing a player[up]
Notoriety +3 for skimmer strike missions[down]
Notoriety +4 for fighting back against cops:S
Notoriety +5 for killing trade ships that resist[arrrr]
Notoriety +6 for crossfire[down]
Notoriety +7 for assassination missions[down]
Notoriety +8 for massacre missions[down]
Notoriety +9 for bounty hunting[down]
Notoriety +10 for launching a fighter[down]

Time spent in-game: 21 hours
Time spent in-game AFK: 20 hours
Profits for FDev Bitmining AFK Clients: unknown [money]

Notoriety +90 for accusing FDev of bit-mining
New forum tag for complaining about C&P: "illseeyouincourt"
Cost of hacking the game to check for bit-mining during game-play: Banned account:x

Reaction from PVE Combat Pilots: [where is it]*User has left the game*[hotas]
Average Steam players Feb '18 (Notoriety is added): 6k
Average Steam players Sept '18 (mostly AFK): 3k

Reaction from Traders, Explorers, and PVP Combat Pilots: [up] Weapons are for psychopaths anyway
Penalty for PVP Combat: Run away, usually only one jump away from the next target. Cost: ~1 jump
Penalty for PVE Combat: Get a new system, new ship, new faction and a new station. Cost: ~1 mil for a combat ship or transfer, Negative influence and rep changes for doing missions for an opposing faction. ~5 jumps if the faction is large.


Penalty for putting players into timeout: PVP in the starter system
Seeing Fdev tag similar threads with "illseeyouincourt": priceless

As a PvE player I am happy with the consequences. But I do think that they have the bounty and the notoriety the wrong way round. Notoriety should be on the ship, bounty should be on the commander.

 

[CMDR Cosmic Spacehead]

In today's news:
Criminal behaviour is considered criminal.

 

[Stigbob]

As a PvE player I am happy with the consequences. But I do think that they have the bounty and the notoriety the wrong way round. Notoriety should be on the ship, bounty should be on the commander.

The way it is now you can run different 'characters' with one account, a rogue a paladin and a barbarian for example.

 

[Marc_Hicks]

As a PvE player I am happy with the consequences. But I do think that they have the bounty and the notoriety the wrong way round. Notoriety should be on the ship, bounty should be on the commander.

Nope, I prefer it the way around that it currently is. I also want Notoriety of 5+ to never decay.....and to be meaningful for criminals to have (i.e. beneficial for criminals).

EDIT: Though notoriety won't decay, you would be able to "work if off" in various ways.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Nope, I prefer it the way around that it currently is. I also want Notoriety of 5+ to never decay.....and to be meaningful for criminals to have (i.e. beneficial for criminals).

EDIT: Though notoriety won't decay, you would be able to "work if off" in various ways.

The issue is if space legs comes a thing, then the commander or NPC has no bounty. You can't hunt them on foot.

Notoriety on a ship makes a lot of sense. Ships get notorious for doing certain things.

So a commander may have two ships a type 7 for legitimate cargo runs and a krait for pirating. You see th krait and it has a rep(notoriety) for pirating ships. You see the type 7 it has done nothing wrong so has no Notoriety, but the commander may have a bounty and is wanted no matter what ship he is in.

The way it is now you can run different 'characters' with one account, a rogue a paladin and a barbarian for example.

Yup. Doesn't make any sense to me. Doesn't matter what ship you are in, you should still be accountable for your crimes.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

The issue is if space legs comes a thing, then the commander or NPC has no bounty. You can't hunt them on foot.

Their shoes might have a bounty, though.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Their shoes might have a bounty, though.

Not if the bounty is on the ship. Its one reason why I dislike bounty on the ship and it's modules.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

Not if the bounty is on the ship. Its one reason why I dislike bounty on the ship and it's modules.

If it works like the SRV the shoes you wear for EVA could count as part of the ship for attracting bounties.

I don't think there's a good answer to bounties with the following constraints:
- multiplayer
- no permadeath
- no bounty-swap exploit
- no suicidewinder exploit
Tying the bounty to the ship is clunky and unintuitive, but if you don't do that you end up with exploits somewhere that make it trivial to lose the bounty with minimal impact.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

If it works like the SRV the shoes you wear for EVA could count as part of the ship for attracting bounties.

Until you change ship and then your shoes are devoid of any bounty.

I don't think there's a good answer to bounties with the following constraints:
- multiplayer

Not sure what the issue is with multiplayer.

- no permadeath

Not too sure again if that's an issue.

- no bounty-swap exploit

As long as the amount you have pay off is more then what the "bounty hunter" gets, it becomes a none issue.

- no suicidewinder exploit

That is easily fixed by having the amount you pay off as certain percentage cost added to what you pay off based on the ship you committed the crime in. Its commulative. See it as a bounty and a fine to which can only be paid off when you have been hunted down or killed by security services. Yes your rebuya my be negligible due to being caught in a sidewinder, not an issue for me as your ship you committed crime in will still have notoriety and will have restriction because of that.

This will in one fell swoop remove most if not all of the exploits.

Tying the bounty to the ship is clunky and unintuitive, but if you don't do that you end up with exploits somewhere that make it trivial to lose the bounty with minimal impact.

All those exploits are easily nullified.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

The bounty-swap exploit stops you doing things such as "have 300 million bounty, die in a Sidewinder, have 299.99 million bounty" because even with only a 2 million cap on bounties you can just switch back and forth with someone else with a similar bounty. You'd have to make it a percentage thing - kill someone with a 300 million bounty, get 3 million. Kill someone with a 10,000 credit bounty, get 100 credits, etc. You might as well just say "you can't claim bounties of other players" at that point.

No permadeath stops you using the Elite/FE2/FFE solution of "if your ship gets destroyed you're dead, so you can't use that to clear bounties" ... multiplayer means that what happens to the ship which collects your bounty is important.

That is easily fixed by having the amount you pay off as certain percentage cost added to what you pay off based on the ship you committed the crime in. Its commulative. See it as a bounty and a fine to which can only be paid off when you have been hunted down or killed by security services. Yes your rebuya my be negligible due to being caught in a sidewinder, not an issue for me as your ship you committed crime in will still have notoriety and will have restriction because of that.

Okay, so if you commit a crime in a Corvette you get a 200 credit bounty plus a 20 million credit fine, regardless of the ship you're actually killed in?

Problem there is that what you do is get killed in a Sidewinder, then declare bankruptcy (permanently losing the stock Sidewinder) rather than trying to pay it - now you're in Trevithick, still in a Sidewinder, completely clean. Go pick up your Corvette.

It stops the use of the suicidewinder exploit if you're in - say - Colonia, but so long as you're operating within the bubble it's only as inconvenient as having to find an IF or handing yourself in, and about as cheap.

as your ship you committed crime in will still have notoriety and will have restriction because of that

I'm not sure I understand what you mean by this. Notoriety is already pretty unrestrictive on clean ships.

 

[Riverside]

Edit: for Marrs

Bit mining is using computing processers (CPU or GPU) to solve crypographic puzzles/equations which, once solved, provide access to a number of coins of the cryptocurrency being mined. Bitcoin being the most well known.

The OP is accusing FD of having introduced C&P to force players to stay logged into the game but to not play it (hence AFK), so that the game can highjack their computer to mine cryptocurrencies.

I hope that clears it up for you. Don't try to make any sense of it, because there isn't any!

I didn't pick up on this aspect of the OP, and it does seem excessively paranoid since a player can wait out their notoriety in space where GPU use is low.

But it does raise the on-going question of just why the GPU load is higher when docked in the hanger compared to sitting on the pads raised position where far more assets are drawn. No conspiracy, but it does seem rather un-optimised and AFAIK has been that way since launch.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

The bounty-swap exploit stops you doing things such as "have 300 million bounty, die in a Sidewinder, have 299.99 million bounty" because even with only a 2 million cap on bounties you can just switch back and forth with someone else with a similar bounty. You'd have to make it a percentage thing - kill someone with a 300 million bounty, get 3 million. Kill someone with a 10,000 credit bounty, get 100 credits, etc. You might as well just say "you can't claim bounties of other players" at that point.

Nope. Bounties stay as they are. But the amount the criminal has to pay off at the detention centre to get their ship back is the bounty + a percentage of the price of your ship you did the crime in. Bounty stays the same. But the costs to clear yourself and leave the detention centre could be very high depending what ship you committed crimes in. If people kept trying to swap bounties they would end up loosing all there money.

Maybe have different percentages depending on the crime.

As to declaring bankruptcy, that should only happen if you can't afford the rebuy. Or if you do declare bankruptcy, all your assets are liquidated and become void. You are bankrupt, so don't have any money.

No permadeath stops you using the Elite/FE2/FFE solution of "if your ship gets destroyed you're dead, so you can't use that to clear bounties" ... multiplayer means that what happens to the ship which collects your bounty is important.

Okay, so if you commit a crime in a Corvette you get a 200 credit bounty plus a 20 million credit fine, regardless of the ship you're actually killed in?

The percentage should depend on the crime commited
QUOTE=Ian Doncaster;7077609]
Problem there is that what you do is get killed in a Sidewinder, then declare bankruptcy (permanently losing the stock Sidewinder) rather than trying to pay it - now you're in Trevithick, still in a Sidewinder, completely clean. Go pick up your Corvette.

Bankruptcy shouldn't be allowed if you have liquidible assets. As you can now pay off rebuy by selling ships, bankruptcy shouldn't really be an option in my view. Remove it if you have he cash to pay.

It stops the use of the suicidewinder exploit if you're in - say - Colonia, but so long as you're operating within the bubble it's only as inconvenient as having to find an IF or handing yourself in, and about as cheap.

Again, that depend is bankruptcy is an option. When at the detention centre have it as not an option unless you literally have not enough money to pay of the fine/bounty.

I'm not sure I understand what you mean by this. Notoriety is already pretty unrestrictive on clean ships.

Notoriety would be on the ship, not the commander. Notoriety would have restriction on the ship similar to what a bounty has on the ship now.

 

[Stigbob]

Yup. Doesn't make any sense to me. Doesn't matter what ship you are in, you should still be accountable for your crimes.

I like having choice and options.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

double post.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

I like having choice and options.

That's not choice and options. That's consequence free gameplay.

I want to play the game in a semi believable game world. At the moment, having a bounty on the ship is very unrealistic and makes no sense.

 

[Stigbob]

That's not choice and options. That's consequence free gameplay.

I want to play the game in a semi believable game world. At the moment, having a bounty on the ship is very unrealistic and makes no sense.

It means you are not trapped into one role or the other, provided you are willing to make concessions like being hunted a dedicated criminal ship and no IF access you can switch as you see fit.

I'm not a great believer in real life comparisons as its a video game but real world vehicles do carry identifying marks for legal reasons.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

It means you are not trapped into one role or the other, provided you are willing to make concessions like being hunted a dedicated criminal ship and no IF access you can switch as you see fit.

I'm not a great believer in real life comparisons as its a video game but real world vehicles do carry identifying marks for legal reasons.

You are never trapped into one role in ED as long as you pay the consequences of what you do. If you commit a crime you are wanted criminal no matter what ship you are in. You don't want to be a criminal anymore, pay the consequences.

The options are still there, there are are just consequences to your options which shouldn't be avoided because you decided to play in a different ship the next day.

As to real life comparisons, it's nothing to do with real life, it's about something that makes some kind of sense within a game world. At the moment it doesn't. You may like that, that's fine, but I do not. I would prefer the game world I platinum to make some kind of sense.