Clone Packs

[avietar]

What I mean with a Clone Pack:

• Consists of only animals (no foliage, no building pieces)
• The animals are 'clones', which means they have recycled rigs and animations. The only changes are made to the animals' visuals, which can range from minute changes to existing animals, to different-but-still-pretty-similar.

A Clone Pack could be a way of providing players with something that is much requested: more animals! While at the same time costing the developers fairly little time to create. No new rigs or animations have to be created: they can use tried and tested rigs and animations, and base the clone designs on existing animals that are already in game.

These packs would basically be filler packs, used to fill up the animal rosters and bring more diversity. When new DLCs come out, people don't like it when animals are released that are very similar to what we already have in game (the arctic wolf - timber wolf debacle). However, that also means that great animals may get passed over in favor of more striking and exotic ones (colorful cassowary bird instead of the 'smaller ostrich' emu).

At this moment, other topics ask about the choice between different leopards, the choice between different rhinos. In my last topic about an European DLC, it was apparent that many people would love to have wisents in the game, even though they look very similar to American bison. On these forums, people have made known that they would love the Sumatran tiger in the game, but fear the odds aren't great with two existing tiger species already present.

Clone Packs could resolve these concerns

Thanks for bearing with me until now! Here are my questions for you:

1. How would you call these packs?
2. How many animals would be in these packs?
3. What would you be willing to pay for these packs?
4. What clone animals would you be excited for?

 

[random goat]

It's a good idea overall. Similar to those monthly reskin animals releases @markun suggested.

Answering your questions:
1. Insert biome animal collection? I'm not too good for marketing stuff
2. It depends on how often these packs would be released and if they'd replace current DLCs. Assuming these 'clone packs' would be extra, once every 6 months with 6 habitat animals would be fairly okay.
3. 8 € sounds fine to me. Even if animals are "just" reskins, surely most of them would need adjustments to their needs and behaviour, plus in some cases the juvenile models would almost need to be made from scratch.
4. Many, really. If I had to pick a few, I'd say black & white ruffed lemur, Malayan tapir, Gran'ts gazelle, Nile crocodile, emu, black or white rhino, scimitar oryx, black bear, mouflon, guanaco, Bennet's wallaby and red forest buffalo.

 

[jcp011c]

I'd be fine with this - things like the White or Black Rhino, the Masai Giraffe, another lion species, the Malayan tapir, Grey Kangaroo, American Black Bear would be definite wants. I think still 4-5 animals would be okay, but with no building items I don't think I'd pay more than $5 for it, especially since it's just alternate species or subspecies.

 

[nutrit]

I would be really happy with malayan tapir or wisent!!! Every extra animal is a great idea for me. If they would release a new animal every week I would buy it anyway

 

[NL_Mutso]

1. How would you call these packs? Species or variety packs
2. How many animals would be in these packs? 5
3. What would you be willing to pay for these packs? € 8,00 - €10,00 (considering it would be an extra and only for people who want this - normally more expensive)
4. What clone animals would you be excited for? Wisent, Malayan Tapir, Striped Hyena, Grey kangaroo (this would be the walkthrough option for kangaroos), Nile Crocodile

 

[NZFanatic]

Thanks for bearing with me until now! Here are my questions for you:

1. How would you call these packs?
2. How many animals would be in these packs?
3. What would you be willing to pay for these packs?
4. What clone animals would you be excited for?

I think it depends on what you consider a 'clone' animal. I don't consider, for example, the Malayan tapir or white rhinoceros to be clones, as both would need not only drastic colour changes but also pretty hefty model adjustments (the tapir less than the rhinoceros, but still), and behavioural/AI changes. For me, a clone animal would be something akin to the Arctic wolf, which required very little by way of adjustment from the timber wolf.

To answer the questions:

- That entirely depends. I'd probably just call them 'deluxe packs'. Any 'biome' or 'species' pack could contain non-clone animals as well.
- I'd be happy with just three.
- If it's only the animals, and if I go by the last answer of three, I'd be willing to pay up to 10NZD for it, but I would expect it to be closer to 5-8NZD.
- Again, that depends on what you mean. If I go by my own definition of clone animals:

Sumatran tigers are a big must-have. They have a massive captive presence (almost as many in captivity as there are left in the wild) and are critically endangered. They are especially important when building realistic Australian or New Zealand zoos, as we don't tend to have the Bengal/Siberian hybrids that other zoos call 'Bengal tigers'.

I'd also like the Asiatic lion. I know, I know - it's part of the same subspecies as the West African lion according to modern taxonomy. That doesn't matter to Frontier, though - the Bengal and Siberian tigers are the same subspecies in modern taxonomy as well, and of course how can I talk about in-game taxonomy without again mentioning the mess of inconsistency that is the wolves.

Eastern grey kangaroo. On top of being a common walkthrough animal, it's also the kangaroo species I'm most intimately familiar with.

Amur leopard. This one straddles the lion between 'clone' and 'not-clone' for me. While functionally the jaguar would be the obvious base, the Amur leopard would behave very differently to the jaguar.

If we took the tiger, lion, and leopard from this list and put them into a three-animal "Big Cat Pack" I'd be pretty happy.

 

[Indoraptor27]

Here's my opinion. Do whatever you want with it. I think true "clones" as in nothing new other than skin color or pattern, would NOT be beneficial to the game. That would just be adding animals for the sake of adding animals. If they were similar to existing animals, while still having slightly different models and mechanics would be a good addition. Things like cougars, leopards, white/black rhinos, new species of lemur, etc. would be great to have. Similar, but distinct at the same time. Things like more tiger subspecies (I agree that having pure Bengals and Siberians is unrealistic, but I'd honestly rather they'd been the only kind of tiger from the beginning than bother with putting them in now), Grévy's zebra, Masai giraffe, and others aren't really necessary.

 

[[PS4] Filthymick420]

Initiate zoo order 66

 

[paul78]

I like some clone animals like Masai giraffes,Sumatran Tiger,and Barbary,Asiatic, or another subspecies or regional lion. To me there more then just another model. Even tho asiatic lions are lions in the general sense they are also very different then their African cousins in pride size and also vary in looks as well. Now even tho the Javan rhino is not a exact clone of the Indian rhino it’s still to close to me in looks despite being smaller in size. Now the white rhino or black on the other hand are far from clone animals as they look quite different and behave in different ways as well.

To me these animals would be just different enough to include them maybe not before a much needed animal but if we got any of them somewhere down the line it wouldn’t upset me either. The Sumatran tiger for example varies in size and looks very different then the Bengal and Siberian as where the indochinese and south China look quite similar to the Bengal Tiger except being smaller.

 

[avietar]

Here's my opinion. Do whatever you want with it. I think true "clones" as in nothing new other than skin color or pattern, would NOT be beneficial to the game. That would just be adding animals for the sake of adding animals. If they were similar to existing animals, while still having slightly different models and mechanics would be a good addition. Things like cougars, leopards, white/black rhinos, new species of lemur, etc. would be great to have. Similar, but distinct at the same time. Things like more tiger subspecies (I agree that having pure Bengals and Siberians is unrealistic, but I'd honestly rather they'd been the only kind of tiger from the beginning than bother with putting them in now), Grévy's zebra, Masai giraffe, and others aren't really necessary.

I suppose I'm not really thinking of true clones then

For example, a clone pack might be an 'antelope pack' with X antelope species. Or it might be a 'big cat' pack with various large big cat (sub)species. Or a 'small cat pack', a 'fox pack', a 'new world monkeys pack'. And so on. It would offer people a way to fill out their zoos in ways that they prefer.

I also like Random Goat's idea of a 'biome collection' that includes X species from a particular biome. In that same line of thinking, there could be something like a 'regional collection' that could include animals from a specific region, for example 'the Tibetan plateau', 'the Indonesian jungle', 'the Sonoran desert', just throwing stuff out there.

To be honest, while writing this down I feel like regional collections sounds like they'd do fine with 5 animals like we're used to now, but biome collections sound like they'd include at least 10 animals. So then I would price a biome collection higher than we're used to now (15 euro for 10+ animal clones), while a regional collection would be cheaper (6 euro for 5 clones). The animal clone packs I mentioned above, I'd price similarly at 6 euro for 5 clone animals.

 

[NZFanatic]

I suppose I'm not really thinking of true clones then

For example, a clone pack might be an 'antelope pack' with X antelope species. Or it might be a 'big cat' pack with various large big cat (sub)species. Or a 'small cat pack', a 'fox pack', a 'new world monkeys pack'. And so on. It would offer people a way to fill out their zoos in ways that they prefer.

I also like Random Goat's idea of a 'biome collection' that includes X species from a particular biome. In that same line of thinking, there could be something like a 'regional collection' that could include animals from a specific region, for example 'the Tibetan plateau', 'the Indonesian jungle', 'the Sonoran desert', just throwing stuff out there.

To be honest, while writing this down I feel like regional collections sounds like they'd do fine with 5 animals like we're used to now, but biome collections sound like they'd include at least 10 animals. So then I would price a biome collection higher than we're used to now (15 euro for 10+ animal clones), while a regional collection would be cheaper (6 euro for 5 clones). The animal clone packs I mentioned above, I'd price similarly at 6 euro for 5 clone animals.

I think you're getting confused about what 'clone' means here. When people refer to 'clone' or 'copy/paste' animals they are referring to animals like the Arctic wolf, Siberian tiger, or Himalayan brown bear - i.e. animals that do not differ from other animals already in the game in any meaningful way except for perhaps colouration and biome (in the above examples, the timber wolf, the Bengal tiger, the grizzly bear). Most people would not consider the jaguar to be a clone of the lion, as another example, even though they are built from the same rig.

 

[Jon Eros]

great idea, this will add way more animals to the game, and not making sharing stuff on the workshop harder becouse you added 1 item comming from an dlc that somebody doesnt have

 

[FoxyDee]

I am all for animals that re-use rigs, if they are reasonably different in either size or fur/scales/feathers. Things like malayan tapirs, carribean flamingos, black and white ruffed lemurs, african rhino etc. I am fine with. However no more brown bears, tigers or lions please.

 

[NZFanatic]

I am all for animals that re-use rigs, if they are reasonably different in either size or fur/scales/feathers. Things like malayan tapirs, carribean flamingos, black and white ruffed lemurs, african rhino etc. I am fine with. However no more brown bears, tigers or lions please.

See, I really don't understand this point of view (to a certain extent).

I myself was disappointed by the Arctic wolf, for example, but not because of what it was. For me it was purely scientific - it rubbed me the wrong way that the game contained both a generic grey wolf and a specific subspecies (now two, including the dingo). I gave the original Zoo Tycoon a pass on this because it was old, outdated, and less committed to accuracy, but I expected better of PlanZo. However, if the Arctic wolf had been released as a standalone animal, or as part of another "Deluxe Pack", or as part of some generic dog pack, I probably wouldn't have had the same objections, because presumably something more unique, like the Arctic fox or wolverine, would have been included in the Arctic Pack in such a scenario.

I don't want the Sumatran tiger as part of an 'Asia Pack'. That would feel like a cop-out to me. I do still want the animal, though, "clone" or no, because it's near and dear to my heart and considerably more important in terms of conservation and captive animal management than the Bengal or Siberian tigers, which are often hybdridised in captivity due to a total lack of clarity and a history of ignorance.

It shouldn't matter what the animal looks like or what it behaves like. I think we can all agree that getting animals that are too similar to others as part of 'main' DLC packs is disappointing, but I don't think we should write them off entirely.

 

[FoxyDee]

See, I really don't understand this point of view (to a certain extent).

It shouldn't matter what the animal looks like or what it behaves like. I think we can all agree that getting animals that are too similar to others as part of 'main' DLC packs is disappointing, but I don't think we should write them off entirely.

I suppose I am not that much into details reagarding subspecies. I can place a tiger and be happy, I can pretend its a bengal or any other subspecies and wont care, since they all look the same to me. The only difference would be a name (and perhaps a biome, but I do not care that much since I try to use the plants that can also live in the biome my Zoo is located at) and that is not enough for me to want it in game.

I understand the importance of it in real life, I really do, but in the game, its just two lines of text that you see in the panels, it has no other meaning, unlike real life, since the game does not care if you release a bengal or siberian. You get points and the animals dissapear from your zoo and that is it. With different looking animals you have at least something new to look at. And we all know the game is heavily foccused on how the animals look, that is the main selling point of PZ after all.

In the end it is up to Frontier, but I think for casuals, or people like me that it is just a name change, and would prefer more unique looking animals.

 

[NL_Mutso]

It shouldn't matter what the animal looks like or what it behaves like. I think we can all agree that getting animals that are too similar to others as part of 'main' DLC packs is disappointing, but I don't think we should write them off entirely.

At some point we'll likeley end up with 1 animal per pack with a similar rig or looking too similar.

Agree, the 'main' DLC should aim for adding unique animals. But an extra DLC with a focus on subspecies - looks like a reasonable idea/suggestion.
I think asking for more unique DLC every 2 months would border on unreasonable...

 

[synthetase]

I think this is a GREAT idea! It would be amazing and a good compromise

1. How would you call these packs?
2. How many animals would be in these packs?
3. What would you be willing to pay for these packs?
4. What clone animals would you be excited for?

1. I would call them taxonomic packs or family packs since the animals that are based off of existing ones are probably related!
2. 4-5 seems awesome
3. Depends, if it was about canines or deer or antelopes (some of my favorites) then I would pay at least 10 if not more, if it were about commonish animals such as tigers or elephants I wouldn't pay much more than 5 (USD)
4. I answered that above, but to go into more detail for canines: foxes, coyote maybe, dhole (that would be pretty awesome!) maned wolf etc... Actually my Dream Canine Pack would probably include a. Arctic Fox b. Red Fox c. Maned Wolf d. Dhole e. Fennec Fox (or Bat-eared but that probably wouldn't happen)

 

[jcp011c]

What clone animals would you be excited for? Wisent, Malayan Tapir, Striped Hyena, Grey kangaroo (this would be the walkthrough option for kangaroos), Nile Crocodile

Masai Giraffe, White and Black African Rhino, Sumatran Tiger, Asiatic Tiger, Amur Leopard, African Leopard, Mayalan Tapir, Stripped Hyena, Grey Kangaroo, Nile Crocodile, American Black Bear, Ethiopian Wolf, Leopard Tortoise would be the main ones for me. I realize some of these could probably fit well in region based packs better than others, like the Rhino and African Leopard, but I think this would cover a lot of bases.

 

[ElectricMonk]

...That would just be adding animals for the sake of adding animals....

I am totally fine with adding animals for the sake of adding animals!

 

[DragonNTiger]

Certainly wouldn't mind if they did something like that... as long as they don't neglect adding truly new animals with new rigs as well... the world is full of great animals and often times the only obvious differences are their color, size or location, and a lot of them are pretty popular... a few off the top of my head that might work would include:

African Spurred Tortoise (Centrochelys sulcata) --- Galapagos Giant Tortoise
American Alligator (Alligator mississippiensis) ----- Saltwater Crocodile
Blue Wildebeest (Connochaetes taurinus) ---------- Black Wildebeest
Brown Hyena (Hyaena brunnea) ---------------------- Spotted Hyena
Dromedary Camel (Camelus dromedarius) --------- Bactrian Camel
Grey Kangaroo (Macropus giganteus) --------------- Red Kangaroo
Grévy's Zebra (Equus grevyi) -------------------------- Plains Zebra
Malayan Tapir (Tapirus indicus) ------------------------ Baird's Tapir
Marco Polo Sheep (Ovis ammon polii) --------------- Dall Sheep

And these are just some of the more obvious ones currently in game... other possible animals that could easily be cloned to widen their family group's representation include Hartebeests, Takins, Foxes, Lynxes, Armadillos, Porcupines, Wallabies... and surely others...

White and Black African Rhino

Hmm... maybe it's just me, but I'm not convinced a straight clone from the Indian Rhino to an African Rhino could be done... the size and shape of the horns are very different, and in the case of the White Rhino the mouth is completely distinct... I feel like they'd have to modify the rig and animations to make it work...