C'mon, this is faintly ridiculous.

[Darth CareBear]

I frequently and repeatedly encounter CMDRs that I've encountered before, without having to try. Chances are, if my CMDR is in the same area as another, and there are no major connection issues, and no blocks in play, we will be placed in the same instances and be able to interact in any manner the game allows. So, how often? Often enough that I know many of the CMDRs that frequent my CMDR's home areas and would recognize a fair portion at most CGs.

Your arguments boils down to, 'I don't pay attention to this stuff, so it can't be a problem'. It's a collection of argumentum ad populum and relative privations fallacies that don't even attempt to address the issues presented.

If the underlying justification of the block feature is that we should be able to be free from the interference of others, even in Open, the fact that block itself can (and this is demonstrable) interfere with non-blocked others, introduces quite a paradox. Should one person's arbitrary desire to avoid contact with an individual, override the desires of others to have contact with that individual? Frontier seems to think so, or is at least apathetic to the issue. You seem to think so. I think prioritizing arbitrary exclusion over inclusion, in the Open mode of a game that has two other exclusive modes, is silly.

Good for you, clearly you arent blocked by them, and your gameplay is intact along with your instance, no instance issues then..."serious potential problem" i.o.w pandemic avoided. point proven well i might add.

Regarding you last paragraph incase you missed my edit of extra content above, i wanted o investigate your point about your future instancing issues further, if it is an issue i dont want to know exists like you said or if its a major ** Pearl cluthing, hold my soy based drink** moment ...it seems Fdev tech and design is your problem with instancing not blocking. Wings and friends should fix this but it does not, as a failure of future needed fixes.

Edit: Extra content...i was interested in your issues regarding your and other blocked players instancing and then finding results/ tests/ and intended funtiontionality.
It looks like the following stands out from these sources.

Blocking in Elite Dangerous

UPDATE - Thanks to much discussion and the very simple but elegant solution posed by one CMDR, I've changed my approach to the blocking system. I've decided to use it as a reverse iron man, in that once you have murdered me, I'm dead to you. You'll never see me again, because to you, I'm dead...

forums.frontier.co.uk

Block was always intended to block all contact between players comms and instancing, however at launch it blocked comms only. Then it was strengthened to reduce the chances of instancing with someone blocked. In these enlightened modern times it blocks people completely regardless of things like the friends list.

Probably as a result of the rules on online harassment being tightened worldwide.

https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDangerous/comments/6e6z2l/_/di9espl

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDangerous/comments/6e6z2l/ip_addresses_harvested_and_account_linked_beware/di9espl?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3


Things that stand out for me from above reading sources:
1) " If most players aren't bad, corollary being that most players are good, then block makes sense. If most players ARE bad, and only a select are good, then private makes sense."
2) Blocking is only a problem for the minority especially when you dont know about it - " Solo excludes everyone. Private excludes the majority. Block excludes the minority. Open without block excludes no one. Especially with how empty the galaxy is, open- only wouldn't help much. "
3) Fdev incapable of enforcing rules and punishing gankers - "Reporting player abuse doesn't seem to make much headway. If you have examples of Fdev publishing punishments publicly, I honestly want to see them. Shadowbanning is a joke of a punishment.
Alternatively, if players are fine with interaction as long as it isn't PvP, then Fdev should implement a PvE flag or other such system."
4) The REAL issue here highlights problems with Fdev game design and tech regarding Wings/ instancing/ PtoP and server loads NOT blocking mechanic -
" I also agree that the instancing is horrible. I've been in a private group, winged with friends on the same VPN, but when one of us interdicted the other, we were dropped to separate instances. The lemon juice on the wound was that we could target each other, but not see or interact with each other. Likewise, I've been in Eravate in open with livestream players and never saw each other over two hours of time. For me, instancing is the real problem with the multiplayer aspect of the game."

 

[Deleted member 182079]

Fwiw, I'm with Morbad re blocking and how it can affect your instancing with others. I've been in situations where the people I want to instance with (such as gankers) were clearly around judging from sys chat, or even my friend list - but I ended up in an instance that's either empty, or with a random player. I often wonder whether this is just poor luck on my side or because others have those gankers blocked.

Also, using covid or whatever else to ridicule the issue is pretty lame - we're on a gaming forum and not one where we discuss current affairs. If everyone took the same approach we may as well stop discussing anything at all because there's always something much more awful happening elsewhere that can be used as a counter. Apples & oranges.

 

[Darth CareBear]

Fwiw, I'm with Morbad re blocking and how it can affect your instancing with others. I've been in situations where the people I want to instance with (such as gankers) were clearly around judging from sys chat, or even my friend list - but I ended up in an instance that's either empty, or with a random player. I often wonder whether this is just poor luck on my side or because others have those gankers blocked.

Also, using covid or whatever else to ridicule the issue is pretty lame - we're on a gaming forum and not one where we discuss current affairs. If everyone took the same approach we may as well stop discussing anything at all because there's always something much more awful happening elsewhere that can be used as a counter. Apples & oranges.

Not sure who was talking about the big flu, i certainly was not, not here to ridicule your and Morbads (minority issue) if you read the tests and resultant feedback above from posts on clearly a blocking dead horse beaten topic...i wanted to find out more how "BIG" is the issue...and its not big at all...infact your minority issue of blocking preventing your instancing gameplay interaction with others including gankers above as you say...drum roll...turns out to be Fdev game tech and coding Wings/ Beacons/ Friends list/ PtoP servers - Not working correctly. Blocking is working perfectly as intended chat and instance blocking.

Anyway i hope truly Fdev will fix your "minority" instance gamebraking issue one day that prevents you of interacting with others, by the time that have found a solution and fixed that (if it needs fixing) it means us the "majority" will have the bigger instancing issues resolved too hopefully like wings/ multi crew, PtoP servers etc...thats the biggy issue.

It was interesting that they mention that blocking due to perhaps new EU game harrassment laws, perhaps there was no alternative, also what about an iron mode where the player you just killed/ ganked blocks you meaning they are now officially dead to you and no need to see them... i thought that was an interesting way to think of it Role play.

I have gone over my quota for typing on forums today, thank you for highlighting your PVP instance plight, but im sure you will be fine playing ED in other ways.

 

[Deleted member 182079]

Not sure who was talking about the big flu, i certainly was not, not here to ridicule your and Morbads (minority issue) if you read the tests and resultant feedback above from posts on clearly a blocking dead horse beaten topic...i wanted to find out more how "BIG" is the issue...and its not big at all...infact your minority issue of blocking preventing your instancing gameplay interaction with others including gankers above as you say...drum roll...turns out to be Fdev game tech and coding Wings/ Beacons/ Friends list/ PtoP servers - Not working correctly. Blocking is working perfectly as intended chat and instance blocking.

Anyway i hope truly Fdev will fix your "minority" instance gamebraking issue one day that prevents you of interacting with others, by the time that have found a solution and fixed that (if it needs fixing) it means us the "majority" will have the bigger instancing issues resolved too hopefully like wings/ multi crew, PtoP servers etc...thats the biggy issue.

It was interesting that they mention that blocking due to perhaps new EU game harrassment laws, perhaps there was no alternative, also what about an iron mode where the player you just killed/ ganked blocks you meaning they are now officially dead to you and no need to see them... i thought that was an interesting way to think of it Role play.

I have gone over my quota for typing on forums today, thank you for highlighting your PVP instance plight, but im sure you will be fine playing ED in other ways.

Just a few posts above.

Good for you, clearly you arent blocked by them, and your gameplay is intact along with your instance, no instance issues then..."serious potential problem" i.o.w pandemic avoided. point proven well i might add.

I'm backing up Morbad simply because it is an issue for some players - not one that I expect to be fixed/addressed (I've given up hope on that and I also stopped trying to 'win over' players who are using block all too liberally, instead of simply switching modes), all I'm doing is talking about it in a (futile) effort to at least raise some awareness because others don't believe it is one, or don't understand how it works, just because it doesn't affect them because they play Elite like a single player game, but in Open.

Which funnily enough is exactly my experience most of the time these days (made worse by the introduction of FCs, which I love otherwise) despite playing in Open and wanting to meet more players, hostile or friendly - but it really is slim pickings outside less than a handful of high-traffic systems, galaxy-wide. So even if one player pauses for a second as a result of this discussion before they click 'block' next time, that's a win already in my book.

It may be an OCD of mine but when I see misconceptions ("blocking players is perfect and doesn't cause issues for players not being blocked") being repeated, I feel to jump in, just like Morbad does (although he/she has a lot more stamina/patience in this regard that I do I have to admit).

 

[Darth CareBear]

Just a few posts above.

Its...its quite unfortunate...you think the word i used "Pandemic" is that the wrd you are referring to? Taken from the interwebs, maybe you are not aware the word "Pandemic" is used in other ways too...example in context of this thread and posts of "BLOCKING" did you miss the context perhaps? I am not responsible to how you interpret your own narrative and internal bias to a word being used a lot lately. It is bad what is going on but you miss-interpreted the contaxt...thats on you, careful of the accusations.
(hi-jacked topic of blocking in game - i think it might be my fault so i will apologize for the hi-jack as i initially asked the question that Morbad and other responded to if it was still possible to do a blocking action)

Here is online example from interwebs of the word used in other CONTEXT similar to my intentions. Morbad was referring to instance blocking being a "potential serious problem" in ED...its not...other IT issues are to blame.
Examples of pandemic in a Sentence

Noun … globalization, the most thoroughgoing socioeconomic upheaval since the Industrial Revolution, which has set off a pandemic of retrogressive nationalism, regional separatism, and religious extremism.— Martin Filler, New York Review of Books, 24 Sept. 2009 …

it also hopes to utilize this cultural investigation to better understand strategies to reduce the massive pandemic we now understand cigarette smoking to produce.— Allan M. Brandt, The Cigarette Century, 2007

 

[antiriad]

'm backing up Morbad simply because it is an issue for some players - not one that I expect to be fixed/addressed (I've given up hope on that and I also stopped trying to 'win over' players who are using block all too liberally, instead of simply switching modes)

I'm with you, and FWIW, I was previously in favour of blocking disruptive players. It was actually a post by Morbad some time ago that changed my mind on the subject. Instancing in this game is broken enough, without breaking it more. By blocking a player that I find disruptive, I can potentially influence the instancing of many other innocent parties, and for my part, this is something I don't want to do. Hence my block list is empty.

If I find a particular player or situation unpalatable, I'll move to PG or Solo - this choice I make only affects me, not others.

As I said, that's just me - I don't like to think I'm causing problems for other players. Others may feel different.

 

[Darth CareBear]

I'm backing up Morbad simply because it is an issue for some players - not one that I expect to be fixed/addressed (I've given up hope on that and I also stopped trying to 'win over' players who are using block all too liberally, instead of simply switching modes), all I'm doing is talking about it in a (futile) effort to at least raise some awareness because others don't believe it is one, or don't understand how it works, just because it doesn't affect them because they play Elite like a single player game, but in Open.

Which funnily enough is exactly my experience most of the time these days (made worse by the introduction of FCs, which I love otherwise) despite playing in Open and wanting to meet more players, hostile or friendly - but it really is slim pickings outside less than a handful of high-traffic systems, galaxy-wide. So even if one player pauses for a second as a result of this discussion before they click 'block' next time, that's a win already in my book.

It may be an OCD of mine but when I see misconceptions ("blocking players is perfect and doesn't cause issues for players not being blocked") being repeated, I feel to jump in, just like Morbad does (although he/she has a lot more stamina/patience in this regard that I do I have to admit).

It is a futile, like you say, issue, in the minority, hopefully there will be a resolution for you and Morbad one day, but it is working as intended. I am sure you have moved on and found other ways of interaction and can still play ED?

 

[Darth CareBear]

I'm with you, and FWIW, I was previously in favour of blocking disruptive players. It was actually a post by Morbad some time ago that changed my mind on the subject. Instancing in this game is broken enough, without breaking it more. By blocking a player that I find disruptive, I can potentially influence the instancing of many other innocent parties, and for my part, this is something I don't want to do. Hence my block list is empty.

If I find a particular player or situation unpalatable, I'll move to PG or Solo - this choice I make only affects me, not others.

As I said, that's just me - I don't like to think I'm causing problems for other players. Others may feel different.

I think that is fair and valid, it would appear that matchmaking though is intended to over rule blocking, when in a wing/ friend list. Now it seems the wings etc not working properly is NOT overuling any blocking. Wings we know needs some fixing among other connection stuffs, but it mostly seems to come back to wings and how it all works.

I dont think you need to be concerned about spoiling other future innocent players instances with any blocks, it seems players who are blocked have preference over an instance...below.

Sandro Sammarco about block in 2014
"Hello Commanders!
In this instance, blocking the Commander might prove quite useful.
When you block somebody, a couple of things should happen.
Firstly, you will receive no communications from them.
Secondly, during any transition where matchmaking is at work (so basically, hyperspace jumps, entering and exiting super cruise) you are much less likely to be matched with the blocked Commander.
Blocking becomes weaker when it comes up against friends (and next year, player wings), because if a blocked Commander is in the same session as a friend (say, because they haven't blocked the Commander, the blocking effect is overruled by the friendship matchmaking.
Outside of this case though, blocking should work fine"
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showth...CK#post1219313

Hello Commanders!
A couple of points worth noting:
The block effect is asymmetrical, in that it is much stronger when the blocking player is arriving at a location where the blocked player already is - effectively more of the onus is on the blocker to change their game than the blocked player.
Instancing is a pretty complicated calculation, affected by a significant number of checks, such as instance populations, quality of player connections, friends, wing members, blocked players, blocking players, recent connections (and possibly more - far cleverer folk than me work this out). The weightings for these elements varies as well - wing membership, for example, is an extremely strong weighting towards allowing a match up.
Whilst I'm sure that to some degree matchmaking can be influenced, the complexity and number of elements completely out of the player's control (or even knowledge) are a strong limiting factor.

At the end of the day, ignoring players is a completely personal choice, that influences the chance of meeting ignored players, reducing the potential for match making with them.

Link : https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...-with-griefing-(part-2)?p=5787391#post5787391

 

[Deleted member 182079]

I'm with you, and FWIW, I was previously in favour of blocking disruptive players. It was actually a post by Morbad some time ago that changed my mind on the subject. Instancing in this game is broken enough, without breaking it more. By blocking a player that I find disruptive, I can potentially influence the instancing of many other innocent parties, and for my part, this is something I don't want to do. Hence my block list is empty.

If I find a particular player or situation unpalatable, I'll move to PG or Solo - this choice I make only affects me, not others.

As I said, that's just me - I don't like to think I'm causing problems for other players. Others may feel different.

Yep, it may have been Morbad for me also who made me aware of this (but others, too, to be fair - I'm not a PvP player as such but I sympathise with their pleas more often than not).

I simply don't feel the need to die on any particular hill just to "win" an arbitrary argument with a rando on the internet, I do want to become a better player and be considerate whether I play a game or anything else IRL (I strongly believe in the golden rule " Do not do unto others as you would that they should do unto you") but sadly have to accept others simply don't give a fig, so I treat them in kind.

 

[Deleted member 182079]

Its...its quite unfortunate...you think the word i used "Pandemic" is that the wrd you are referring to? Taken from the interwebs, maybe you are not aware the word "Pandemic" is used in other ways too...example in context of this thread and posts of "BLOCKING" did you miss the context perhaps? I am not responsible to how you interpret your own narrative and internal bias to a word being used a lot lately. It is bad what is going on but you miss-interpreted the contaxt...thats on you, careful of the accusations.
(hi-jacked topic of blocking in game - i think it might be my fault so i will apologize for the hi-jack as i initially asked the question that Morbad and other responded to if it was still possible to do a blocking action)

Here is online example from interwebs of the word used in other CONTEXT similar to my intentions. Morbad was referring to instance blocking being a "potential serious problem" in ED...its not...other IT issues are to blame.
Examples of pandemic in a Sentence

Noun … globalization, the most thoroughgoing socioeconomic upheaval since the Industrial Revolution, which has set off a pandemic of retrogressive nationalism, regional separatism, and religious extremism.— Martin Filler, New York Review of Books, 24 Sept. 2009 …

it also hopes to utilize this cultural investigation to better understand strategies to reduce the massive pandemic we now understand cigarette smoking to produce.— Allan M. Brandt, The Cigarette Century, 2007

Well, thanks for that patronising post, you put a lot more effort into that than would've been necessary. A simple "no that's not what I meant" would've sufficed.

 

[Darth CareBear]

Yep, it may have been Morbad for me also who made me aware of this (but others, too, to be fair - I'm not a PvP player as such but I sympathise with their pleas more often than not).

I simply don't feel the need to die on any particular hill just to "win" an arbitrary argument with a rando on the internet, I do want to become a better player and be considerate whether I play a game or anything else IRL (I strongly believe in the golden rule " Do not do unto others as you would that they should do unto you") but sadly have to accept others simply don't give a fig, so I treat them in kind.

I agree with you Obi, butt...you accused me of using the Big Flu to ridicule someone did i really?, was that treating things fairly or kind?

 

[antiriad]

I dont think you need to be concerned about spoiling other future innocent players instances with any blocks, it seems players who are blocked have preference over an instance...below.

Yeah I get your point, but I weighed up the pros and cons and have made my decision. Others may choose differently, and that's fine. My personal code of conduct is the main factor in my choice.

Do not do unto others as you would that they should do unto you

This is exactly why I made the choice that I did.

 

[Deleted member 182079]

I agree with you Obi, butt...you accused me of using the Big Flu to ridicule someone did i really?, was that treating things fairly or kind?

The tone makes the music, doesn't it. Combined with your belittling attitude in your posts, throwing in the word pandemic (while being in the midst of one so quite topical and specific a word to use) triggered my response. If you can't take it don't give it etc.

 

[Manticore]

Used to be a ship upgrade was an investment, you worked in it until it paid off and made you enough to make another upgrade. Now it's the blip on the road to Anaconda.

Those were the days:

 

[Darth CareBear]

The tone makes the music, doesn't it. Combined with your belittling attitude in your posts, throwing in the word pandemic (while being in the midst of one so quite topical and specific a word to use) triggered my response. If you can't take it don't give it etc.

Sorry for you assuming my attitude and again missing the context not sure how you get tone of typed words on a forum, not everything on this forum, is related to what is happening out in the world, maybe the context of a post/ thread is still relevant regardless if there for example was just a massive explosion in EU?

Anyway that was not my intention for you to be triggered, and i can see you've doubled down on what you think my intentions were, may you and the internet forgive me then? Cheerio

 

[Deleted member 182079]

Sorry for you assuming my attitude and again missing the context not sure how you get tone of typed words on a forum, not everything on this forum, is related to what is happening out in the world, maybe the context of a post/ thread is still relevant regardless if there for example was just a massive explosion in EU?

Anyway that was not my intention for you to be triggered, and i can see you've doubled down on what you think my intentions were, may you and the internet forgive me then? Cheerio

There are posters who have a habit of using horrible things that happen in the real world to belittle issues we discuss in this forum (made-up example would be along the lines of "you complain about a bug when there's millions of children dying of hunger!") basically shutting down any discussion to be had (and are presumably doing this to win the argument) because the issue at hand is irrelevant, even though it isn't for others in the context of the game they play.

Your posts above did read like that to me, if that wasn't your intention then fair enough.

 

[Darth CareBear]

There are posters who have a habit of using horrible things that happen in the real world to belittle issues we discuss in this forum (made-up example would be along the lines of "you complain about a bug when there's millions of children dying of hunger!") basically shutting down any discussion to be had (and are presumably doing this to win the argument) because the issue at hand is irrelevant, even though it isn't for others in the context of the game they play.

Your posts above did read like that to me, if that wasn't your intention then fair enough.

Yeah i get it...

Imagine being falsely accused based on the history and posts of others and then Cancelled, like being blocked in ED based on the attitudes and history of others...seems legit

Thanx, i wish you well then CMDR! Cheerio

 

[Starshot_Jigawatts]

Yeah i get it...

Imagine being falsely accused based on the history and posts of others and then Cancelled, like being blocked in ED based on the attitudes and history of others...seems legit

Thanx, i wish you well then CMDR! Cheerio

That's the guy who made it a point to say he was ignoring me because I argued too hard, but didn't provide any reasoning. Just that I guess he didn't like my points or whatever.

Gotta love the whole " You aren't worth talking to but I'm making a post specifically to tell you that I'm not talking to you" forum posts LOL. They never go out of style...

 

[Navigare Necesse Est]

That's the guy who made it a point to say he was ignoring me because I argued too hard, but didn't provide any reasoning. Just that I guess he didn't like my points or whatever.

Gotta love the whole " You aren't worth talking to but I'm making a post specifically to tell you that I'm not talking to you" forum posts LOL. They never go out of style...

Stuff like that only appears once or twice.

 

[killerofstars]

Why do you have to wait 25 seconds to build a marine in Starcraft 2? Why is my running speed limited in Minecraft? I'm not a child, I no longer need to be taught patience, so shouldn't I be allowed to fly a Dreadnaught in EVE from the get go?
No, of course not. Because time sinks aren't (usually) used to waste the player's time, they're used to reward the savvy player who used some foresight to anticipate their needs and optimize the time spent, and also allow other events to interfere in the meantime, such that your goals might be pushed back, creating more opportunities for gameplay.

I'm not saying everything should be instant. I'm saying your ships should always be immediately available for free at every station. For free. I say this because however long it's been since ship transfers became available, the way this tends to affect my playtime is that I go to where I intend to transfer a ship, start the transfer and then LOG OFF and do something else for an hour or two till it gets there. Any gameplay design that encourages players not to actually play the game is a bad design.

I say it should be available for free because as my fleet has grown in size, I tend to stay rooted in one spot, unlikely to transfer or move to another station. That's also something the devs have said they specifically wanted to avoid.