ty. tyvm.
combat the combat loggers
- Thread starter livijambo
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ty. tyvm.
FD may consider that what I did was cheating @RasputinX, but are you really saying I have to a actually kill the NPC rather than go back to work? I was just trying to get from one station to another in my break, already been interdicted once and won. Then got another one.
I'll repeat was winning but it was taking too long, really I wasn't going to lose anything other than my job. So you're saying I should lower my shields, throttle down and let my ship get blown up because the lasers I had were making a long job of eating through the NPC's hull. Even then I don't know how long the NPC would take to kill me, this was pre the recent NPC buff so it was doing a poor job of attacking me.
And I agree combat logging is wrong other than that occasion I don't do it and have been killed by other commanders.
My point though is combat logging is only an issue because it impacts on real players. NPC's wouldn't complain, so let's look at how it impacts real players. Well it stops them from taking a kill, often an easy kill with a much lower rigged out ship on the other end. So talking of impact on real players, being interdicted by a wing all kitted out for killing can wipe out anyone in a trading/mining rig out almost immediately. And that's why people go to solo, or mobius which will leave open even emptier than it is.
I actually find being attacked by real commanders quite exciting but only if you have a chance at getting away. If it's guaranteed death/lost cargo then that's no fun from the trader end.
EDIT
In fact does it actually count as combat logging if you're winning the fight?
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Well, it used to be BMW drivers, but BMW seem to have changed their attitude. BMWs are now marketed as high quality and luxurious. Audi ads are always aimed at the genitally challenged aggressive driver types, and are pretty much the only marque to be advertised this way in the UK.
Obviously is is only a small percentage of Audi drivers who are complete spanners, but if you are ever tailgated, cut up, or otherwise hassled on the road more often than not, the car will have four interlinked circles on the front of it.
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Yes, this.
To get this clear:
Combat logoff is exploiting/cheating and will get punished when reported or recorded frequently.
Yes, even against NPC combat logoff is using exploit.
BUT
Combat logoff is only when dash and quit or cut connection or power down usw.
The save and exit option with the 10 seconds delay IS NOT combat logoff for FD.
For FD that way is legit.
My opinion is the delay should be increased to 60 or at least 30... another story...
In combat with other cmdrs it is in this current state a legit form off combat logoff.
I understand it must be a quick and legit form to end the game, but I will report even that legit way off logoff in combat, in the hope of when this player often get reported to use this as an escape FD will rethink the delay time.
So guys, be honorable and never logoff during combat when not RL problems occur suddenly.
Good times and fly safe
I should maybe research this stuff more before commenting! In that case I've never combat logged. Thanks for the clarification Shadowrunner.
This has been discussed to death, but it has always been my feeling that if the in-game system (basically insurance, but maybe a little beyond that...) inspires people to log-off/cheat, then it could be improved. Obvious choices would be: some kind of no-claims discount; different insurance scales for ship class/type; a mechanism for surrendering in 1v1 PvP PvE combat; penalties for destruction of unarmed ships, or ships with no cargo which don't deploy weapons. There are probably plenty of things. I've never, ever even considered pulling the plug in PvP combat, but I do have a knack of running away, but clearly something's wrong if people are having to do it. I prefer PvP in CQC, but clearly that's such a different "feeling". Maybe something's missing in the cross-over of Elite to multiplayer, and forcing combat isn't correct? If an Anaconda interdicts a Sidewinder, I really don't want some copy'n'paste "boost, boost, boost and get back into SuperCruise" response. Most people can see the wrong in it. I just can't see the solution. 
Obviously you don't fly a T9. Boost? What's that, 4 seconds from an overly agro human players combat built ship is a death sentence. I play solo, I promote solo, because if you don't drop cargo than human so called pirate, goes agro, and shoots to kill cause that person isn't getting their way. 5 million to rebuy my T9, thats an hour of trading 30 seconds is all it takes a combat ship to kill me. What do they get? Nothing but a bigger so called ego, what do they lose, lol ill leave that to the imagination, but its I who lose. I lose my cargo, my hour of time and my 5 million all cause some jack wants to play CQC in open. So go solo, don't combat log!!!! And don't say just drop your cargo. I've tried this and watched the guy laugh as I drop it and I die. So do I trust that the pirate won't kill me no, what then do I do? SOLO. cause there is no other option. Some may say party with friends, not everyone wants to follow my slow t9 from one station to the next.
I would. Well actually I think you'd have to compromise your profit's for me as I can't jump as far as a T9.
You obviously know a lot about how licensing works, but that still does not justify the creators in revoking licenses. Just because you can ban people doesn't mean you should. This is'nt a question of what they can do it's a question of should they be doing it, and they should not.
We'll have less or your sensible observations, thank you very much. You're talking about treating the cause and not the effect. We don't do that around here.
Let me calrify my position as you seem to believe I'm all for combat logging. The only way to solve the problem is for FD to abandon P2P architecture, which simply won't happen. I'm against your idea as I honestly believe it will make matters worse not better. As we stand, people can log with impunity. Giving them something to lose has the capacity to backfire drastically. Right now they have no need to be inventive. Don't give them one.
I totally agree and one of the reasons I only play solo now as well. If someone wants to be aggressive why should I have to submit to them. I have seen a couple games do this mostly racing games where u accept or deny the request to race or combat. With that FDev has a record now if the loser combat logged. I don't know if anyone else made this point as well cuz I didn't read fsr enough ahead
First off, I am completely aware that Frontier considers combat logging (ie: manually and intentionally pulling the plug) an Exploit and have shadowbanned people in the past for doing so.
That said, I'm always fascinated by the "combat logging discussion", particularly in how passionately people feel about it. More specifically, I'm amazed in how intensely people feel "wronged", even though they have not actually been cheated.
What is the "cost" of being combat logged upon? What do people "lose" when their target does so?
Sometimes there is a bounty, but it seems that most often the winner would have little to actual gain if the combat had reached its full conclusion (in the case of killing traders/miners).
So, from the winner's position, what is the difference between someone combat logging at 1% hull or blowing them up? A few more shots and a pretty explosion? The knowledge that the loser has been financially penalized for the loss?
My speculation: It seems that people only feel that the combat has reached a resolution when a ship is destroyed. If someone FSD's out of there, that prompts a need to pursue (to Supercruise, to the next system, etc) with the intention to re-interdict, and continue the fight (to the conclusion of a destroyed ship). If someone combat logs, it seems to cause a lot of anxiety, because the player has this need to conclude the combat, but they know they cannot because the other player has left. There is enough emotional turmoil from this lack of resolution that people have a need to seek consolation (ie: creating forum posts) from their peergroup. And, equally amazing, the peer group understands, and shares in these feelings (as you can tell from all the posts that agree).
Anyways, that's my psuedo-psychological take on it. Can someone please help me understand why combat logging is such a big deal? Because I really have a hard time seeing it.
That said, I'm always fascinated by the "combat logging discussion", particularly in how passionately people feel about it. More specifically, I'm amazed in how intensely people feel "wronged", even though they have not actually been cheated.
What is the "cost" of being combat logged upon? What do people "lose" when their target does so?
Sometimes there is a bounty, but it seems that most often the winner would have little to actual gain if the combat had reached its full conclusion (in the case of killing traders/miners).
So, from the winner's position, what is the difference between someone combat logging at 1% hull or blowing them up? A few more shots and a pretty explosion? The knowledge that the loser has been financially penalized for the loss?
My speculation: It seems that people only feel that the combat has reached a resolution when a ship is destroyed. If someone FSD's out of there, that prompts a need to pursue (to Supercruise, to the next system, etc) with the intention to re-interdict, and continue the fight (to the conclusion of a destroyed ship). If someone combat logs, it seems to cause a lot of anxiety, because the player has this need to conclude the combat, but they know they cannot because the other player has left. There is enough emotional turmoil from this lack of resolution that people have a need to seek consolation (ie: creating forum posts) from their peergroup. And, equally amazing, the peer group understands, and shares in these feelings (as you can tell from all the posts that agree).
Anyways, that's my psuedo-psychological take on it. Can someone please help me understand why combat logging is such a big deal? Because I really have a hard time seeing it.
Its quite simple. Video games (and internet discussions) give people with no power in real life an inflated sense of ego.
For example, I saw a user post referring to himself a god. I gaurantee in real life this person is a pathetic excuse for a human. The only power they wield comes from their imagination. Combat logging denies these individuals satisfaction and, since video games are their primary source of self esteem, they take it as a personal affront. Some go as far as to record or tattle. These are the saddest people of all.
it is also cheating .personally i take it as a minor victory against an inferior player.but as someone said earlier real life gets in the road which reminds me
Perhaps you can explain it for me, livijambo, since you started the thread.
When a person combat logs against you, what does it "cheat" you out of? You still won the encounter. You battled against another player until there was a clear victor (you). At the end of it, only you were "left standing".
What have you lost from the other player combat logging that you would have gained from destroying his ship? What did his combat logging take from you?
Help me understand what all the fuss is about, if you would.
That is irrelevant. If you don't agree with the Ts & Cs that the licence requires you to agree to, don't use the software.
time
as in it takes time to work out what a player has been up to before and since a disconnection, time that a dev and support team are not likely to have to spare.
as in it takes time to work out what a player has been up to before and since a disconnection, time that a dev and support team are not likely to have to spare.
I'll lose out on some nice cargo.
unfortunately i don't make the rules ,its microsoft who made them and quitting early is against the terms and conditions that all xbox players signed and agreed too .
as i said i take it as minor victory,most who combat log have attacked me 1st ,now if you start something at least be man enough to see it through to the end .
now i do alot of power play in enemy controlled systems and if i see someone from another faction in a combat vessel he is fair game and if he logs he has cost me 30 merits.
influence the out come of power play .
Again it is also against the game mechanics which frontier frown upon and have banned players in the past for combat logging it happens
i started this thread as a way of keeping players in the game.by not getting then banned but with a financial punishment against them (reduction of 10% from their assets)this way they will be grateful to lose only 5% for there re buy .
again i know real life comes in to it but am sure they don't loss connection when they mining , trading or exploring only when they are down to 20% and no shields .
as i said i take it as minor victory,most who combat log have attacked me 1st ,now if you start something at least be man enough to see it through to the end .
now i do alot of power play in enemy controlled systems and if i see someone from another faction in a combat vessel he is fair game and if he logs he has cost me 30 merits.
influence the out come of power play .
Again it is also against the game mechanics which frontier frown upon and have banned players in the past for combat logging it happens
i started this thread as a way of keeping players in the game.by not getting then banned but with a financial punishment against them (reduction of 10% from their assets)this way they will be grateful to lose only 5% for there re buy .
again i know real life comes in to it but am sure they don't loss connection when they mining , trading or exploring only when they are down to 20% and no shields .
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