Conveying this games "Story" through nothing but text is unacceptable.

[Comrade Napoleon]

Ah, that's interesting.

Off topic but wasn't the biblical Salome a seductive dancer as well ?
The 'Dance of the seven veils' ?
The plot thickens !

I am all in for that "seductive dancer" stuff!! Too little of that !
Forget about those veils, veils are highly overrated imo!!
But I am just an old swine...
What DID you expect, anyway

Cheers Cmdr's

 

[lysan]

in ARMA they use the news flash to give the headlines. if you want to know more you need to read.

[video=youtube;lQpLtaggimE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQpLtaggimE[/video]

 

[Haleks]

Over do it and people will start complaining about the game spamming them?

We are very far from being spammed (at least when it comes to plot heads up), I think FD has a lot of room for improvements in many areas.

Drew said earlier that everything (plot-wise) is in Galnet; "everything is buried deep in Galnet" would be a more accurate statement : there's no search option ingame, and unless someone reads galnet every day of the month, he will most likely miss on a lot of informations or plots (and don't tell me to go read galnet on the web). Where are the Sports and Alien Encounters pages? Newspapers in the 21st century are more convenient to read.
How about displaying a holographic headline in stations whenever something major happens (like an encounter of the first kind)? No voice-over needed (yay!).

Speaking of voice vs text, NPC tend to become kinda depressive when they text you that they are going to pirate you (don't say it, do it for starters!) or when someone broadcasts to the entire system that he's about to get married...
It feels cheap, but more importantly it feels gamey and completely out of touch with the work that has been done on orbital stations immersion-wise.

 

[Enderby]

With no disrespect to Mr David Braben OBE, he is only a OBE and not a KBE thus the use off Sir is incorrect, unless of course he was Knighted by the Queen then we can use the prefix of Sir.

I see this a lot around here, OBE does not make one a Sir unless your Knighted by the Queen. (I might be wrong here, not sure if Mr B was knighted or just awarded the OBE)

Of course we can call each other sir as in you "sir are incompetent and should not be posting such off thread tosh" thus I shall take my leave and let this thread get back on topic.

Aye, Davo is an OBE, not a knight, so he is not a 'Sir'.

 

[Punished Mobius]

I don't disagree that NPC dialogue is repetitive at this stage and that there is clearly only a limited set of phrases being cycled. But NPC dialogue is only one of many textual components in the game. It's probably on a list; a prioritised, time-dependent, does-this-add-more-than-that-to-the-game list. All text has to be QAd, translated, checked, inserted into dev releases and tested. It's not a case of populating a file called dumbNPC.txt and uploading it to an AWS server. Maybe it's on hold because of another feature, maybe it's on hold because the dialogue system is slated for replacement at some point in the future. Who knows? Game dev is a matter of working with priorities. Any 'little' feature might not take much time on its own, but it's time a dev isn't doing something else. That all adds up and a dev lead makes a call.

Player submitted dialogue saves no time as it would all need to be verified and checked for consistency by a QA team and leads to more IP complication than it's worth. Submitters try to drop in dialogue from their favourite films or TV shows. TL;DR the idea has been investigated and rejected already.

FMV dialogue? It takes weeks to do this to match the quality level seen elsewhere in the visuals, its simply not viable with a team the size of the one at FDev. They'd face the combined criticism of the videos themselves and 'why are you wasting time making video when you should be working on the game'.

FDev read out loud Galnet? And stick two fingers up to the community streamers and youtubers that have been doing this for years? I doubt it.

That's before you get to the consistency. What about mission text. What about in-game non-NPC description and dialogue, what about scannable artefacts. It's simply too big.

Perhaps outsource it? Have you any idea how much that costs?

Even with all this you'll get the same sarcastic responses as I've seen already on this thread. "There is a story?" In place of "I don't read GalNet" you'll have "I don't watch the videos, who wants cutscenes in an MMO?"

The priorities in the game are set. You can't please all of the people all of the time, so you aim to please the maximum number you can with the resources you have.

As for the book I'm writing. No one at Frontier has the time to do that, lots of people want books. Not everyone does. For less than the price of a shipkit you can have a story in the ED universe that expands on what GalNet has been telling you, coupled with in-game mysteries and actual content... and (hopefully) be entertained for several hours.

Like that shipkit you can buy it if you want to, or not. The choice is yours. The same goes with the story. You're not the hero, you're just a bystander. Get involved if you want, or don't bother. The story doesn't owe you anything, you're just some random person in a spaceship.

So far that book represents 243 days of writing effort and time and it will cost you the price of a few beers when it comes out. That is known in the trade as a schmucking bargain.

Cheers,

Drew.

I am not trying to just dismiss these points and problems. But it really seems the answer to me is that Fdev have bit off more than they can chew and so we get to all choke on mediocrity for other aspects of the game. Because it's too big too hard or takes too long.

The story could be livened up by placing little tidbits when possible. A moon blows up like the other week? Place an asteroid field. A ship crashes? Place a wreck. Have it jump off the pages something that small could add so much for the people who care. It doesn't have to be much more than it is already. No movie studios. No newscasts. Just sprinkle some breadcrumbs when you can. Get this "Plot" out of a text vacuum. They can place objects and things without a server reset now so I don't see why not add a little something to applicable systems when possible.

As for dialogue the human brain is incapable of not reading. So when some turd burglar comes to steal my Biowaste haul I am forced to read whatever nonsense the AI is spamming me with subconsciously. And I really just can't accept that this is taking a backseat. AI text is front and center. Something that is directly in the spotlight of all players should not be this slapdash. Yeah sure you guys have priorities. But people have been on about this stuff since the beginning. It has been a joke for years. And only even got worse as time went by. It really doesn't feel like prioritization. It feels being ignored because they feel it is good enough. Because they are actually somehow happy with it. And I am sure to whoever wrote the wedding barge dialogue that anything is considered good enough to them if these are the standards of dialogue they accept. You are right though player submitted dialogue wouldn't save time. But it would still be leagues better than what has been put out so far. But the foot came down on that idea already I suppose. As far as difficulties go in getting the dialogue in the game. Whether you have to write conditions and code for a line to be read. That is the devs problem. And I don't want to hear it. If they have still not yet made a way to semi easily inject text lines at this stage of development than that is just another case of you guys painting yourself into a corner.

As for your book. I just don't get it. Usually a Universe that gets a book will have massive amounts of lore and whatnot to work off already from the actual game. But in this case it is the exact opposite. Basically no lore in the actual game. And so they are writing a book to supplement it. Usually this type of effort would go towards a codex or something in the actual game. But instead it is being used to prey on a very distinct subclass of Neeeeerds that are indigenous to this game and this game alone. I am sure it will be a fine enough book on its own. But I just can't justify an "extended universe" when there is nothing to even really extend in the first place?
Elite Dangerous (Lore sold separately)
Again to be clear I am sure it will be great in and of itself. But to take another game as example the reason no one batted an eye when Mass Effect started churning out books and comics and all that was because they already had a small books worth of stuff in the original game. Same goes for many other titles. So it just seems to me that by writing this book ED is trying to join a club that by rights it has absolutely no business being a part of yet.

 

[Enderby]

Need game not book.

 

[Han_Zen]

Need game not book.

I agree. Books are bad. They can hurt your eyes. You end up with glasses and knowledge other discdusting stuff.

 

[Enderby]

I agree. Books are bad. They can hurt your eyes. You end up with glasses and knowledge other discdusting stuff.

I'm an avid reader. I studied literature at university. But this computer program needs more added to IT rather than separate books.

 

[NMS]

Need game not book.

You're an unimaginative guy ... 75% of the gameplay content was designed thinking that with one hand you would hold the joystick and in the other hand a book, and so you will imagine that you are doing everything you want in space or planets, while maneuvering Your ship. Imagination is your limit in this game.

 

[Enderby]

You're an unimaginative guy ... 75% of the gameplay content was designed thinking that with one hand you would hold the joystick and in the other hand a book, and so you will imagine that you are doing everything you want in space or planets, while maneuvering Your ship. Imagination is your limit in this game.

Yes, I think the fault must lay entirely with me.

 

[Han_Zen]

I'm an avid reader. I studied literature at university. But this computer program needs more added to IT rather than separate books.

I was just pulling your legg. This book does not come at the expence of anything else. It's just an adition to the lore. It's self financing and does not take dev resources.
It's a pure bonus that makes the game richer.

 

[Enderby]

I was just pulling your legg.

Ha! You got me!

 

[zarrazee]

OP. Agree.

 

[JosiahD]

I think what some need to realise is that we, as a player, are not the central protagonist in the story. None of us are. We're not the hero here. Relatively speaking, we're nobody, just another pilot flying around. The plots being weaved by Frontier are background, there only to provide flavour to the galaxy. Otherwise the galaxy would seem stagnant. The notion that Frontier could do more with it is true, but don't expect something whereby every CMDR is the central hero to a storyline. A fortunate few might occasionally get the opportunity to have some part to play, to get their 15 mins of fame or notoriety. But if you're expecting to be the saviour of the galaxy, that's not what's going to happen imho and I'm not convinced it should (at least as individuals). Even the superpowers don't really care that much about you, even if you do happen to have high rank with their Navy.

Now, how Frontier reconciles that we're all actually insignificant with the current Navy rank structures, and how we can simultaneously be high rank with both the Federation and Empire navies beats me. Completely at odds with the idea that we're insignificant in the grand scheme of things. Bring on the Navy career structure and disconnect the two so we have to choose one or the other.....

 

[Han_Zen]

The ranks are for auxilary possitions. They give you no command. It's a reward, not a job.

 

[Dbrn47]

They've done a little more than just text, but of course, you conveniently and consistently ignore anything contrary to your own myopic viewpoints.

They've had ships, faster than anything we have haunt the edge of our sensors.
They've had UA morse code challenges.
They've had cryptic sound files outlining graphical maps.
They've had alien crash sites.
They've had lost outposts pop up on planets.
They've had alien compounds appear with various items and objects.
They've had clues in news outlets throughout core space and Colonia.
They've had hyperdictions by unknown alien ships.
I'm sure I'm missing some, but I've made my point. It's a slow burn, built up over years and just now coming together.

Sir David Braben, OBE, is a proven, award winning, game designer who has sold over 2.2 million copies of Elite: Dangerous. Fortunately, he does not pattern his successful games to the wishes of ignorant, insolent and unappreciative brats. Not that it would make any difference, as I'm positive you'd go "meh" to anything put in front of you, regardless of scale or medium. Miserable people, who've accomplished nothing in their own lives, like to try to tear down others who have achieved something.

Whenever I read your posts, I always imagine a flappy seagull making incoherent and cacophonous noise while simultaneously crapping over everything.

Meh.

This thread interests me greatly.

Firstly, and this is meant in no way to disrespect Drew for the work he has done.

No in-game story should be hidden behind a paywall. Lead up, history, that sort of thing isn't so bad I suppose, but when you mix that with actual gameplay, then I will always have an issue.

Back in the day, when gaming was a lot more innocent, I remember various games having their backstory released in a book that came free with the game in question. I still remember StarGlider, and the accompanying novel which was a great read, and a good way of explaining what you were doing in the game.

There was another one too... The Dark Wheel. Now.. I can't quite remember what game that came free with....

Anyway, today, you have to buy extra books to even have an inkling of what some aspects of the game is about. That's just not on. Frontier should have commissioned Drew to write these books and they definitely should have been part of the overall package. If Drew wants to write fanfiction which has no bearing on the game, then that's up to him - but to tie a game to something he has written AND expect players to pay for it just to understand what's actually happening in game... nope, sorry.

As for Galnet? Quite apart from the fact that it frequently breaks the 4th wall, which IMO is horrific, it simply doesn't work in a means to convey the Elite galaxy. Properly written story-based updates are hidden amongst cold procedurally generated stats. I heartily recommend Cmdr Wotherspoon's audio version of the News, it's great to listen to. However, this should be in game. There should be Breaking News articles that play either when you're flying about, or when you first log in, to alert you to new stuff going on. And I would like to HEAR these articles in game, on the 'official' GalNet News channel.

We should not have to wait for out-of-game newsletters to know what's going on. We need to have this IN-GAME, where it belongs. Hell, pay Wotherspoon to do what he does to play it in game - he is virtually the Voice of Galnet as it is.

As for other means of story delivery? Not every single player needs to visit the NPC to get the mission of the hour. That's not how a single world works - and we really don't want Elite to turn into Galaxy of Warcraft do we? Let individuals find the next piece of the puzzle. After all, the moniker 'your story' applies to everyone, and if your own personal story involves being the envoy of Humanity... then that's awesome.

The galaxy is too quiet. Pirates that menacingly threaten you by text? The only voices you hear are from station control? That seriously needs to change. I'm not suggesting voiceovers for everything... but I would like to HEAR people talking to me on occasion. Hell I would supply voiceovers for free (limited stock) if it meant bringing the galaxy more to life than it is now. Everything feels sterile, dead. There is so much life in Elite, but it's very shy.

Imagination only takes you so far.

Summed it up pretty nicely for me. While it's there, it always feels so far removed and partitioned that I can't be bothered to pay attention to any of it.

 

[Madrax573]

A question for the people complaining about this stuff.

When watching the new on the TV or whatever news website you frequent do you automatically think 'Damn why aren't I there in the middle of all that actions/drama/whatever'?

I'd bet a lot of credits that you don't.

 

[CMDR ColD_ZA]

A question for the people complaining about this stuff.

When watching the new on the TV or whatever news website you frequent do you automatically think 'Damn why aren't I there in the middle of all that actions/drama/whatever'?

I'd bet a lot of credits that you don't.

Nope, that's why I play PC games, so I can be in the middle of the action/drama/whatever

 

[Goose4291]

A question for the people complaining about this stuff.

When watching the new on the TV or whatever news website you frequent do you automatically think 'Damn why aren't I there in the middle of all that actions/drama/whatever'?

I'd bet a lot of credits that you don't.

That would be because its a game, and not real life.

- - - Updated - - -

You're an unimaginative guy ... 75% of the gameplay content was designed thinking that with one hand you would hold the joystick and in the other hand a book, and so you will imagine that you are doing everything you want in space or planets, while maneuvering Your ship. Imagination is your limit in this game.

That would explain why the AI is so atrocious, if we're only supposed to use 25% of our attention on the game

 

[Madrax573]

That would be because its a game, and not real life.

It's also a simulation. And if everyone was bombarded with 'story stuff' all the time the amount of whining about it would be huge!

I for one would much rather FD spend their time and effort on other things than some of the suggestions for tarting up the story stuff.