Could core mining mechanics be used to create salvage gameplay

Just something I thought last night. Like, instead of planting charges to fissures to crack asteroids, we'd have derelict spacecrafts (megaships/carriers/etc) and abandoned outposts to scan and locate weak spots on the hull, bulkheads and so on. Then blow those up to gain access to whatever there might be inside. But just like in core mining, we'd have to be careful with the charges to create a controlled detonation. Too much force and the whole thing just blows up to your face.

What the salvage would be then? And what would be the salvage equivalent of a mother lode and should there be one? I don't really know. This isn't a fully fledged mechanic or even a fully fledged concept, just an idea that crossed my mind I thought was interesting. And I guess not so much about what to find but how to find.

But to elaborate little further just for the heck of it.. Maybe we'd find them with the FSS, then use pulse wave scanner (an industrial variant, of course) to scan the ships/stations, fire prospector, blow a hole to the hull and collect. But unlike 'roids I think ships and outposts could have several possible locations to blow up; loading bays, storage areas, processing plants, the usual places you'd expect to find on such installations. And outposts could be found further in deep space as well. In a way it would make sense; companies expand too far, too aggressively, a promising moon or ring turns out to be a bust, no way to negate the expenses, company goes belly up and all the assets are left behind to slowly decay out of existence. Until a salvage ship happens upon them.

Maybe there could be some new type of "bulk scraps" to collect, among other things? Electrical components, hull parts and what not. You could then sell these to salvage traders on stations and they'd pay according to what they need or are more interested in.
 
No, because FD will want to make three new weapons, two ulitiies, and ten new limpets, all of which will be required to do basic salvage gameplay. Optionally you can add two further utilities - but they only work in multicrew, to perform advanced salvage - which is the only type that earns more than ten credits per decade.
 

Deleted member 38366

D
Some good ideas.... I always wondered why there's no Option for at least a Data Link Scan on derelict Vessels. A little backstory on them, how they ended up failing.

Such a scan (analog to MegaShip/Structures) could reveal weak spots to cut into the hull or the location of Hatches (hacking gameplay), plus yield info about contained Equipment or remaining Cargo.

But I guess it would really only excel after we get some form of space legs - EVA galore to investigate a cold, dark Ship that holds numerous surprises.
Some very good opportunities buried down that route :)

In a fully fleshed out Gameplay, we might end up (with the right Equipment) to mark such a find and return later (timer) to our Beacon with a highly dedicated Salvage Vessel that can either salvage larger components or even restore the Ship back into a somewhat flying condition. A wreck that'll cost to restore but a "Salvage motherlode" might be worth it.

Yep, that'd work.

-- edit --

I think in lieu of literal space legs.... something like the claustrophobic use of a remote controlled Drone in close quarters might work just fine. Fullscreen Telepresence basically.

Make the drones valuable and a bit of a pain to lose, some flying challenges and make it interact with its surroundings.
Given the excellent audio team we got, that should make for a good atmosphere - even if no real EVA was possible yet (i.e. technical reasons).
[ but obviously space legs would be absolutely golden for it ]
 
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Yeah, I think salvage and rescue basically screams space legs/EVA.

Might also give some proper scale for those ships and structures (for non-VR players) when you're EVA'ing in and around one.
 
I think that'd make some great gameplay there.
Maybe even loot modules or dislodge them, you need to take them to engineers to have them adapted to your ship, or repaired (needs big cargo hold).

But as others said, you'd need space legs for that, to go exploring and wander around in ships and stations.
 
Salvage gameplay is surely something that should be attached to space legs if/when it comes.
I agree. Sure, mining mechanics are very nice, but it would only make the game feel more repetitive if they were to copy/paste them to other aspects of the game.

No, because FD will want to make three new weapons, two ulitiies, and ten new limpets, all of which will be required to do basic salvage gameplay. Optionally you can add two further utilities - but they only work in multicrew, to perform advanced salvage - which is the only type that earns more than ten credits per decade.

That just gave me an idea - what if spacelegs could add the option "replace" things such as recon limpets, hatch breaker limpets and other utility modules, by allowing you to get out of the ship and do it manually? This way we would have a choice: Having to sacrifice a module slot on our ship, or spend more time and effort by going out of the ship.
 
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CQC Assets, Recon/Research limpets, USS and environmental effects are ...

SO
DAMN
UNDERUSED


Literally every mechanic needed exists in the game right now, but for the life of me, FD for whatever reason don't want to build the compelling gameplay around it. One of the mistakes FD made was removing most USS/scenario activity from all unpopulated systems, instead of having systems within 1000LY of the bubble still contain these regularly, which is absolutely realistic (unregistered outpost activity, that sort of thing). Then you'd have two forms of exploration.
  • What currently passes as exploration; and
  • Sub-1000LY exploration, where jump range isn't important, but being kitted out with all sorts of limpets and gear is.
Let's play this out with some undoctored screenshots from the game... and a bit of imagination thrown in.

You're out in the reaches of the bubble... and you spot an automated distress signal. Dump out at it, and you spot this, though slightly more derelict (still powered in some areas)

142455


You scan the derelict outpost and spot a cargo bay. Inside is 20t of LTDs, Voipals, insert your choice of high-value cargo here. Problem is, it's got an active powered security system, and the limpet docking node is inactive.

142456


A further review of your scan shows a potential entry point... you can either hack it open using a recond limpet, or blast it off with siesmic missiles (the one used for core blasting, i forget it's name):

142457


Inside the maintenance tunnel, everything is a mess, and your ship suffers massive interference (essentially, you're taking minor hull damage, and taking periodic system damage, with visual effects like when you approach the damaged section of the oracle in the below video, at 4:20)

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUMkS5zOHpQ&t=260


You navigate the tunnels enduring those conditions and find the power core running the security for the cargo hatch. By this stage, your shields are now offline. It appears to be malfunctioning which is why the limpet port on the cargo hatch is inoperable. You can either:
  • Blow it up; this causes a significant shockwave, potentially damaging your ship critically given you now have no shields; or
  • fire a repair limpet at it.
You decide to blow it up.

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grqVuxcaFDE


You then navigate your way out of the hulk before your ship succumbs to system damage from the interference in the derelict outpost, return to the cargo hatch and claim your reward.

This is just an example using some of the effects. As posted by me here a while back, FD have a host of effects available to them, and all can be used to make interesting, interactive experiences like this.

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threa...echanics-left-at-back-of-the-cupboard.515476/

This sort of thing could then be used for:
  • Missions
  • USS
  • Scenarios
  • State-based USS
... and create a really, really awesome game experience. It's all there, FD just have to use it.
 
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CQC Assets, Recon/Research limpets, USS and environmental effects are ...

SO
DAMN
UNDERUSED


Literally every mechanic needed exists in the game right now, but for the life of me, FD for whatever reason don't want to build the compelling gameplay around it. One of the mistakes FD made was removing most USS/scenario activity from all unpopulated systems, instead of having systems within 1000LY of the bubble still contain these regularly, which is absolutely realistic (unregistered outpost activity, that sort of thing). Then you'd have two forms of exploration.
  • What currently passes as exploration; and
  • Sub-1000LY exploration, where jump range isn't important, but being kitted out with all sorts of limpets and gear is.
Let's play this out with some undoctored screenshots from the game... and a bit of imagination thrown in.

You're out in the reaches of the bubble... and you spot an automated distress signal. Dump out at it, and you spot this, though slightly more derelict (still powered in some areas)

View attachment 142455

You scan the derelict outpost and spot a cargo bay. Inside is 20t of LTDs, Voipals, insert your choice of high-value cargo here. Problem is, it's got an active powered security system, and the limpet docking node is inactive.

View attachment 142456

A further review of your scan shows a potential entry point... you can either hack it open using a recond limpet, or blast it off with siesmic missiles (the one used for core blasting, i forget it's name):

View attachment 142457

Inside the maintenance tunnel, everything is a mess, and your ship suffers massive interference (essentially, you're taking minor hull damage, and taking periodic system damage, with visual effects like when you approach the damaged section of the oracle in the below video, at 4:20)

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUMkS5zOHpQ&t=260


You navigate the tunnels enduring those conditions and find the power core running the security for the cargo hatch. By this stage, your shields are now offline. It appears to be malfunctioning which is why the limpet port on the cargo hatch is inoperable. You can either:
  • Blow it up; this causes a significant shockwave, potentially damaging your ship critically given you now have no shields; or
  • fire a repair limpet at it.
You decide to blow it up.

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grqVuxcaFDE


You then navigate your way out of the hulk before your ship succumbs to system damage from the interference in the derelict outpost, return to the cargo hatch and claim your reward.

This is just an example using some of the effects. As posted by me here a while back, FD have a host of effects available to them, and all can be used to make interesting, interactive experiences like this.

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threa...echanics-left-at-back-of-the-cupboard.515476/

This sort of thing could then be used for:
  • Missions
  • USS
  • Scenarios
  • State-based USS
... and create a really, really awesome game experience. It's all there, FD just have to use it.


This would be crazy good. But of course if FD was to do it they would make sure it's not profitable at all so that no one does it for any other reason than the experience. :cautious:
 

Deleted member 110222

D
I'd like to extend on this nice idea, building on my love of giant explosions.

Demolition contracts.

Abandoned/decommissioned mega ships that need taking apart for scrap.

The contract offers payment for pilots willing to go into close proximity of dangerous work sites and demolish retired assets.

Mostly I just want giant explosions though.
 
I suspect the "best" way to implement a salvage mechanic would be as another kind of USS.

Trouble is, you couldn't really have permanent salvage sites without undermining the immersion of the task or oversimplifying it.
You'd either jump in, chew up a load of wreckage, jump out, jump back in again and it'd all be miraculously restored to it's previous condition so you could chew it up again OR it'd simply end up like an "orbital Dav's Hope" where you could collect stuff without actually interacting with what you find there.

Which probably leaves temporary USSs as the best way to present salvage locations.

If it was me, I'd probably set it up so that the BGS generates salvage USSs within a system for, say, 48 hours after the end of a war.
People deliberately seeking salvage USSs would need to pay attention to the BGS to optimise their opportunities.

I'd also set it up so that salvage yielded mat's, normal cargo and ship modules which'd need suitably large ships and new modules to handle.
If you find a delelict Cutter, for example, you might be able to salvage a set of 8A thrusters off it, which'd be worth half the value of a new set but you'd need to be flying a ship with a C8 Salvage rack installed.

I'd also set it up so that there was some kind of "salvage collector" module which'd help collect salvage but it'd still be awkward to do by yourself - trying to get salvaged modules lined up so they can pyshically be taken aboard your ship would be fiddly.
That being the case, I'd also set it up so that there was some kind of salvage manipulator module which could be fitted to a ship's hardpoints, either for a player to use alone or fit to other ships.

In practice, a lone player could use various tools to slice lumps off a derelict ship, use salvage manipulators to move a lump of salvage into position and then trigger the salvage collector to try and bring it aboard their own ship or players could work together so that, say, a couple of players in Vultures could chop up wreckage, control it and move it across to a larger vessel for collection.
 
I always loved showing up to a uss in an eagle, and finding an exploded cutter with some mats and cargo around it. It felt like something happened and you would never know what it was. overheat ? mutiny ? evacuation ?
 
I'd rather say that's a pretty good gameplay element for space legs (if they ever come...)
Think of the gameplay from Subnautica where you have to enter shipwrecks. Limited air storage, dangers, breaches to open.
I would totally dig that...
I thought the same as I read the OP
 
Some great suggestions in this thread. FD please take note.

Its interesting that one of the loadouts for Fleet Carriers is for Search and Rescue, which IMO is in need of at least a bluff for payouts.
 
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