Elite Dangerous | System Colonisation Claim Pause

[Darth Ender]

I'm on the complete other end of the spectrum, a small 5k ton structure would probably take 2-3 hours for me, and thats mainly just from sourcing all the junk! Weeks for an outpost sounds insane... Whats your setup? I'm running a 784 ton cutter with YT on in the background and both flight computers, and i'm able to move thousands of tons pretty fast. Is your station parked super far out?

what 5k ton are you talking about? an outpost requires almost 25k units of commodities. basically a full carrier load.

it's not like it takes weeks of time to do nothing but trucking. it's that after making 10 runs, you stop having any interest in 'playing'. the only thing driving the mechanic to completion is then just the idea of getting it finished and not failing the mission.

edit: 22085 units for a science outpost. if there is an outpost type that only needs 5k, then yea, that would be a couple hours and make this 15ly limit even more stupid. it would just really incentivize only building that to get you where you want. just a string of useless colonization activity steps.

 

[kepler68]

what 5k ton are you talking about? an outpost requires almost 25k units of commodities. basically a full carrier load.

it's not like it takes weeks of time to do nothing but trucking. it's that after making 10 runs, you stop having any interest in 'playing'. the only thing driving the mechanic to completion is then just the idea of getting it finished and not failing the mission.

edit: 22085 units for a science outpost. if there is an outpost type that only needs 5k, then yea, that would be a couple hours and make this 15ly limit even more stupid. it would just really incentivize only building that to get you where you want. just a string of useless colonization activity steps.

Ahhh i misunderstood. Yeah an outpost would take me an afternoon to build too, based on how fast i sourced mats and how fast i empty carriers doing ida stuff.

And no pressure if hauling bores you, though if you have a ton of credits you could probably get a bunch of new players to haul for you! Set your buy/sell prices such that the haulers make a big profit and then post a thread/on reddit about a moneymaking opportunity!

 

[Darth Ender]

Ahhh i misunderstood. Yeah an outpost would take me an afternoon to build too, based on how fast i sourced mats and how fast i empty carriers doing ida stuff.

And no pressure if hauling bores you, though if you have a ton of credits you could probably get a bunch of new players to haul for you! Set your buy/sell prices such that the haulers make a big profit and then post a thread/on reddit about a moneymaking opportunity!

perhaps I'd hire underlings to fill a carrier... if there was any real need to lose money, still end up space trucking the carrier and end up with a station in a system next to 8000 other systems with the same stations and function/purpose/effect.

 

[Eldritchsen]

what 5k ton are you talking about? an outpost requires almost 25k units of commodities. basically a full carrier load.

it's not like it takes weeks of time to do nothing but trucking. it's that after making 10 runs, you stop having any interest in 'playing'. the only thing driving the mechanic to completion is then just the idea of getting it finished and not failing the mission.

edit: 22085 units for a science outpost. if there is an outpost type that only needs 5k, then yea, that would be a couple hours and make this 15ly limit even more stupid. it would just really incentivize only building that to get you where you want. just a string of useless colonization activity steps.

Ahhh i misunderstood. Yeah an outpost would take me an afternoon to build too, based on how fast i sourced mats and how fast i empty carriers doing ida stuff.

And no pressure if hauling bores you, though if you have a ton of credits you could probably get a bunch of new players to haul for you! Set your buy/sell prices such that the haulers make a big profit and then post a thread/on reddit about a moneymaking opportunity!

The second quote lines up with my experience about size and building. The initial outpost of the system was 22k of good and took me roughly 12 hours across 3-4 days of scattered play (2-3 hour blocks). Then with the initial clock stopped I've built several installations to mold the system to what I wanted. Those are each about 7k of good and took 2 hours to complete. None of this was using a carrier as I don't own one. Everybody's situation will be different though depending on where they're located and what tools (ships) they have available and want to use.

It seems, as I read it, the main premise of the first quote is after a very short amount of time it's too boring to do and that means the time drastically slows down and isn't worth the effort. That's a matter of opinion for each individual to judge for themselves. Personally for me building the installations has been fun and I keep going back to start more. I've recently started building a Coriolis to get a large landing pad in the system and eventually a place to park my fleet of ships.

All told I've done maybe 22 hours of game time for colonization across the two or so weeks and have 5 structures and I'm not bored of it yet. Perhaps it's because I do what I think of as active flying (no assist other than docking, HOTAS controls, and VR so I'm always tweaking something). Maybe it's the VR views. Or perhaps I just enjoy hauling and seeing a tangible result of my efforts other than money in the bank.

To each their own. Not all gameplay or activities will suit everybody and that's okay. If colonization isn't your thing that's fine. There are lots of other activities too and of course many other games out there.

 

[Shir]

So in such a short time the Bubble went from 20k inhabited systems to 33k. That's a huge change for the game. And it went from systems designed with some logic from the programmers to systems randomly designed by the players. That has to present significant challenges for the way the background simulation works, Bgs and all.

One thing I'm starting to dislike is that there are no special places in the bubble anymore. The pleiades, Robigo, a bunch of systems on the edge that were far away or secluded and thus special, all that is gone.

But I guess that is how real colonization would be. Only time will tell how this update will impact the game long term..

 

[Kallipar]

what 5k ton are you talking about? an outpost requires almost 25k units of commodities. basically a full carrier load.

it's not like it takes weeks of time to do nothing but trucking. it's that after making 10 runs, you stop having any interest in 'playing'. the only thing driving the mechanic to completion is then just the idea of getting it finished and not failing the mission.

edit: 22085 units for a science outpost. if there is an outpost type that only needs 5k, then yea, that would be a couple hours and make this 15ly limit even more stupid. it would just really incentivize only building that to get you where you want. just a string of useless colonization activity steps.

That's why it's a beta testing activity steps.

 

[BloodOfMe]

So this is what a live beta means.

yeah, but now it's a closed live beta

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

They probably stopped the claim of new systems to let us build structures within the systems and test what is the core of colonization
When they have enough data they will reactivate everything

that genuinely may be useful data (I have no idea) but if so they could have initially eased open the taps by only allowing each account to colonise a set limited number of systems , that way everyone gets to have a go even when new colonisation is paused for some players.

 

[Mr T]

They probably stopped the claim of new systems to let us build structures within the systems and test what is the core of colonization
When they have enough data they will reactivate everything

Well, I think everyone, including FDev, severely underestimated how popular colonisation would be from day 1. Now I think they need to examine how it's gone and how it can be best guided going forth. If further restraints or restrictions are going to be put in place it would be better to do it now rather than later.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

And it went from systems designed with some logic from the programmers to systems randomly designed by the players.

Though Frontier have put a fair bit of thought into things like the T1->T2->T3 pipeline, and the other pre-requisites for buildings, to encourage players towards making "proper" systems with potential for other players to have varied and interesting gameplay in them.

That has to present significant challenges for the way the background simulation works, Bgs and all.

Possibly in terms of scaling up the tick processing, but it shouldn't be a major problem for the BGS in general.
- inter-system ranges are forced short enough to guarantee working mission boards and market data transfers
- most explicit inter-system interactions were taken out of the BGS way back in version 3.3 because highly expanded factions were already breaking them at that point
- Colonia managed fine for years (pre-Odyssey) with a whole lot of systems which basically only had a single station of some sort in them and low populations.
- further system development is encouraged to be BGS-friendly with building of installations, Odyssey settlements and Horizons hubs, and with the automatic spreading out of assets between system factions

The potential challenge later will be that the increase in systems will reduce the average player activity per system, so make the BGS "flatter". But on the other hand:
- that was already a problem pre-colonisation
- Architects might well hang around "their" system once they've built it and keep putting new BGS inputs in as they play
- they can always turn up the per-action effects a bit to amplify small movements

 

[Xenia_K]

Well, I think everyone, including FDev, severely underestimated how popular colonisation would be from day 1. Now I think they need to examine how it's gone and how it can be best guided going forth. If further restraints or restrictions are going to be put in place it would be better to do it now rather than later.

My guess is that for BGS calc alone they need to rent some additionl servers, implement and test them - takes time as well, especially when Claim is back on the next bubble-explosion will start - my prediction -> within a month the number of Human settled Systems will tripple easily

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

Well, I think everyone, including FDev, severely underestimated how popular colonisation would be from day 1. Now I think they need to examine how it's gone and how it can be best guided going forth. If further restraints or restrictions are going to be put in place it would be better to do it now rather than later.

given they are not rolling back, I really hope they don't increase the costs , as it stands now it is doable long term solo... however to allow some to get on the train then pull up the ladders for others would suck .
if they wanted to slow it down by forcing players to properly spec out a system (to say 60% minimum) before offering another colonisation contract that would be acceptable for me. this would also have the advantage of forcing players just stepping stoning out to do it in systems with just a main star and little else leaving "good" systems to players who want to actually colonise , but at the same time not blocking players from branching out

 

[Ian Doncaster]

if they wanted to slow it down by forcing players to properly spec out a system

That would barely have slowed down the initial rush at all.

Galnet reports 26000 claims made. At the time they paused new claims, only 8000 had been completed. You can only have one pending claim at once anyway, so there must have been at least 18000 different players making claims (more, if not everyone who completed their first claim in the first week immediately made a second).

For all the talk of players making stepping stones of minimal outposts, that's really not how most people are actually approaching colonisation
- a substantial majority of colonies are within the existing bubble and not increasing the number of reachable systems at all
- almost all of the rest are on the near fringes of the bubble or in small clouds around existing near-bubble systems and not making a chain in any particular direction
- most of the really visible chains (of which there are only five or six total, looking around the map) are large group projects where it's likely that most of the steps are owned by different architects anyway, so limiting individual ability to chain out barely makes a difference to them

 

[pmejna]

4-6 hours doesn't seem reasonable even if you are just loading and unloading an already filled carrier.

after the 10th load transferred, how are you still docking at the same 5 min per cycle rate while watching TV or falling asleep?

if you're actually having to source items then you are really just lying. even if you know all the places that sell what you need without looking, other player activities are also tanking the supply of certain items even after the recent buff to cmm's. and that's assuming you aren't using a carrier and having to wait for the jump and do double the transfers.

solo outposts are more realistically being done in a couple weeks with scattered game time.

and once you do the first one, it's very unlikely the enthusiasm to speed grind it again exists.

a very small population of players, if any, are solo speed grinding multiple systems.

but i do believe most of the new colonies are just outposts and will always be just outposts. the activity isn't fun and the reward isn't good enough to outweigh the cost. what we've seen activity wise in this beta is as active as this mechanic will ever be... unless it changes significantly on one or both of these aspects.

I mentioned "cheapest thing" not cheapest space outpost xD that would be more like 10-15 hrs for me probably

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

That would barely have slowed down the initial rush at all.

Galnet reports 26000 claims made. At the time they paused new claims, only 8000 had been completed. You can only have one pending claim at once anyway, so there must have been at least 18000 different players making claims (more, if not everyone who completed their first claim in the first week immediately made a second).

For all the talk of players making stepping stones of minimal outposts, that's really not how most people are actually approaching colonisation
- a substantial majority of colonies are within the existing bubble and not increasing the number of reachable systems at all
- almost all of the rest are on the near fringes of the bubble or in small clouds around existing near-bubble systems and not making a chain in any particular direction
- most of the really visible chains (of which there are only five or six total, looking around the map) are large group projects where it's likely that most of the steps are owned by different architects anyway, so limiting individual ability to chain out barely makes a difference to them

not the original rush no but surely it will impact the time taken going forward from now, if players have to spec out a system before moving onto the next.
That is just going with the assumption that multiple systems dotted about the place is even a problem, which maybe it isn't but I was just responding to posters suggesting it is, as well as one person who thought that the pause would be useful for FD it it encouraged players to backfill some of the existing claims which presumably is what many are doing.
how many active players are there and how many of those have multiple systems to their name already? if massive expansion is a problem (and if so should have been a predictable one) there are plenty of ways to slow it down other than increasing costs which is what some players are requesting.

not all of us have metagamed our way to many billions of credits such as they mean nothing. over 3000 hrs in I just bought a fleet carrier (Purely for colonisation) it's now fully loaded with no where to go and I am practically skint. (well under 900mil so technically not skint! )

 

[Ian Doncaster]

not the original rush no but surely it will impact the time taken going forward from now, if players have to spec out a system before moving onto the next.

Possibly.

On the other hand:
- there's people like you (and new players continually joining the game) who don't even have one colony yet
- there's probably plenty of people who already intended to build up their first system anyway (I certainly don't have any plans to take on a second yet!)
- a lot of systems will stay fairly small in the short/medium even if they're someone's only system just because it takes a while to make them bigger

(I think there are more separate forum threads from people worried about minimalist chains of outposts than there are actual minimalist chains of outposts, so it's probably not something Frontier needs to do anything about anyway)

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

that is the thing . ultimately we don't know why FD had to put the brakes on and turn it into a closed beta only that they did.

so it's all just players guessing. but it is those suggesting costs are too low and that it should be a group activity anyway which worry me.

ultimately I only want 2 systems in the game. one can be anywhere, just a good one to stick my teeth in to last me years to make into a thriving system with many bases.

and the other one is probably ,3000ly out and realistically I may never get the opportunity to get there but it's been bookmarked for years just in case and i fly out to it every time there is a new thing I can do to put my name on it

 

[CMDR Engalo]

Hi folks, we appreciate you are eager to know more on the Colonisation pause. We don't have anything to announce right now as investigations are still ongoing. We are not able to offer a timetable at this time. Rest assured that as soon as we can share more we will let everyone know.

I understand that investigations take time, but the lack of regular updates in a dedicated thread wich nobody could comment in is frustrating.
Even if there’s nothing new to report, a simple daily update acknowledging that work is still ongoing would go a long way in maintaining transparency and keeping the community informed.
Since this is a beta feature in a live environment, clearer communication should be a priority.
Can we get a commitment to more frequent updates in a dedicated thread moving forward?
Im sure more than me would be very grateful.

 

[ds2007]

I understand that investigations take time, but the lack of regular updates in a dedicated thread wich nobody could comment in is frustrating.
Even if there’s nothing new to report, a simple daily update acknowledging that work is still ongoing would go a long way in maintaining transparency and keeping the community informed.
Since this is a beta feature in a live environment, clearer communication should be a priority.
Can we get a commitment to more frequent updates in a dedicated thread moving forward?
Im sure more than me would be very grateful.

I agree, we need more information on what they are doing

 

[Ian Doncaster]

a simple daily update acknowledging that work is still ongoing

What's the point in Paul putting a daily post out that says
"Colonisation is still paused, we're still investigating a fix for the issues but don't have a timetable yet"
every day for the next week / month / however long it takes, that won't say anything we don't already know and won't get it re-enabled any faster?

Their communication has been perfectly clear. Saying it again slower and more loudly won't improve that. Clear and "what we want to hear" are of course very different, but that's nothing Paul can solve.

(Sure, it'd be amusing to watch Paul find increasingly obscure synonyms for "pause", "investigation" and "timetable" after day five or so, but I expect he has better things to do with his time)

When the situation changes - either they have a fix and a timetable for making it live, or less likely they've determined that there was an unexpected issue with colonisation that was so severe the feature has to be abandoned for the foreseeable future - then they'll have something useful to tell us, and I'm sure we'll hear promptly at that point.