Patch Notes Fleet Carriers Update - Patch 4 Patch Notes

[Just Ice]

(...)

Hell has frozen over.
I aggree with the inconsistency of "vision" on FDev side.

Here they added UC to allow solo use

This is overinterpretation.
They added UC to allow commanders selling exploration data in deep space.
It does not translate to supporting the idea of "solo deep space fast FC travel" in any way.

 

[Just Ice]

(...)
Next on beta they figured that many commanders can afford buying it.
(...)

A lot commanders can afford FC, because:

• FD has not patched OP and glitched LTD mining in time, what resulted in absurd oucome - every player, even new, could become multibillionaire after a few days of playing. So now we have a plague of clueless commanders as FC owners demanding that EASY GRINDING comes back.
  
  
• FD has reduced original upkeep price UNDER PRESSURE OF THE SAME SUBGROUP of players - original costs made more sense - it would require effort of several commanders to afford FC in a long term. Or skilled and knowing at least a bit about the game solo commander.

 

[alexzk]

It does not translate to supporting the idea of "solo deep space fast FC travel" in any way.

Fast & solo are different things. UC is a must to use it solo and nice addition for expeditions.
Fast is coming from "solo" fact. Because expeditions are never fast. They take 5-6-7 months for the way I cover in 3 weeks. Actually, firts 6s months I was opening planned expedition plans and just repeated their checkpoints. Takes 5-10 times faster then planned by expedition.

Also slowness is different for expedition and carrier. When you speak about expedition slowness comes from the fact everybody sleep/job/eat/etc. So they gather once a day and do jump, then everybody free to explore or mining or sleep.
When you do solo, you don't have to wait other people - you have time, you have mood - u can jump ...nope, please mine 5 hours.

 

[alexzk]

A lot commanders can afford FC, because:

• FD has not patched OP and glitched LTD mining in time, what resulted in absurd oucome - every player, even new, could become multibillionaire after a few days of playing the game. So now we have a plague of clueless commanders as FC owners demanding that EASY GRINDING comes back.
  
  
• FD has reduced original upkeep price UNDER PRESSURE OF THE SAME SUBGROUP of players - original price made more sense - it would require effort of several commanders to afford FC in a long term.

No matter, it is fact now, also they made good arx on that. So will not rollback.

 

[Just Ice]

(....)..ou have mood - u can jump ...nope, please mine 5 hours.

5 hours mining for a jump?
Maybe with pickaxe in Odyssey
My FC is topped with Tri, so it's as heavy as it gets.
And is using less then 200t of Tri for 500ly max range jump.
Guess what is my Tri SSD mining hourly rate in single SSD hotspot.
Yes, about 200t/h.

EDIT my bad, I have checked wrong sheet in my table.
It's more like 250t/500ly jump ATM.
It makes rest of post 25% wrong initially
Still, I need 1h15 minutes of mining for a jump.

1h, when I will use some of Tri I have in cargo now.

Coincidence?

I would laugh my *** off, if after the patch laser mining Tri would gave similar yields.
It would make clear, that FD has planned "one hour mining per jump" efficiency from the beginning.

 

[alexzk]

5 hours mining for a jump?
Maybe with pickaxe in Odyssey
My FC is topped with Tri, so it's as heavy as it gets.
And is using less then 200t of Tri for 500ly max range jump.
Guess what is my Tri SSD mining hourly rate in single SSD hotspot.
Yes, about 200t/h.

Coincidence?

I would laugh my *** off, if after the patch laser mining Tri would gave similar yields.
It would make clear, that FD has planned "one hour mining per jump" efficiency from the beginning.

No matter, 1 hour for 1 jump + 20 mins delay. It is already 1.5 hr almost.
Count time to find rings. Maybe you did it yday, maybe you need to find it now. I tried on beta trip to Anaconda graveyard. With 2000t on board. That was like 40-50 mins to find next good jump point. I was like 3-4 jumps during 12 hours play session. That is not acceptable.
Total time is shown at the end. FC holds 65000 ly now. To refuel that u need to mine 100-120 hours. Point. No mater if u spend it at once or day by day. This is pure 3 weeks of life.

 

[Just Ice]

Yes.
5 hours
1 hour
What's the difference

Anyway, I would use cooldown to scan or mine
Not mentioning, that as I have said several times: FC never was intended for "jump after jump" mode of transportation.
Even if we agree that "solo exploration" was suggested as one of possibilities.

 

[Hellrider]

nearly 1,5h is good "price" for jump for solo explorer.
Do you want faster travel?
Organize expedition with group of players, carriers can be mobile storage, but exploration isn't task for solo player with carrier.
Stop complain on it, because making carriers easy tool for alone explorer is IMPOSSIBLE, you need more than 1000 trit/h, and you will still complain on mining

 

[alexzk]

nearly 1,5h is good "price" for jump for solo explorer.
Do you want faster travel?
Organize expedition with group of players, carriers can be mobile storage, but exploration isn't task for solo player with carrier.

Ye, if that will be final, i will sell out fc and request arx refund, as initial rules changed, that is not what I bought.
When I paid them real money it was 1 day of preparation for 65000ly travel.

 

[Just Ice]

i will sell out fc and request arx refund

Ahem.
Have you read TOS yet?

1 day of preparation for 65000ly travel.

Now this is something new to me.
Care to elaborate?

 

[alexzk]

Ahem.
Have you read TOS yet?

Will see...i'm not in mood to fight with...but will see.

Now this is something new to me.
Care to elaborate?

Yes, LTD - sell price 1.6mil, trit buy price 4000. Ratio is 1 to 400. In avr without searching both too good it was 1 to 200.
U mine 4-5 hours of LTD in new Borann. Sell it. Load up trit.
Now you're ready for 65000ly + you have extra funds for extra 65000 at bigger prices, like 40000 at Colonia.
So you could do:

Bubble->Colonia->Beagle->Colonia->Bubble without mining, everything was funded with 1 day of LTD.
P.S. I never did "egg". that was all simple normal mining in tripple spot.

 

[Just Ice]

(...)

Yes, LTD / Tri ratio is not coming back.
25k of Tri in 1 day is still "doable" or "buyable".

You can buy about 6.200t of Tri at 40k/tfor 1 hour of Painite mining
IF the sell price is 980k
5000t if it's 790k
So it's 4-5h of mining.

1-1.5h of selling in 200-250 batches per round, to avoid price drop.

Time needed for transferring Tri from station to FC has not changed.

Still doable in 1 day, but I would not recommend to forcibly do it in one session

 

[Just Ice]

Colonia is busted though. So it's one way trip ATM

My condolences

 

[alexzk]

Colonia is busted though. So it's one way trip ATM

That's too...they did 2 or 3 changes at once, which broke all refuel routes. And 1 was broken from the start (trit mining). Now they're focused on fixing something they broke, but eventually it does not look like a fix for initial bad idea.
I think I'm done with Elite till monday. SWTOR got nice pvp fixes today. At least somebody do their job.

 

[Kestrel71]

A lot commanders can afford FC, because:

• FD has not patched OP and glitched LTD mining in time, what resulted in absurd oucome - every player, even new, could become multibillionaire after a few days of playing. So now we have a plague of clueless commanders as FC owners demanding that EASY GRINDING comes back.
  
  
• FD has reduced original upkeep price UNDER PRESSURE OF THE SAME SUBGROUP of players - original costs made more sense - it would require effort of several commanders to afford FC in a long term. Or skilled and knowing at least a bit about the game solo commander.

Partially agree on the first point. COMPLETELY disagree on the second point; the original costs for FC were completely outrageous. Those costs MIGHT have been realistic had the FC been squadron-owned, but squadrons are a half-arsed attempt at the moment. Even then, the utility of an FC to a squadron is questionable as I don't think there's really much incentive for a squadron to use an FC outside the bubble.

 

[Taarakian]

Yes, and there's no way to tell on eddb.io and suchlike. You go 400ly out of your way to seel some data or at least get a quick integrity repair, and the carrier is refusing any docking, even though eddb.io and other 3rd party tools show it as a presumably usable "station".

Yeah, I've run into this problem to many times to count, it's awfully discouraging. Away from the bubble carriers should feel like a welcoming oasis for travellers. No docking or repair upon arrival undercuts all that. At very least such carriers shoul be flagged at a glance on the nav panel (if such services are suspended or unavailable.)
Perhaps some mechanic to reduce shipyard cost the further from the bubble you are - (since the futher you go the less incentive to keep (or own) an active available shipyard/repair facility. This might occur as an altruistic credit given weekly to all commanders for performing a community service.

 

[Just Ice]

Partially agree on the first point. COMPLETELY disagree on the second point; the original costs for FC were completely outrageous. (...)

Really?
I don't remember being bothered by upkeep costs.
What I remember is how I was grinding money on 2nd account to buy 2nd FC (for my kid).
It was piece of cake.
I couldn't care less if I had to pay 20 or 200 millions per week, if I was able to do that:

I made 5 bil in 4 days. (21th to 25th)

 

[Kestrel71]

Really?
I don't remember being bothered by upkeep costs.
What I remember is how I was grinding money on 2nd account to buy 2nd FC (for my kid).
It was piece of cake.
I couldn't care less if I had to pay 20 or 200 millions per week, if I was able to do that:

I made 5 bil in 4 days. (21th to 25th)

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Yes, yes, we all understand that you are the supreme player of all time and that none of us have any clue compared to you. HOWEVER, in spite of the fact that many of us have the cash to pay those kinds of upkeep costs, it's not practical the way FCs are implemented, as a single player ship, with no facility to be paid for by multiple players (i.e. squadrons). With mining being so heavily nerfed, an overly aggressive supply and demand system, a 200M weekly upkeep cost is far out of reach for a great many players and would continue to be so. The FC would not be feasible were it to cost 10B/year simply to own. Many people don't have the time (or inclination) to spend grinding out 200M, particularly if those players aren't inclined toward mining. Even 25M/week is a good bit of cash for non-miners to pull together each week, particularly in light of the fact that they are going to need cash for rebuys (combat) and equipment upgrades, as well as spending time grinding out materials and data for the engineers.

 

[Nutter]

So you need to read more carefully "Tritium SSD mining is not broken (by the patch)" - this sentence of mine is in this thread several times, and this is my context.
And I stand by this as true.


Did they say "ANY kind of explorers, even those who want to fly 60.000 ly on one tank ?"

I guess at some point everyone gets to to the point where they identify a person who maybe out of touch with reality.

I dunno? did they say that 'apples grow underground and baby unicorns dig them up with teaspoons?'

So anyway, you have proved the value of your posts. You ignore not only your own facts, but pick and choose quotes.

Feel free to type fake news, I won't be listening.

 

[Just Ice]

(...) particularly in light of the fact that they are going to need cash for rebuys (combat) and equipment upgrades, as well as spending time grinding out materials and data for the engineers.

OK I get it.
FC should be available to anyone.
It's just a larger Sidewinder with some upgrades.

I see nothing wrong in FC, AFAIR an "end game" asset being available only to commanders who don't have anything to grind anymore and have more credits then they could spend.

We have other opinions. FD chose "FC for peasants" option, that makes no any sense other then RL priorities/game world coherence - cash for ARX, as someone mentioned here already.