Dinosaurs General Gameplay Foliage to Match Paleoecology (w/ new Scenery suggestions)

[RadicalEdward2]

I know posts have probably been made about this in the past about how the engine limitations make it difficult for them to add new trees or how its impossible to have this Sorna...

...to replace this Sorna...

...but there are some ways that they could implement new tree types without reworking the entire tree brush (in the off-chance that its intangible to do so).
​

See as how Frontier is working on the new Zoo Tycoon game, they could take some pointers from the original Zoo Tycoon by building upon the recently added Scenery placement mechanics in JW:E in a way similar to how Zoo Tycoon used it to mix and match foliage to make animals feel more at home (increasing their ratings).

The point I'm getting at is that they could incorporate more foliage diversity by making redwoods, conifers, and essentially all of the flora from the greenhouse and fossils into ploppable Scenery.
Placing individual trees increases dinosaur woodland needs already so maybe there could be more building upon this by making it so that placing individual trees native to the dinosaur's ecology could increase the woodland needs more than using the tree brush or any old generic tree; essentially recreating Zoo Tycoon's animal needs system.

Not really sure how else to explain this.
tldr:
In classic Zoo Tycoon...
Placing any old tree or a near equivalent to their ecosystem in the animal's enclose = happy
Placing a tree native to their ecosystem in the enclosure = really happy

Using even few native trees would be enough to fill the woodland needs
while
Using the brush tool or generic trees provide less satisfaction; requiring more generics to meet the woodland needs

I personally own the original Zoo Tycoon and only got it for the Dinosaur Digs expansion back in the day.
The best I can really say to the devs is pick up the original game and the expansion and mess around with it for a bit.
I'm pretty sure its probably abandon-ware by this point so it shouldn't hurt to check it out.

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As for how to unlock these new trees and bushes, there are plenty of fossils in the game that could potentially be extracted just like the dinosaurs.

Aside from pretty much all of the trees types from Zoo Tycoon (gradually maybe), there's some suggestions I would have for the game in terms of new objects/flora...

Spoiler

The lone palm tree
The three palms bunched together are nice but, just a single palm tree would be nice.

Variations of the lone smaller elephant ear palm tree

These larger and chunkier mangrove-like swamp trees from the early game footage (and more swamp-like trees in-general)

Single Small Tree/Bush

Bamboo

Scots Pines (of varying sizes)

Spruce Trees

These suggestions are (again) additions intended for the Scenery tab.
If you took the time to review this entire post, thanks ♥​

 

[Helmutt]

I like this very much. I had a similar thought too. Although broader and more generalized, my thought touched more on the how to make balancing the dinosaur needs more on hands other than spamming terrain tools.

 

[RadicalEdward2]

I like this very much. I had a similar thought too. Although broader and more generalized, my thought touched more on the how to make balancing the dinosaur needs more on hands other than spamming terrain tools.

agreed. the environment system is very much a matter of spamming the terrain tools right now and placing a feeder but, I feel like the game could be much more than that without having to really reinvent the wheel. They have almost 2 decades worth of history with the Zoo Tycoon IP for them to look back at influence and inspiration and there's plenty of potential that this game still has to offer (especially now that we can place scenery).

 

[spruce56]

I would like terrain brushes to use the plants from the greenhouses: horsetail fields, cycads, rotten tree stumps, tree ferns, ginkgo.

Also the ability to place taller grass - deep meadows where the smaller dinos can vanish.

 

[gabeluna27]

The thing about scenery trees in Jurassic World Evolution is that they already do a similar concept. When you place a scenery tree within a dinosaur enclosure, it will raise their forest need levels, while also decrease their grassland need levels. If more tree scenery options were to become a thing, they would definitely do just that. I'm sure Frontier Developments already know a thing or two about habitat construction by now, and don't need to play very old generation games to learn too much more than what they might already know.

If new plants were to be added, which they might, they would probably have to fit the game's theme and authenticity as to the franchise's film series which is what it greatly aims for, rather then just being a "generic" plain animal theme park/zoo construction and management simulator, but with dinosaurs. Beach palms, redwoods and maybe certain pine trees, just for a little difference from the tropical forest trees, would be likely when it comes to new trees as they do and can fit the style of the game's theme and the theme of the movies. Paleo plants (even if some species still do exit today like monkey puzzels, or ginkos) may probably become a thing, it's just a matter of knowing how exactly they should be introduced and serve what gameplay progression purpose into the game, if either of those two factors were to be different from the current in-game plants, should they be decided.

When it comes to the concept of making dinosaurs feel more at home with a new "need" mechanic with paleo plants, I really don't see it being a part of a free update because it might affect saves too greatly (the wetland need mechanics for the spinosaurs wasn't even exactly that extremely major in my opinion), it would have to be a special optional DLC for something that special. I just don't know what kind of special DLC it would have to be because, all the major upgrading DLCs introduce revolutionary JWE gameplay progression mechanics as part of new or expanded stories and lores, rather than just generic "more buildable content" packs like the two current 3+ dino packs.

If such a concept were to be a thing, it would likely be an optional requirement to boost your dinosaur ratings and/or so fourth, kind of like the paleobotany system from the Claire's Sanctuary DLC. That system from the DLC isn't needed at all, but it can help with the quality of your dinosaurs and your park ratings should you wish (just like how I used it to help me earn a five star rating on Isla Sorna to unlock and earn the jungle cosmetic gene sooner than later). The only thing I have with this is how (if so) would it affect the current "regular" dinosaur habitat requirements.

 

[Player 99234567]

Man I am really hoping that the next big dlc (hopefully its the '93 dlc) comes with a free update with new brushes and decor for redwoods. Would be a real treat for everyone who has been wanting to make the authentic Site B. I wouldnt be surprised that if the next big update is the '93 dlc we would get a new map for nublar based on the original park and a new map for Sorna which would probably be exactly what you are asking for. That way they dont have to redo the current map and we get more new stuff.

 

[spruce56]

Honestly, I'd be fine with new plants just being cosmetic, even if they are the greenhouse plants (not a requirement for comfort). Dinosaurs graze on the grass, but get no food from it, so I'd expect it to be like that. You can decorate a paddock with, say, cycads, but it doesn't give a food/paleobotany score.

 

[Alan_Grady]

Paleobotany sceneary items could still have an impact on dinosaur diet, though. Perhaps reducing the threshold for hunger like the Wu genes reduce confort threshold?
Bigger herbivores such as sauropods or stegos would need enormous quantities of plant material to live and due to their body volumes, they would need to be almost constantly feeding. So, their hunger thresholds should me much higher than they are currently.
That also in addition to the usual effect of increasing rating. Also, I think they should have 'lifetime' as dinosaur have (although much longer) that would drastically decrease the more herbs there are within the paddock feeding on them without enough alternative sources (regular feeders).
Main difference would likely be that those effect would be ten

 

[RadicalEdward2]

Honestly, I'd be fine with new plants just being cosmetic, even if they are the greenhouse plants (not a requirement for comfort). Dinosaurs graze on the grass, but get no food from it, so I'd expect it to be like that. You can decorate a paddock with, say, cycads, but it doesn't give a food/paleobotany score.

Yeah I get you. Tbh, I never was crazy about how all the four-legged dinos seemed like they were ALWAYS grazing. They did more than just graze all day and even if they did, I would rather there be an effect on the terrain in the paddocks from them doing so.

 

[RadicalEdward2]

I would like terrain brushes to use the plants from the greenhouses: horsetail fields, cycads, rotten tree stumps, tree ferns, ginkgo.

Also the ability to place taller grass - deep meadows where the smaller dinos can vanish.

Agreed.
When I first saw the images for the greenhouse plants, I was under the impression that functional scenery was going to be added instead of exclusively more feeder options; with the conifers and image of the fallen tree log being what peaked my interest. I honestly thought, I needed to grow a rotten log so I could get the access to place one :c
Granted, the paleofeeders are cool additions but, the models don't change based on what plants you put in it so its just an amalgamation of all the plant models (even the ones the dinos can't eat).

With there being some sprites for the paleoplants in the feeder, they could probably recycle them to double as placeable flora in the enclosures.
Even more interesting, they could add an option to requisition a separate supply of individual plants from the greenhouse that would deplete the more you place it.
Kind of like how you can terraform with a limited supply of dirt in Cities:Skylines.

And when that supply of that particular paleoplant scenery runs out, you have to request another supply of it to place more (separate from the feeder one of course).​

 

[RadicalEdward2]

Added another scenery suggestion that I somehow missed.
There's actually a really small tree or bush that would work pretty well as a small equivalent to the 3 tiny palm trees.

 

[Indoraptor27]

I think these would be great, as long as they're just cosmetic. Having them be part of special requirments like in Zoo Tycoon would be really annoying, as I'd have to remake every single enclosure I have.

 

[LordTrilobite]

I think these would be great, as long as they're just cosmetic. Having them be part of special requirments like in Zoo Tycoon would be really annoying, as I'd have to remake every single enclosure I have.

Do you mean like the original Zoo Tycoon? Cause that was the absolute best feature of the game. It made creating an exhibit a real challenge.

 

[Indoraptor27]

Do you mean like the original Zoo Tycoon? Cause that was the absolute best feature of the game. It made creating an exhibit a real challenge.

I get what you mean but redoing every island to match the requirments would be a hastle.

 

[RadicalEdward2]

I think these would be great, as long as they're just cosmetic. Having them be part of special requirments like in Zoo Tycoon would be really annoying, as I'd have to remake every single enclosure I have.

I wouldn't think every enclosure would need to be remade but at the very least, having flora native to a dinos ecosystem could improve their rating instead of relying almost exclusively on how the genes are mix and matched.

On top of that, part of why I'm for having the adjustments to the habitats being something worth looking at is because the dinos don't seem to care for much of anything.
They have like two emotions: 100% Comfy or Bash every part of their heads into walls and no real in-between.

 

[Player 99234567]

On top of that, part of why I'm for having the adjustments to the habitats being something worth looking at is because the dinos don't seem to care for much of anything.
They have like two emotions: 100% Comfy or Bash every part of their heads into walls and no real in-between.

I hope they are fixing that. I feel like that exists solely because breakouts were the only gameplay mechanic they ever had in mind for this game but it turned out to be irritating and not fun.

 

[Elise the Indominus rex]

I wouldn't think every enclosure would need to be remade but at the very least, having flora native to a dinos ecosystem could improve their rating instead of relying almost exclusively on how the genes are mix and matched.

On top of that, part of why I'm for having the adjustments to the habitats being something worth looking at is because the dinos don't seem to care for much of anything.
They have like two emotions: 100% Comfy or Bash every part of their heads into walls and no real in-between.

Yes, I agree. Adding certain plants to make the dinosaurs feel more comfortable seems like a nice idea to me; it'd also add a bit of a challenge to the game. I did play the old Zoo Tycoon as well (good old times) and it was truly difficult to please every animal up to 100% comfort because everyone wanted different kinds of plants and amounts of plants and rocks.

 

[gabeluna27]

I’ve recently been thinking of something that could possibly work. That is, assuming their implementation hasn’t been planned and decided yet, especially considering it’s already late in the time span between Update 1.8 and the potential reveal and release dates of the next major update. That's not to say I wish for it to be in the very next update, but at least want to give something out there for consideration either for this next update or which ever next one after the next major update, if an implementation hasn't been planned and decided yet.


There have been at least one or two DLCs that I know of that have been upgraded with new content post their release. DLCs, particularly the ones I know of, typically don’t get upgrade for more content, but I think Claire’s Sanctuary could possibly fall as an exception like those other exceptional DLCs that I know of for good reasons.

The introductory of paleo themed plants is within Claire’s Sanctuary through a fleshed out story lore. Having these paleo plants just appear else where in free updates like how the 1.8 update implemented placeable trees and rocks, or other paid major DLCs, I think that wouldn’t make too much sense. It would make more sense if they were implemented through there.

How?

Claire’s Sanctuary did something the game has never done before: a script-on sidequest contract that unlocks extra content for the next map.
When you are on Isla Nublar North in the campaign, an optional script contract will pop up when you are doing the task mission of bringing in some selected dinosaur individuals for observation. In which you can take pictures of all the herbivore species in the map where afterwards, Claire will not only thank you, the T.Rex becomes available on Sanctuary once you get there after saving your chosen dinosaurs. You don’t need to complete this optional script contract at all to progress the campaign, because it’s completely optional. If you do it, you can get the rex for Sanctuary Island, while you won't if you don't complete it.

So, what I think is the placeable paleo plants would be in something similar. Once you are doing a later mission on Sanctuary with paleobotany going on, or maybe even after all the missions are done as a special “secret” treat after playing around in the map afterwards, an optional sidequest will appear for you to where you must do something (anything that could work) in order to complete it. Once you do, the paleo plants you can place in your parks will become available to you, both in the Claire’s Sanctuary campaign and the main game campaign (if it can be script while doing a paleobotany related mission first, and if you complete the contract before completing the Claire campaign, the placeable paleo plants become available to the main campaign after you complete the Claire campaign like everything else), with the system that you suggested above.

When it comes to acquiring them after doing this, it would make some more sense if they were the ones you’ve actually planted in your greenhouses. Whatever you research from the paleobotany category, and plant in your greenhouses becomes available for you to plant around.

How to make this balanced? Maybe whatever it is you grow in the greenhouse, you get fully unlock those placeable plants like you would when researching something or getting enough dino species genome. So whether or not you have those plants in your greenhouse, as long as you grow any of them once, they will become fully available for you, nothing else needed.
Maybe whatever you have in your greenhouses will become available for you the whole time they are in there, until you replace or remove a selected plant, and that option becomes disabled until you select and grow then again.

If it will be the latter (and only “if”), then it won’t be a big deal for your paleo feeders if you switch around other plant choices because they will still be rigged with whatever plant you chose for them, they just won’t be available to you for restocking until you grow them back again for that map. So if you placed any kind of paleo foliage in your map, they’ll still be there if you remove them from your greenhouse, they just won’t be selected in your menus again until you re-grow them back. Also, I would imagine it would be like some the other operational buildings, considering you can only place one per map in Challenge mode and in the main game campaign, except for sandbox maps.
For operation buildings like the fossil, expedition and research centers, you must have one per island in the main campaign to progress further stuff in-game, so I see it where if you have one greenhouse with specific plants in it on one map, the placeable paleo foliage options will be carried over to all the other maps in your save, and then you kinda get where I’m getting at if you place another greenhouse on another main campaign map. But then again, you can always switch around the plants in just one greenhouse, should you wish.


There are models for the paleo plants as well if you look at the inside of the grenhouse’s dome and on the two paleo feeders. A nice start, in my opinion, for placeable paleo plants, should it be planned and decided.

I can imagine some being landscape exclusive plants like, logically, the horsetails. Some being scenery object exclusive, with at lest three different variations, like the logs (rotten wood). And some being a mix of both like the cycads.