Frontier- You Have My Support

[NecoMachina]

But they DID do the right thing. In the commercial world delays are a reality. Tried getting credit for anything ordered on-line before? The only reason bad taste remains is because people like you keep feeding it.

Only offering 70% refunds is not "the right thing" in my book. And the fact that it took such a huge outcry, so many weeks, and impending class-action lawsuits for them to finally even offer the 70% speaks volumes as to the character of this company. So many people seem to look back on the previous games with such fondness (I do too, to be clear), and they meet David Braben and the devs and they gush about how they are so passionate about the game and how they are such great people. And maybe they are. But they have also shown themselves to be capable of VERY underhanded business practices.

And yet there are many who talk as though they can do no wrong at all. Which is fine - believe what you like. But PLEASE stop trying to belittle opinions of people who aren't of the same mindset. PLEASE stop telling everyone who posts anything negative to go away and play another game. There is alot of immaturity and insults being thrown around on both sides of the fence - the haters AND the "white knights" - and it would be nice if BOTH sides could maybe tone it down a little. Discuss YOUR opinions instead of attacking those whose opinions differ. I know how futile it is to even ask this, but...PLEASE?

 

[Jack Schitt]

In the commercial world delays are a reality. [...] The only reason bad taste remains is because people like you keep feeding it.

The "bad taste" has nothing to do with any delay but with what happened later. You appear to continually misinterpret this, either through a lack of context or deliberate choice. Either way, it is exactly the sort of misinterpretation that leads "people like me" to respond in these threads in an attempt to restore the facts.

FD took pledges/sales for an in-development product explicitly stated to include x. They tried very hard to include x. X turned out to be not technical doable. They scrapped x. People who had pledged/bought on the strength of x requested refunds or compensation. FD flatly refused those requests until media exposure and the threat of legal action caused them to reconsider.

I cannot put it any clearer than that. If you're happy with that sort of behaviour, fine. Many weren't, which is why there is a continued albeit diluted sense of distrust to this day. Whether you think that's justified or not is up to you. But what you cannot do is sweep it under the rug like it never happened.

 

[Juniper]

Only offering 70% refunds is not "the right thing" in my book. And the fact that it took such a huge outcry, so many weeks, and impending class-action lawsuits for them to finally even offer the 70% speaks volumes as to the character of this company. So many people seem to look back on the previous games with such fondness (I do too, to be clear), and they meet David Braben and the devs and they gush about how they are so passionate about the game and how they are such great people. And maybe they are. But they have also shown themselves to be capable of VERY underhanded business practices.

I read an interview with Ian Bell a while back, and his last question was "What would you tell your younger self?"

His answer was: "Don't expect David to play fair by you."

So, yeah. Super guy, legend in his own lifetime, passionate about the game... but...

 

[NecoMachina]

I read an interview with Ian Bell a while back, and his last question was "What would you tell your younger self?"

His answer was: "Don't expect David to play fair by you."

So, yeah. Super guy, legend in his own lifetime, passionate about the game... but...

Yup. In my own experience, David's like every other person I have ever met or heard about. Not 100% "great guy" and not 100% "evil". I think he's GENERALLY SPEAKING a good dude. Has DEFINITELY done alot for computing and gaming. I respect the guy, FOR THE MOST PART. But he has DEFINITELY engaged in some scumbag behavior at times. And just because I'm a fan of the Elite series, Rollercoaster Tycoon, Planet Coaster, etc DOES NOT mean I'm not gonna call out FDEV when they make mistakes or occasionally act in a despicable manner. It REALLY irritates me when people cannot separate the concepts of "being a fan of a company's games" and "the actions of the company itself". It's similar to how people idolize actors just because they love the movies they acted in.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

I read an interview with Ian Bell a while back, and his last question was "What would you tell your younger self?"

His answer was: "Don't expect David to play fair by you."

So, yeah. Super guy, legend in his own lifetime, passionate about the game... but...

There are always two sides to a story.

 

[Lowievisser]

content but also in favor of the whining on forums

 

[Old Duck]

There are always two sides to a story.

What is that story, anyway? Is there a link to an article or wiki or something describing the falling out those two had? I honestly know nothing about it except that it happened.

 

[[VR] optimal_909]

There's been a lot of threads this week about absolute crap. People trying to stir the pot with unfounded allegations, taking facts out of context, or just outright deliberate lying. From the phrasing of some of them, I doubt if they've even played the game they are trashing.

I've been a customer of Frontier since Jan 2015 (v1.0.) Since buying Elite, I have encountered a few major bugs that were fixed relatively quickly. Certainly nothing that affected my game play for any significant time period. There's been some disappointing releases that could have been implemented better and they are being addressed in Beyond. There's been a few controversies because of communication foul-ups, but they were sorted out, usually to the customers benefit.

Some players have bashed and harangued the devs over the smallest pieces of information in the past and up to today. Just one example: Three words in a livestream, "Winter is coming" caused a spew of verbal diarrhea that went on for over eighty pages in one thread alone. If a dev mentions anything off-the-cuff in a livestream the forums explode with speculation based on few, if any, actual facts. And you wonder why they don't communicate with us anymore?

People who criticize Frontier need to go buy games from other companies to see just how well they have it here. I owned a computer games company and I would have killed to have a motivated staff like the Frontier devs. Talented, forthright people who truly love what they do. Well, until they read some of the drivel generated on these forums. Maybe they think negativity will somehow speed the devs up. Good luck with that.

Today, I have three accounts, two of them with LEP's and I'd buy a third in a heartbeat if given the chance. I do appreciate the fact Frontier are giving us a year of FREE updates in Beyond. Thank you for that ladies and gentlemen. As a multiple LEP owner I don't feel "cheated" or "sold short" by any means. The LEP's are long term investments and I know that Elite will be developed for many years to come. The value of my LEP's will be eclipsed by what gets delivered to me in time. Yet, there are some here who feel a years worth of upgrades for nothing is a bad thing? Good lord.

People have called me a fanboi in the past, because of my optimistic posts. A fanboi sees no faults in the thing they promote. I've been critical of some Frontier decisions and I see faults, take a look at the list of bugs I've submitted, but I also see them being fixed and improved as time goes by. Elite isn't perfect, but I'm not expecting perfection. I just want a game to take my mind off the real world for two hours a night. Elite does that, because it's a damned good game, getting better all the time.

I prefer to think of myself, and I'd like Frontier to consider me, a satisfied customer to date.

Haters, trolls and the eternally negative are entitled to their opinion. That's mine.

The biggest advantage of the new forum structure is that I don't have to pass by dangerous threads to open the Cannon (or any other lore/story related) thread. So I don't have to look at all the nonsense moaners are posting.
I love this game so much that it is the sole reason I'm spending money on the rig.

I'm also buying stuff in the store occasionally, and will buy more to support FDev as Beyond is free.
I'm even holding a modest package of FDev shares too, which -so far- was a(n almost literally) stellar investment.

 

[Gully Foyle]

What is that story, anyway? Is there a link to an article or wiki or something describing the falling out those two had? I honestly know nothing about it except that it happened.

History here but no mention of strife, unless Dave didn't like black light body paint as much as Ian seems to now.

http://www.theguardian.com/books/2003/oct/18/features.weekend

 

[Simpleye]

Played Elite in 84 on BBC Micro.
Have been an avid gamer ever since.
My kids are confused, because since they bought me the game at 1.3 I have only played Elite.
Not a fanboy, can see faults but no other game came close in 84 and no game comes close now.
Happy customer and looking forward to Beyond

 

[Juniper]

There are always two sides to a story.

Three. Both perspectives, plus a third one: the truth.

The trick is using one or both of those perspectives to gain access to the third.

History here but no mention of strife, unless Dave didn't like black light body paint as much as Ian seems to now.

The "strife" was largely caused by lawyers I believe (isn't it always?). On a personal level, I think they both get on fine... just their careers took different directions.

 

[ShimEnki]

There's been a lot of threads this week about absolute crap. People trying to stir the pot with unfounded allegations, taking facts out of context, or just outright deliberate lying. From the phrasing of some of them, I doubt if they've even played the game they are trashing.

I've been a customer of Frontier since Jan 2015 (v1.0.) Since buying Elite, I have encountered a few major bugs that were fixed relatively quickly. Certainly nothing that affected my game play for any significant time period. There's been some disappointing releases that could have been implemented better and they are being addressed in Beyond. There's been a few controversies because of communication foul-ups, but they were sorted out, usually to the customers benefit.

Some players have bashed and harangued the devs over the smallest pieces of information in the past and up to today. Just one example: Three words in a livestream, "Winter is coming" caused a spew of verbal diarrhea that went on for over eighty pages in one thread alone. If a dev mentions anything off-the-cuff in a livestream the forums explode with speculation based on few, if any, actual facts. And you wonder why they don't communicate with us anymore?

People who criticize Frontier need to go buy games from other companies to see just how well they have it here. I owned a computer games company and I would have killed to have a motivated staff like the Frontier devs. Talented, forthright people who truly love what they do. Well, until they read some of the drivel generated on these forums. Maybe they think negativity will somehow speed the devs up. Good luck with that.

Today, I have three accounts, two of them with LEP's and I'd buy a third in a heartbeat if given the chance. I do appreciate the fact Frontier are giving us a year of FREE updates in Beyond. Thank you for that ladies and gentlemen. As a multiple LEP owner I don't feel "cheated" or "sold short" by any means. The LEP's are long term investments and I know that Elite will be developed for many years to come. The value of my LEP's will be eclipsed by what gets delivered to me in time. Yet, there are some here who feel a years worth of upgrades for nothing is a bad thing? Good lord.

People have called me a fanboi in the past, because of my optimistic posts. A fanboi sees no faults in the thing they promote. I've been critical of some Frontier decisions and I see faults, take a look at the list of bugs I've submitted, but I also see them being fixed and improved as time goes by. Elite isn't perfect, but I'm not expecting perfection. I just want a game to take my mind off the real world for two hours a night. Elite does that, because it's a damned good game, getting better all the time.

I prefer to think of myself, and I'd like Frontier to consider me, a satisfied customer to date.

Haters, trolls and the eternally negative are entitled to their opinion. That's mine.

Hell, with respect, if that doesn't give rise to an invitation to FD head office for tea and cookies and even a shake of the hand of...the lead dev beside OA, then I don't know what will.

 

[Louis Calvert]

I've said before and I'll say again, I love Elite.

 

[NecoMachina]

The biggest advantage of the new forum structure is that I don't have to pass by dangerous threads to open the Cannon (or any other lore/story related) thread. So I don't have to look at all the nonsense moaners are posting.
I love this game so much that it is the sole reason I'm spending money on the rig.

I'm also buying stuff in the store occasionally, and will buy more to support FDev as Beyond is free.
I'm even holding a modest package of FDev shares too, which -so far- was a(n almost literally) stellar investment.

And yet you DID stop into Dangerous, just to call people whiners. Why is it that the majority of the name-calling seems to come from those that have nothing but positive to say about the game? Just stop, please? Post your positive vibes or whatever, but PLEASE stop the name-calling. Seriously.

 

[NecoMachina]

Played Elite in 84 on BBC Micro.
Have been an avid gamer ever since.
My kids are confused, because since they bought me the game at 1.3 I have only played Elite.
Not a fanboy, can see faults but no other game came close in 84 and no game comes close now.
Happy customer and looking forward to Beyond

See? THIS. No name calling. No telling people that their criticisms are groundless. Posts his positive vibes, and that's it.

 

[sollisb]

There's been a lot of threads this week about absolute crap. People trying to stir the pot with unfounded allegations, taking facts out of context, or just outright deliberate lying. From the phrasing of some of them, I doubt if they've even played the game they are trashing.

Let's see your metrics to back that up? No? Don't have any?

I've been a customer of Frontier since Jan 2015 (v1.0.) Since buying Elite, I have encountered a few major bugs that were fixed relatively quickly. Certainly nothing that affected my game play for any significant time period. There's been some disappointing releases that could have been implemented better and they are being addressed in Beyond. There's been a few controversies because of communication foul-ups, but they were sorted out, usually to the customers benefit.

Some players have bashed and harangued the devs over the smallest pieces of information in the past and up to today. Just one example: Three words in a livestream, "Winter is coming" caused a spew of verbal diarrhea that went on for over eighty pages in one thread alone. If a dev mentions anything off-the-cuff in a livestream the forums explode with speculation based on few, if any, actual facts. And you wonder why they don't communicate with us anymore?

I can give you good reason.. They're embarrassed to come on face the players they're accountable to? Constant release filled with bugs. Some small some glaringly obvious to the smallest amount of testing.

People who criticize Frontier need to go buy games from other companies to see just how well they have it here. I owned a computer games company and I would have killed to have a motivated staff like the Frontier devs. Talented, forthright people who truly love what they do. Well, until they read some of the drivel generated on these forums. Maybe they think negativity will somehow speed the devs up. Good luck with that.

See above. Maybe if the devs and the FDev management in particular, should had a good look at themselves compared to other professional coders and project managers, they'd see they'd be fired for gross negligence and being unfit for the job.

Today, I have three accounts, two of them with LEP's and I'd buy a third in a heartbeat if given the chance. I do appreciate the fact Frontier are giving us a year of FREE updates in Beyond. Thank you for that ladies and gentlemen. As a multiple LEP owner I don't feel "cheated" or "sold short" by any means. The LEP's are long term investments and I know that Elite will be developed for many years to come. The value of my LEP's will be eclipsed by what gets delivered to me in time. Yet, there are some here who feel a years worth of upgrades for nothing is a bad thing? Good lord.

This is laughable!! Do you normally invest in triplicate in Vapourware?

People have called me a fanboi in the past, because of my optimistic posts. A fanboi sees no faults in the thing they promote. I've been critical of some Frontier decisions and I see faults, take a look at the list of bugs I've submitted, but I also see them being fixed and improved as time goes by. Elite isn't perfect, but I'm not expecting perfection. I just want a game to take my mind off the real world for two hours a night. Elite does that, because it's a damned good game, getting better all the time.

List 5 things that made it better in the 2.4 release? I'll list you the same number of pathetic bugs.

I prefer to think of myself, and I'd like Frontier to consider me, a satisfied customer to date.

Haters, trolls and the eternally negative are entitled to their opinion. That's mine.

You're entitled to your opinion as am I

 

[sollisb]

But they DID do the right thing. In the commercial world delays are a reality. Tried getting credit for anything ordered on-line before? The only reason bad taste remains is because people like you keep feeding it.

No - we don't. Again, it is the people who keep feeding the fire of "bad taste" that keep dredging it up.

Which "we" are we talking about here? I'm not in that "we". But I suspect all the people like yourself who keep dredging it up AND feeding the fire of bad taste are.

What nonsense! Aim that accusation at SC. FD have actually delivered. Perhaps it isn't exactly what you want, or matched your priorities, but don't you go talking for me.

I'll talk for myself! Just because you, want to bury the fault doesn't mean everyone else has to be like you. FD delivered what exactly? A bug ridden game? Release after release with bugs? Release after release with untested code? Release after release of disjointed add-ins?

For a company to be delivering what they do after 3 years, shows that they have nothing but contempt for the players keeping them in a job!

 

[Obi0914]

I'm a satisfied customer, thank you frontier. The best way to show support is to purchase something from the store. I bought the horizons and a few cosmetic items to show my support.

 

[Zazzilas Arden]

Hear hear.

 

[sb413197]

I am a bit disgruntled but I think it's because I'm almost done with the game, unless vast amounts of new content is added. That's fine though, I've certainly gotten my money's worth!!