Give hauler ships an innate cargohold to make them actual haulers

Ganogati

Ganogati
Max Factor said:
Why would anyone grind deep core mining, just to get another ship, so they can continue to grind deep core mining?

The only reason why this post is relevant is because people do grind. But for people like me who don't, the price is a serious consideration.
Click to expand...

Your best bang for buck would be the python, so price wise it makes more sense. The T7 is a one trick pony so you’d have to buy other ships to do other things. The python is a multipurpose that can haul just as much as the one trick pony while still being able to do pretty much anything in the game quite well.

If avoiding grind is the goal, working directly to the Python is the way to go, IMO, to avoid duplicating effort.
 

-VR- Max Factor

-VR- Max Factor
Ganogati said:
Your best bang for buck would be the python, so price wise it makes more sense. The T7 is a one trick pony so you’d have to buy other ships to do other things. The python is a multipurpose that can haul just as much as the one trick pony while still being able to do pretty much anything in the game quite well.

If avoiding grind is the goal, working directly to the Python is the way to go, IMO, to avoid duplicating effort.
Click to expand...
Why is grinding the python the way to go? You can do pretty much anything in a Cobra that you can do in a python. The python just does more of it in one go, not that you notice it.
 

VirtueXOI

VirtueXOI
@Ganogati Another idea to improve your beloved kneelback ? :p
I do agree with this, but I'll add once again the idea of more specialized modules.
You take teh exemple of military ones and do , lets say "traders" one or explorer ones ? with limited type of mudule you can fit in , but for trader thats mean specialized cargo modules. And maybe bit of both , if you put cargo rack in trading emplacement , it will have 10% more cargo . Dont know . But i agree that some ship have to be tuned up to be at least niche.
 

AdmiralXanos

AdmiralXanos
lets not do magic slot boosting for any ship. what determines a ship's role should be what it is equip to do. The specialist slots for passengers was a mistake and I'm glad that was removed. I'm ok with the military slots but I think that could be expanded to include shield generators. Making auto-pilot and SCA as modules was a mistake too, they should have introduced tech slots that can only fit things like: autopilot, SCA, Planetary landing assist, or a better turret targeting chip, a faster FSD processing card... and ships only have so many card slots. while i had fun with the extra size 1 slots added, i wish they had considered better ways of handling that whole thing.
 

Teh Smoo

T
Ganogati said:
Was talking about this in another thread and wanted to toss up a suggestion thread about it.

Essentially: hauler ships have nothing that separate them as haulers right now. Because of the way that optional slots work, and the need for combat ships to have good optionals, you end up in situations where certain haulers are on such close footing with their warship counterparts that it's not worth buying the hauler just for that task, or they are totally outclassed by their warship counterparts (looking at you poor T-7).

Give T ships an innate cargo hold, a base cargo space in tonnage that exists regardless of whether you put a cargo rack on or not. This would guarantee that haulers will always have an advantage when it comes to hauling over other ships. For example, choosing to give the hauler class ships a % of their maximum reasonable carrying weight (running all cargo racks except for lowest possible t slot shield).

T6: 98T max, 20T innate. Max tonnage able to be hauled: 118T.
Keelback: 82T max, 16T innate. Max tonnage able to be hauled: 98T.
T7: 278T max, 56T innate. Max tonnage able to be hauled: 334T.
T9: 758T max, 152T innate. Max tonnage able to be hauled: 910T
T10: 470T max, 94T innate. Max tonnage able to be hauled: 564T.

Anyhow, I think that this would help create a proper hauling niche to some of the ships, without actually needing to risk overpowering them in any other way by adding even more options to them (since guardian modules could allow them be modified in more clever ways using those slots).
Click to expand...
I had an idea about the same- have hauler types take less a lot less jump penalty from cargo mass. Boosts their range, makes it more consistent from empty to full.
 

Morbad

Morbad
Cargo racks are as close to a universal slot as it gets; about all that would rationally be required for one is a way to move 1*2m canisters from them to the cargo hatch and vice versa. So, I'm not in favor of reserving internal space for them, at least not until what we can carry as cargo changes, or we get actual internal layout of ships that have unusual limitations.

Most larger ships would be highly unlikely to have any volumetric limitations at all. As a general rule, as ships get bigger in ED, volume climbs geometrically faster than mass. It takes a bit of creativity to fit everying a Sidewinder can carry into a Sidewinder's volume. A T-7, Python, or Anaconda held to the same standards of volume would have vast areas of empty space.

Teh Smoo said:
I had an idea about the same- have hauler types take less a lot less jump penalty from cargo mass. Boosts their range, makes it more consistent from empty to full.
Click to expand...

A given FSD requires a certain amount of fuel to move a certain amount of mass a certain distance...it's not something I'd willingly allow to be fudged to increase the appeal of a ship for hauling.

I'd much rather see the game become more internally consistent, rather than less.
 

Greasetrap42

Greasetrap42
Guaranteed to be unpopular idea:

Loading/unloading time of cargo based on type of ship:

Cargo ship: very fast (2 sec per 100 tons)
Multirole ship: slower (10 sec per 100 tons)
Combat ship: very slow (20 sec per 100 tons)
 

Maggie_Oz

Maggie_Oz
I do like this idea. It's a bit like the Saud Kruger ships, they have a special ability that suits them to a particular role.
It would be grand to see all of the various activities get a specialist ship like that.
 

lemon407

L
IMo i think really the issue here is how ED handles cargo basing it off weight and not by volume. IMO which again is not worth a lot, every ship should have a basic cargo hold, that is fixed and it never goes below a specific amount, and adding module cargo holds just add to that space, and allow you to hold mode cargo based on volume, not weight. Weight based cargo hauling is all around just a really weird mechanic that still does not really make sense in the game. I think its just a carry over from predecessors.
 

Maggie_Oz

Maggie_Oz
lemon407 said:
IMo i think really the issue here is how ED handles cargo basing it off weight and not by volume. IMO which again is not worth a lot, every ship should have a basic cargo hold, that is fixed and it never goes below a specific amount, and adding module cargo holds just add to that space, and allow you to hold mode cargo based on volume, not weight. Weight based cargo hauling is all around just a really weird mechanic that still does not really make sense in the game. I think its just a carry over from predecessors.
Click to expand...
How do you know it isn't off volume ?
 

lemon407

L
Maggie_Oz said:
You can have volumetric tonnes, most IRL shipping works on that principle
Click to expand...
Right but in game is dont based off that, you buy literally tons of things, and they give you no volume, thats the problem that imo needs to be changed, because it makes no sense that hauling a ton of gold, takes the same space as a ton of water or something. If have room for 1 ton of water, thats 1000cm^3. why can that space that holds 1 cubic ton of water, not hold more then 1 cubic ton of gold which is only 37cm^3
 

Ian Skippy

Ian Skippy
The ships are properly balanced as is. Income howevee is fundamentally broken, which means it really doesn't matter how you balance the ships, or pretty much anything else. All the meaningful choices this game could have forced the player to make are gone, and ships like the T-series will be pointless for anyone but role players until ED2 or a server reset. Purchase price, maintenance cost, insurance risk: all completely pointless and irrelevant.
 

Maggie_Oz

Maggie_Oz
lemon407 said:
Right but in game is dont based off that, you buy literally tons of things, and they give you no volume, thats the problem that imo needs to be changed, because it makes no sense that hauling a ton of gold, takes the same space as a ton of water or something. If have room for 1 ton of water, thats 1000cm^3. why can that space that holds 1 cubic ton of water, not hold more then 1 cubic ton of gold which is only 37cm^3
Click to expand...

Says who? If I buy 700 tonnes of slaves are you suggesting I have 7000 people on my ship? (700t -> 700,000kg -> 100kg per person -> 7000)
I say each person occupies 1 cubic meter, which could be thought of as a volumetric tonne.
If we use that notion then it makes a lot more sense that a ship that can carry 700 tonnes of vegetables or 700 tonnes of Gold in the same cargo space. If we go off weight the veggies would occupy a considerably great volume than 700 tonnes of Gold. So using the shipping model anything that has a volume of less than 1 cubic meter per tonne, i.e. Gold is measured by mass, anything that is greater is measured by volumetric weight, which equates to the volume occupied by a reference mass, often water, which is about 1tonne per cubic meter.

Note MASS not weight to account for differing gravities. Divide weight by 10-ish on Earth
 

Darkeyed

Darkeyed
Ganogati said:
laden jump
22 degree/s pitch rate with pips in engines
Large ship; cannot land on outposts


So the price difference between these two is about 200mil, right? Except a Cobra MkIII's small 16T hauling capacity would bring 25mil per run deep core mining, so in 10 runs (about 5 hours) you'd have the Python.

At that point, why would you fly the T7? You can't land on outposts, you have a much worse pitch rate for when you get interdicted, much worse straight line speeds and you only gain 2 LY jump range. Armor and shields are comparable between the two.

The moment you get past your first month in the game, the T7 becomes pointless. It's just a stepping stone on your way to the real ship, the Python or (if you are determined to remain in the large ships) the Big 3. My suggestion is to actual give these ships a valid lifespan beyond just the first month of the game. If the T7 was actually able to haul a sizeable amount more than the Python, being able to run 334T compared to the pythons 272T, it might actually be worth buying for someone who isn't having to penny pinch early on.
Click to expand...
well not everyone one likes mining so while mining is extremely profitable doesn't meant that every person can stand to do it. also back when the game first came out you have to understand mining was not really that great of a money turner, heck trading was far more profitable than mining back then. the type 7 while consided a meh ship did have a use back then because it was half the cost of python traders would roll into a type 7 because you could fit it out for half the price of a python and while it cant land at outpost you really didnt need to be able to be a good trader. the only reason for the fall of the trading ships is because of the revamp of mining which now is like printing money
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom