Griefing

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I've never understood griefers and gankers; I just don't roll that way. But I DO understand WHY people will do that.
Griefing and ganking is easier than becoming truly skilled. It takes hundreds and thousands of hours to be a truly capable, truly competent combatant that will fight on an equal level with ANY opponent.
It's EASY to engineer a Vulture and take it to Deciat; knowing that Felicity is the first Engineer new Commanders visit. It's EASY to target CMDRS with ranks below your own.

I have no time for 'easy', myself. 'Easy' is 'boring'.
I want a target that NEARLY kills me. I want a puzzle I can BARELY solve. I want a challenge I can barely understand. The Guardian FSD-booster was a lovely puzzle that had me scratching my head before I worked it out.

That's why I'm here.

So if the Algonquin occasionally flies over to Deciat to check if players are abusing lesser players...well; that's my preference. Any gankers who don't like it may face my guns.
 
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Deleted member 38366

D
The easy answer would be : lower psychological motives, commonly known as the condition of being an [Forum-friendly puzzle] {Start Character A, word length 7}.

It would fall too short of reality though.

Reality is that most other MMO/Multiplayer Games have taken Ganking/Griefing into account during their earliest design phases already.
Hence, a common Griefer will fight a more or less relentless (and eventually very punishing) uphill battle of tasting a dose of his or her own medicine - invalidating the desire to cause other Players harm with no or only minimal risk.

Now meet ELITE Dangerous. A Game without any functional C&P to - in any way - reasonably limit or contain this phenomenon.
Instead, everything was designed to facilitate and optimize endless Ganking/Griefing and every possible advantage has been tossed into that direction.
If it wasn't officially (quote) "It was a Design Decision. Working as Intended" that'd be nothing short of an epic, complete and catastrophic design failure on a grand scale.

So noone should be surprised that this Player Archetype follows the open invitation and takes advantage of the countless imbalances baked into the Game to nourish and advertise exactly this specific approach playing the Game. Even confirmed cheaters got off with a slap on the wrist in the past - if even that occurred, countless examples where nothing happened over a very long time.

With so little choice amongst MMO/Multiplayer titles and such a unique invitation - there's your prime reason why Ganking/Griefing in ELITE has become so widespread it's literally considered "condition : normal" by now.
It's no wonder they flocked to ELITE like moth being attracted to light and (despite not being a fan of that by any accounts) I can't blame the Gankers/Griefers.

PS.
I still stand by my words from 2015 : utter and complete design failure on that part. Inexcusable. And probably the single worst Design Decision I ever saw.
Difficult to estimate the cumulative revenue potential lost by that decision alone but I'm confident it's safe to assume it's profound
For some reason FDev seems convinced it was worth it. ¯\(ツ)
 
Maybe if you all stopped being such easy marks the gankers would really have a harder time. But no. Beeline to Farseer, Shinrarta, and whatever CG is active at the moment like the drones you are. Don't bother learning to fly your big ship. Don't bother learning to outfit. Heck, why even consider choosing Solo or PG when you're not in the mood for PvP.

Nope, just click Open. Take that five days of exploration data and head straight to Shinrarta. Maybe you won't get ganked this time. But hey, if you do, there's plenty of people ready to hold your hand and make you some chicken soup.

Meanwhile, all the folks you decry as gankers be like:

source.gif
 
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What do players get from camping by a nav beacon and constantly attacking an unarmed ship with no cargo, or no bounty? Is it just the pleasure of ruining the game for someone else, or what?

Human nature is human nature. Although some PvPers do like ganking and griefing, and they have the right to do so according to the ToS, there are indeed many PvPers who refuse to gank and grief knowing full well they could ruin another's day.

I am one of them and am sorry you had that experience.

Unfortunately, human nature is human nature.

And if Commanders have the right to gank and grief, you have the right to ask why. You also have the right to refuse to adhere to anything anyone says. Including myself.

Best wishes.

o7
 
My 2 cents...

But for the new players, in his hauler/viper a lot wouldn't be known by them at that stage of the game, imho.

5 to 10 days into the game, maybe just left the training bubble, never been to the forums, (the shame of it!)
and has no idea how to spot, let alone counter, said ganker..
Whom outta say, the six or seven ships around farseer has picked the one ship that's got no weapons or decent build set up and is clearly a beginner..

(probably, like I was doing the first time I was "Ganked" trying to discover how to go about engineering)

But I want ... to "test muh skills"...

So why would he bother with the noob? Especially When there's a mid level engineered Annie there,

is it a challenge?...

Hell no,

Is it to teach this "noob" not to fly in open in an un-engineered ship ..

No, because he has no idea why you splatted him..
Obviously not. Its just a human, as usual, being a "Pe-Nus"!
Ajay
o7
 
Unpopular opinion: or not enough. There is this wishy-washy phase you have to plow through...
One must solve and coagulate to make room for the laser-fire, in order to observe the circular orbits of phlogiston inside. The true self is formed this way, also shaped in position of right hand in evoking position and another in veneration. To emulate the primal nature of the world-egg one must first reveal thy star-splendour inside and separate the two dragons of reincarnation from each others tails. This is the sacred chrysopoesis, anima mundi. Volatile stars of the aether must be consumed by light before the house of Tothos can be entered sideways, thus circumventing the blindess caused by spiritual magnetism. To build the house, one must first gank 365 novice Asps, one for each heaven, while ethically aligned to fixed stars in the sky, and repeating the triangular incantation of creation: Abracadabra!
 
One must solve and coagulate to make room for the laser-fire, in order to observe the circular orbits of phlogiston inside. The true self is formed this way, also shaped in position of right hand in evoking position and another in veneration. To emulate the primal nature of the world-egg one must first reveal thy star-splendour inside and separate the two dragons of reincarnation from each others tails. This is the sacred chrysopoesis, anima mundi. Volatile stars of the aether must be consumed by light before the house of Tothos can be entered sideways, thus circumventing the blindess caused by spiritual magnetism. To build the house, one must first gank 365 novice Asps, one for each heaven, while ethically aligned to fixed stars in the sky, and repeating the triangular incantation of creation: Abracadabra!
Someone likes the dictionary! 😉
Lotta big words in there..." We ain't good wit ur ledders" lol
o7
 
One must solve and coagulate to make room for the laser-fire, in order to observe the circular orbits of phlogiston inside. The true self is formed this way, also shaped in position of right hand in evoking position and another in veneration. To emulate the primal nature of the world-egg one must first reveal thy star-splendour inside and separate the two dragons of reincarnation from each others tails. This is the sacred chrysopoesis, anima mundi. Volatile stars of the aether must be consumed by light before the house of Tothos can be entered sideways, thus circumventing the blindess caused by spiritual magnetism. To build the house, one must first gank 365 novice Asps, one for each heaven, while ethically aligned to fixed stars in the sky, and repeating the triangular incantation of creation: Abracadabra!
Consulting my Mystical Purple Crystal of Florb to figure out what the blazes you just said.
 
Neither, really. The ones chained to the meta of how to proceed with the process of unlocking Engineers.


While the whining about it is a little pathetic, what would the newish player who wants to explore be expected to do? Armor up, bolt on heavy weapons, and not engineer? Spend hours in combat zones to "get gud" at something they didn't really want to do?

I can understand going around and shooting spaceships in a game largely based on shooting spaceships. I don't understand the rather pervasive opinion that anyone that tries to develop a ship specialized for things other than combat is a tard. If I build a decent mining ship, it's only ever going to suck at combat. If I want to jump long distances to get to remote places it's silly to bolt armor and guns to the ship and take huge heavy modules. It's like F-22 fighter pilots hunting students in Cessna 152's. "It's their fault for being in the air with a single engine paper airplane.... dumb____s".

However, this isn't real life and the game allows for people to pop soap bubbles for fun so: Folks, if your ship is made of aluminium foil and you are coming in with 4 weeks of exploration data, perhaps... just perhaps... "open" is not the perfect mode for you. If you just bought that new Type-9 and you only have 2 rebuys worth of credits heading to the CG in open might not be, so to speak, the perfect plan. But then the new player that doesn't get on the forums isn't going to know this so I'm probably preaching to the choir.

Of course this leads to complaints that nobody is in open and that nothing done in solo should count because there is no risk.... so its all a snake eating its tail.
 
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Some of them, yes.
Some of them do it to vent steam.
Some want to test the response of the victim.
Some like explosions.
Some shoot everything that flies (and frankly a lot out there is crap builds).
Some do it because their friends do it.

Nah. That is a good list of all of the different ex post facto lies they use to justify their irrational desire to feel powerful in a space video game.
 
I have a theory about gankers and griefers. I think they are the kind of people who are bullied in their day-to-day life. They get picked on at school, yelled at by their abusive boss, or have an overbearing mother like Norman Bates. So, when they sit down behind the keyboard they become monsters. They get picked on all day, so when they are playing their favorite games online, preferably with other betas who can't stand up to people in real life, they become the abusers. They become God. It's the only way they get to feel powerful. The same goes for certain moderators I've seen on a few online forums. I'm looking at you, rpg.net

Now, I'm not talking about people who kill other players legit. If I get killed by a CMDR working for Zachary Hudson while I'm under Aisling Duval, that is a legit kill and I shouldn't get too salty over it. If anything, I should be mad at myself for either a lack of skill, or because I tried engaging a fully outfitted combat ship with my cargo ship because it has nice shields.

I don't even get mad when other players kill me for no reason at all. It's just a game. The only time I get annoyed is when a player goes out of his way to stalk and harass me. Then I just block them from instancing and move on.

Yes, some of them might be sadistic little (insert your favorite vulgar slang word here), but I always think to myself... jeez... this guy's life must really suck. Then I get over it.
 
I don't play anymore cause I got sick of the engineer grind but the last couple times I did, I played Solo which I haven't done since the first couple weeks, since realizing what a drag Solo is on this game, and I had more fun just being able to focus on that. Not much more. But more.

I realized I was sick of having to balance my ship for Open and away from simply being dictated by what I felt like. I was sick of having to pick my ship for Open. I was sick of having to alter my playstyle for Open and away from how this game is played naturally (bandwidth monitor on, check recent player list, jumpstar chore, never scoop on last, avoid hotspots in non-pvp built ship [edit: broken interdiction system]. and why does this game's sc radar always reset? do the devs love pressing pgup so much?).

So it's better now, but I can't touch PP and I'm not even sure about BGS. Probably OK if no pmf is present in system but otherwise bgs is out too.

Open/Solo sucks and Frontier should have instead had edge systems or story systems/hotspots where PVP was possible. Or scaled the amount of PVP potential by bgs system security level.

As it is it just mostly sucks and ruins the game at some point for everyone but trash.
 
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I mean, I wasn't involved with the community at all for ages, and I got access to Felicity first because I ran passenger missions. It was just kind of second nature to head to her first (although I played Solo-only for a long time, so I didn't really care about any risks there may have been).
Like, I'm not going to argue that 'just don't go to Deciat' is great advice, but I'm also not sure how there's a meta involved? In a vacuum, you're gonna get a roughly even split of people going to each one.
Care explaining what you mean by the meta? There's definitely a trend, I'm just not sure what you see in it.

It's been a long, long time since I did the Engineer grind for the first time. In fact, it was when Engineers first came out. Back then, the first bit of advice was to unlock Farseer and grab the extended range FSD. That's been the dominant paradigm ever since. The sheer amount of traffic (and resulting violence) shows this. Beyond that, Google "Engineer guide Elite Dangerous" and see what people recommend. The top result (Fox's Guide or some such) doesn't even mention Martuuk.

We all know how lazy the average Commander is. "What's the fastest way to grind (insert goal here)?"

I know this isn't very scientific. I don't have the time to really dive in. Just the reflections of a long time Elite: Dangerous player (who has done his fair share of ganking).

While the whining about it is a little pathetic, what would the newish player who wants to explore be expected to do? Armor up, bolt on heavy weapons, and not engineer? Spend hours in combat zones to "get gud" at something they didn't really want to do?

Good defense doesn't require a massive sacrifice on the part of an explorer. This has been known for a long, long while now.

I can understand going around and shooting spaceships in a game largely based on shooting spaceships. I don't understand the rather pervasive opinion that anyone that tries to develop a ship specialized for things other than combat is a tard. If I build a decent mining ship, it's only ever going to suck at combat. If I want to jump long distances to get to remote places it's silly to bolt armor and guns to the ship and take huge heavy modules. It's like F-22 fighter pilots hunting students in Cessna 152's. "It's their fault for being in the air with a single engine paper airplane.... dumb____s".

Real life analogies don't work here. Elite: Dangerous is dystopian space punk where folks will kill you for any and every reason under the sun if it suits their interests.

However, this isn't real life and the game allows for people to pop soap bubbles for fun so: Folks, if your ship is made of aluminium foil and you are coming in with 4 weeks of exploration data, perhaps... just perhaps... "open" is not the perfect mode for you. If you just bought that new Type-9 and you only have 2 rebuys worth of credits heading to the CG in open might not be, so to speak, the perfect plan. But then the new player that doesn't get on the forums isn't going to know this so I'm probably preaching to the choir.

Of course this leads to complaints that nobody is in open and that nothing done in solo should count because there is no risk.... so its all a snake eating its tail.

Reports of Open Play's have always been, and will continue to be, greatly exaggerated.

I have a theory about gankers and griefers. I think they are the kind of people who are bullied in their day-to-day life. They get picked on at school, yelled at by their abusive boss, or have an overbearing mother like Norman Bates. So, when they sit down behind the keyboard they become monsters. They get picked on all day, so when they are playing their favorite games online, preferably with other betas who can't stand up to people in real life, they become the abusers. They become God. It's the only way they get to feel powerful. The same goes for certain moderators I've seen on a few online forums. I'm looking at you, rpg.net

Now, I'm not talking about people who kill other players legit. If I get killed by a CMDR working for Zachary Hudson while I'm under Aisling Duval, that is a legit kill and I shouldn't get too salty over it. If anything, I should be mad at myself for either a lack of skill, or because I tried engaging a fully outfitted combat ship with my cargo ship because it has nice shields.

I don't even get mad when other players kill me for no reason at all. It's just a game. The only time I get annoyed is when a player goes out of his way to stalk and harass me. Then I just block them from instancing and move on.

Yes, some of them might be sadistic little (insert your favorite vulgar slang word here), but I always think to myself... jeez... this guy's life must really suck. Then I get over it.

People you and this forum would label "gankers and griefers" are some of the most intelligent, kind, and thoughtful people I know. Some of the highest quality players this game has ever seen not only gank,but mine, explore, trade, BGS, and do PowerPlay. More than a few write, roleplay, plan in game events, and mentor new players in every aspect of the game you can imagine. Even more test the game's limits, provide valuable feedback to the developer, and create even more meaningful adventures for all of us to enjoy.

The fact of the matter is Open Play allows for unrestricted PvP in a dystopian space punk environment. Folks like you lose their brains over it because frankly, you probably should've moved on from Elite ages ago.
 
People you and this forum would label "gankers and griefers" are some of the most intelligent, kind, and thoughtful people I know.
Off course they are! 😉
Some of the highest quality players this game has ever seen not only gank,but mine, explore, trade, BGS, and do PowerPlay. More than a few write, roleplay, plan in game events, and mentor new players in every aspect of the game you can imagine. Even more test the game's limits, provide valuable feedback to the developer, and create even more meaningful adventures for all of us to enjoy.
Ooh, should we all thank them for being so friendly and helpful? I never knew they had my best interests at heart!
Folks like you lose their brains over because frankly, you probably should've moved on from Elite ages ago.
Sorry I didn't realise you were the boss lol, ill get my stuffs..
 
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