Guilds in Elite Dangerous

[Roybe]

Oh I meant single players in Open griefing guildies by whichever method. If it makes guildies cry and move to Solo - that would just be delicious, but wrong

Single players griefing group members? It could happen, but then who would care? Just bring another wing and have a huge battle. Seems like emergent gameplay to me! Most players concerns is that the groups will in some way hinder single players. If a single player is playing in open and gets angry over interactions with others, they are playing in the wrong mode entirely.

 

[The Wallet Inspector]

It is the very fact that Elite is faction-based rather than guild-based which makes Elite what it is. You're trying to use "bring it into the 21st Century" as justification. Simple fact is - Elite: Dangerous has a background simulation based on faction control - NPC at that. Guilds are next to pointless.

They dont have to compete with the background sim factions. also, the background sim is BROKEN, and I cannot even affiliate with one of the NPC factions, so Guilds would be FAR from pointless. Maybe if they had a working system for players to ally themselves in a meaningful way, you would have a point. I dont even have a list of factions I am allied with, where is this information?

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That's just it - good argument and facts for guild introduction have not so far been presented to the satisfaction of everyone.
All these comments about "fear" are absolutely laughable. Telling people that they should play solo or die is hardly giving them incentive to play open.
As for local chat, I immediately disabled it, and now voice comms too.
As for the drama, that is relative.

I have to say though, the arguments against are just as spurious. as another poster pointed out, we seem to be delving deep into the slippery slope logical fallacy, and some players who even admit it would not make there game worse, vote NO because they don't want others to have it. They are not good enough reasons imo..

 

[Roybe]

That's just it - good argument and facts for guild introduction have not so far been presented to the satisfaction of everyone.
All these comments about "fear" are absolutely laughable. Telling people that they should play solo or die is hardly giving them incentive to play open.
As for the drama, that is relative.

No one is telling people to play in solo or die. We are suggesting players understand their personal level of comfort with loss and play accordingly. I have lost millions in ships. I play primarily in Open. Yes it stings when I lose...but I understand the choice I made. Everyone has to understand their choice to play in Open. if they are going to allow that sting of loss to destroy their 'fun', they need to choose to play in private modes. Why is this so hard to understand? <not trying to be facetious here, I do not understand why people fail to grasp this concept, you will lose your ship in Open, sometime>

 

[Genar-Hofoen]

Currently the factions are all but meaningless. We can hope that will change but claiming they are essential to the nature of the game is plain wrong. Just as it is wrong to claim that guilds are next to pointless. That is merely your assessment of their worth to you.

The current iteration of the background sim is kind of placeholder - yes.

Nevertheless, FDEV have gone down the route of coding a background sim based on factions. It is here to stay. It will improve. Guilds, once again, are pointless in ED.

 

[Kayweg]

Yeah, like the minority of players who wanted to wing up lol. The same care bears are coming out of the woodwork to prevent players from teaming up. If they are that scared, they should go play solo. The devs should spend their time making the game the best they can, within their own vision of the game, not pandering to people who fear change. As for next week, I hope I am surprised. Between this argument, and the instant shield recharge hack, and the whining about people logging, I am getting pretty sick of the drama...

Perhaps that's exactly what they are doing and why there are no guilds ?

 

[Roybe]

It is the very fact that Elite is faction-based rather than guild-based which makes Elite what it is. You're trying to use "bring it into the 21st Century" as justification. Simple fact is - Elite: Dangerous has a background simulation based on faction control - NPC at that. Guilds are next to pointless.

A guild working to bring up a faction caused the fun we had in Lugh. Bad argument is bad.

 

[Asp Explorer]

As things stand, there is only an argument for. The current state is against, so no argument needs to be made on its behalf as to why it should be introduced. Only arguments for and against its current state, and why it should be changed in favour of the "for" group make any sense.

 

[The Wallet Inspector]

The current iteration of the background sim is kind of placeholder - yes.

Nevertheless, FDEV have gone down the route of coding a background sim based on factions. It is here to stay. It will improve. Guilds, once again, are pointless in ED.

You keep using the word "pointless", as if it would have no meaning. It WOULD have meaning to the players in the guilds, who use the chat function, and bear the tag of their guild. So no, they would not be "meaningless" in any way, unless you just chose not to be in one. So then no problem either way for you..

 

[Genar-Hofoen]

They dont have to compete with the background sim factions. also, the background sim is BROKEN, and I cannot even affiliate with one of the NPC factions, so Guilds would be FAR from pointless. Maybe if they had a working system for players to ally themselves in a meaningful way, you would have a point. I dont even have a list of factions I am allied with, where is this information?

You are clearly showing a lack of understanding of the game.

Your alliance with a faction is shown in-game on the right-hand panel.

FDEV are working on improving the background sim - which, again, is faction based and will stay that way, rendering guilds pointless.

Lastly, "teamspeak guilds" indeed can only influence the background sim - in turn influencing the background sim factions. The teamspeak method works, so just keep it that way.

 

[The Wallet Inspector]

As things stand, there is only an argument for. The current state is against, so no argument needs to be made on its behalf as to why it should be introduced. Only arguments for and against its current state, and why it should be changed in favour of the "for" group make any sense.

So basically you would like people who disagree with you on the matter to stop making their arguments, and advocating for their position. That is not going to happen in an open forum of ideas. This is all the same opposition I heard to Wings, nothing new here..

 

[Genar-Hofoen]

You keep using the word "pointless", as if it would have no meaning. It WOULD have meaning to the players in the guilds, who use the chat function, and bear the tag of their guild. So no, they would not be "meaningless" in any way, unless you just chose not to be in one. So then no problem either way for you..

It is pointless relative to the background sim.

Use teamspeak and create your guild forum, just keep this utterly pointless guild stuff away from infecting ED.

You can always play EvE Valkyrie when it comes out, if you want.

 

[Roybe]

You are clearly showing a lack of understanding of the game.

Your alliance with a faction is shown in-game on the right-hand panel.

FDEV are working on improving the background sim - which, again, is faction based and will stay that way, rendering guilds pointless.

Lastly, "teamspeak guilds" indeed can only influence the background sim - in turn influencing the background sim factions. The teamspeak method works, so just keep it that way.

So what is the harm in allowing those groups some social capabilities. Membership lists, tags, overall guild chat, shareable rights to private group instancing, etc. Preventing these types of interactions is as silly as the no wings and basic comms we had at the start.

 

[Ghostickles]

You are clearly showing a lack of understanding of the game.

Your alliance with a faction is shown in-game on the right-hand panel.

FDEV are working on improving the background sim - which, again, is faction based and will stay that way, rendering guilds pointless.

Lastly, "teamspeak guilds" indeed can only influence the background sim - in turn influencing the background sim factions. The teamspeak method works, so just keep it that way.

...rendering guilds pointless? Do you even guild bro?
Social interactions. Not Replace Factions.
I have a horde on my friends list, sorry if your possibly not as social but that makes nothing 'rendered pointless'
...of all the ignorant things ive had to read today, im going to bed, that tears it.
/stomps off shaking head

 

[The Wallet Inspector]

You are clearly showing a lack of understanding of the game.

Your alliance with a faction is shown in-game on the right-hand panel.

FDEV are working on improving the background sim - which, again, is faction based and will stay that way, rendering guilds pointless.

Lastly, "teamspeak guilds" indeed can only influence the background sim - in turn influencing the background sim factions. The teamspeak method works, so just keep it that way.

You clearly dont understand my post OR the game. I am not referring to Empire Fed, but the smaller FACTION. Also, the fact you can be high ranking with both is laughable, and makes the whole system impotent. You cannot even tell whether another player is allied with the same people you are, so no, it is not working correctly. Oh and as for Teamspeak, lets NOT keep it that way. Having to use third party apps to get the most out of the game shows where it is lacking in content and feature. It breaks immersion.

 

[Asp Explorer]

So basically you would like people who disagree with you on the matter to stop making their arguments, and advocating for their position. That is not going to happen in an open forum of ideas. This is all the same opposition I heard to Wings, nothing new here..

The exact opposite I'm afraid - I'd love you all to explicitly say what you would like to see introduced, and state how it would benefit everyone, how it would benefit Elite, and why the devs should introduce it.

 

[Kayweg]

A guild working to bring up a faction caused the fun we had in Lugh. Bad argument is bad.

That only proves one thing, player collaboration already works, without in-game guild mechanics.

 

[Roybe]

The exact opposite I'm afraid - I'd love you all to explicitly say what you would like to see introduced, and state how it would benefit everyone, how it would benefit Elite, and why the devs should introduce it.

Many have posted their desires within this thread. I suggest reading through it. Not our fault it's a swamp of no..no...no...no. Good luck!

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That only proves one thing, player collaboration already works, without in-game guild mechanics.

It would just be nice to have some ways to have it work better.

 

[Genar-Hofoen]

So what is the harm in allowing those groups some social capabilities. Membership lists, tags, overall guild chat, shareable rights to private group instancing, etc. Preventing these types of interactions is as silly as the no wings and basic comms we had at the start.

1) You have a friends list in-game. Use it.

2) You can bung your guild tag in your commander name - use it. Just need to erase your CMDR first then name him with [WHATEVER].

3) I have no idea what "shareable rights to private groups" means in the context of ED.

4) Comms - use teamspeak - I heard that's good for guilders.

 

[Asp Explorer]

So many posts. Little introduction. Much guildlessness.

 

[The Wallet Inspector]

The exact opposite I'm afraid - I'd love you all to explicitly say what you would like to see introduced, and state how it would benefit everyone, how it would benefit Elite, and why the devs should introduce it.

You just have to look at the posts to see what people want, I have reiterated my position more than once on here this afternoon, yet people still seem to read it as "I want a game where you have to be in a 2000 player guild and I want guild missions and guild only content and I want to gank other players who are not in my guild and I want this game to be WOW". I myself do not want extra game content, just social tools attached to guilds/squadrons, and the ability to see who is member of who. I also want that for the NPC factions, I would like to be able to say, affiliate with The Farmers Union of Kappa Fornacis, and for other players to see that. It can encourage co-operation (and conflict) amongst strangers.. If you look at the poll, only 10 people wanted this to turn into a guildfest, and I bet half of them were trolling.. I did not even get to vote in it as it was closed so long ago...