Hellmode

[Feros-da-Grundig]

Also as terrible as they are, I'd even accept the nonsensical proposal if there was a meaningful way to find players in open aside from CG, seals in eravate, or murderhoboes in jameson/bunda/san tu.

Wakes that persisted for minutes or even an hour, but required an A rated scanner (this is a lot of current draw for a medium ship). Gal map heat overlays of cmdr activity in open over the last hour. Anything. Throw me a bone aside from stupid CGs and "pirating" cmdrs in eravate where I usually just end up teaching them how to deploy a cargo scoop or land. The void opal stations were nice before there were 40 of them. (39 to be exact).

I also had no idea C&P was even aimed at gankers until recently. I always assumed it was there to deter people who were using NPC murder to INF- the BGS, which no longer is effective in 3.3 anyway. In fact I'm almost certain that's why it's there. It does nothing to deter ganking. Due to sparsity of CMDRs in open even the most prolific ganker will have a much much much lower killcount than a 3.2 era BGS murder-influencer. They'll never reach your notoriety levels without also either drastically changing how notoriety works in PvE, or greatly increasing the number of CMDR interactions.

 

[Feros-da-Grundig]

EDIT ehh disregard this thread is noes

 

[CMDR Cosmic Spacehead]

Or...

Notoriety 6+ = Open Only.
With galmap marker, that's updated each jump to a system with a nav beacon, and will show if they're on or near anything like a planet or station.
Compromised nav beacons update too, but slower, but don't give in-system information.

+ Persistent ATR, so you'll never be alone taking the CMDR down.

+ The CMDR shows as a red hollow square/triangle, and doesn't require a scan, thus completely legal to shoot at.

 

[M00ka]

You wouldn't believe what happened to me. There I was heading to my home station in my Mamba but being a little more cautious because there is a CG going on there. Next thing this idiot starts bombarding me with stupid messages about what side I am on - heck I'm not even participating in the CG I just want to get home. Next thing this ganker just opens up on me, next thing I am seeing is the rebuy screen.

 

[Bryan K]

Actually Hellmode was suggested originally as players who persistently murder non wanted players (gankers), exploiters and cheats, get placed into an version of Open which does not effect the Galaxy, BGS etc in anyway.
The only players they would ever meet are like minded gankers, exploiters and cheats.

I would support this.

 

[Sup3rfluiD]

Or...

Notoriety 6+ = Open Only.
With galmap marker, that's updated each jump to a system with a nav beacon, and will show if they're on or near anything like a planet or station.
Compromised nav beacons update too, but slower, but don't give in-system information.

+ Persistent ATR, so you'll never be alone taking the CMDR down.

+ The CMDR shows as a red hollow square/triangle, and doesn't require a scan, thus completely legal to shoot at.

I think you might get more than you're bargaining for with this type of proposal.

The major driving factor for a PvP player is to find someone to fight.
If your ideas were implemented it would encourage even more non Consensual combat than ever.
Killing someone would just make it more likely I'll get another fight with your snazzy advertising mechanic.

I like it.

Ps. The ATR are a joke to properly skilled and constructed players.
I really can't fathom why people keep thinking they are some kind of protection.

 

[Crazy Joe]

Notoriety above 5 should increasingly lose you the benefits of membership of the Pilots Federation. The first thing you should lose is the IFF function - the pilot's name and status, the ship's name and, most importantly, the "hollow" flags on the radar that identify other CMDRs. Without those the Hassle-hole gankers would find it hard to target other CMDRs.

Also include loss of other Pilot's Federation perks such as access to Shinrarta Dehzra. If you kill your fellow members of the Pilot's Federation you shouldn't be allowed in the organization's home system.

 

[Havvk]

My suggestions were of course nonsensical, as were the original set.

I'm certain mine would actually go further in terms of reducing ganking though. If you think these guys can't gank from an unengineered viper in eravate then you should learn more about the subject before thinking you can fix it.

Some of us also just don't believe in actual victims in video games, aside from perhaps a few truly extreme cases which crossed into IRL behavior. It's just a rebuy. Don't fly without rebuy, better yet without 5 rebuys.

Most of my "victims" have a lot of fun and send friend requests after, the rest just flee, or try to fight back and then flee, or comms log (since I always start with comms, I don't even get to combat logging stage).

How many times have the posters in this thread actually been ganked? Did you adjust your piloting behavior in any way after?

I fly without even 2% of a rebuy just to prove statements like this false

 

[Kaocraft]

Notariety 1 - 30 second timer anytime you want to log out of the game.
Notariety 2 - must change ship paintjob before leaving every station or be insta-scanned on your way out and instascanned at next port of entry.
Notariety 3 - docking computer privileges revoked in non-anarchy systems.
Notariety 4 - "block player" and "send friend request" features disabled.
Notariety 5 - 60 second timer anytime you want to log out of the game, insta-death if you force-quit, internet goes out, or your game crashes.
Notariety 6 - may no longer adjust audio settings in the game.
Notariety 7 - may no longer adjust graphics settings in the game.
Notariety 8 - Must install new launcher called "Elite:Notorious Launcher". This launcher has two buttons "I'm sorry" and "Quit". Pressing "I'm Sorry" launches the regular Elite Dangerous launcher.
Notariety 9 - All Galmap bookmarks deleted upon ship destruction.
Notariety 10 - Your location is visible to all on galmap, holo-me profiles are all overwritten with duplicates of Harry Potter/Beseiger's avatar.

 

[Feros-da-Grundig]

You wouldn't believe what happened to me. There I was heading to my home station in my Mamba but being a little more cautious because there is a CG going on there. Next thing this idiot starts bombarding me with stupid messages about what side I am on - heck I'm not even participating in the CG I just want to get home. Next thing this ganker just opens up on me, next thing I am seeing is the rebuy screen.

Ugh. This is a response to the comment I removed almost immediately after posting. I wanted to avoid the rabbit hole.

It would have been classy to just remove your comment as well. But here we go down the rabbit hole.

The comment described an actual encounter this Sunday in open that involved no ganking, but could have qualified me to gain a point into "helltown" or whatever it was called for CMDRs who kill unwanted ships. I was trying to point out how unworkable that system would be by punishing legitimate CMDR interactions that cannot be easily algorithmically distinguished from ganks.

Responder is pretending to be a Mamba I interdicted at a CG. The difference is his version makes no sense and is entirely fictitious, whereas I am happy to share video of my actual real open encounter. So his opening line "You wouldn't believe what happened to me" should be taken at face value. Don't believe it, it's entirely impossible and would never happen.

Of note:

He fails to mention there never was a rebuy, because as mediocre as this pilot was to lose shields and 56% hull in just 4 minutes while piloting a combat fit Mamba versus a pirate kit challenger, he at least knew enough to press that magic mamba boost key which for the mamba is an instant ~600m/s exit. As weak a pilot as he was, he lived because he exercised the basic guidelines of engagement and escape that we shout from the rooftops to no avail among certain crowds.

He fails to mention the Mamba had a multicrew, which for a ship that can't carry SLF is almost surely an exploit to gain combat advantage via an extra pip. Commanders who do this are exclusively looking for combat, and well versed enough in the game and combat to realize how important an extra pip is, and it possibly violates the terms of service by using ghost accounts under false names to gain extra crew who sit there and do nothing besides provide an extra pip. This mamba had no turrets for crew to operate. Why does this behavior not bother you, responder?

He fails to mention I clearly stated this "cautious" Mamba rammed seconds after a 3rd comms, and before any shots were fired. Ramming is one of the Mamba's most potent weapons, and also allows him to attack me first without incurring a bounty. With the amount of time it takes to make 3 comms attempts on a PS4, he could easily have disengaged. He was clearly spoiling for a fight, and just didn't want to fire the first shot. A mythical unicorn peacetime Mamba would not have made three circle passes while listening to comms instead of just boosting away.

[gankers don't comms, it's a massive combat disadvantage especially on PS4 and especially 3 attempts. insulting attempt to paint me as a ganker. interdiction != ganking]

He fails to understand that no one actually jumps anywhere in mamba, it is among the worst traveling ships in the game. Going to a "home" system in it is ridiculous.

Next time you make up a story, post something remotely believable.

I on the other hand have a video posted of the event to back up every fact I've just listed. Because it is a real open CMDR interaction, and nothing to be ashamed of, in fact I'm quite pleased for having defeated a combat CMDR who was leveraging an exploit to have an unfair advantage in a ship most would consider superior to mine for PvP.

This response pretty much highlights everything wrong with this thread. So many people just spinning wild fantasies of murderous ganker swarms dominating every single CMDR interaction out there when that is not what open is like, it's mostly empty space just like solo. Some obvious infrequent exceptions like DW2 launch. My previous CMDR interaction before this one was getting a gg from a dude across a language barrier (we sparred to 30%). The one before that was teaching a noobie in eravate how to cargo scoop and land, by requesting he help me smuggle narcotics into Maine Hub. He gained a lot of knowledge and 10k credits from that in his sidewinder on his first day of play while I got to pretend I was doing piratey narcotics smuggling when what I really was doing was the sort of training missions FDev should have build into the game. I have video of these encounters as well and I put effort into finding them because that is one of the ways I find the game fun.

So to the poster who saw fit to make up a bunch of nonsense, what were your last CMDR interactions like, and when did they occur?

Have you ever taught a day 1 commander in eravate how to dock?

Or do you play in solo and just speculate what should happen to the rest of us in open?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZcrtWgcggRM

 

[Weps]

The only Hellmode that needs to happen is player kill unending notoriety levels with exponential decay periods instead of linear, and exponential associated financial penalties. No notoriety from NPCs, or substantially reduced rates.

Let players decide just how often they want to kill, and how much waiting time they can bear for repeated killing. Accidental notoriety can also benefit from this since it will get a much shorter period.

Or if they don't care about notoriety, then let them choose just how high the rebuy can get. Penalties are just going to be doubling up for the same number of kills.

But the best part about it is gankers ganking the gankers. So you wanna be Tony Dogs the new maniac tough guy in town? No problem, there is surely someone out there looking to gank you right back into that account reset. Alpha dog race. The bigger fish. Ganking leaderboards.

 

[Myou]

Also I might add, that the type of people who hunt nooblets are more often than not the folks who get utterly pooped all over at the CG's by the PvPers who can actually fly. Sure theres a few bad eggs, but why should the rest of the PvP community suffer because a couple of people act like T***s?

Surely if you do proper pvp this wouldnt affect you? You're not gonna go massively slaughter clean ships with report crimes on would you? That said i think the scale of this could be increased, attacking just 6 traders would be a bit... well short lived for gameplay.

I rather like the idea of actual police chasing criminals though, just like how federal agents go after you about anywhere if you have a federal bounty. Beef'm up so they can go toe to toe with you and it'd be cool. None of this lose your engineering on rebuy nonsense though, what id want would be GTA kind of chases and mayhem.

 

[Sup3rfluiD]

I don't think most people understand that there is a quite large and skilled PvP player base that has very little to do.
There is no support through design or mechanic to occupy their time.
For many of the most prominent " problem children" throughout the game have simply been forced to assume their own content.
You can't play cowboys without someone playing Indians.
If the odd settler gets scalped by a war party so the cavalry can come charging , well don't take it so seriously.

 

[Feros-da-Grundig]

I fly without even 2% of a rebuy just to prove statements like this false

First off, there were a lot of statements there. Which does yours prove false?

If you mean that gankers can't succeed without overwhelming builds... welll I fully believe you can't be ganked by a viper. Your listed ship is a vette and you're a frequent poster. I would not be surprised to find out you're a superb pilot. I wouldn't even be surprised to find out you couldn't be ganked by an FdL.

But 9/10 eravate commanders could be ganked by a well flown A rated non engr. viper or even eagle. There is video out there to prove it.

 

[Rubbernuke]

I don't think most people understand that there is a quite large and skilled PvP player base that has very little to do.
There is no support through design or mechanic to occupy their time.
For many of the most prominent " problem children" throughout the game have simply been forced to assume their own content.
You can't play cowboys without someone playing Indians.
If the odd settler gets scalped by a war party so the cavalry can come charging , well don't take it so seriously.

Open Powerplay would go a long way to help that, but once again the squealing hordes shouted that down as well so here we are.

 

[Navigare Necesse Est]

Notoriety and consequence should be tied to killspeed. The faster you kill a hapless victim due to your power juiced meta-ship the more pronounced the consequences.

 

[Feros-da-Grundig]

Notoriety and consequence should be tied to killspeed. The faster you kill a hapless victim due to your power juiced meta-ship the more pronounced the consequences.

Not a bad idea per se, but using certain bizarre builds (stuff like triple short range cytoscrambler w/ Inertial Impact on an alliance ship otherwise loaded with screening shell frag) can kill the highest level wing mission assassination targets solo in something like 5 or 15 seconds.

Which obviously in and of itself wouldn't cause C&P but consider again the BGS (which is probably a much larger community than PvP, certainly at least comparable).

Without careful foresight, there would be side effects that might affect a larger userbase (BGS players) just to react (emotionally and irrationally) to a smaller userbase (the subset of PvP that gank).

Increase of pilot evasion skill is the #1 way to address this, and FDev could do it with much better training missions and a modest intro plot line of 10-20 handcrafted missions. Which would also solve other new player retention problems (I found landing much much much more dangerous as a noob than gankers, the in game help was horrendous). Plus maybe some sort of murder muffler in lhs 3447/ancellus primus/eravate.

What people are clamoring for here is retribution, not gameplay balance or actual protection (or training or help) of green pilots.

 

[Bryan K]

I don't think most people understand that there is a quite large and skilled PvP player base that has very little to do.
There is no support through design or mechanic to occupy their time.
For many of the most prominent " problem children" throughout the game have simply been forced to assume their own content.
You can't play cowboys without someone playing Indians.
If the odd settler gets scalped by a war party so the cavalry can come charging , well don't take it so seriously.

“Large” is a relative term. FDev have already stated that most players don’t PvP.

 

[Feros-da-Grundig]

Also include loss of other Pilot's Federation perks such as access to Shinrarta Dehzra. If you kill your fellow members of the Pilot's Federation you shouldn't be allowed in the organization's home system.

Ironic, considering the debut album of the band that spawned your font.

That pretty much excludes every single open-only powerplay combat player from Shinrarta.

Every player trying to roleplay as a pirate (which is not a ganker).

Every wing with player faction that voluntarily engages in war vs other wings.

The list goes on and on.

The simplest solution will always be that solo button. And for those who want the other button, the solution will always be to learn the minimum skills needed to operate safely in open. The latter seems unlikely to ever happen, unless FDev makes a substantial attempt to address the extremely steep learning curve *in game*. I bet so many players get turned off because they don't want to gave to google every bizarre little quirk of the game (especially on console).

 

[Dillon Fallon]

A lot of people here basically saying that the current C&P system is ok. Obviously high security system like Sol are perfectly safe then, and it's only backwater anarchy systems where you've got the highest chance of being murdered.