How far can mods go?

[DreamMaster]

We can't make any mods of any kind yet. Frontier hasn't told us a thing about doing it, whether or not there will be official tools to do it, and nboody has really dug into it. The file types are also obscure because the last game that used them, Frontier Dangerous, has a community that was told not to mess with them...and they didn't.

It's pretty obvious they don't want mod now to keep the focus on the ingame assets and futur update. It's more of a business move then anything. Just like how they don't want to allow no collisions so that the game look broken to somes.

I Just hope they don't make us wait like 3 years for them.

 

[Yaffle]

I've spent quite a frustrating few days trying to get another of my favourite builder-type games (Cities Skylines) to work again. Its latest patch killed a load of mods, I am sure without the intention to, which killed the game, as in, stopped it loading.

While mods are great, and I really like them, that's a Bad Thing to happen.

 

[FinalMantasyX]

That seems like an irrelevant point.

Are you arguing against mods? In that case, "patches can break mods" =/= a valid argument against them. That's a risk you have to take with them, and it doesn't apply to cosmetic mods or new objects.

Are you arguing for mods? Then why bring up something like breaking them with patches?

 

[Yaffle]

Neither, just a comment on them being a mixed blessing.

 

[gregorburns]

Neither, just a comment on them being a mixed blessing.

I quite like mods personally. They add a nice touch of colour to the forum. Green to be exact. This one has a nice santa hat on too! [haha][haha]

 

[breezerHOG1]

Timeline for Future Plans

I've read that RCT3 was developed in about 1 year flat, not sure the exact time for the expansions but probably about the same? I also know that RCT3 was rushed and required some patches to get everything running smoothly. I didn't play RCT3 when it was new because it didn't run well for me, and it was a bit tougher to play than RCT1. I don't know why, but I will always love the original scenarios of RCT1, I still consider RCT3 to be the greatest sim game even above PC because RCT3 had so many features (plus mods) and it was simpler so I didn't have to spend as much time to make a wicked coaster.

Anyway, I'm sure PC will grow in time just as RCT3 did. Now, PC had 2 years of development time (with half a year in "alpha") and I think we have a great foundation to continue improving from. I first learned about PC over a year ago, well before Alpha launched. However, I now feel a bit in the dark about future plans. Yes, obviously, we all know Frontier will continue progressing the game, and they really are listening to our feedback. The community livestreams are great fun, the contest give always are very surprising, and I even got a great discount on my purchase of PC.

I think the devs did a great job of optimizing the game to run smoothly! I know with UGC or add-ons we might see a drop in performance requiring better machines in the future (which is fine). I'm hoping though, that we can get some info about where Frontier plans to go with PC. It's unfortunate that certain aspects were held back (like security, etc) but I still have faith that PC will surpass RCT3 in a couple years!

There's 2 sets of fans here though, those who spend a lot of time building amazing stuff with tons of intricate details, and those who like the simulation and management aspects. Can both sides be satisfied without over complicating things?

There's a reason RCTW doesn't try and render thousands of peeps

Haha! I was about to start a new thread for my post(above) but I figured since this topic has so mention attention I would toss my comment here. My question about future timelines pertains to both UGC and any other add-ons. Its great you guys are here replying to us about what is in the works! Just hoping we can get more details about the main game and many of the requests people have such as management, water rides, and more [up]

 

[Ramm]

Neither, just a comment on them being a mixed blessing.

dont forget mods are optional

so it doesn't really matter, all you have to do is remove the mods and the game works again untill the mods are updated. But i see how some people can complain about that, so maybe a big disclaimer in the mod menu: "MODS MIGHT BREAK DURING GAME UPDATES" and people might complain less

 

[FinalMantasyX]

The Sims 4 automatically shuts off your mods folder when you install a patch, and a pop-up explains this to you.

Unfortunately that doesn't stop people, EVERY patch, from going onto reddit and other sites crying "The new patch broke my mods! none of them work!" because they don't know how to read and can't figure out that they were turned off, not broken...

 

[cerealfruitcakes]

I've slowly been moving away from downloading mods for games due to them getting broken from patches/updates and it just gets exhausting trying to keep up with them and waiting for them to get updated, IF they do...

 

[Ramm]

The Sims 4 automatically shuts off your mods folder when you install a patch, and a pop-up explains this to you.

Unfortunately that doesn't stop people, EVERY patch, from going onto reddit and other sites crying "The new patch broke my mods! none of them work!" because they don't know how to read and can't figure out that they were turned off, not broken...

Well then a menu where the mods say its compattible with what version number would be best.

I'd rather have the possibility to have a mod than have no mods at all

besides within steam you can select which game version you want. I think this is also how it works for Euro Truck Simulator 2. Some mods only work on old versions of the game so you simply select an old version of the game and then you run it untill the mod has been updated. All this could be simply explained in the menu

 

[FinalMantasyX]

Well then a menu where the mods say its compattible with what version number would be best.

That's not feasible at all. You just have to hope people in general have an understanding that when there's a patch, stuff might break, and you have to try and figure out what broke.

Mods are for users who are above a level that could reasonably be defined as computer illiterate. People who suffer from "Why are my mods not working????" because they clicked right past a bootup message that explicitly explained to them what happened, why, and how to fix it are people who we just have to ignore in the conversation about mods. Those people are lost souls. We cannot help them. They are, and forever will be, incompetents, and we cannot say "No- this game shouldn't have mods, because 89 year old TexasGrandmaFromWashington on The Sims 1 BBS 15 years ago doesn't know windows explorer from internet explorer and she might get confused if there's a patch and cry on the forums that she installed Unleashed and suddenly her mod that makes sims get bored slower stopped working and EA is the devil.

"Patches cause problems with mods" is not relevant here. It's just not. You're not saying it is, but I'm just reiterating- the chance that users who are incompetent could have trouble with them is not a good reason to delay their existence, or make them only work in such a way that they're lowest-common-denominator compatible.

 

[S100Headache]

I've slowly been moving away from downloading mods for games due to them getting broken from patches/updates and it just gets exhausting trying to keep up with them and waiting for them to get updated, IF they do...

Heck, I was a former TS4 modder (DrChillgood) and I gave up on it. Granted, it was more due to being burnt out with TS4's shortcomings. Maxis higher-ups said it was a solid foundation? Pfft. Planet Coaster is a solid foundation, TS4 is a creaky one.

 

[Inge Jones]

Heck, I was a former TS4 modder (DrChillgood) and I gave up on it. Granted, it was more due to being burnt out with TS4's shortcomings. Maxis higher-ups said it was a solid foundation? Pfft. Planet Coaster is a solid foundation, TS4 is a creaky one.

Hi DrChillgood. TS4's engine is very restrictive about the depth to which we could mod, compared with previous games in the series. Planet Coaster at this time is completely closed to modding apparently. As for solidity of foundation, I don't think it's gone far enough yet to judge. We already have the "only 8 terrain paints per world" restriction, which I think we'd have abdabs about if it was The Sims! Granted PC's reasons may be perfectly reasonable, but if EA used those same excuses they'd be lynched. There is definite bias going on.

 

[Ramm]

That's not feasible at all. You just have to hope people in general have an understanding that when there's a patch, stuff might break, and you have to try and figure out what broke.

Mods are for users who are above a level that could reasonably be defined as computer illiterate. People who suffer from "Why are my mods not working????" because they clicked right past a bootup message that explicitly explained to them what happened, why, and how to fix it are people who we just have to ignore in the conversation about mods. Those people are lost souls. We cannot help them. They are, and forever will be, incompetents, and we cannot say "No- this game shouldn't have mods, because 89 year old TexasGrandmaFromWashington on The Sims 1 BBS 15 years ago doesn't know windows explorer from internet explorer and she might get confused if there's a patch and cry on the forums that she installed Unleashed and suddenly her mod that makes sims get bored slower stopped working and EA is the devil.

"Patches cause problems with mods" is not relevant here. It's just not. You're not saying it is, but I'm just reiterating- the chance that users who are incompetent could have trouble with them is not a good reason to delay their existence, or make them only work in such a way that they're lowest-common-denominator compatible.

if they know how to install mods they know what the compatibility is

i think its just a bad argument to not have mods because some people are too stupid to use it. That ruins the game imho

 

[FinalMantasyX]

if they know how to install mods they know what the compatibility is

oh you poor precious child [haha]

 

[breezerHOG1]

That's not feasible at all. You just have to hope people in general have an understanding that when there's a patch, stuff might break, and you have to try and figure out what broke.

You dont know how frontier is going about handling the UGC situation. UGC is not the same as mods, UGC has been confirmed, mods have not. Gotta give them time to release these things

 

[FinalMantasyX]

O...kay? I'm not talking about uGC. I'm talking about mods. That's what this thread is about.

 

[Ramm]

oh you poor precious child [haha]

ok well then we wont have mods in this game because some people are too stupid to use them

lets take out management too because some people might be too stupid to run the park so its best to just keep this game sandbox only

maybe also not do economics because some people might not understand it

 

[Mogeley]

As we've said before, we'll have more to say about modding "soon". Adding mod support to a game is very, very complicated. Especially so given how Planet Coaster has to be written in order to remain performant. It's also worth pointing out how much more complicated the authoring process is in Planet Coaster compared to RCT3. So, we're working on it - give us some time and we'll be able to tell you more.

Cheers

Andy

Thanks!

When you have any information it would be very helpful.


In the meantime is there:

• A modders list that people can subscribe to?
• A modding documentation page? Even if stubbed out only?
• Anything modders can do now to get ready?
• Ways in which you expects mod code to interact with the game?

Thanks!

 

[Klinn]

So if the devs are already looking at modding possibilities then I guess all we have to do is wait. It feels better to mod the game "officially" without compromising its core stability.

You've highlighted a critical difference between official tools and user-made ones -- stability. Any tools Frontier releases carry an implicit assumption that they won't corrupt your game, so they have to take extra time to polish them. With user created tools like the ones we had for RCT3, it was understood that they could break your saves. Not trying to diminish the great work that JonWil did, just highlighting the different user expectations.

We already have the "only 8 terrain paints per world" restriction, which I think we'd have abdabs about if it was The Sims!

But are they low-frequency terrain textures? [big grin] (inside joke for TS4 users)

*waves at Dr Chillgood / S100Headache*