How feasible are Thargoids science wise?
- Thread starter HAMM3R
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DeletedUser191218
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Basing this around this concept art picture I've seen floating around the webz for some time. I've no idea if it's official/real or random fan art.
I'm no expert in evolutionary biology and the likes so I've been thinking, how likely would it be for hive-mind "insects" to evolve into a space faring species? What effects would such evolution have on their anatomy, physiology and such? How would their biomechanics define/affect the design language of their tools, vehicles, ships and so on? What would their cities look like? Do they have cities as such? What means of transport they used before space travel? Would they even need to travel, all being one mind, thus everyone being everywhere, what purpose would traveling serve? No need to visit in-laws.. Being a hive-mind, would they wear clothes/accessories to indicate their place in society? Would they have any kind of culture - arts, crafts, music, fashion, popular?
And to backtrack a little, what kind of conditions should the Thargoid homeworld have to even support man-sized insects? If they are indeed insectoids of some kind. Then again it's said that they "are experts in bioengineering, so they may have augmented their own biology to a point where natural evolutionary processes are meaningless." In that light, the above picture would be way off as they'd probably resemble a machine more than anything organic and that basically renders this whole post moot. But I'll keep it because I'm typing this little paragraph after I typed everything else, lol.
But hey, we can discuss and speculate what would make scientifically feasible alien species in general. Not just Thargoids.
Anyway, one attribute that's been credited for human race's advance from tree branches to where we are now is our hand. More precisely, the fact that we can touch our pinkies with our thumbs, something no other primate can do, allowing the use of fine motor skills required to do small movements, pick up and hold small things, handle tools and do any kind of precision work. Looking at the picture above, I think dude with appendages like that isn't going to build anything too complicated anytime soon. The stance lacks intelligence, too. Just slouching on its four legs, hands hanging limp. Not poised at all (that of course could be on the artist for not putting effort to pose his/her creation). But still, imagine that dude working in a lab, doing RNA splicing or some such. Doesn't really cut it, does it? Speaking of laboratories. What about computers? Would hive-mind race even need them or would they just store everything in their collective mind.
It's actually the one thing that irks me in scifi games and movies. The weird looking alien species just for the sake of looking weird. All kinds of spikes and tentacles sticking out of their bodies and what not, yet none of it seem to serve any purpose other than to look alien. But then for some reason, no matter how tentacly and blobby the alien in question is, all their equipment, weapons and spacecrafts somehow seem to be designed to be operated by a two legged, two armed hominid with five digits in each appendage. How peculiar.
Anyway, I'd imagine their evolution would work the same as ours and remove features that are no longer needed. Insectoid races would probably lose chitin in their exoskeletons over time after learning they could make their own and wear them for even more protection and so on. Basically, the more advanced the race, the less features their bodies would have. At least that would be my uneducated logic.
Probably wouldn't. Hive bugs tend to stay in one place. They build a nest and spend their time building and defending it. Humans had to migrate to follow food sources, escape climate fluctuations etc..hence, the evolved desire to explore and expand. I guess one could argue bugs relocate when their home is destroyed and it does lend itself to the notion that their aggression is a result of us encroaching on their home - if you go near a beehive you'll know they make Thargoids look hospitable by comparison. The issue is intellect. If they're a hive intelligence, where are the scientific minds evolving to build those ships?
Then again....it is a science fiction game and scary big baddie alien space bugs are cool.
I'm not an evolutionist or bioligist so this is only a persona opinion.Basing this around this concept art picture I've seen floating around the webz for some time. I've no idea if it's official/real or random fan art.
I'm no expert in evolutionary biology and the likes so I've been thinking, how likely would it be for hive-mind "insects" to evolve into a space faring species? What effects would such evolution have on their anatomy, physiology and such? How would their biomechanics define/affect the design language of their tools, vehicles, ships and so on? What would their cities look like? Do they have cities as such? What means of transport they used before space travel? Would they even need to travel, all being one mind, thus everyone being everywhere, what purpose would traveling serve? No need to visit in-laws.. Being a hive-mind, would they wear clothes/accessories to indicate their place in society? Would they have any kind of culture - arts, crafts, music, fashion, popular?
And to backtrack a little, what kind of conditions should the Thargoid homeworld have to even support man-sized insects? If they are indeed insectoids of some kind. Then again it's said that they "are experts in bioengineering, so they may have augmented their own biology to a point where natural evolutionary processes are meaningless." In that light, the above picture would be way off as they'd probably resemble a machine more than anything organic and that basically renders this whole post moot. But I'll keep it because I'm typing this little paragraph after I typed everything else, lol.
But hey, we can discuss and speculate what would make scientifically feasible alien species in general. Not just Thargoids.
Anyway, one attribute that's been credited for human race's advance from tree branches to where we are now is our hand. More precisely, the fact that we can touch our pinkies with our thumbs, something no other primate can do, allowing the use of fine motor skills required to do small movements, pick up and hold small things, handle tools and do any kind of precision work. Looking at the picture above, I think dude with appendages like that isn't going to build anything too complicated anytime soon. The stance lacks intelligence, too. Just slouching on its four legs, hands hanging limp. Not poised at all (that of course could be on the artist for not putting effort to pose his/her creation). But still, imagine that dude working in a lab, doing RNA splicing or some such. Doesn't really cut it, does it? Speaking of laboratories. What about computers? Would hive-mind race even need them or would they just store everything in their collective mind.
It's actually the one thing that irks me in scifi games and movies. The weird looking alien species just for the sake of looking weird. All kinds of spikes and tentacles sticking out of their bodies and what not, yet none of it seem to serve any purpose other than to look alien. But then for some reason, no matter how tentacly and blobby the alien in question is, all their equipment, weapons and spacecrafts somehow seem to be designed to be operated by a two legged, two armed hominid with five digits in each appendage. How peculiar.
Anyway, I'd imagine their evolution would work the same as ours and remove features that are no longer needed. Insectoid races would probably lose chitin in their exoskeletons over time after learning they could make their own and wear them for even more protection and so on. Basically, the more advanced the race, the less features their bodies would have. At least that would be my uneducated logic.
Concerning the shape and size I think it would be possible for creatures like this to exhist in specific biomes.
Concerning the technology instead I think that a hive-minded species will never be able to develop space technology. Insects and species like this react only to their basic instintcts: shelter, food, survive. So the only reason you might see them in space is because somehow they discovered better food and better shelters in open space and their body evolved to let them reach these places with their own bodies rather than with some sort of artificial vehicle.
Thargoid ships seem biological bodies so this now for me 50% feasible which is enough for reasonable sci-fi.
Who says they did not originate in space? Humans did...
//How feasible are Thargoids science wise?//
Personally I think it would be a tad arrogant of us to assume we could determine if something is scientifically feasible when our knowledge of life and how it evolves is limited to our little blue/green marble. We have absolutely no idea how life could evolve elsewhere in the galaxy.
We could, I suppose, hypothosize by applying the rules and regulations of Earth to the Thargoids; but it wouldn't be accurate.
Not really related:
Personally I think it would be a tad arrogant of us to assume we could determine if something is scientifically feasible when our knowledge of life and how it evolves is limited to our little blue/green marble. We have absolutely no idea how life could evolve elsewhere in the galaxy.
We could, I suppose, hypothosize by applying the rules and regulations of Earth to the Thargoids; but it wouldn't be accurate.
Not really related:
Kind of like how we can't ever definitively say that something isn't possible. Like, FTL travel. Science right now says FTL isn't possible, but then science used to say that the Ptolemaic model was correct.
Human are carbon based life and thargoids are ammonia based so both definitely originated on a planet
hahahaha - methylidyne radicaHuman are carbon based life and thargoids are ammonia based so both definitely originated on a planet
This does not look like insect. It has skin. This is most likely lizard. Thargoids are insects.
You making judgements using own experience and expecting the things should work same way for others.
We need hands because we created tools for our hands. They can have different interfaces to interact with their tools. For example if you would be able to connect to your PC using cord attached directly to you brain you do not need keyboard, monitor and even eyes.
They could be even humans in the past. Discovered the ways to grow bodies they need and put their mind inside.
I'm pretty sure you got your evolution backwards there.
No, they're carbon based, it's just they use ammonia as a solvent rather than water.Human are carbon based life and thargoids are ammonia based so both definitely originated on a planet
Nice catch, but no.
We need hands now, because we created tools for our hands using hands we had.
If we'll create tools which will use another interfaces which does not utilize hands then we'll need no hands to use the tools.
Human are carbon based life and thargoids are ammonia based so both definitely originated on a planet
Both are Carbon based
Humans using water and supposedly Ammonia for the Thargoids for the Solvent solution for the carbon Chemistry
Oxygen levels were much higher hence the larger supported bodies with respect to their raspatory systems
I'd say it looks a lot like skin over carapace. I could see them having evolved a hermetic epidermis, and this allowing them to leave gaps in their exoskeleton, making more room for musculature, and allowing better articulation, whilst also reducing weight. So you have a (EDIT: ...flexible...) carapace on the back, but that whole belly and throat "open", and free to contract and swell.
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Well, yes.
That probably is a more sensible explanation (and a verifiable one) but it doesn't negate the fact that there are wacky theories regarding changes to Earth's gravity.
TBH, it's not something I've paid a great deal of interest to but I'd assume that higher levels of oxygen would only benefit certain creatures whereas lower gravity would benefit all (?) creatures?
I mean, a giant insect that simply needs to flap it's wings faster in order to fly would benefit from higher oxygen levels whereas, by contrast, a giant crab that simply can't fit big enough muscles inside it's shell isn't going to be able to thrive regardless of how much oxygen it can get.
Presumably, the fossil records show that the sort of giant insect that existed were species that could make use of higher oxygen levels rather than ones that would need lower gravity to thrive.
Like I said, it's not something I've paid a lot of attention to but it can make for interesting reading for an hour or so.
My current Theory is Bio Mechanical constructs barely sentient, not free thinking or sapient, directed by hard wired in, via cyber implants, directives, and there is an GAI issuing strategic level commands that they are all linked to.
Find and Return Meta Alloys
Find and Return Thargoid Tech
Destory Guarian Tech on Site
They seem to on an individual level react to stimuli positively or negatively like a dog would, but have no self preservation, or seeming planning beyond the very next step.
Note how they wont call for help if attacked, but present them with more than 5 meta alloys, the only item to trigger a happy response, they will immediately call in another Interceptor to help.
Seems like
Primary Directive Find and Return Meta Alloys
If find, trigger pleasure response as reward to encourage behaviour, and signal others to come help collection of over 4 units.
If not find then locate any Thargoid Tech
If not then ignore and move on
and emergency override of If Guardian Tech Destroy
They only get violent when their directive is blocked or resisted, otherwise they ignore
That is why we haven't managed any communication or negotiation, as what we have come across is simply a Meta Alloy Harvesting Group, that unexpectedly came across Humanity and is just responding to a blocker to their objective.
They have no individual or collective understanding to open negotiations or to be able to negotiate and the Overarching GAI has no directive to so wont.
The interceptors are Harvesters and the Scouts being more aggressive arrived when more aggressive scout by force was needed in the Core systems but it isn't an attack on humanity but more an investigation as to the size of the blocker's infestation
We need to wait until Something high up enough to consider the possibility that the blockage is another space faring civilization to begin such, if the Thargoid ever choose such a path.
One thing I wonder
We talk about the Thargoids as the ships and Creatures encountered in 3125 are the sum of the Thargoid Civilization
If it is a Civilization that is possibly been space faring Millions of Years, possibly from another Galaxy possible from witch space, with incredible AI tech and Bio engineering tech and the bridging of the two
What if the Insectiod "Thargoids" are simple one of the many tools used by this Ancient civilization that happen to be used and adapted for Meta Alloy seeding and Harvesting.
Like mistaking bees collecting honey for the Human Civilisation that will be the ultimate user of the honey, who built the bee hives and breed the bees
See, this is something I feel like FDev got back-to-front.
We have barnacle sites which generate MA's.
Goids visit the barnacle sites and, apparently, suck stuff up into their ships... but leave the MA's behind.
That seems kind of odd, given that they apparently like them so much.
I always preferred the idea that the barnacle sites were some kind of "filter".
The barnacles are leeching something out of the planet's surface, sending whatever they need up to the visiting goid ships and the outcrops we see on the barnacles are actually the stuff that's been filtered out because it's not stuff the goids want.
A bit like having a chlorine filter in your water-pipes and then some kind of chlorine-eating animal discovers it and thinks it's a free dinner.
That would seem to make more sense than the idea that the goids are mining MAs but then not harvesting them when they do a fly-by of the barnacle sites even though they do like to take them when we drop them... which seems a bit schizophrenic.
Very feasible. Once you've seen a pseudo-scientific analysis of the biological composition of Quarian sweat and its implication on smell and inter-species "interaction" the possibilities just seem endless.
Oh yeah now we're talking. I think that these points are often missed. The Thargoids appear to be the oldest space-faring species in the galaxy. As such, i think it is difficult to comprehend how long they have had to adapt to life in space, especially with their bioengineering ability. They have the multiple legs to navigate structures in zero G, and they likely interface with their tech without touch. I think they have been in space long enough to lose any resemblance to their planetary origins.
I think it is also likely that the ships we see are engineered sentient beings rather than ships controlled by pilots. In the same way that humans are moving more to drone warfare, it is possible they did the same thing millions of years ago.
I would love to see them harvesting meta alloys/ whatever from the barnacles in an attempt to build something like a Dyson Sphere around a star.