I love E:D But really?

[Stealthie]

To revisit the OP's original point...

I did something silly last night.
I said I'd never do it, but I did.
On release, I bought the Mandalay with the (thunder?) ship-kit.
Under the influence of Australian Merlot, last night, I was twiddling with the ship-kit parts on my Mandy and saw a couple of bits that looked really cool.
Only problem was, in order to fit them I'd have to buy a completely separate -kit... just to get 1 or 2 bits.
So, I did.

I feel like such a mug... but it does look superb.

 

[Rat Catcher]

Or, one is the British standard and the other is American standard (everyone but the Japanese)...

... and South Africa, and that tiny island called Australia, and New Zealand...
So many countries drive on the proper side of the road!

 

[Dougie]

Left seat is standard in fixed-wing aviation, with a few exceptions. Maybe something to do with WW 2?

I was under the impression that it is to do with the fact that right-handedness is most prevalent. In FW (GA and commercial aircraft) traditionally the right hand needed to carry out multiple tasks whilst the left hand mainly stabilised the yoke. In helicopters the control of the cyclic is much more demanding and thus required the dominant hand to remain attached whilst the left carried out other tasks.

If course that is just what I remember being told in basic aeronautical engineering training a very long time ago in the Fleet Air Arm (when we actually had one).

In combat / high performance aircraft historically the "joystick" is crotch-mounted with the ergonomics of the controls again being very much oriented towards right-handedness.

 

[galahad2069]

... and South Africa, and that tiny island called Australia, and New Zealand...
So many countries drive on the proper side of the road!

They speak (kind of) French on the Seychelles still they drive on the left.

I don't think I've ever tried to wipe the dry windscreen that often anywhere else because the turn signal stalk was on the wrong side.

 

[Morbad]

Tired because there is no P2W, nobody has yet come up with what we are winning in numerous threads.

Ignoring the myriad of answers to the question of what that money is winning those that fork it over is not the same as there not being answers.

Think of all the potential reasons, that could have any, in-game, mechanistic, advantage, of any kind. Every one of these is an example of pay-to-win.

On the other hand some people perceive any and all definitions of P2W as predatory/unhealthy/exploitative/etc. Even if it has no real world negative impact on the game. Even if the game is single player.

I'm having difficulty conceiving of a scenario where P2W has no negative impact on a game, unless the point of the game is to gauge the wealth and privilege of the player.

Also, if this were a single player game, I'd consider any lack of control that could provide a monetization path for any in-game advantage as blatantly predatory.

It's an open forum and all, but don't you think that ship sailed?

Software can be patched, not that it will in this case, but plenty of aspects of the game that were seen as relatively fixed have been changed.

Now it's just "if you have to buy something it's P2W".

If it provides any conceivable advantage what-so-ever, yes. That's not new though and this game has had P2W elements--that I've been complaining about as long as I've been here and will continue to complain about until they are removed (which I fully expect to be never)--since the KIckstarter (which had backing tiers predicated almost entirely on P2W advantages).

But does illustrate, quite nicely, that the ship really doesn't matter, pilot skill does, doesn't it? Regardless of what they are flying...

Ship matters, a lot, really.

Skill matters, arguably more, but these are very synergistic things. The better you are the more you can get out of your tools. The better your tools the more you can demonstrate your skill.

I'm not sure you can actually have real P2W in a game that has a solo mode.

Direct PvP is not remotely the only, nor most prevalent, venue for competition in this game...it's just the only venue excluded by Solo.

 

[Pville_Piper]

... and South Africa, and that tiny island called Australia, and New Zealand...
So many countries drive on the proper side of the road!

All former British possessions... The only odd man out is the Japanese.

 

[Rat Catcher]

All former British possessions..

As was the USA...

 

[Stealthie]

Direct PvP is not remotely the only, nor most prevalent, venue for competition in this game...it's just the only venue excluded by Solo.

I don't know whether it's deliberate or accidental but it seems like FDev have this under control.

As I've said before, if we rate all ED's ships on a scale (of, say, 1 to 10), it's true that most of the new ships are an 8 or 9 but (aside from the CM5) FDev have so far avoided releasing a pay-ship that's an 11 out of 10, thus extending the scale to a point where you need the new ship to achieve more than people who don't have it.

 

[Pville_Piper]

As was the USA...

But we left long before the car was invented, the others after...

 

[Kamiyoda]

I’m pretty sure it was the French who chose the right. And the francophone sphere of influence was far greater than the USA during the early days of motor vehicles. - ignoring the fact that we’ve been passing each other on roads a long time before the motorcar.

Was the Cobra Mark.5 a chariot?

 

[Stealthie]

I’m pretty sure it was the French who chose the right. And the francophone sphere of influence was far greater than the USA during the early days of motor vehicles. - ignoring the fact that we’ve been passing each other on roads a long time before the motorcar.

It's a bit odd really.

Historically, we instinctively pass others on the left because most of us are right-handed and that meant you could defend yourself more easily when walking or riding.
Bonaparte was, apparently, a leftie and (in true megalomaniac fashion) after conquering territories he dictated that riders should pass on the right to make life easier for lefties like himself.

The odd part is, settlers moved to America long before Bonaparte kicked-off so they should have had at least a hundred years to get used to passing on the "correct" (left) side of the road.
When more Europeans migrated to America after the napoleonic wars, I suppose they brought with them the habit of passing on the right and, regardless of what road customs were already in place, I guess people just went with it and passed on the right.

People say that the USA drives on the right for economic reasons, because it allows for car imports from most of the world.
That's probably not true though.
I mean, the USA invented mass-produced cars and for several decades there were only US-made cars on the roads.
By the time any imported cars arrived, Americans were already happily driving on the right.

 

[Kamiyoda]

I'm gonna tell my son its because we wanted to easily give eachother high fives

 

[Stealthie]

Yeah and it’s the Americans who came up with the standard pedal layout.

Is that true?

I know that the controls on a Model T Ford were bonkers so I guess they didn't get it right straight away.
No idea what people like Benz were doing in Europe at the time so I dunno if they helped decide what went where.

 

[aRJay]

Is that true?

I know that the controls on a Model T Ford were bonkers so I guess they didn't get it right straight away.
No idea what people like Benz were doing in Europe at the time so I dunno if they helped decide what went where.

Cadillac and then Austin developed and then popularised the pedals/control layouts we now have.
It wasn’t just the bonkers pedal controls that Henry F put on the model T it was also the first widely available left hand drive vehicle in America.

 

[ꝁestrel]

I'm having difficulty conceiving of a scenario where P2W has no negative impact on a game, unless the point of the game is to gauge the wealth and privilege of the player.

It depends on one's definition of "winning". Usually the discussions boil down to that.

I don't think that Elite's ARX store has a negative impact on the game and I've yet to see a concrete explanation of how it negatively impacts the game.

Also, if this were a single player game, I'd consider any lack of control that could provide a monetization path for any in-game advantage as blatantly predatory.

I played Assassin's Creed Odyssey without ever buying a single booster. The existence of boosters didn't negatively impact the game for me one bit. Yet some people still called that game's booster microtransactions predatory.

 

[Rat Catcher]

I don't think that Elite's ARX store has a negative impact on the game and I've yet to see a concrete explanation of how it negatively impacts the game.

As far as I can tell, by the P2W arguments abounding since the Arghs store sold them thar fancy new ships...

I have "Won" because I can fly it immediately, whereas any other player has to wait until my massively OP ship becomes available for in-game credits to all.
It really isn't just "sour grapes" you know

 

[ꝁestrel]

It's a bit odd really.

I read an interesting piece on this in a Civil Engineering journal. Jump to page 54. It's a very interesting read!

https://saice.org.za/downloads/monthly_publications/2013/Civil-Engineering-September-2013.pdf

 

[Kamiyoda]

I played Assassin's Creed Odyssey without ever buying a single booster. The existence of boosters didn't negatively impact the game for me one bit. Yet some people still called that game's booster microtransactions predatory.

Well yeah, cause it is predatory, your personal experience doesnt change that. It can be both predatory and something that doesn't personally bother you. A lot of things are like that for me.

As far as I can tell, by the P2W arguments abounding since the Arghs store sold them thar fancy new ships...

I have "Won" because I can fly it immediately, whereas any other player has to wait until my massively OP ship becomes available for in-game credits to all.
It really isn't just "sour grapes" you know

I won because I bought stocks in Frontier developments. We will now get the Panther Clipper, because I said so!

The LX version not that nonsense from previous games.

 

[ꝁestrel]

Well yeah, cause it is predatory, your personal experience doesnt change that. It can be both predatory and something that doesn't personally bother you. A lot of things are like that for me.

Point taken. But what makes something inherently predatory vs not?

EDIT: To clarify, one might consider RNG loot boxes as predatory because they prey on people who have a predisposition to gamble addiction. Or even funneling young people into gambling.

I won because I bought stocks in Frontier developments. We will now get the Panther Clipper, because I said so!

 

[Knuttin Atoll]

I don't think that Elite's ARX store has a negative impact on the game and I've yet to see a concrete explanation of how it negatively impacts the game.

Not the arx store per se, while they only sold cosmetics, but the ships changed that imo - I often wonder if the stats of the new ships would've been more subdued if they would've been added for free, like in the past.

As much as I enjoy flying the Cobra 5 it does feel like cheat mode at times, and made a lot of ships I used to fly obsolete.