If I wanted a 'radio-tuning' game I would have rather bought an old radio.

[CMDR Zadian Lichtfrost]

This needs clarification!! How do you use that? I don't even look at the sys map until after FSSing so how can the blank sys map be used for anything (genuinely curious here).

In my opinion, based on what I read in the discussions about the FSS/ADS, most of the discussions are at the core about what the player considers the result of "exploration".
For some it is the system map. Anything in addition is just credits or materials. For those the FSS is good as ist hides the system map (not the information about the system) until the player has done something.

For some the system map is the starting point and not the result. They used the system map as a starting point to "explore" the system. For them the ADS was exactly what they needed. It provided some information, but most of the finder details about the objects where only obtainable by doing something in that system.

Sadly it appears that those two mindsets about exploration are mutually exclusive. At its core the whole controversy is just about the question if the system map is the start or the end of exploring the system. In my opinion, from what I've read, how I understand it …

 

[Leper Messiah]

Well this was my little secret, but okay, I'll share:

There are many systems that are partially discovered. By using the signal count that displays after a honk to compare with a partially-populated system map, I can very quickly tell if a system is undiscovered, partially discovered, or completely discovered. If it is partially discovered, meaning there are still undiscovered planets in the system, the system map lets me quickly identify where those planets may be. It's kinda like how you hunt a quiet submarine - you look for "gaps" in the surrounding "noise".

As someone who is interested in finding undiscovered worlds, this is a huge asset.

I see!! Thanks for the info. I just FSS everything straight away as it's so quick and easy and more dosh, even if just ice and rocks!!! I cherry pick what to probe though (don't we all missus--oo-er! <frankie howerd>)

 

[redstar1]

Is there anything to be said for forcing players to do the frame shift drive calculations manually prior to a jump?

 

[Leper Messiah]

My thinking on this is that any ship "out in the black" with a free module slot would automatically have the ADS reinstalled, with the option to power it off like any other module. Customer support needs to focus on fixing bugs

ps - I answered your other question, just look a few posts up.

I was thinking some out in the black may not want the ADS back, customer support don't fix bugs though, that's the devs...I meant the people who move ships around and re-imburse credits etc by player request because of issues.

replied

 

[Burke]

I actually feel sorry for the people asking to be moved back. I think they should fix this and give those people their ADS back. Exploration is a long term thing. Trips taking months or even longer. They could have been more considerate about this.

 

[Leper Messiah]

In my opinion, based on what I read in the discussions about the FSS/ADS, most of the discussions are at the core about what the player considers the result of "exploration".
For some it is the system map. Anything in addition is just credits or materials. For those the FSS is good as ist hides the system map (not the information about the system) until the player has done something.

For some the system map is the starting point and not the result. They used the system map as a starting point to "explore" the system. For them the ADS was exactly what they needed. It provided some information, but most of the finder details about the objects where only obtainable by doing something in that system.

Sadly it appears that those two mindsets about exploration are mutually exclusive. At its core the whole controversy is just about the question if the system map is the start or the end of exploring the system. In my opinion, from what I've read, how I understand it …

rep, that's a good take on the matter. But it's more complex, don't forget the other issue is many like flying out to the planets as well and prefer that to the "telescope" FSS. Also some just hate the FSS mechanics.

FSS = scientist looking at the moon via a telescope
ADS = Apollo missions TO the moon.

 

[Skip Rockbounder]

...why are we fighting?

Mainly because some of the pro FSS faction are Drazi and see a particular scarf* as the enemy!

*Green or Purple

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

I see!! Thanks for the info. I just FSS everything straight away as it's so quick and easy and more dosh, even if just ice and rocks!!! I cherry pick what to probe though (don't we all missus--oo-er! <frankie howerd>)

I probe anything I can get my hands on...


...Darn it wrong forum again.

 

[sollisb]

As far as I can see, there's only a few very loud people in this forum who want back the ADS and God Honk system.Go through all these endless threads and count the number of those people, you'll see there are indeed very few. It's always the same few guys with the same complaints over and over again.
I really hope that FDev will ignore them and continue to improve the new system. I don't say that I am completely happy with the FSS as it is now, but it's a huge step forward. I hope we will never see the old ADS and Honk again, because that would be a step back into the wrong direction.

I have 5 accounts; I buy Ship kits for all ships on all accounts. I've spent in the region of 400 euro in the shop over the past year.

Now go on tell me, how ignoring me is a good idea.

 

[Kaltern]

Well this was my little secret, but okay, I'll share:

There are many systems that are partially discovered. By using the signal count that displays after a honk to compare with a partially-populated system map, I can very quickly tell if a system is undiscovered, partially discovered, or completely discovered. If it is partially discovered, meaning there are still undiscovered planets in the system, the system map lets me quickly identify where those planets may be. It's kinda like how you hunt a quiet submarine - you look for "gaps" in the surrounding "noise".

As someone who is interested in finding undiscovered worlds, this is a huge asset.

I can also mention as an addition to this point, that (and I suspect this might be an FDev oversight), if you enter a system, and just look at the FSS screen without scanning, you will be able to find out roughly how many bodies are in a system. Since at least the main star is resolved, if you look on the bottom left of the FSS, it will tell you the percentage of bodies that have been resolved. By using this number, combined with the numbe of bodies auto-resolved due to being in range of your ship, you can easily tell if it is a busy system or not before you scan.

Personally I want that percentage hidden until after you scan.

 

[Leper Messiah]

Is there anything to be said for forcing players to do the frame shift drive calculations manually prior to a jump?

Traveling through hyperspace ain't like dusting crops, boy! Without precise calculations we could fly right through a star or bounce too close to a supernova and that'd end your trip real quick, wouldn't it?

Mainly because some of the pro FSS faction are Drazi and see a particular scarf* as the enemy!

*Green or Purple

Babylon 5 iirc!

 

[Navigare Necesse Est]

Is there anything to be said for forcing players to do the frame shift drive calculations manually prior to a jump?

Ye, no talk about substances here. Not everyone wants to do spice all day.

 

[Old Duck]

FSS = scientist looking at the moon via a telescope
ADS = Apollo missions TO the moon.

I don't need the ADS to go to the moon. I've visited more moons since the ADS was replaced with the FSS. In fact, the old ADS / DSS allowed you to scan moons from a further distance than our moon is from the earth, so sorry, but your analogy is rubbish

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

FSS = scientist looking at the moon via a telescope
ADS = Apollo missions TO the moon.

How do you work that one out. it's more like:

ADS = Don't really need to do anything to discover planets and is done with a five second press of a button (zero gameplay).
FSS = Need to actively use the scanners to discover planets (gameplay).

That is basically the difference, with some minor changes on the information gathered by each.

 

[[Diplomacy] Carnegie]

I don't need the ADS to go to the moon. I've visited more moons since the ADS was replaced with the FSS. In fact, the old ADS / DSS allowed you to scan moons from a further distance than our moon is from the earth, so sorry, but your analogy is rubbish

You know you were allowed to fly to moons under the ADS system, right? Except prior to 3.3 is 'boring flying in straight lines'. Now suddenly it's apparently exciting gameplay.

 

[Burke]

You know you were allowed to fly to moons under the ADS system, right? Except prior to 3.3 is 'boring flying in straight lines'. Now suddenly it's apparently exciting gameplay.

The old way of course was to fly up to the pole of the gas giant and look down. Often you could get all the moons with just a few degrees of movement. Just saying

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Jeebus Cripes. I just had an idea. So that's how that feels.

Tingly.

I think it's a brilliant idea, but it might be genius.

 

[Old Duck]

You know you were allowed to fly to moons under the ADS system, right? Except prior to 3.3 is 'boring flying in straight lines'. Now suddenly it's apparently exciting gameplay.

Being a jerk to an ally is not good for your cause. You misrepresent me. Stop it.

 

[Burke]

Being a jerk to an ally is not good for your cause.

How you read that into it i dont know but i did put on the end in case there was any confusion. Im sure drew doesnt need you to speak for him

Probably my fault for being unclear it was more of an addition to his answer to you. Its just the post structure isnt made for such things.

Ok?

 

[[Diplomacy] Carnegie]

Being a jerk to an ally is not good for your cause. You misrepresent me. Stop it.

It's early, not enough coffee. My bad.

Still, it's a reasonable question, don't you think?

Much of the criticism of the ADS has revolved around it being boring to fly to bodies to scan them, and that the FSS is much better because it removes this requirement.
However, it's still necessary to fly to bodies in order to probe them - so why is flying around the system suddenly okay again?