News Implementation of a dedicated mission server

[Brian of Ardagh]

Yes! .. so much this.

I don't know if these threads ever get looked at by FDev but the UI for missions could really do with some basic work like that.

As for refreshing. Just make a 'Refresh' button, and people can click on that to reload when they want. It can be rate-limited so it's not spammy but that doesn't seem beyond the realms of possibility to me.

One of the developers explained why the refresh wouldn’t work as the missions are generated for everyone. If you were to refresh the board it would refresh for everyone else.

It could be done by generating a lot more missions server side than you see when you open the board and a refresh would just let you, and you alone, see the other missions. Other players could refresh as well to get more listings.

 

[fu9ar]

They are making it so that BGS work will be a test of skill and dedication on the same playing field instead of an RNGfest.

 

[Shinji Ikari]

They are making it so that BGS work will be a test of skill and dedication on the same playing field instead of an RNGfest.

Well, the dedicated server won't cut down the RNG, after all, mission will still depend on it. On the other hand, BGS already takes a good amount of skill & dedication as some friends fighting Diamond Frogs have shown me.

 

[WorldsGreatestForumDad]

Well, the dedicated server won't cut down the RNG, after all, mission will still depend on it. On the other hand, BGS already takes a good amount of skill & dedication as some friends fighting Diamond Frogs have shown me.

Just saying if missions boards are still based off RNG and there is a fight between 2 factions. The board population with random ++,+++,+++++ missions that are rewarded. Plus how many missions each faction gets.

The whole phase of the war can be determined off RNG. We cant flip to min max anymore. We have to rely on luck.

Thats not skillful at all.

 

[fu9ar]

If you have to maximize results based on the same RNG, an individual's ability to do that based on the same mission boards is more skill based than logging in and out while praying to RNGesus.

 

[Riverside]

If you have to maximize results based on the same RNG, an individual's ability to do that based on the same mission boards is more skill based than logging in and out while praying to RNGesus.

I'd agree it favours the player who is good at a wide range of tasks over one that excels at a single activity maybe, yeah.

 

[Riverside]

Just saying if missions boards are still based off RNG and there is a fight between 2 factions. The board population with random ++,+++,+++++ missions that are rewarded. Plus how many missions each faction gets.

The whole phase of the war can be determined off RNG. We cant flip to min max anymore. We have to rely on luck.

Thats not skillful at all.

Instead of sitting in the dock for 5 minutes board flipping to get the perfect storm of missions every time, you could grab the best ones based on your experience of how to get the max inf per hour, then come back for more.

I'm currently tending towards fetch missions atm, for something to do between wars. I'll take one or two wing missions that are going to take a few runs, and each time I return I take more little fetch missions off the board.

Sometimes it can work out pretty well, tonight I had a bunch of metals to fetch along with some leather & algae. There's a refinery system nearby that has an earth-like in it so I was hopping A-B all evening & selling copper flavoured algae probably considering how I fly

 

[fu9ar]

I'd agree it favours the player who is good at a wide range of tasks over one that excels at a single activity maybe, yeah.

So in other words it will favor objectively better pilots.

 

[Riverside]

So in other words it will favor objectively better pilots.

Sure, that description fits, but it would re-define what they need to be 'better' at. No doubt the competitive BGSer will quickly adapt.

I don't habitually board flip or instance switch, I just play the hand I'm dealt. While others are waiting in station logging out & back in again over & over again I'm out doing the missions I've grabbed already. When doing missions (I almost always do them for faction influence now) my sessions are varied and I pick up mats & stuff along the way, mostly from killing the mission specific pirates rather than as a mission reward.

I used to board flip in certain stations (new yembo was one of my favourite haunts years ago) and I loved doing 120ly in 20minutes missions - I did loads of them, working out which order to complete them because sometimes literally every second counted. I can still speed dock a Cobra MkIII better than any other ship even though those missions are gone, and the ability to get so many on one go will soon be gone too.

The game, and the mission system has already been through so many iterations, this is just another one. The 'better' pilots will probably just adapt more quickly to the new meta way to do missions is all. If nothing else changes it may not affect me at all.

 

[Ralph Vargr]

Sure, that description fits, but it would re-define what they need to be 'better' at. No doubt the competitive BGSer will quickly adapt.

I don't habitually board flip or instance switch, I just play the hand I'm dealt. While others are waiting in station logging out & back in again over & over again I'm out doing the missions I've grabbed already. When doing missions (I almost always do them for faction influence now) my sessions are varied and I pick up mats & stuff along the way, mostly from killing the mission specific pirates rather than as a mission reward.

I used to board flip in certain stations (new yembo was one of my favourite haunts years ago) and I loved doing 120ly in 20minutes missions - I did loads of them, working out which order to complete them because sometimes literally every second counted. I can still speed dock a Cobra MkIII better than any other ship even though those missions are gone, and the ability to get so many on one go will soon be gone too.

The game, and the mission system has already been through so many iterations, this is just another one. The 'better' pilots will probably just adapt more quickly to the new meta way to do missions is all. If nothing else changes it may not affect me at all.

In poker, I play the hand I'm dealt as well. Usually, I fold, because it's trash.

The mission board is a rigged deck.

 

[WorldsGreatestForumDad]

Instead of sitting in the dock for 5 minutes board flipping to get the perfect storm of missions every time, you could grab the best ones based on your experience of how to get the max inf per hour, then come back for more.

I'm currently tending towards fetch missions atm, for something to do between wars. I'll take one or two wing missions that are going to take a few runs, and each time I return I take more little fetch missions off the board.

Sometimes it can work out pretty well, tonight I had a bunch of metals to fetch along with some leather & algae. There's a refinery system nearby that has an earth-like in it so I was hopping A-B all evening & selling copper flavoured algae probably considering how I fly

Thats not how this works. I dont think you understand whats going on at all.

The supply and demand in terms of how content is delivered to each player group and the way its disturbed has very to little to do with the rules of the game.

Im sure anyone that has been to a credit fountain sees this.

The place you're at can be in Boom. And the controlling faction thats supposed to be rewarded for being in boom can spawn 3 missions, and the other guys you're fighting can spawn 12. Board flip and everything changes.

The point is, people before had a fair shot to compete with each other. Because they eventually could stack up a decent amount of missions. And it depended on their skill against the game, time and effort to complete it.(not the other players intervening cause everyone is usually in solo or private during these times as we all know)

Now, with one board. One side could get lucky and win the war between the factions. It wont matter how good the other group performed.

See where I am going with this?

 

[Riverside]

In poker, I play the hand I'm dealt as well. Usually, I fold, because it's trash.

The mission board is a rigged deck.

Well you can bluff in Poker, and I always got the impression the game was more about learning to be good at bluffing than being good at finding matching cards

I've never really thought of the mission board 'spawn' as being loaded for or against me, and on the occasions where I have board flipped it never felt like any more than re-rolling dice - random within a range of criteria then filtered by my current ability to take that mission (rep level, rank, cargo space etc).

In what way have you come to the conclusion that it's 'rigged'?

 

[Riverside]

Thats not how this works. I dont think you understand whats going on at all.

The supply and demand in terms of how content is delivered to each player group and the way its disturbed has very to little to do with the rules of the game.

Im sure anyone that has been to a credit fountain sees this.

The place you're at can be in Boom. And the controlling faction thats supposed to be rewarded for being in boom can spawn 3 missions, and the other guys you're fighting can spawn 12. Board flip and everything changes.

The point is, people before had a fair shot to compete with each other. Because they eventually could stack up a decent amount of missions. And it depended on their skill against the game, time and effort to complete it.(not the other players intervening cause everyone is usually in solo or private during these times as we all know)

Now, with one board. One side could get lucky and win the war between the factions. It wont matter how good the other group performed.

See where I am going with this?

In my view The skill isn't in board flipping, it's in choosing missions you can do quickly and how quickly you can complete them. Plus you will spend less time logging in & out of the main menu, and more time flying spaceships

 

[WorldsGreatestForumDad]

In my view The skill isn't in board flipping, it's in choosing missions you can do quickly and how quickly you can complete them. Plus you will spend less time logging in & out of the main menu, and more time flying spaceships

Ok.

 

[Susanna]

I have thought on this awhile now. I still think it sucks because I can't see much positive change in terms of increased mission complexity happening for many years to come. It's taken 4 years to do anything to improve the exploration Honk, Lord knows how long it would take to do anything more than the current tinkering with the mission system.

In the mean time ranking up with specific factions to obtain system permits for example is going to become a whole lot harder with less than half the number of potential missions available. For that reason, I'm doing these now... Unlocking all of the permit locked systems while ranking up with the permit giving faction is still reasonably quick (about a day per permit).

I have totally lost faith in FDev doing this for the benefit of the game. It's just another time sink waiting for the right missions to spawn. The 10% extra credits are not the point and make sod all difference imo.

 

[Riverside]

I have thought on this awhile now. I still think it sucks because I can't see much positive change in terms of increased mission complexity happening for many years to come. It's taken 4 years to do anything to improve the exploration Honk, Lord knows how long it would take to do anything more than the current tinkering with the mission system.

In the mean time ranking up with specific factions to obtain system permits for example is going to become a whole lot harder with less than half the number of potential missions available. For that reason, I'm doing these now... Unlocking all of the permit locked systems while ranking up with the permit giving faction is still reasonably quick (about a day per permit).

I have totally lost faith in FDev doing this for the benefit of the game. It's just another time sink waiting for the right missions to spawn. The 10% extra credits are not the point and make sod all difference imo.

I agree the extra 10% is a bit of a distraction, hopefully that's just a placeholder while the mission balance is readjusted.

Currently we have essentially two paths players can take to accept a mission - take the best offered (average) or board flip to get a really good one (peak).

These two paths are unbalanced - so we need to reach a point where all players take one path or the other - average or peak. This solution forces all players to take the average path, I guess what you are looking for is for everyone to take the peak path - ie always get an awesome mission every time.


The way to force peak is to only offer an extremely limited range of missions - only the 'best' mission for the player. But of course what's 'best' for one player isn't for another so we need a spread of missions, easy, hard & inbetween.

Which brings us back to the solution we are getting - all players will see a consistent choice of missions - random within a controlled range.

Once this is done what that actual range is can be tweaked more precisely than with the current situation where there is more than one path the player can follow. This is an ongoing process (mission templates are regularly tweaked already).

 

[NeilF]

I have totally lost faith in FDev doing this for the benefit of the game.

If this isn't being done for some overall improvement in missions (eg: more stateful missions so they need to be on a single server), at some upcoming time, then I'll join you...

 

[who?]

Just saying if missions boards are still based off RNG and there is a fight between 2 factions. The board population with random ++,+++,+++++ missions that are rewarded. Plus how many missions each faction gets.

The whole phase of the war can be determined off RNG. We cant flip to min max anymore. We have to rely on luck.

Thats not skillful at all.

Luck is a factor in real-life, why shouldn't it be a factor in the game? I completely understand how it'd be very frustrating if one faction is spawning lots of high-reward missions and the competing faction isn't. But board-flipping is a Filthy McNasty 'solution' to this problem. If you're 'playing' the game by repeatedly exiting the game, something is badly broken.

Maybe a better solution would be for the BGS to detect this 'rivalry' scenario from the increased take-up of missions, and spawn additional supply of these and similar types of missions for the 'busy' factions. It should be limited in size/duration (can't have a massive supply boom in a tiny low-population outpost) and in type (an agriculture station shouldn't be spawning a huge number of combat missions) etc.

 

[Ralph Vargr]

Well you can bluff in Poker, and I always got the impression the game was more about learning to be good at bluffing than being good at finding matching cards

I've never really thought of the mission board 'spawn' as being loaded for or against me, and on the occasions where I have board flipped it never felt like any more than re-rolling dice - random within a range of criteria then filtered by my current ability to take that mission (rep level, rank, cargo space etc).

In what way have you come to the conclusion that it's 'rigged'?

Too many 7-2 offsuits being flopped (ice mining missions), and low pay are tells...

 

[Becky]

In the next chapter of Beyond (3.3), we will be implementing and migrating mission data to a new separate server. While this mainly affects the back-end of the game, you will see some changes to missions in-game.

Are mission board instances shared between commanders? or does each commander get their own mission board?

eg if two players are in the same station in the same instance, and commander 1 chooses missions will they become unavailable to commander 2?


The biggest and most significant impact i can see with this change is commanders getting their imperial/federation rank missions - we want to stack up our maximum of 20 faction missions and get them done asap, and rince and repeat until faction rank is to maximum.

If we can't refresh boards we wont be able to fill our mission quota.