Is megaship looting broken?

[sallymorganmoore]

@sallymorganmoore as much as I never tag you, I think this is rather critical for pirates at this stage (see the post above #259)

Can we hope for this to be looked into in a near future? <3

Ah yes yes, sorry I do have this aswell to run around with. Leave it with me, I've got it slotted in under "Missions being weird" o7

 

[Deleted member 182079]

You know what, I haven't once pinged Sally and I think this one's worth it.

@sallymorganmoore Morning! Could you please pleeeeeeease please look into the above - the frustrating part is that not only was the megaship cargo bay issue (where cargo is stuck and not ejected) fixed previously after over a year of being broken, only to be re-broken again with patch 7 iirc, but now we have the hatch breaker issue on top of that also.

What makes this so frustrating is that this cuts out a significant chunk of gameplay - I could build a ship dedicated to silent running, with recon and hatch breaker limpets fitted, and go to town stealing from megaships and installations. Basically the ship version of settlement sneaking/theft. But computer says no. Again. You (as in Frontier) almost had it, it was working I think after U6, I was so happy this was back then you (as in Frontier) snatched defeat from the jaws of victory. Please, with a pumpkin on top, can you get this sorted again for the next update?

It would make this grumpy nerd significantly less grumpy.

Edit - glol - ninja'd by CM. That's a first

 

[GroG79]

Sally for president!

 

[sallymorganmoore]

You know what, I haven't once pinged Sally and I think this one's worth it.

@sallymorganmoore Morning! Could you please pleeeeeeease please look into the above - the frustrating part is that not only was the megaship cargo bay issue (where cargo is stuck and not ejected) fixed previously after over a year of being broken, only to be re-broken again with patch 7 iirc, but now we have the hatch breaker issue on top of that also.

What makes this so frustrating is that this cuts out a significant chunk of gameplay - I could build a ship dedicated to silent running, with recon and hatch breaker limpets fitted, and go to town stealing from megaships and installations. Basically the ship version of settlement sneaking/theft. But computer says no. Again. You (as in Frontier) almost had it, it was working I think after U6, I was so happy this was back then you (as in Frontier) snatched defeat from the jaws of victory. Please, with a pumpkin on top, can you get this sorted again for the next update?

It would make this grumpy nerd significantly less grumpy.

Edit - glol - ninja'd by CM. That's a first

Absolutely, already grabbing all of this to add in, no worries. Sorry I missed the updates over here in this thread til being taggied. Never feel a pain for tagging on things like this - especially things sneaking back/becoming worse/entirely squashing gameplay.

 

[Jmanis]

@sallymorganmoore as much as I never tag you, I think this is rather critical for pirates at this stage (see the post #259 above)

Can we the poor pirates hope for this to be looked into in a near future? <3

It pains me that it comes to this...

Interceptor tissue sampling, smuggling prices and outbreak massacres have all been broken nearly as long as this or longer (in years at least), and while Megaship looting has been one of my favourite "Hey FD, these basic mechanics are still broken" topics, and seeing it fixed (again) would make me happy... this can't be the way to get things fixed, can it?

So many multiple expired issue tickets on these things...

 

[rootsrat]

It pains me that it comes to this...

Interceptor tissue sampling, smuggling prices and outbreak massacres have all been broken nearly as long as this or longer, and while Megaship looting has been one of my favourite "Hey FD, these basic mechanics are still broken" topics, and seeing it fixed (again) would make me happy... this can't be the way to get things fixed, can it?

So many multiple expired issue tickets on these things...

I cannot wait for improvements to issue tracker... Massively overdue.

 

[Deleted member 182079]

Absolutely, already grabbing all of this to add in, no worries. Sorry I missed the updates over here in this thread til being taggied. Never feel a pain for tagging on things like this - especially things sneaking back/becoming worse/entirely squashing gameplay.

Much appreciated Sally

 

[Deleted member 182079]

It pains me that it comes to this...

Interceptor tissue sampling, smuggling prices and outbreak massacres have all been broken nearly as long as this or longer (in years at least), and while Megaship looting has been one of my favourite "Hey FD, these basic mechanics are still broken" topics, and seeing it fixed (again) would make me happy... this can't be the way to get things fixed, can it?

So many multiple expired issue tickets on these things...

Baby steps Jmanis... although I agree and unless I'm missing something (which is possible) the smuggling prices in particular are probably quite easy to fix as it's just fiddling with some variable values/formulas.

What is particularly annoying with this one is that it's one of way too many regression issues - surely Frontier ought to look at their QA/rollout processes to address these from reoccuring, it must cost them a fair bit of money re-fixing the same bug several times. Such an ineffective way to operate, I just don't get how this keeps happening. And drowning a single CM with all the issues really isn't a sustainable solution, neither for the CM, the company, or indeed the rest of us.

 

[Jmanis]

Baby steps Jmanis... although I agree and unless I'm missing something (which is possible) the smuggling prices in particular are probably quite easy to fix as it's just fiddling with some variable values/formulas.

What is particularly annoying with this one is that it's one of way too many regression issues - surely Frontier ought to look at their QA/rollout processes to address these from reoccuring, it must cost them a fair bit of money re-fixing the same bug several times. Such an ineffective way to operate, I just don't get how this keeps happening. And drowning a single CM with all the issues really isn't a sustainable solution, neither for the CM, the company, or indeed the rest of us.

Yeah, the smuggling is (should) literally just be an incorrect boolean logic thing where it's going "If illegal, deduct 'stolen' price debuff".

The tissue sampling is a big bugbear of mine, because it was a significant enough issue for FD to pull an early Aegis CG to collect them.... they then fixed it, then an update broke it again, just like the case for Megaship looting. And despite the "betancourt base" addition to the Coalsack where they pay a premium for samples, you'd think the mechanic should have been fixed before that got floated as an idea.

But yeah, the fact that tissue sampling was fixed and then got broken again in a future update, just like this. That's what pains me the most.

The outbreak massacres are a very mild inconvenience, since it's pretty stateful, but really, those issues which were more systemic to massacres got fixed a long time ago... that one just fell through... but it rears it's head every now and then.

Either way, totally agree, drowning a CM in issues and tags is not the right way... and why I don't do it... only that seems to be the only way that's working right now, because putting in at least 40-60 minutes preparing a detailed issue only to have it expire in a few months is rock-bottom.

 

[Deleted member 182079]

Yeah, the smuggling is (should) literally just be an incorrect boolean logic thing where it's going "If illegal, deduct 'stolen' price debuff".

The tissue sampling is a big bugbear of mine, because it was a significant enough issue for FD to pull an early Aegis CG to collect them.... they then fixed it, then an update broke it again, just like the case for Megaship looting. And despite the "betancourt base" addition to the Coalsack where they pay a premium for samples, you'd think the mechanic should have been fixed before that got floated as an idea.

But yeah, the fact that tissue sampling was fixed and then got broken again in a future update, just like this. That's what pains me the most.

The outbreak massacres are a very mild inconvenience, since it's pretty stateful, but really, those issues which were more systemic to massacres got fixed a long time ago... that one just fell through... but it rears it's head every now and then.

I hear ya... before I wiped my account I used to have various Thargoid-related ship builds - one was a Clipper to nab tissue samples - so much fun especially when planet side (that base in the Coalsack was one of my hunting grounds for them). Very irritating to joust with a flower ship waiting for the tissue sample to complete for it to only disappear just like that before it disconnects and can be picked up. Given how quickly that PA super weapon got fixed (and I'm not saying it shouldn't - but it shows where there's a will there's a way) it's a pity that these issues stay in the game for so long. I know, niche content, but it's still content.

 

[Jmanis]

I hear ya... before I wiped my account I used to have various Thargoid-related ship builds - one was a Clipper to nab tissue samples - so much fun especially when planet side (that base in the Coalsack was one of my hunting grounds for them). Very irritating to joust with a flower ship waiting for the tissue sample to complete for it to only disappear just like that before it disconnects and can be picked up. Given how quickly that PA super weapon got fixed (and I'm not saying it shouldn't - but it shows where there's a will there's a way) it's a pity that these issues stay in the game for so long. I know, niche content, but it's still content.

<big tangent>
It's why Megaship looting (and these others) being broken is such a big deal... because the mechanics are interesting. I'd love it if there were missions tied to megaship looting. Salvage missions shouldn't be confined to just "fly to spot in space, pick up floating cans"; it should be "fly to mission USS, find megaship wreck, scan and hatch break hatches, but during your scans of the megaship and looking for the right hatch to pop, that's when the enemies might rock up. Maybe you're even within the ship's infrastructure when the ships are there, and it's safe while you're in there, but you need to bide your time to boost out at the right moment.

This is wear Odyssey gets it right; the missions are more interactive, and a simple salvage mission there involves cutting open seals to overload doors, or use eBreaches to bypass locks... right up to a more complex cover theft mission requiring stealing credentials, disabling security and all those bits in between. It's little stuff, but it matters to the experience... and all these broken mechanics are right up there for making these activities more interesting.

Even just Hijack missions as they currently are, are a step above normal missions because it's not just "go to spot, scoop/kill, leave"... you need to tank, you can't kill the target, they'll try to get the stolen cargo back, the authorities might arrive, the authorities might kill the target too... it's all stuff that makes the mission fun.

 

[Deleted member 182079]

<big tangent>
It's why Megaship looting (and these others) being broken is such a big deal... because the mechanics are interesting. I'd love it if there were missions tied to megaship looting. Salvage missions shouldn't be confined to just "fly to spot in space, pick up floating cans"; it should be "fly to mission USS, find megaship wreck, scan and hatch break hatches, but during your scans of the megaship and looking for the right hatch to pop, that's when the enemies might rock up. Maybe you're even within the ship's infrastructure when the ships are there, and it's safe while you're in there, but you need to bide your time to boost out at the right moment.

This is wear Odyssey gets it right; the missions are more interactive, and a simple salvage mission there involves cutting open seals to overload doors, or use eBreaches to bypass locks... right up to a more complex cover theft mission requiring stealing credentials, disabling security and all those bits in between. It's little stuff, but it matters to the experience... and all these broken mechanics are right up there for making these activities more interesting.

Even just Hijack missions as they currently are, are a step above normal missions because it's not just "go to spot, scoop/kill, leave"... you need to tank, you can't kill the target, they'll try to get the stolen cargo back, the authorities might arrive, the authorities might kill the target too... it's all stuff that makes the mission fun.

What I like about the megaship instances is that you don't even need a mission to interact with them. I prefer playing this way, the missions are sometimes good to provide some structure if you're not sure what you want to do, but just like mining, exploration, or working RES's, I can show up at a megaship without relying on mission boards, and then it gives me various options without having to commit to any. Pirates might attack it which I may support, or I could instead defend against them, or I could do my own thing and rob the megaship while an attack is ongoing (meaning both megaship and pirates become hostile).

Organic gameplay at its best (by Elite standards at least), and on top of that and as I mentioned earlier, it provides me with another reason to build dedicated ships for this purpose - and ship building is probably my favourite activity in the game and has kept me entertained throughout the past years.

 

[Jmanis]

What I like about the megaship instances is that you don't even need a mission to interact with them. I prefer playing this way, the missions are sometimes good to provide some structure if you're not sure what you want to do, but just like mining, exploration, or working RES's, I can show up at a megaship without relying on mission boards, and then it gives me various options without having to commit to any. Pirates might attack it which I may support, or I could instead defend against them, or I could do my own thing and rob the megaship while an attack is ongoing (meaning both megaship and pirates become hostile).

Organic gameplay at its best (by Elite standards at least), and on top of that and as I mentioned earlier, it provides me with another reason to build dedicated ships for this purpose - and ship building is probably my favourite activity in the game and has kept me entertained throughout the past years.

Agreed, but it's kinda part of the problem.

Historically, on the topic of reward balance, I've had people complain at my "Oh Jmanis, why do you care if mining earns eleventybillion and smuggling earns table scraps, just do what you enjoy!"

... then in the same breath it'll be "Oh Jmanis, why do you want FD to expend effort fixing smuggling when so little people do it! It's niche gameplay anyway!"

It's niche because it's not front-and-center to activities like missions. It's niche because it rewards poorly. It's niche because it's unbalanced compared to other things. It's niche because it's broken.

Imagine for a minute, if megaship looting could reward you as richly as pre-nerf mining could. Imagine how quickly that would be resolved.

Now imagine a scenario where instead of players huddling around the single cash-cow the game offers, all activities are equally rewarding in their own way... and when one activity breaks, it actually needs to be fixed, because people actually do it, instead of getting ignored because it's a niche, background, unrewarding, broken activity.

Eh... I'm rambling now. Don't worry, we still can't walk in ships for no real reason, that'll get the resources instead of this, because as much as people are bothered when I create unnecessary either-or scenarios when I suggest FD should've fixed these things instead of releasing things like legs, threads like this remind me it really is either-or, and that wishing things like Smuggling getting fixed is too much to ask.

 

[rootsrat]

Absolutely, already grabbing all of this to add in, no worries. Sorry I missed the updates over here in this thread til being taggied. Never feel a pain for tagging on things like this - especially things sneaking back/becoming worse/entirely squashing gameplay.

THANK YOU! <3

 

[Zeke Drexel]

This is really annoying ... recon limpets still broken after all this time.
I would have expected this to have higher priority than fixing some lighting here and there.

There has been an open issue on the tracker for some time now:

https://issues.frontierstore.net/issue-detail/44596

 

[Factabulous]

This is really annoying ... recon limpets still broken after all this time.
I would have expected this to have higher priority than fixing some lighting here and there.

There has been an open issue on the tracker for some time now:

https://issues.frontierstore.net/issue-detail/44596

This update will also include a plethora of fixes and tweaks, including (but not limited to) the following:

• Issues relating to hatch breaker limpets when used on cargo hatch or escape pods on non-dockable megaships (Odyssey and Horizons)

 

[Zeke Drexel]

Cool ... that will be great if it happens. Just to be clear the issue reported above is around the use of recon limpets, not hatch breakers.

 

[BL1P]

Looking forward to them breaking it again in update 10

 

[Drelthar]

Cool ... that will be great if it happens. Just to be clear the issue reported above is around the use of recon limpets, not hatch breakers.

Recon limpets are broken too? blerg

 

[GraphiteGB]

Cool ... that will be great if it happens. Just to be clear the issue reported above is around the use of recon limpets, not hatch breakers.

wrong link posted then...
"Unable to use Hatch Breaker, Recon, or Repair Limpets on Megaships" was the report you linked...
but the cause is likely the same but hatch breaker effected EDH not just EDO..