Isnt it somehow lame that Multicannons are so much better than Railguns and Cannons?

Well...cannon are nerfed cuz kids cried too much about cannon vipers.

Next nerf is on the multicannons.

As many said, in the end all you'll have to fight is the mining lasers.

I don't think they will nerf it.

Why? because a nerf on damage of Multi-Cannons will simply make it less interesting than a lasers on hull damages.
They can increase ammo cost and align it on the other cannons. Better choice but that will force more people to use lasers.

Overall ammo cost should be lowered except for Multi-Cannons. That's the best choice.

PS : nerf of the missile damage on shield was a good idea.
 
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As for the 450 m/s speed limit, think of that as a governor cap on your engine preventing you from going faster while at the same time having the demon spawn outer-dimensional child of Newton flogging your spacecraft from a higher dimension on the outside preventing it from exceeding this speed even in flight assist off mode. ;)

I know, I know, ED doesn't follow the laws of physics but at times the gigantic nerd inside of me wants to jump out and shout out loud.
Faster... relative to what?

IMO as soon as you make up things such as drag in space for ships, you can do it for projectile weapons as well. Maybe the shots are not actually made of normal matter, but unstable meta-matter that unstabalises and becomes less meta and more matter the further it goes. There we go, made up physics for you!
 
I love cannons and rails.

Only thing I would change is a very slight reduction in rail ammo cost.
Plus an increase in the amount of ammo carried for both.

That's it, that's all that is needed imo
 
fitting one multicannon to a viper or cobra setup just allows that much higher damage output. U gott go with what wins and at the moment its MCs. So until its nerfed i say fit it and enjoy the higher amount of kills.
 
A realistic way to balance railguns would be to make their ammo cheaper and more plentiful, but firing them empties the WEP capacitor and damage dealt is proportional to the amount of charge left in the capacitor at the time and the quality of the power distributor. Come to think of it, the same should apply to plasma cannons, only instead of ammo they use hydrogen fuel from the reservoir tank to make the plasma. That would make for some fun gameplay decisions.
 
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Multis are just fine where they are, the real issue is there is little else viable right now asides lasers (largely become of tiny amounts of ammo capacity, or high costs vs. smaller rewards).

I'd say reduce the ammo costs with more bias for class 1 reductions, and improve ammo... I posted some ideas a while back - but I'd like to see something a little more inventive than simply doubling the numbers of some guns.
 
It would be great to see an Ammo Storage Module or utility that works like a cargo rack that maxes out at double the ammo of the weapons you're carrying. I used 4 c1 cannons & 2 d2 lasers for the first time the other night and had great fun except for having to go and restock the cannon ammo constantly, waste of credits & time.
 
None of the projectiles should have damage falloff at range. I was just singling out railguns specifically.

Per Newton's first law:


Their trajectory would be altered because if they were to impact an object or particle in space, per newtonian physics their vector state would change depending on the angle of incidence they contacted the foreign object at relative to its stationary mass and their forward momentum.

Lasers will have a damage falloff due to beam divergence. It is really really hard to make a laser have zero divergence. To do so would require great amounts of power and generate a large amount of heat focusing in the weapon. Read up on the inverse square law and you'll start to get the idea.


As for the 450 m/s speed limit, think of that as a governor cap on your engine preventing you from going faster while at the same time having the demon spawn outer-dimensional child of Newton flogging your spacecraft from a higher dimension on the outside preventing it from exceeding this speed even in flight assist off mode. ;)

I know, I know, ED doesn't follow the laws of physics but at times the gigantic nerd inside of me wants to jump out and shout out loud.

But WAIT! This is a Space Simulator Except.. It's Not, its a aeroplane in space... Just another Fail. The same things people are stating here about Range, applies to lasers a focused beam of light in REALITY it would go for 10's of Kilometers if not 100's of kilometers and maintain that deadly energy. In ED that tightly focused beam of energy diffuses faster than what should be possible.
 
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I want to love cannons, I do... But they either need a serious buff in the velocity department, or they need to make a bigger boom. In current form, they were way over-nerfed, and nobody seemed to bother to check back to see how they were going.

An 800cr fine?

I'm kidding...

3 x Large burst lasers and 2 x medium multi cannons get me close to 1m cr int he right extraction zone. My multi cannon/burst laser equipped Asp wasn't too far behind.
Z...
 
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For me the Railgun and Cannon seem ok (they have their place and strengths), but the lack of ammo for anything other than the multicannon is very lacking. Thats why I don't use anything but multis when it comes to projectiles.
 
They are not better. They just require less skill. A pilot skilled in the use of fixed rails and cannons will punch way above the weight of someone rocking the standard gimballed beams and multi-cannons.

Different tools for different situations as Mike Evans stated. Yes, they do require more skill to use, but they also aren't needed for every situation. I'd say more skill is required in knowing when to use these weapons over being able to use them at all. I'd also say there are more situations where Multis are just more efficient due to extended battles, for instance, RES hunting. Falling back to Multicannons is easy when you likely won't need Rails or Cannons unless you are PvPing, doing Assassinations (still questionable), or just specifically hunting big ships.

It all comes down to what you are doing and how long you are doing it for. That doesn't come down to skill in usage, it's about efficiency. I can use Rails just fine, but I don't, really no need for me, I do sometimes fit cannons though. There is always room for discussion about these things and I don't think anyone is demanding that anything be made easier here. Multicannons are a very solid choice due to their staying power in multiple engagements over a longer period of time, which is probably the situation a lot of people find themselves in while farming credits or Combat Rank.

I think these reasons are why people fall back to them and label them better. They are better *for them* in general play, unfortunately they then come here and try to turn it into a fact in their arguments for balance. That's why these discussions are good, we can find error in our ways. :)
 
A realistic way to balance railguns would be to make their ammo cheaper and more plentiful, but firing them empties the WEP capacitor and damage dealt is proportional to the amount of charge left in the capacitor at the time and the quality of the power distributor. Come to think of it, the same should apply to plasma cannons, only instead of ammo they use hydrogen fuel from the reservoir tank to make the plasma. That would make for some fun gameplay decisions.

Railguns just need 2 things:

- Cheaper ammo
- Bigger ammo capacity


The overheat is pretty fine right now, just like the power usage.
The way that they have a delay before firing is perfect too.

Those last changes are pretty acceptable, but the ammo cost and ammo count needs to change.
 
Different tools for different situations as Mike Evans stated. Yes, they do require more skill to use, but they also aren't needed for every situation. I'd say more skill is required in knowing when to use these weapons over being able to use them at all. I'd also say there are more situations where Multis are just more efficient due to extended battles, for instance, RES hunting. Falling back to Multicannons is easy when you likely won't need Rails or Cannons unless you are PvPing, doing Assassinations (still questionable), or just specifically hunting big ships.

It all comes down to what you are doing and how long you are doing it for. That doesn't come down to skill in usage, it's about efficiency. I can use Rails just fine, but I don't, really no need for me, I do sometimes fit cannons though. There is always room for discussion about these things and I don't think anyone is demanding that anything be made easier here. Multicannons are a very solid choice due to their staying power in multiple engagements over a longer period of time, which is probably the situation a lot of people find themselves in while farming credits or Combat Rank.

I think these reasons are why people fall back to them and label them better. They are better *for them* in general play, unfortunately they then come here and try to turn it into a fact in their arguments for balance. That's why these discussions are good, we can find error in our ways. :)

Some great points. By adding more ammo to rails and cannons and maybe more speed to cannons too would make them more efficient and lead to better gameplay due to there being more variety in weapon loadouts and not leading good weapons to only being used in pvp.
 
The best setup I've run in my viper is 2 fixed class 2 pulse and two gimballed cannons. I like being able to keep 4 guns on a moving target at once and pulse lasers are powerful and don't drain the capacitor like beams. I also will run 4 fixed multi cannons but I don't find this as profitable because the multis aren't as good against shields. If I had the foresight to properly equip for larger targets I would run fixed pulses and cannons- but fixed cannon are useless against smaller targets. You don't usuall know what is going to spawn in RES.

I think we need more weapons first. Maybe a few more rounds or higher cannon velocity second.
 
Some great points. By adding more ammo to rails and cannons and maybe more speed to cannons too would make them more efficient and lead to better gameplay due to there being more variety in weapon loadouts and not leading good weapons to only being used in pvp.

different ammo types would indeed be very usefull.
i mean...no one would waste a highly expensive railgun shell against a sidewinder, if he could just use a "made in neo china station" shell.
Those shells would have worse stats obviously, less armor penetratrion, slower reload or something like that.

what i could imagine is the following:
Cheap Ammo (less stats but also waaaaay cheaper)
AP Ammo (to puncture the hull a bit more, for MC and Cannons)
Thermal Ammo (to shift a little bit of damage away from hull to shields)

Then again, such a system would need a way to store more ammo.

i know i know, no one likes what im about to say but: I think Eve had a pretty good system there. Different types of Ammo against different types of enemies. All in different grades from cheap to extremely expensive.
 
A realistic way to balance railguns would be to make their ammo cheaper and more plentiful, but firing them empties the WEP capacitor and damage dealt is proportional to the amount of charge left in the capacitor at the time and the quality of the power distributor. Come to think of it, the same should apply to plasma cannons, only instead of ammo they use hydrogen fuel from the reservoir tank to make the plasma. That would make for some fun gameplay decisions.

I like this about the plasma cannon - I don't think it needs ammo as long as the "recharge time" penalty is enough either through a weapon cooldown or using up the capacitor a bit like boost does with the engine capacitor
 
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