Krait vs. Python - Power Distributor

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Don't you think that never going out of juice with 2 pips is a bit over the top, though? What other ship does that?

Not at all.
I've spent dozens of hours recently, doing nothing but comparing the flight models of the Krait, Chief, Challenger, FDL, and FGS.

Try to orbit a Coriolis, boosting in FA-Off with the above ships, all in maxed out 3.0 combat trim.

The Krait is the worst by a landslide!

It is even difficult to stay close to the station.
You will turn a relatively wide, and lazy orbit, even boosting while in full throttle forward and pointing at the station with down thrust.
Any of the other ships will crash doing that.
I must use 0 throttle or even feather reverse for the rest.

It doesn't change vectors nearly as well as any of the others, and the boost frequency at 2 pips is irrelevant because of that.

That's all despite how good it feels to fly, and that I generally like how it flies in FAoff too.
It just can't keep up with the others in a boost/turn respect.
It's not even close.
 
I love the FGS more than anyone. Yes it has a large Power Distributor. But it's too slow to even be in this conversation.


LOL, it's a medium ship with an SLF.
And it blows the Krait away in this respect!

Try to orbit a Coriolis in FAOff compared to a Krait and get back to me.
It's no contest, the FGS wins hands down.

The Krait gets left in the dust.
You can boost continuously, and it won't matter at all if it can't effectively change velocity/vector.

So your answer is no, then. I'll check those ships out to confirm your story.

Don't put words in my mouth.
It's a silly question.

There is nothing wrong with the Krait PD or its boosting.
It simply can't keep up with other medium ships in a boost/turn respect, no matter the frequency.
 
There is nothing wrong with the Krait PD or its boosting.
It simply can't keep up with other medium ships in a boost/turn respect, no matter the frequency.
The question isn't whether it can compete with smaller combat ships with regards to FA/OFF, the question is whether any other ship can permaboost with 2 pips, and whether that is desirable. Do I have to bother engineering the FDL to find out?
 
The question isn't whether it can compete with smaller combat ships with regards to FA/OFF, the question is whether any other ship can permaboost with 2 pips, and whether that is desirable. Do I have to bother engineering the FDL to find out?

If the other ship can effectively keep a tighter, faster circle while boosting, then I suggest that is all that matters.

Just like how some people type lots of words with no substance, it's not the frequency of boost that matters; it's the end effect.
 
If the other ship can effectively keep a tighter, faster circle while boosting, then I suggest that is all that matters.

Just like how some people type lots of words with no substance, it's not the frequency of boost that matters; it's the end effect.
You're pretty defensive about a ship that is apparently so inferior to everything else in its class. I wonder...
 
You're pretty defensive about a ship that is apparently so inferior to everything else in its class. I wonder...

I'm not defensive and I think the Krait is one of the best ships in the lineup.
That's why I have two.

You are just making all sorts of logical fallacies, and it is tedious to unpack.
Now you are suggesting it's personal.
LOL.

Your thread is based on an empty premise, sorry!
 
Try to orbit a Coriolis in FAOff compared to a Krait and get back to me.
It's no contest, the FGS wins hands down.

Yeah the only time I find myself orbiting a Coriolis is in my Imperial Courier at a CG buzzing Cmdrs.

Stats wise no issues with turn rates - but it's not relevant to real game usefulness of a ship unless you include top speed in your calculation - especially in Open play.
 
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I'm not defensive and I think the Krait is one of the best ships in the lineup.
That's why I have two.

You are just making all sorts of logical fallacies, and it is tedious to unpack.
Now you are suggesting it's personal.
LOL.

Your thread is based on an empty premise, sorry!
You do realise that having low requirements on the engines gives you greater freedom to distribute power elsewhere, right? Not everyone spends their time spinning around stations.

Btw., Fer De Lance cost:
[video=youtube;_2tUsYpVWtY]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_2tUsYpVWtY&feature=youtu.be[/video]

I don't think there's need to go on..
 
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You do realise that having low requirements on the engines gives you greater freedom to distribute power elsewhere, right? Not everyone spends their time spinning around stations.

Btw., Fer De Lance cost:


I don't think there's need to go on..



And that's why I used 2 pips for all the tests, LOL.

You are hung up on a "feature"; perma-boost.
I am talking about the purported "benefits".
In this case the benefits are vector and velocity changes.

The "benefit" is simply not realized in practical terms vis a vis perma-boost in the Krait.
You can boost til the cows come home, for all the difference it will make.

On the other hand, that FDL with the smaller PD and more needy boost, covers WAY more ground and turns MUCH more readily.

So, who cares how often a Krait can boost?
It doesn't matter since it's left in the dust anyhow.
 
So, who cares how often a Krait can boost?
It doesn't matter since it's left in the dust anyhow.
Again, who cares how it turns over smaller, dedicated combat ships? I just told you that the low engine requirements allow for greater freedom in power management. You don't have to worry about having power in your engines most of the time. This isn't just about agility.

No other ship behaves this way.
 
This the last resort of the guilty. You left your car unlocked, therefore it was fine for me to take it.

Thanks for the lols, especially comparing using vr to exploiting game mechanics using extra accounts. Good one. Lol.

Except that FD doesn't consider it "cheating" or an "exploit".

I play exclusively in Open, I don't even enter Solo to refresh mission boards because I prefer not to play that way, but I don't call players who mode-switch "cheaters" because they use a legitimate gameplay feature that FD has expressly permitted. There is a massive difference between playing within the rules and cheating and you seem to be confused about this. Your personal preferences about how you think players should play the game is not the same as cheating or using exploits, sorry.
 
Again, who cares how it turns over smaller, dedicated combat ships? I just told you that the low engine requirements allow for greater freedom in power management. You don't have to worry about having power in your engines most of the time. This isn't just about agility.

No other ship behaves this way.


Um, you can put pips into sys or weps in any of the other ships too.
They will still outperform the Krait, that is what you are ignoring.

You are acting like the Krait has some unfair advantage, when it's clear there is none.

That freedom is offset by the subpar boost/handling performance!
LOL.

You need it since you will be outmaneuvered!
 
Um, you can put pips into sys or weps in any of the other ships too.
They will still outperform the Krait, that is what you are ignoring.

You are acting like the Krait has some unfair advantage, when it's clear there is none.

That freedom is offset by the subpar boost/handling performance!
LOL.

You need it since you will be outmaneuvered!
Whatever, man. I'll report this as a bug and let FD sort it out. If it turns out that it's by design, then fine, I'll live with it. If not, then good. It should be toned down, IMO.
 
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It's one player simulating the presence of additional players for the purpose of gaining an advantage over others. I'd definitely consider it cheating.

Even if Frontier has specifically made an exemption for it, it's clearly an unfair advantage.

So is VR and yet FD has specifically refused to add a headlook toggle feature even though I've been using those in flight sims for over 25 years. Should we label VR "cheating" as well because it provides an "unfair advantage" over the standard control setup?

It's barely any advantage at all, unless your sensors have been destroyed/powered down as even an unresolved contact will give reasonably accurate positional data and the game's latency compensation makes actual facing often differ from apparent facing. Removing one's eyes from one's instruments is often a liability as well.

Sorry but that's utter nonsense. The few times I've used my mouse in headlook mode as I was maneuvering it was dramatically easier to track smaller targets, being able to do this automatically is a massive advantage. The only reasons I don't use VR is that my computer isn't currently powerful enough to handle it (as I am using a 5 year old gaming rig) and I don't like wearing heavy/bulky goggles while gaming, otherwise I would probably be using VR myself.

Headtracking and good controls could be described as pay-to-win in some cases, but I'd have thought the line between removing barriers to the personal/manual control of one's vessel, as opposed to gaining the mechanical advantages of multi-crew with a single player, would be fairly clear.

Yes, the line is clear in that a second account is far more accessible to most players, as it requires no more than $40 USD, while most IR tracking setups are upwards of $100-200 USD and VR is upwards of $200-400 USD. I to use a second laptop if I'm running a second multicrew account because I happen to have one available but even my 5 year old gaming system can easily multibox two copies of Elite at the same time so there's no need to buy a second laptop to take advantage of multicrew.

Cost isn't the issue.

Yes, it is, because if you can obtain a legitimate advantage for a modest cost and minimal effort then it's ludicrous to call it "cheating" when players routinely put more money into other control options and setups that also provide in-game advantages. There's also the issue that you can tell immediately see if someone is using multicrew, it shows up right on the target HUD readout as "Crew", and you can choose to engage that CMDR accordingly but you have no idea if someone is using an expensive VR setup that gives them a significant control advantage.

No one who considers something a cheat is also going to consider that thing a legitimate advantage. Nor do I imagine that most of the people you are seemingly amused by are following the backwards cause and effect you presume they are. The reason I don't think a single player should be using multiple accounts simultaneously, and certainly not in this manner, is because it provides an unfair advantage that is contrary to the intended purpose of the feature. I didn't label it a cheat because I don't like (there are plenty of mechanisms I do not like that are not cheats). I don't like it because it is a cheat.

So do you also take the same approach to mode-switching? That clearly circumvents the mission board refresh limits. It actually circumvents an existing game mechanic completely. All multicrew does is use an existing game mechanic to provide built-in benefits.

If you refuse to label mode-switching as cheating than you are just picking and choosing how you personally prefer to play the game which means absolutely nothing to another player who is free to play the game the way they choose using any and all legitimate gameplay options, including mode-switching, IR/VR setups and a second multicrew account.

The intent behind multi-crew is for multiple players to play together, not for one player to get extra pips at 40 dollars a pop. Obviously, this can be abused (though I don't think it's particularly common) and I'd think the easiest solution to this would be to remove any and all passive benefits of multi-crew.

The intent of wing missions is for multiple players to play together, and yet players have been advertising "free" credits from wing missions on the forums since the feature launched. All you needed to do is join the wing at the end of the mission and cash in a full share of those credits despite doing nothing to actually contribute to those missions. It was completely permitted and was being done by players offering an advantage to other players to circumvent the inability to directly transfer credits between players. Did you jump all over those posts and label those players "cheaters" as well?

Sorry but until I see the same players who complain about multicrew afk benefits also apply the exactly same reasoning to mode-switching, IR/VR tracking and wing missions I can't take those claims seriously. All that those players are doing is arbitrarily trying to attach some sort of "moral" significance to their own personal gameplay preferences while overlooking far worse "abuses" of the existing game mechanics that are all specifically permitted by FD.
 
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