Lifetime pass and general update questions

Ah, so we were stupid to pre-pay. Do you think FDev share that view?
The LEP wasn't really pre-paying or pre-order but supporting continuous development of the game. And that's what FDEV did.
It's not a way to save money. If you wanted to do that you shouldn't have bought anything at all but wait until the game is on a sale

I think the plan changed is all, and it has been communicated extremely poorly. And after this long with neither anything to show for it nor any useful information on what's coming (or willingness to provide any) offers of refunds to those no longer happy to wait would be a good way to settle this.
I believe there never was a clear plan...

PS
On refunds: Wouldn't that signal they no longer believe in the future of the game? I believe that's probably the worst thing they could do.
 
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The LEP wasn't really pre-paying or pre-order but supporting continuous development of the game. And that's what FDEV did.
It's not a way to save money. If you wanted to do that you shouldn't have bought anything at all but wait until the game is on a sale
snip
Imho that's not correct...

What do most games get after a short while or even with launch ? Right a season pass ... A way to pre-pay for oncoming content and to save money on that next season DLCs, with a given number of DLCs or a time span to deliver those DLCs...

And to get on top of that what would one probably call an even better and loooonger lasting season pass then ? Right a lifetime expansion pass ...


Sold at a time when "Seasons" were the way to go, only to change that to a DLC-type-modus right after the first "season" Horizons which then became the first paid DLC...
and until now also the last... And i guess no one expected back at the time, that it might last a good 5 years to get the next paid content... no one...


My 2 ct
 
PS
On refunds: Wouldn't that signal they no longer believe in the future of the game? I believe that's probably the worst thing they could do.
Earlier I posted a list of solutions:

Solutions to this ongoing issue:

Provide the stuff,
Talk about it,
Offer to return the money.
Put the LEP on permanent sale in the shop.
If offering refunds is the worst thing they could do then putting the LEP back into the store is (by the same logic) the best thing they could do under the circumstances. Putting the LEP on sale would demonstrate confidence that there is an intention to make it a worthwhile purchase.

After this long there are no easy choices left. FX17 would have been a point where an option for FDev and customers alike to back out of the LEP ball & chain would have worked, I'm sure they'd have realised it would be a sticking point if they'd thought about it.

There have been plenty of opportunities for FDev to be proactive on tackling this, personally I think 'saying nothing and hoping the problem will just go away eventually' is the worst thing they could do as far as their standing in my eyes is concerned.
 
Earlier I posted a list of solutions:



If offering refunds is the worst thing they could do then putting the LEP back into the store is (by the same logic) the best thing they could do under the circumstances. Putting the LEP on sale would demonstrate confidence that there is an intention to make it a worthwhile purchase.

After this long there are no easy choices left. FX17 would have been a point where an option for FDev and customers alike to back out of the LEP ball & chain would have worked, I'm sure they'd have realised it would be a sticking point if they'd thought about it.

There have been plenty of opportunities for FDev to be proactive on tackling this, personally I think 'saying nothing and hoping the problem will just go away eventually' is the worst thing they could do as far as their standing in my eyes is concerned.
Putting the LEP on sale now wouldn't make any sense without announcing the contents of the next paid expansion. Which isn't something they can do yet.
 

Viajero

Volunteer Moderator
Also, the “keeping the LEP on sale” argument to prove confidence is a bit narrow and flawed. Assuming not much changed within the few weeks the 2015 LEP was on sale (August to September if memory serves), why do we think they took it off sale only after those few weeks instead of, say, keeping it available or until further notice as suggested above as the most logical course of action purely based on “confidence”?
 
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Actually no, he didnt. Here the relevant part:



It was very deliberate in leaving out all the actual main elements of the 2015 LEP that could be "deducted" until I pointed it out.
Seriously, how long are you going to go on about this single post? What about the dozens of other posts where Riverside went into more detail and stated that he also got Horizons and beta access? You're being dishonest yourself and focus on the one post where Riverside was probably tired to write the same stuff again and again and went for a shorter version.

Why not ask him if he has ever talked to Frontier about it?

It honestly feels like you are deliberately derailing this thread for the last couple of pages.
 

Viajero

Volunteer Moderator
Seriously, how long are you going to go on about this single post? What about the dozens of other posts where Riverside went into more detail and stated that he also got Horizons and beta access? You're being dishonest yourself and focus on the one post where Riverside was probably tired to write the same stuff again and again and went for a shorter version.

Why not ask him if he has ever talked to Frontier about it?

It honestly feels like you are deliberately derailing this thread for the last couple of pages.
My correction was very factual, simple and straightforward. The puzzling thing was actually seeing the rationalisation, wishful thinking and doubling down that happened afterward.

I would actually argue the derailing started much earlier with the discussion about personal grievances with the LEP which are certainly far off topic from the very specific and straightforward answers the OP got already at the start.
 
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This topic was addressed by FDEV not too long ago:
That is usual go-around chit-chat from FD!
They weren't so quiet and worried about quality (as stated in that PR post) during KS when they needed money, once money arrived they went silent (until they released other titles DB was very talkative about ED, after other titles granted Frontier financial stability DB went silent).

Also if they are so worried about quality of announcement details and sneak peak how come they released recent updates without QA and with tons of bugs.

It is very hard to officially wrote few lines after one year of major drop down with Beyond content stating 2020 update will be atmos, legs, base building or something else.....nothing to misinterpret there!
But again there could be a reason, like it was with Beyond so they can drop down significant amount of content once they realise they can't do it.

Overall, very naive community here....
 

Sir.Tj

Moderator
Volunteer Moderator
I'd say that is probably a good place to halt this thread.

It's not as if the subject hasn't been discussed over and over again.

I'll ping a FD Staff member and let them decide if it should be reopened.

At the very least it will give some a chance to cool off for a ilttle bit.
 

Paige Harvey

Community Manager
Frontier
Folks
I pretty much stopped playing, as did the majority of the folks I played Elite with, once the "no substantial content" till 2020 announcement, so forgive me if this has already been answered.
Has there been any announcement as to exactly what lifetime pass holders can expect to be receiving?
Has there been a reveal on any new content?
Any answers, gratefully received.
Hello OP and others reading this!

To answer OP's questions, all LEP holders will receive the 2020 release free as part of their pass. Other Commanders will need to purchase the content if they want to play it. Any other updates coming this year will be free for all Elite Dangerous players, so keep an eye on our forums and social channels for more information on what's coming.

At the time of writing, we've not revealed any information regarding the 2020 release. Earlier in this thread, Viajero linked to one of my forum responses which offers a summary of why we haven't released any information, and this may be of interest to you!

That’s a good question!

While we’d love to tell you everything as we find it out, the reality is that we need to show things when they’re ready, and in the best shape possible. Every single feature, in every single game, goes through multiple iterations, bug tests and redesigns before they’re released to the public. As such, if a company were to release all the information they have, you’d end up with a lot of convoluted and eventually incorrect content.

We know it’s exciting to get a sneak peek at things in development, but as mentioned, things change and when that has to happen, we wouldn’t want to let anyone down. You also have to understand that you can’t just speak about a feature, you have to show it. That requires development time to teach the feature, tech time to set up the build, creative services time to make images and videos and community time to design a release plan and get that information out.

To do all that for information which will change very quickly doesn’t make a lot of sense. So, in order to make sure that what we present to you is as correct as possible, sometimes we have to hold our secrets to our chest and ensure it’s right before we show it off to you all.

TL;DR – Games development is constantly in flux and features constantly change. Showing off information early leads to misinformation and potential disappointment. There’s also a lot more to releasing info than simply putting a post on the internet.

We hope this information helps explain the situation a little!
This thread will reopen shortly, so please stay on topic! :)
 
Hello OP and others reading this!

To answer OP's questions, all LEP holders will receive the 2020 release free as part of their pass. Other Commanders will need to purchase the content if they want to play it. Any other updates coming this year will be free for all Elite Dangerous players, so keep an eye on our forums and social channels for more information on what's coming.

At the time of writing, we've not revealed any information regarding the 2020 release. Earlier in this thread, Viajero linked to one of my forum responses which offers a summary of why we haven't released any information, and this may be of interest to you!



This thread will reopen shortly, so please stay on topic! :)
hello :) tell me, have you ever thought that what you are doing may be ... hmm ... (how could I describe it better, so that I would not be accused of toxicity?) may be ... wrong, uninteresting for the players themselves? perhaps, all the same it is worth showing to the players (at least those who are really worried about the state of the project, and not showing those who do not want to know what you are working on and whether you are working at all) what you have at the moment so that they can suggest any things and help, make the game better, in the end, among the players there are people who love this game as much as you. Moreover, if you put the boundary between "we work, see what happened" and "we promise"
adequate people would not have any complaints against you, but what does a person who is worried about the project (I speak for myself) think when they don’t see news on the development of the project? if you do not show anything, then there is no development = no work. There are a lot of people (I am among them) who refer to ed as a parent to their child. What does a loving parent think when it receives no news from a child? something happened, probably something really bad. Of course, I said it figuratively. but hopefully clear enough.
 
hello :) tell me, have you ever thought that what you are doing may be ... hmm ... (how could I describe it better, so that I would not be accused of toxicity?) may be ... wrong, uninteresting for the players themselves? perhaps, all the same it is worth showing to the players (at least those who are really worried about the state of the project, and not showing those who do not want to know what you are working on and whether you are working at all) what you have at the moment so that they can suggest any things and help, make the game better, in the end, among the players there are people who love this game as much as you. Moreover, if you put the boundary between "we work, see what happened" and "we promise"
adequate people would not have any complaints against you, but what does a person who is worried about the project (I speak for myself) think when they don’t see news on the development of the project? if you do not show anything, then there is no development = no work. There are a lot of people (I am among them) who refer to ed as a parent to their child. What does a loving parent think when it receives no news from a child? something happened, probably something really bad. Of course, I said it figuratively. but hopefully clear enough.
The reality is that you are not a part of the development team. As such, they are under no obligation to reveal what state the project is in, as that is internal company knowledge. Additionally, there is no point in telling "just those that want to know". In today's times, if you're going to tell one person, you may as well tell everyone (see the "leak" that came out). You are a customer, not an investor or employee.

Do I wish that we culd get some more information? of course. But lets not act like we are entitled to be cc'd on Fdev's emails
 
The reality is that you are not a part of the development team. As such, they are under no obligation to reveal what state the project is in, as that is internal company knowledge. Additionally, there is no point in telling "just those that want to know". In today's times, if you're going to tell one person, you may as well tell everyone (see the "leak" that came out). You are a customer, not an investor or employee.

Do I wish that we culd get some more information? of course. But lets not act like we are entitled to be cc'd on Fdev's emails
That they do not wish to reveal all is understood, there is plenty that can still be said that is not which creates awkward situations just like this, and leads me to the conclusion that they can be as secretive as they like without my extra LEP money. It wasn't this way before, it doesn't have to be now. Dev updates, sneak peeks in the newsletter, general confidence inspiring communication. Last week's livestream on the Krait was great - let's have that same level of info on this. It doesn't need a livestream, just contribute to the thread.

If I hadn't paid extra for the LEP I'd be pretty happy with the game overall, and would have little to nothing to complain about with regard to updates or timescales for future content. Anything more than we have is just a bonus (as long as it isn't detrimental to the existing game).



But I did buy an LEP in 2015 & quite frankly I just want that extra money back. Had I known that extra would provide ZERO value four years after paying and that I would still have no information (other than a moving, ever more distant and vague date) I would not have paid that extra. I think it is disgraceful behaviour.
 
The reality is that you are not a part of the development team. As such, they are under no obligation to reveal what state the project is in, as that is internal company knowledge. Additionally, there is no point in telling "just those that want to know". In today's times, if you're going to tell one person, you may as well tell everyone (see the "leak" that came out). You are a customer, not an investor or employee.

Do I wish that we culd get some more information? of course. But lets not act like we are entitled to be cc'd on Fdev's emails
Of course, like you, I am just a “consumer”, but, as I said, people are different, there are those to whom the condition of the elite is very important, and there are those to whom it is completely indifferent. Can I influence the development? not. Can I give advice because how to make so that no one was disappointed? yes I can. that's what i did now. those who want to know about how things are going, you could find out, those who don’t need it, could just pass by. In addition, as I have already said, it is possible, and it is possible and necessary to put a clear line between "we work, we succeed and we do not" and "we promise that it will be so."
that, before that leak, it is difficult to describe in words how much I was inspired by the fact that I saw it, and especially by the fact that it began to be confirmed.
 
That they do not wish to reveal all is understood, there is plenty that can still be said that is not which creates awkward situations just like this, and leads me to the conclusion that they can be as secretive as they like without my extra LEP money. It wasn't this way before, it doesn't have to be now. Dev updates, sneak peeks in the newsletter, general confidence inspiring communication. Last week's livestream on the Krait was great - let's have that same level of info on this. It doesn't need a livestream, just contribute to the thread.
An idea about the state of fleet carriers and the snow planet updates are would be a start. These have already been revealed in FX17 so I would have thought they do not have to be so secretive about them, unless they are well and truly behind schedule or deprioritised.

However, I will not be holding my breath.
 
That they do not wish to reveal all is understood, there is plenty that can still be said that is not which creates awkward situations just like this, and leads me to the conclusion that they can be as secretive as they like without my extra LEP money. It wasn't this way before, it doesn't have to be now. Dev updates, sneak peeks in the newsletter, general confidence inspiring communication. Last week's livestream on the Krait was great - let's have that same level of info on this. It doesn't need a livestream, just contribute to the thread.
IIRC Horizons was announced 4 or 5 months before release. Technically we know more about the next paid expansion than we did in 2015... ;)
 
An idea about the state of fleet carriers and the snow planet updates are would be a start. These have already been revealed in FX17 so I would have thought they do not have to be so secretive about them, unless they are well and truly behind schedule or deprioritised.

However, I will not be holding my breath.
The word is reprioritised. And they can't be behind schedule since there is no schedule. Frontier haven't figured out yet what to do with carriers. At least that's the last info we got.
 
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