Morai CG Payment

[Devari]

No, you certainly aren't going to be able to help me with that. I know why it is though, it's because your analogies are risible as I already pointed out.

No, I don't think that I am. If you don't understand my analogy there is really no way I can help you.

Oh dear. As I said, your analogy is worthless. It is worthless because in order for it to have any validity whatsoever here, the only metric by which the value of an employee would be measured would be the time that he has previously spent working. Even leaving aside that it's a nonsense when applied to the world of work, a computer game is in no way analogous to that particular sphere.

Sorry, but you don't even understand the analogy in the first place. Which is why you're confusing the ridiculous CG payout with the differences between Cutters and Sidewinders. They are not even remotely related concepts and have nothing to do with each other.

I have well over 1,000 hours into it myself by the way and my assets were over a billion before this CG so don't confuse yourself by imagining that I'm somehow arguing from the perspective of someone about to see their sainted cash cow slaughtered. I could have the credits from this CG taken off me tomorrow and not miss them at all.

It might not matter to you, but what exactly would you say to someone who "missed" the ridiculous CG payout, who is maybe making 1-2 million/hr in a Type 6 and sees another player with a similar ship and gameplay time suddenly make 100-200 million from 1 hour of participation in a CG? What would you say to that player that would convince them to "stick it out" and keep playing Elite despite not benefitting from an obvious and imbalancing game bug? "Mistakes happen"? Yeah, not going to matter to that Type 6 pilot. "It's good for the game"? Not from the perspective of the Type 6 pilot who didn't get the extra 100-200 million, it's not "good" for that player's game experience at all. Maybe "just keep grinding another 50-100 hours and you'll make up the difference"? Yeah, not going to go over well either.

Quoting Meatloaf won't help you here. You need the ability to think logically combined with the ability to view the CG payout situation from the perspective of a player who is struggling to get 10 million from boring trade runs and will be quite discouraged to see certain players randomly handed 100-200 million for nearly no effort.

 

[swefan]

I have gained 138M in less than an hour yesterday, I'm happy but I feel a little uncomfortable...
290M in almost 300 hours of playing, 1M per hour, I never took advantage of an exploit or bug
Now 138M in less than an hour... I feel like I broke my way of playing...

I have decided not to spend the credits and waiting the response of Dev, if they say that it was intentional I will accept the "easy-credits" and I will buy an Anaconda, if not I will be happy to return them...


But if they can take only the credits not spent, and not the credits already spent, well, it will be just another exploits (The "spend before exploit"), and I'll feel very very annoyed for that

 

[Vasious]

Under 1 hour of "work" for 100 million credits is hardly what I would call "work".



And there are players like myself, who have 1000 hours into the game, who are questioning whether the buggy game mechanics are worth investing any more of my time.



Wait, what now? If getting 100 million credits for almost no work is "enjoyment", then what should I call my Sothis runs, or the other 1000 hours I spent in the game, much of it doing boring grindy activities to get bigger ships? Because if getting money for almost no work is "enjoying" the game, then I clearly haven't been "enjoying" Elite very much so far. Last time I checked the entire point of setting up goals with a defined amount of work required to reach them was supposed to make achieving those goals meaningful. Not being handed 100 million credits because someone at FD added an extra zero to a CG payout by mistake.

Once again you just come across as
"I chose to do B rather than A but the people who chose A got more than me, and it is not fair."

Same could be said for QANY CG over normal trading profit

If someone only Trades and someone trades to a CG and gets the same profit per ton, but then gets the CG reward, isn't that just as unfair according to your criteria.

How would you propose to balance that imbalance.
Same amount of work, different profit.

All because of a choice to participate in the CG or not.

Come on, fix it, explain to us how you would balance that our to ensure same reward for same effort

Pilot A trade 5000 tons, at 200 tons a run, at 1000 CR a ton for a profit of 5,000,000 CR away from a CG

Pilot B trade 5000 tons, at 200 tons a run, at 1000 CR a ton for a profit of 5,000,000 CR Plus 5,000,000 for Completing the CG

The only difference is the choice to participate in the CG or not, both are trading the exact same trade goods from station A to station B

You DEMAND that reward be proportional to effort, so how do you reconcile that?

When that is down to choice, just as it was YOUR CHOICE which I am sure you have complete agency over, not to join the CG on the 25th when you thought you could get more CR elsewhere.

By rights, you should be against ALL CG on PRINCIPAL, not just the ones that you didn't get the reward for.

 

[clivewil]

I spent it all. your move fd.

roger that. i just returned from buying and outfitting a new Orca and yet another Python.

now only got 5.5 mil in my bank. nothing to see here FD, move along please.

 

[koop26]

I hope it's already been argued that this game has never had an airtight progression curve, and sandbox games in general are prone to exploits, tricks and inadvertent outcomes not anticipated by devs.

I never run Sothis/Ceos but i recognize peoples rights to make millions quickly, and their successes don't bother me in the least.

In some ways you have to recognize this game is the wild west and that your way of doing something may not be "fair" compared to someone else's way of doing something, you can adapt to be successful, or be happy with the fiction you've created for your pilot.

This to me is why even if it was a mistake to payout the credits, they should honor the payout and let this solidify in elite history as that moment lots of people got rich on a community event. Maybe more people will be paying attention and doing these now.

 

[A. C. Dobro VI]

Wah wah some people are having fun at a video game and didn't have to suffer through the stages of early adoption like I did. Goddamn the level of entitlement from some people here. Spoiled brats the lot of you.

Meanwhile, as a Fed who didn't participate, enjoy your new toys CMDRs.

Seriously if you have to complain about someone else making more money than you in a goddamn video game, you should just uninstall and go get some sun.

Have any of you bothered to postulate that perhaps it's intentional on FDev's part to bring us newer commanders up to par for when the aliens show up? Or should we just suffer in Vipers and Eagles? Kindly screw off with the salt. Robigo, Sothis, all of this exists for a flipping reason. You have to be daft if you expect us new players to catch up to 1.5 years of playtime when there's about to be a completely hostile element of gameplay that you elitist jerks didn't have to play through. But hey, guess the game should be no fun for me just because I bought it two months ago and not at release.

 

[Limoncello Lizard]

When I first heard of the Morai CG, I thought it said Moral CG and said "I'm not doing that then".
Karma caught up to me on that one

 

[Soopyyy]

If they reneg on this, the can shove the game.... They had plenty of time to sort this out while the CG was going and now people have spent a lot of time on it. The game is grindy enough as it is without doing this...

 

[aRJay]

Apologies if I missed seeing this.

Here is the information previous build a fleet CG for the Federation that time.

Notice that it only reached Tier 3 but the payment for the top 10% was 10,000,000 which is where we were in this CG at that level.
So if this one was a bug or mistake and Fdev need to reduce the payouts by a factor of 10 then so was that one and the same thing should happen.

I personally don't think there was a bug these are urgent military acquisition/construction programmes I have no problem at all with somebody in authority saying hang the cost we need those ships right away.

As for the support tickets, there were several commanders in the CG mega thread saying the payment screen didn't match with previous screens.


Description:
As the antagonism between the Federation and the Empire continues to simmer, the Federation has announced plans to expand its Navy with three new Farragut-class Battlecruisers. The announcement follows a recent initiative to add three new capital ships to the Imperial fleet.

In a statement, Federal President Zachary Hudson spoke candidly about the motivation behind the campaign.

"We live in uncertain times, and are on the brink of an uncertain future. When I speak to the people of the Federation, I want to be able to promise them that their homes and families are safe"

"By contributing to this campaign, you can help me keep that promise."

The Federation has placed an open order for Autofabricators, Tantalum and Superconductors for use in the construction, and has authorised the Workers of Gooheimar Alliance to reward pilots who deliver the requested materials to Brady Horizons in the Gooheimar system.

The campaign begins on the 4th of August 3302 and will run for one week. If the Federation's targets are met earlier than planned, the campaign will end immediately.

To be eligible for rewards you must sign up as an active participant before delivering Autofabricators, Tantalum or Superconductors to Brady Horizons in the Gooheimar system.

Be aware that faction-state changes, UA bombing and other disruptive events can negatively impact markets and station services, and could prevent the initiative from running smoothly.

System: Gooheimar
Station: Brady Horizons (Coriolis Starport, large pads available, 8,969 Ls from main star, 43.29 Ly from Sol)
Objective: Deliver Autofabricators, Tantalum or Superconductors
Time limit: 11th August 3302 @ 15:00 UTC

Current Contributors: 4,431
Current Global Progress: 4,044,092 tonnes collected
Current Reward Tier: 3/8
Current Global Reward: None listed

Current Participation Rewards:
Top 4 CMDRs: 16,800,000 CR
Top 10%: 10,080,000 CR
Top 25%: 6,720,000 CR
Top 50%: 4,200,000 CR
Top 75%: 2,100,000 CR
Top 99%: 200,000CR

 

[Deareim]

Ticket must have been opened by jealous one that usually participate into CG but not that time. Robrigo style.

And I am reading all the time on this forum "Game is not about credits".

 

[nosleepdemon]

Wah wah some people are having fun at a video game and didn't have to suffer through the stages of early adoption like I did. Goddamn the level of entitlement from some people here. Spoiled brats the lot of you.

Meanwhile, as a Fed who didn't participate, enjoy your new toys CMDRs.

Seriously if you have to complain about someone else making more money than you in a goddamn video game, you should just uninstall and go get some sun.

Have any of you bothered to postulate that perhaps it's intentional on FDev's part to bring us newer commanders up to par for when the aliens show up? Or should we just suffer in Vipers and Eagles? Kindly screw off with the salt. Robigo, Sothis, all of this exists for a flipping reason. You have to be daft if you expect us new players to catch up to 1.5 years of playtime when there's about to be a completely hostile element of gameplay that you elitist jerks didn't have to play through. But hey, guess the game should be no fun for me just because I bought it two months ago and not at release.

Calling out early adopters as entitled brats, now I've truly seen it all. No, no don't reply - you've not whipped yourself nearly enough times today for the right to speak. Shame. Shame! Also please don't disrespect the Viper, it's an excellent ship and is flown by many experienced (sorry, entitled) pilots from whom you could learn a thing or two. Your new Python isn't going to do a better job of protecting you than that Viper you suffered in, if you do not know how to fly it.

 

[Fendalton]

Gota say, the rewards are a bit excessive, but not for those who have been playing for a year+

For a new player then yes. I only got 132 Mill, but that's just 5% of my total assets.

 

[Devari]

Once again you just come across as
"I chose to do B rather than A but the people who chose A got more than me, and it is not fair."

No, it's that FD made a mistake with CG payouts for that particular CG, and players who happened to do a trivial task lasting less than 1 hour of gametime ended up with 100-200 million credits. Please actually read my posts if you want to respond to them. I get tired of repeating myself over and over again when someone can't even be bothered to read what I typed.

Come on, fix it, explain to us how you would balance that our to ensure same reward for same effort

Try reading my posts again. Thanks.

By rights, you should be against ALL CG on PRINCIPAL, not just the ones that you didn't get the reward for.

Again, could you maybe read my posts? Mmmmmkay?

 

[Soopyyy]

I've been playing since the Beta, I remember it taking months to make my first million credits. These days spending hours for a few million as a reward is not going to happen. It's simply not worth the effort considering how much can be made in a Corvette bounty hunting in the same time.

I think the payouts for this CG are fine. 100-200mil doesn't go far these days.

 

[Henkka77]

Umm.. wait, so someone actually made a ticket about those rewards??

Here, have some salt, now go and run to mommy.


Geez...

 

[Kershek]

My total assets were 90m after 300 hours of play. With this CG I got into the top 25% with a brand new AspE I just purchased. Now at 314m credits, I just more than tripled my assets. Wow.

Yes, I didn't gain a lot of money in 300 hours. I was having fun exploring, driving on planets, finding places to take screenshots, and doing other things that weren't counted in credits/hour. My stats are 54m in bounties, 6m in trading, 6m in mining, and 6m in exploration, with the rest in cash (that was right before I bought the AspE).

With a 221m infusion of cash, that cut out many, many hours of bounty grinding. Now I can try out the next ship on my list, the FAS, and go from there. Oh, wait, gotta grind Fed rep first, lol

 

[Vasious]

I get tired of repeating myself over and over again when someone can't even be bothered to read what I typed.



Try reading my posts again. Thanks.



Again, could you maybe read my posts? Mmmmmkay?

No. Please re-read my posts again.

I have this is what they say

That was never the issue, it's that the boss in my analogy walked into a specific floor of a building and rewarded those employees out of proportion to their work.

who is maybe making 1-2 million/hr in a Type 6 and sees another player with a similar ship and gameplay time suddenly make 100-200 million from 1 hour of participation in a CG? .

You need the ability to think logically combined with the ability to view the CG payout situation from the perspective of a player who is struggling to get 10 million from boring trade runs and will be quite discouraged to see certain players randomly handed 100-200 million for nearly no effort.

Which is exactly my point, there would have no expectation that they would make 100-200 million credits from 1 hour or less of work.

All players are playing the same game, grinding for credits at some rate that is set by the FD devs. FD is the "boss" in this analogy as FD has "chosen" (or made a mistake) where they are disproportionately rewarding some players for almost no work.

If there was any indication we could get 100-200 million for less than 1 hour of work, that would have been completely different if that was the "expectation" that FD set out in advance. .

No, I want it to be a reward that is proportional to work involved.

I am only making around 8 million/hr. Getting 100 million credits for under 1 hour of work is equivalent to 12 hours of boring Sothis runs. There is no way that is balanced where 1 hour of a CG is supposed to equate to 12 hours of long-range trading from Sothis.

The comparison gets even worse for a player making only 2 million/hr in a Type 6, that is equivalent to 50 hours of their regular gameplay. That is ridiculous no matter how you look at it.

Under 1 hour of "work" for 100 million credits is hardly what I would call "work".
.

I mean some people getting 200 million credits for less than 1 hour of "work" in the game and other players getting their usual earning of maybe 1 million credits trading in their T6 instead?

Particularly starting players for whom 100 million credits of "free" money would make a massive difference. It is far worse for FD to correct a bug than to allow some players to profit immensely for no particular reason, it's not like the CG participants "expected" that was going to be their payout.

So I ask again

How you would balance that our to ensure same reward for same effort

Pilot A trade 5000 tons, at 200 tons a run, at 1000 CR a ton for a profit of 5,000,000 CR away from a CG

Pilot B trade 5000 tons, at 200 tons a run, at 1000 CR a ton for a profit of 5,000,000 CR Plus 5,000,000 for Completing the CG

The only difference is the choice to participate in the CG or not, both are trading the exact same trade goods from station A to station B

You DEMAND that reward be proportional to effort, so how do you reconcile that?

When that is down to choice, just as it was YOUR CHOICE which I am sure you have complete agency over, not to join the CG on the 25th when you thought you could get more CR elsewhere.

By rights, you should be against ALL CG on PRINCIPAL, not just the ones that you didn't get the reward for.

 

[_Fissure]

No, it's that FD made a mistake with CG payouts for that particular CG, and players who happened to do a trivial task lasting less than 1 hour of gametime ended up with 100-200 million credits. Please actually read my posts if you want to respond to them. I get tired of repeating myself over and over again when someone can't even be bothered to read what I typed.



Try reading my posts again. Thanks.



Again, could you maybe read my posts? Mmmmmkay?

Any mistake made on the part of the Dev's that benefits the players should remain. That's how I've seen just about every other gaming company do it, and they are doing a hell of a better job at managing their communities and creating content than FD is.

Honestly, I don't think there was a "mistake" at all. I guarantee that this is the result of whiny, self-entitled players flooding FD with tickets after the completion of the CG and now, in typical FD style, FD is considering cutting off their nose to spite their face.

If this goes through, and FD revokes player's CG rewards, I am going to send them a ticket about the precious gem CG every single day just to make a point. I didn't get to participate in that CG, where the profits were ridiculous and "broken," but at the same time you never saw me crying about it. Why you ask? Because how many credits another CMDR has in their bank account doesn't impact my enjoyment of the game in any way, shape, or form. It is simply infantile how much people on this forum care about the way others play the game, and simply insane what many player's perception of "unfair" seems to be. The only people who get this worked up over how others play the game and make their credits are self-righteous busybodies.

I thought that an older gaming community would be better than this. The degree to which people care about other players Cr balances is hysterical college freshman levels of insanity.

 

[A. C. Dobro VI]

Calling out early adopters as entitled brats, now I've truly seen it all. No, no don't reply - you've not whipped yourself nearly enough times today for the right to speak. Shame. Shame! Also please don't disrespect the Viper, it's an excellent ship and is flown by many experienced (sorry, entitled) pilots from whom you could learn a thing or two. Your new Python isn't going to do a better job of protecting you than that Viper you suffered in, if you do not know how to fly it.

>Meanwhile, as a Fed who didn't participate, enjoy your new toys CMDRs.

My new Python is non-existent, but nice proving my point at how the older players are condescending when it comes to the new blood. Yeah it took you guys months for your first million. Reality check: because the game sucked balls at first. And I can fly my Viper real well, but nice typical elitist assumptions.

 

[Devari]

I have gained 138M in less than an hour yesterday, I'm happy but I feel a little uncomfortable...
290M in almost 300 hours of playing, 1M per hour, I never took advantage of an exploit or bug
Now 138M in less than an hour... I feel like I broke my way of playing...

My total assets were 90m after 300 hours of play. With this CG I got into the top 25% with a brand new AspE I just purchased. Now at 314m credits, I just more than tripled my assets. Wow.

Yes, I didn't gain a lot of money in 300 hours. I was having fun exploring, driving on planets, finding places to take screenshots, and doing other things that weren't counted in credits/hour. My stats are 54m in bounties, 6m in trading, 6m in mining, and 6m in exploration, with the rest in cash (that was right before I bought the AspE).

So we have two players, each with around 300 hours playtime, who had 290 million and 94 million each during those first 300 hours. That works out to 1 mil/hr for the first player and 300k/hr for the second player during their first 300 hours of gameplay. Now after spending under 1 hour contributing to a CG and getting a buggy reward, they have each made 138 million and 221 million. In a SINGLE hour.

And I actually need to explain to anyone why this type of a bug causes a massive game balance problem for players?