General / Off-Topic My OS is better than your OS

Just been watching some Mat chat episodes on youtube (check out his review of Elite),in this
one he is talking about a mainframe system called Plato and some of multiplayer games that
could be played on it in the mid 1970.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5k_QQV9sj4I

Heres the link to the vid of space sim he mentions in his vid.

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/2179119/spasim_the_first_3d_massive_multiplayer_online_game/


I never heared of the system and Iam just amazed to think that these game ideas were nailed down in
70,normally I think of 1970s video games as being space invaders or asteroids.

I still like to dig my amiga out for games of

Alien breed 3d the killing ground http://hol.abime.net/3237

ufo http://hol.abime.net/1789

Napalm http://hol.abime.net/938

Syndicate http://hol.abime.net/2249
 
^_^

I maintain OpenGL is OpenGL, that is, it's a standard. If it's made for the PS3, a Linux port should be seriously considered..

even if the set of GL extensions don't match up with whatever's in dx10 or dx11, the aim isn't to be "as pretty", elite games have never been about teh pretty, they've been about elegance. So if the shaders a different level, or anisotropy costs more GPU, or SDL doesn't have the same depth of sound offerings, it'd be a great feat, and pave the way for an easy Mac port... and vice verse, assuming there's a Mac version, since Macs are OpenGL too. (as well as unix-based)

Especially considering the depth and complexity in Elite IV, and the parallel depth in Linux, bound to attract a compatible market of players. Everybody wins. ;)

that's my vote. Don't hate.

Cheers,
 
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Speaking for a developement point of view the game should be made for PC and ps3 at the same time, then ported to 360 from the Pc build as an xbox is a stripped down pc. Ps3 because of it's unusual architecture requires more attention than a simple port to do it right plus the ps3 like the PC is capable of Large online networking where the xbox sadly isn't
 
I thought this was as good a thread as any to pick up the console vs PC discussion...

DraQ said:
•:insert obligatory rant about consoles ruining the quality of gaming by catering for people who are too dumb to play any game requiring one or more functional brain cell and have too short attention span to play games longer than four hours here:

I would have to disagree with you on that call (other than it being essentially identical to Dangerous1's call). I've had some of my best gaming experiences on consoles and I don't think that the games themselves have been dumbed down at all.

You have to remember that the majority of computer games are either of an ASWD + mouse configuration and any extended functionality is through the function keys or numerical keys barring perhaps 'I' for inventory and 'M' for map and 'F' to use and 'R' to reload or joystick controlled (or gamepad anyway) which is a moot point. Between the 16 odd buttons on an XBOX 360 controller or a PS3 controller, there is plenty of scope for equal functionality, and in many cases significantly better functionality.

Some of the games that have really made an impression on me as a PS2 gamer were the likes of:
Wipeout - The entire series really - wonderful games and as far as racing games go - fundamentally the same whether they be on a console or on a PC - generally better

Gran Turismo - Epically great series of games and still acknowledged as the greatest racing series out so far - not to mention it's constantly pushing the boundaries of hardware capability and the end result is often better than what you could get on a PC.

Ace Combat - Granted this is an arcade flight sim but it sure was pretty - it never aimed to the lofty heights of the MS Flight Sim series but visually at the time it was brilliant.

Metal Gear Solid - Wonderful story telling, stunningly immersive and cleverly mapped on the controller. This was a brilliantly deep game that roped me in for hours and all sat in front of my TV and Playstation.

Final Fantasy VII - The daddy of all grand production RPGs and it showed - what a world, what a game! I can't believe how many hours I spent latched in front of my TV playing this - stunning game and not at all less for being on a console.

Grand Theft Auto - Vice City - What do I need to say about this game - just perfect and perfectly playable on a console. Again this killed both my social life and had me living on curries from the corner shop for weeks on end. Not to mention having one of the best game soundtracks of all time.

Others? - ICO, Silent Hill, Tekkan, Resident Evil, SOCOM Navy Seals, Time Splitters, Soul Calibur,

Now there are some genres which I agree whole heartedly should never have attempted to make the transition to console. The like of Starcraft, Command & Conquer, Warcraft, Doom, Quake and pretty much any other first person shooter. Granted there has been some semi successes like Killzone for the PS2 but if I'm being honest they never had the flow of playing an FPS on a PC. As great as the games look on a console the lack of accuracy from playing with a controller was (in my opinion) a bit of a killer.

In my mind consoles are just as capable a gaming machine as the vast majority of computers out there, and if we're being entirely honest better than. They are massively cheaper than the average gaming computer and often more capable and infinitely more stable.

I'm fundamentally a PC gamer and I've spent the money to have a machine that's capable of playing the majority of games out there at a decent framerate with most settings at max and it has stayed that way for the last 12-18 months. Games haven't been advancing enough to make me want to upgrade so my investment has lasted a really decent amount of time.

Like I've said before - I understand why games houses prefer to make games for consoles and why the PC gaming market is stagnating a little and I believe that if Elite 4 came out on console only, I'd still buy it and find some way to convince the missus that I need a really big HD LCD TV to boot but I'd prefer not to. I'd prefer to have it on my PC and I'd prefer to have it moddable and have the longevity that such games enjoy (like Halflife etc) but I'd understand if it weren't.
 

Sir.Tj

The Moderator who shall not be Blamed....
Volunteer Moderator
I think it's a case of "horses for courses" when it comes to the PC Vs Console debate. games designed for the PC tend to use the full functionality of the controls avaliable i.e the keyboard & mouse where the Console has the joypad restricting the number of options.

Graphically theres not a huge amount between them (I think) not having had a latest generation of console I can't fully comment, but the advantage consoles have over the PC is the games are designed to be run on a set platform, where the PC can have a vast range of graphics cards and memory configurations. which for the end user means a continual process of upgrading I've just done this myself which when you add it up can cost as much as a console. of course the PC is not designed as solely a games machine where the console primarily is.

As for GTA Vice city, wasted many many hours on that game, perfectly suited for the console, I played GTA4 on the PC and it wasn't the same.
 
I think it's a case of "horses for courses" when it comes to the PC Vs Console debate. games designed for the PC tend to use the full functionality of the controls avaliable i.e the keyboard & mouse where the Console has the joypad restricting the number of options.

I dunno, the games where you regularily use the full gamut of controlls on a computer are few and far between. Typically, in my experience, it's been the hardcore simulators like DCS Black Shark, LOMAC or Flight Simulator X.

Even games like the X series or EVE Online which are fiercely complicated don't have a huge range of keyboard controlls that can't be mapped to a joystick. When I play Flight Simulator X I rarely touch the keyboard at all.
 

Sir.Tj

The Moderator who shall not be Blamed....
Volunteer Moderator
I'll bow down to superior knowledge on this. :D

To be honest I don't play a wide enough range of games to give a definitive answer, I tend to play FFE (of course!!) and first person games which used the mouse and keyboard control method, which I find very easy to control the game.

I'll have to try someting like COD4 on a console to see the difference between the platforms.
 
I'll bow down to superior knowledge on this. :D

To be honest I don't play a wide enough range of games to give a definitive answer, I tend to play FFE (of course!!) and first person games which used the mouse and keyboard control method, which I find very easy to control the game.

I'll have to try someting like COD4 on a console to see the difference between the platforms.

Heh - I haven't played COD4 in aaages - I can't imagine that it would be much fun on a console when compared to a PC - it's a very rapid game.
 
You have to remember that the majority of computer games are either of an ASWD + mouse configuration and any extended functionality is through the function keys or numerical keys barring perhaps 'I' for inventory and 'M' for map and 'F' to use and 'R' to reload or joystick controlled (or gamepad anyway) which is a moot point. Between the 16 odd buttons on an XBOX 360 controller or a PS3 controller, there is plenty of scope for equal functionality, and in many cases significantly better functionality.
And, if the game uses mouse on the PC, significantly worse functionality. There is a reason why console FPS games tend to have autoaim and why PC FPS games lost this feature about the same time the joys of unrestricted mouselook were introduced.

Ace Combat - Granted this is an arcade flight sim but it sure was pretty - it never aimed to the lofty heights of the MS Flight Sim series but visually at the time it was brilliant.
Ah yes, it's all visuals these days.

The problem with consoles is that they often trade capacity and flexibility for improved visual performance, so the games look pretty on them, run well, but tend to be small and limited in scope. Then, the technology marches on and the PC games become even prettier while remaining bigger and generally leave the console titles in the dust - unless they happen to be multiplatform titles that with tiny levels, blurry textures, poor optimization and unresponsive controls. Bonus points if they are multiplatform sequels to PC games.

Final Fantasy VII - The daddy of all grand production RPGs and it showed - what a world, what a game! I can't believe how many hours I spent latched in front of my TV playing this - stunning game and not at all less for being on a console.
I could have a field day with that. I don't intend to diss jRPGs, as liking them is generally matter of taste. It does however make me die a little on the inside, and feel nerdrage rising whenever I hear something like the phrase in bold.
I mean, whiskey tango foxtrot! :mad:
I know that Japanese, for some obscure reason call those games "RPGs", but they bear little similarity to "proper" (western) RPGs that arose form the PnP, obviously don't belong to the same genre and to implicate that they are the RPGs is obvious lunacy.
What about stuff like Infinity Engine games (BG series, PS:T), Fallout 1 & 2, TES 2 & 3, Wizardry series? PnP RPGs were basically interactive adventures with stats, and this should apply to their computer counterparts - games with linear, if elaborate storyline and simplistic mechanics simply don't belong. They are not any more RPGs than Starcraft would be an FPS if it's makers insisted on calling it that. They should be called jRPGs, or, if you're sufficiently jaded, JPGs, as - be they fun or not - you don't play a role there any more than you do in DOOM (you're stuck with an established character and can't influence their development in any meaningful way) and they are about as interactive as the popular graphics file format.

Now, to explain my perspective a bit better:

Consoles are particularly well suited for casual games - they are simple, easy to use, are often played on a couch, often make playing a social event, etc. This means that they attract casual gamers and here is our problem - casual gamers like casual games, the ones that are simple, don't require prolonged attention, and the ones that are easy. Complexity, challenge and depth are a nemesis to the casual gamers, this is seen in how post-Morrowind TES series evolved - from intriguing, original diverse world, into bloom-tastic, simplified carbon copy generic fantasy crap, with blurry textures and overt level scaling. This is seen in how Deus Ex went form brilliant cyberpunk thriller to diluted, dumbed down claustrophobic crap with purty graphics.
Hardcore PC gamers have every reason for distrust and hostility towards console gaming.

P.S.
If you like the JPGs, you should play Anachronox. Brilliant, PC western-made game that nevertheless belongs to the genre. Great storyline and humour worthy of late Douglas Adams himself.
 
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It is a pertinant point though, what OS or formats do you think Elite 4 will or should be released on and what are the implications arising from that?

i've heard it said, that if you program something right [correctly] from the start, it's no bother to port it to other systems... and the way frontier are, i kinda expect no less from them.

having said that,
being someone who has pretty much stopped playing all other games in anticipation of elite4, (though i do play the various questionable-legitimatacy FFE versions to keep me sane) because frankly, FFE has still never been beat by any game yet,
and being someone who has almost completely removed microsoft from their life,
i'll be somewhat irate and really miffed if i cant play it on linux.
wine will reluctantly do,
but i'd prefer a native linux port.
and why the heck not?
i reckon thats where a lot of elite/frontier/ffe fanboys are, because we have good taste. ;) ;)


linux please!


:)


much love.
 
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