No Single Player offline Mode then?

xxThe_Dice_manxx · Nov 16, 2014

stimutacs said:
Would you say it's people pointing out

* how desperate FD were for kickstarter funds, and how much offline backers contributed to getting the project funded at all

* how recently they lied about offline being available, and how long this went on, for years

* how wrong the idea that this is somehow "not DRM" is, and how undeliverable that promise is

* how unsuitable a persistent always-on connection is for people who can just "play solo", only they can't, actually, chum

* how feeble the justification for using the cloud seems to be, standing tall over such classic lines as EAs "oh no, simcity 5 couldn't possibly let you buy power from a neighboring city without the power of the cloud™" or major nelson's "they can't just flip a switch"

which of those would you say rattles you the most? Is it more a gestalt of all those and so much more?

None of them ,what rattles me the most is how low a person will go over a game which retails at 40 quid or something.

rich_hard1 · Nov 16, 2014

Nice! Level playing field, full focus on online play, no more money glitches!

Nice work FD! Now please fix the bugs in time for December

FX2K · Nov 16, 2014

rumtruffle said:
strikes me as sheer laziness in that they couldnt be bothered to create an ai controlled economy etc
i hate multiplayer. i bought this game thinking it would have singleplayer offline based on what the devs had previously stated.

if i cannot connect to the servers to play my solo game on launch day or therafter i will ask for an immediate refund.

Many games suffer on launch day, even if offline was going to be a thing there could still be the potential issues of authenticating...
Asking for an immediate refund due to launch day hiccups is a bit extreme don't you think?

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rich_hard1 said:
Nice! Level playing field, full focus on online play, no more money glitches!

Nice work FD! Now please fix the bugs in time for December

How many online games have you played?

Ill just leave this here as an example:
2013 - http://allhackersnews.com/2013/12/rampant-money-hacking-ruining-gta-online.html
2014 - http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/gta-5-onli...ollars-weapons-players-via-money-mods-1465620

light487 · Nov 16, 2014

xxThe_Dice_manxx said:
"meaningful and mature way"

This went out the window a long time ago ,what we have now are trolls who want to destroy this game and are delighted about it.

Simply untrue. I came into this thread later than others and have discussed the issue I have with the decision and the feeling that I am not completely mortified by always online but instead that there won't be a way to not have data synced from the multiplayer. I've been reasonable in my expectations, mature in my comments and open to counter arguments.

If anyone is trolling it is you, based on the last few comments you've made in this thread.

stephen_usher · Nov 16, 2014

fandango said:
Oh dear, it's all gone a bit 'Godus'...

It could never bet *THAT* bad!

We've not had a lack of interaction from Frontier for six months after the game went Beta for a start.

Warrick Ambrose · Nov 16, 2014

I am utterly disappointed and quite disgruntled by FDs decision and behaviour.

I would not have given them 100 GBP (and bought a new PC and Joystick) if ED had been announced as a pure Online-Game. I want to be able to play when I want to - regardless whether the servers are down or not.

I bought several skins (although I think they are overpriced and not very well made) to support the team and development further and I was willing to do so in future. Well, that will not happen anymore. FD won't see a single penny from me until they deliver an acceptable Offline-Version. Simple as that.

ThatFuzzyTiger · Nov 16, 2014

FX2K said:
Many games suffer on launch day, even if offline was going to be a thing there could still be the potential issues of authenticating...
Asking for an immediate refund due to launch day hiccups is a bit extreme don't you think?

If offline was a thing you wouldn't need to authenticate, so this would be a moot discussion. Offline by nature means aside from the initial registration check to confim you -own- the game, you can then play in peace, which most of us have done. Whereas with everything being persistently online, I'll give you three guesses what the potential outcomes are. You can take one quick look at Simcity and Diablo 3 for the last fantastic examples of a singleplayer game mandating a persistent online connection. It wasn't pretty. If most people are stuck staring at a login screen on the 16th, they'll be ... well, mildly unhappy to say the least.

Bloomster · Nov 16, 2014

Maybe I am missing the point but what is the big deal about having to connect to a server to login and play a game? Does your Antivirus software not already login and update to the internet, are you working away from the internet at most times? Do you not need an interenet connection to keep the game up to date? do you not need an internet connection to discuss topics on the boards? I personally don't see a problem with a model that has the Solo play for those single player minded and an open play for those that want it. Maybe i missed the point further back in the 274 pages but if you don't have an internet connection nowadays then your PC is useless. Mountains and molehills comes to mind.

Keep going Dev's you are doing a great job! look how far we have come in the past two months. Gameplay content is where the devs should be spending their time not creating multiple games.

enbeekay · Nov 16, 2014

The thing about sim city was it didnt have a huge public beta before they launched and they severely underestimated the server load...with the numerous alphas and betas you'd expect frontier to have a better handle on it.

jamotide · Nov 16, 2014

Bloomster said:
Maybe I am missing the point but what is the big deal about having to connect to a server to login and play a game?

If its no big deal, why did they specifically promise us that that wont be necessary? Why are the pledge rewards literally called "DRM free" meaning no always online DRM either.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Always-on_DRM

Ref Minor · Nov 16, 2014

It will be interesting to see FD response tomorrow, I am sure it will affect many peoples decision whether to go for a refund or not.

I hope FD re-evaluate the cost of this decision. Goodwill is an actual thing, it is measured by accountants.

Skeloton · Nov 16, 2014

Kerrash said:
Closing the thread would only serve to add fuel to the argument of unfair censorship.
Everyone is welcome to discuss this topic in a open, meaningful and mature way.

Shame some have deemed that my mature, open and meaning comments mean nothing, or have gone out of their way to make me that way.

SJT · Nov 16, 2014

C Wusher said:
I don't get the whole thing with the timeline.

Imagine the following:

*knock knock*
MB: Yes?
Dev: Hi Michael, we got a problem.
MB: One more ...
Dev: Yes, we just discovered, that we put too many features onto the server side.
MB: That means?
Dev: We basically cant offer an offline mode.

So Michael, you really want to tell us, that you noticed the offline mode wasn't doable just right now?

What's the job of a producer? Please enlight me.

I wonder what the minutes of their monthly dev meetings are like:

Jun - MB: How's offline coming? Dev: Yeah, we're looking at it.
Jul - MB: Got anywhere with offline yet? Dev: Yeah, we're doing it.
Aug - MB: About offline.. Dev: We have a handle on it boss.
Sep - MB: How's offline coming? Dev: It's sorted. Leave it to me.
Oct - MB: I'm getting a bit concerned about offline. Dev: Don't worry, we have it covered
Nov - MB: Do you have offline finished yet? Dev: Off what?

synchromesh · Nov 16, 2014

If you know how costly this is, why didn't Frontier know and ditch the offline idea from the start?

Perhaps they had an idea of just doing a mini universe......Stand alone version like Frontier on a DVD or a digital download....with the option just to connect to the net like other Multiplayer games .....

I would love an offline version but sometimes things just don't work out even with the most honest best of intentions....
For years many of us dreamed of playing Elite online so at least we are finally there....

If FD did do a kickstarter for a single offline version like frontier I would be in !!
Just another edition to collect

ToddlerfromHell · Nov 16, 2014

Stormfish said:
Offline gaming is so last century, hardly the end of the world. Quit complaining and be grateful they're trying their best to get a good balanced online game.

Be grateful? What load of nonsense!
We are paying good money for a product they are offering. You bet they'd have to "try their best".
(Bold by me for emphasis)

You'd be better off griping about it being a 32 bit engine and not exploiting the power of modern hardware (i.e. should be a 64 bit build).

Actually, there are probably very good reasons why they stick to 32 bit, porting being up there on the list.

-Toddler

FX2K · Nov 16, 2014

ThatFuzzyTiger said:
If offline was a thing you wouldn't need to authenticate, so this would be a moot discussion. Offline by nature means aside from the initial registration check to confim you -own- the game, you can then play in peace, which most of us have done. Whereas with everything being persistently online, I'll give you three guesses what the potential outcomes are. You can take one quick look at Simcity and Diablo 3 for the last fantastic examples of a singleplayer game mandating a persistent online connection. It wasn't pretty. If most people are stuck staring at a login screen on the 16th, they'll be ... well, mildly unhappy to say the least.

I don't disagree... I wanted offline for my own reasons, nothing really to do with internet connection.
The point was, the initial registration check could also have been a potential issue for an offline mode on launch day... Something most people would accept (complain about perhaps but accept) and not demand a refund immediately for.

Sylv3r · Nov 16, 2014

Bloomster said:
Maybe I am missing the point but what is the big deal about having to connect to a server to login and play a game? Does your Antivirus software not already login and update to the internet, are you working away from the internet at most times? Do you not need an interenet connection to keep the game up to date? do you not need an internet connection to discuss topics on the boards? I personally don't see a problem with a model that has the Solo play for those single player minded and an open play for those that want it. Maybe i missed the point further back in the 274 pages but if you don't have an internet connection nowadays then your PC is useless. Mountains and molehills comes to mind.

Keep going Dev's you are doing a great job! look how far we have come in the past two months. Gameplay content is where the devs should be spending their time not creating multiple games.

You have missed two point i will explain :
- First is that not all people have a good internet everywhere .. many have a bad connection. The game dont need only a connection for authentification, it need a permanent connection even in solo mode, cause all transactions (traden missions and all ) are on some other servers.
- Second that lead on the DRM way.
Browse back and you wiil find it.
For your support part i agree fully, ED is doing a very nice work and that why there are many emotions in this thread.

stimutacs · Nov 16, 2014

Bloomster said:
Maybe I am missing the point but what is the big deal about having to connect to a server to login and play a game? Does your Antivirus software not already login and update to the internet, are you working away from the internet at most times? Do you not need an interenet connection to keep the game up to date? do you not need an internet connection to discuss topics on the boards? I personally don't see a problem with a model that has the Solo play for those single player minded and an open play for those that want it. Maybe i missed the point further back in the 274 pages but if you don't have an internet connection nowadays then your PC is useless. Mountains and molehills comes to mind.

Keep going Dev's you are doing a great job! look how far we have come in the past two months. Gameplay content is where the devs should be spending their time not creating multiple games.

For me the issue is that their server is on the opposite side of the planet, they have no plans to bring online other, closer ones, and over 20,000 something km of cable across the entirety of the pacific, north america, and the atlantic, I can end up with something operating at 3500ms lag with loads of loss. Plus, you know, the ditching of the no DRM promise, the ditching of the offline play promise, the removal of any possibility of messing around with cheats or mods, not even being able to pause, etc.

Essentially I now feel like I have signed up for the world's crappiest MMO, with all of the drawbacks of such, and practically none of the most basic gameplay or even housekeeping systems one could expect from one of those in 2014. I mean. I wouldn't even pay for a good one of those!

I remain hopeful though. Bigger ships than this have been turned around. EA got rolled. Sony got rolled. Microsoft got rolled. I am pretty sure it is conceptually possible to knock sense into FD at some point.

Solei · Nov 16, 2014

PIXEL said:
It's such a shame this is happening.. ^^

While Im here writing does anyone fancy a Kickstarter campaign to raise a few quid for a purely offline version of Elite Dangerous? - No promises tho (-:

Even better, let's have a chat with the author behind space engine. That engine already have many different galaxies, based on procedural generation, where everything is seamless right down to each and every object:

Video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mootV7Iqa34
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSH8zkAIosE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t3H6nPvC-PQ#t=14

Download:
http://en.spaceengine.org/

stephen_usher · Nov 16, 2014

Bloomster said:
Maybe I am missing the point but what is the big deal about having to connect to a server to login and play a game? Does your Antivirus software not already login and update to the internet, are you working away from the internet at most times? Do you not need an interenet connection to keep the game up to date? do you not need an internet connection to discuss topics on the boards? I personally don't see a problem with a model that has the Solo play for those single player minded and an open play for those that want it. Maybe i missed the point further back in the 274 pages but if you don't have an internet connection nowadays then your PC is useless. Mountains and molehills comes to mind.

Keep going Dev's you are doing a great job! look how far we have come in the past two months. Gameplay content is where the devs should be spending their time not creating multiple games.

To re-iterate what has been pointed out previously, which you've probably missed, the game client, even in solo on-line mode, almost constantly needs to talk to the servers. The off-line solo mode would not have needed to do this at all, hence you could still play if you were not able to have an Internet connection.