No Single Player offline Mode then?

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Promised? While I appreciate the annoyance I yet again have to go back to the fact that this is not a commission. This is not a pre-order. This was you electing to put your money behind a developer because you believed in their vision for the game. At the time, they hoped to include it but have decided that it would negatively effect the product.

If it negatively effects the end product it should be removed. Period. Even if for whatever reason they decided their vision was to make it a console game that I couldn't play I would support it because that is their decision.

Would I request a refund? sure. But that's only because I bought it through their store, not kickstarter.

Kickstarting something implies you trust the developer to do what's best for the end product. Even if it isn't the best for you.

Promised, "committed to", take your pick... but it definitely was not billed as "hope to". They matter of factly stated that this would be available, not predicated on "hope"!

As for Kickstarter, I don't know (or care frankly) about the legal position, their FAQ says -

What is a creator obligated to do once their project is funded?

When a project is successfully funded, the creator is responsible for completing the project and fulfilling each reward. Their fundamental obligation to backers is to finish all the work that was promised. Once a creator has done so, they’ve fulfilled their obligation to their backers. At the same time, backers must understand that Kickstarter is not a store. When you back a project, you’re helping to create something new — not ordering something that already exists. There’s a chance something could happen that prevents the creator from being able to finish the project as promised. If a creator is absolutely unable to complete the project and fulfill rewards, they must make every reasonable effort to find another way of bringing the project to a satisfying conclusion for their backers.

I would expect a company wishing to maintain integrity to voluntarily do so, whether absolutely legally required to or not.
 
From the man itself or, from the horse's mouth:
brokenpromise_zpsb296a5e0.jpg

Funny how things can change, isn't it? Just look what happened to the Tokyo Stadium! Plans are one thing, reality is another, nobody's perfect ;)
 
I don't believe we'll see planetary landings happen. I sincerely hope I'm proved wrong, because I want it so bad, but when I consider the obstacles.... it just doesn't look very likely. Walking around your ship.... very achievable. Walking around spacestations.... also very achievable, but meaningful content is going to be an issue. Landing on planets, walking around terrain and cities.... I'm struggling to see it.

I don't know, GTA series of games always did a good job of making me feel like I was in a living city, NMS have shown us what PG planetary landscapes, complete with wildlife and vegetation and dynamic weather might look like, as for things to do, I'd be happy to park my eagle, by a lake gab a fishing rod and catch some fish, while I watch the binary suns set, and two or three moons come up
 
Pretty clear answer from almost 1000 Beta backers, when questions in poll are put right (and there is no outsiders such SC/EvE fanboys messing up voting):

(A) I can't ever play without Offline Mode (internet is unavailable or very intermittent)
34 3.62%

(A) I can't play sometimes without Offline Mode (internet only available sometimes)
71 7.57%

(A) I can play most of the time without Offline Mode (occasional lack of reliable internet)
76 8.10%

(A) I don't need Offline Mode now, but want it for when the servers are switched-off
267 28.46%

(A) I'd like Offline Mode, but can live without it
191 20.36%

(A) I don't care about Offline Mode.
334 35.61%

(B) Offline Mode can be a completely unchanging galaxy (static markets, missions, stations, etc)
270 28.78%

(B) Offline Mode NEEDS to have randomly changing markets, but otherwise can be unchanging
178 18.98%

(B) Offline Mode NEEDS to allow updates (once a month) to stay in sync with the multiplayer galaxy
109 11.62%

(B) Offline Mode NEEDS to have almost all features of multiplayer galaxy (likely impossible!)
44 4.69%

The people who spend most of their time offline (like me) won't have replied to the online poll (like me) therefore the responses are skewed. I want offline, I thought I was promised offline, so now I'm sad
 
Given they had planetary landings in Frontier: Elite II in October 1993, they can certainly do it in Elite: Dangerous in 2015.

Im pretty sure its just as easy to do a green ball representing a planet you can just land on and see nothing but a 1-2 color horizon now as well, But I don't think thats what we want in a game this modern, Do you even think?
 
Given they had planetary landings in Frontier: Elite II in October 1993, they can certainly do it in Elite: Dangerous in 2015.

OK, I'll say it - we had an offline galaxy that didn't need always-on DRM and other players mucking everything up in Frontier: Elite II in October 1993. ;)

But, see what a broken promise & disrespect shown does to a company's reputation? Now everything is open to question, scrutiny, and doubt.
 
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Given they had planetary landings in Frontier: Elite II in October 1993, they can certainly do it in Elite: Dangerous in 2015.

They had a huge dynamic galaxy on a stand-along machine then as well.

EDITED TO ADD:

A guy in a backroom using Dark Basic did a pretty good job with Evochron Mercenary. It shouldn't be too hard to get planetary landings as in Frontier.
 
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Promised, "committed to", take your pick... but it definitely was not billed as "hope to". They matter of factly stated that this would be available, not predicated on "hope"!

As for Kickstarter, I don't know (or care frankly) about the legal position, their FAQ says -



I would expect a company wishing to maintain integrity to voluntarily do so, whether absolutely legally required to or not.

Honestly? you are picking and choosing,

"What is a creator obligated to do once their project is funded?

When a project is successfully funded, the creator is responsible for completing the project and fulfilling each reward. Their fundamental obligation to backers is to finish all the work that was promised. Once a creator has done so, they’ve fulfilled their obligation to their backers. At the same time, backers must understand that Kickstarter is not a store. When you back a project, you’re helping to create something new — not ordering something that already exists. There’s a chance something could happen that prevents the creator from being able to finish the project as promised. If a creator is absolutely unable to complete the project and fulfill rewards, they must make every reasonable effort to find another way of bringing the project to a satisfying conclusion for their backers. "

For them, offline mode is not something they can include to bring the project to a satisfying conclusion. Cutting it is how they are abiding to the kickstarter rules for the majority of their backers
 
There are to many lawyer in this world.


Don't worry, they are being thinned down by scientists using them for experiments instead of lab rats. They have found that the scientists get less attached to the lawyers and that there are things that you can't even get a rat to do.

Sorry, just trying to lighten the mood a bit (and yes, I am actually a lawyer !!!)
 
The people who spend most of their time offline (like me) won't have replied to the online poll (like me) therefore the responses are skewed. I want offline, I thought I was promised offline, so now I'm sad

I did not find out about the offline thing until Sunday evening, because I was (shock horror!) offline, away from an internet connection, from Friday afternoon to Sunday afternoon.
 
Funny how things can change, isn't it? Just look what happened to the Tokyo Stadium! Plans are one thing, reality is another, nobody's perfect ;)

On that note, why are you in this process? Think about the point that got you to pull the trigger and lay down your money.
Braben: Sorry, we coded and coded and we have to drop that feature.
You: WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAT!!!!!
Me: LOL things change. Suck it up. bro! trolololol.
 
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Oh it's quite possible with good PG.

As you say though, the issue (like with stations) will be the content... and I suspect you may be right. I'll believe it when I see it. This whole episode has harmed FD in ways I don't think they're even aware of yet.
Yeah, I've seen plenty of PG content. I don't dispute that content-generation is possible. As we both mention, it's the meaningful content (and diversity - how diverse are space station interiors currently?) that will be the issue. And the technical challenges of real-time atmospheric entry.
 
From what I understand about FDEV justifications: it's not impossible to do it, but impractical, costly in terms of time and money, and would hurt the development process of the core of the game: its online dimension. It seems it could also be a breach for exploits, cheating and piracy.
 
I don't believe we'll see planetary landings happen. I sincerely hope I'm proved wrong, because I want it so bad, but when I consider the obstacles.... it just doesn't look very likely. Walking around your ship.... very achievable. Walking around spacestations.... also very achievable, but meaningful content is going to be an issue. Landing on planets, walking around terrain and cities.... I'm struggling to see it.

I can imagine them pulling it off, if it's done in stages and not in a single expansion. "Landing on planets" doesn't have to mean "Walking around on planets" right away. It could go something like this:

DLC expansion #1: Walking around on your ship, and in station hangers, and whatever else they can squeeze in, like hanging out in bars to get BB assignments as an option to the in-ship method.

DLC expansion #2: Transition from orbit to atmospheric flight, flying over the planet surface and landing at a surface station. Walking around in the planet-side stations but not outdoors (i.e the identical thing they've already developed for orbital stations). Discovery of basic alien life, artifacts etc. by flying over and scanning the surface with your ship, but no actual walking around except inside surface stations.

DLC expansion #3: Walking around on the surface of planets on foot, elaborating on the game mechanics developed in the first two expansions.


Spread that out over 2 years development time, and doesn't look like that massive a project. Remember that the scale of the project will be limited by the gravity parameters. You'll only be walking around on planets and moons where the gravity isn't too far from Earth-normal. But getting back to the current topic, this only works if FD learns how to communicate what they're actually selling to their customers, and not yanking features at the last minute after taking pre-orders and paid Beta access.
 
I can imagine them pulling it off, if it's done in stages and not in a single expansion. "Landing on planets" doesn't have to mean "Walking around on planets" right away. It could go something like this:

DLC expansion #1: Walking around on your ship, and in station hangers, and whatever else they can squeeze in, like hanging out in bars to get BB assignments as an option to the in-ship method.

DLC expansion #2: Transition from orbit to atmospheric flight, flying over the planet surface and landing at a surface station. Walking around in the planet-side stations but not outdoors (i.e the identical thing they've already developed for orbital stations). Discovery of basic alien life, artifacts etc. by flying over and scanning the surface with your ship, but no actual walking around except inside surface stations.

DLC expansion #3: Walking around on the surface of planets on foot, elaborating on the game mechanics developed in the first two expansions.


Spread that out over 2 years development time, and doesn't look like that massive a project. Remember that the scale of the project will be limited by the gravity parameters. You'll only be walking around on planets and moons where the gravity isn't too far from Earth-normal. But getting back to the current topic, this only works if FD learns how to communicate what they're actually selling to their customers, and not yanking features at the last minute after taking pre-orders and paid Beta access.
I've thought about this, and I'm still sceptical. But we'll see. I certainly hope they can do it.
 
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