No Single Player offline Mode then?

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Deleted member 47764

D
moonsword said:
What I see is that FD tries to listen and to deliver to the wishes and suggestions of its customers in a way I haven't seen it before.
Nothing emphasies this better than the DDF.
At least THEY are responsible for the quality of their product and therefore THEY need to decide if they need to change or decline a requirement and no one else.

If a promised feature of MANY already delivered promised features can not be deliverd because of technical reasons which were not feasible at the beginning but all the other features have already been deliverdy by the supplier and used by the customer, the supplier should have the right to decide how he treats this problem.

I am not a lawyer but for me there is no fraud by the supplier detectable.
The supplier was forced by technical reasons to change one of his promises or better say requirements of the product.
This is something usual and happens not even in companies but everywhere.
I do not see any sort of fraud or deception...
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They weren't forced to do anything, they made the game.

They made the decision early on to not include offline support, he states in clear text if you read the updated newsletter that it was a conscious decision.
 

Hermit

Hermit
Leo_Bartlet said:
This thread and discussion needs to be taken out back and shot, Its beyond parody now and Jumped the shark at around the 5k post mark.

644 pages and its just the rehashed arguments over and over.
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Not really a good idea with all the rage that's flowing. At least this thread is attempting to keep it focused here.
 

Warbler

W
Ref the David Hostetler posts on Kickstarter. Having looked at the Terms of Use that were applicable to FDEV, it looks like they don't have to commit to promises (offline mode). If the current Terms of Use were applicable they would have to or else provide compensation, but they are not. So this is a very serious issue of the kind that Kickstarted are now obviuosly aware of, but may need to be presented to a higher authority.

Edit
I have my own writings on the matter but being inexperienced at this kind of thing they may take some time to come to fruition.
 
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Papa Smurf

P
Vlodec said:
Most aren't getting a refund.

And have you considered that it's people like yourself who come into this thread purely to needle those who already feel aggrieved that ensures its longevity? Were you all to leave the thread would run out of steam in no time. But, call me a pessimist, that's not going to happen is it?
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The moment we are given a refund... I am gone Vlodec!
 

nexxo

N
Zieman said:
Yes, this was a given since the first Kickstarter enquiries about the offline mode. Empty & static like Elite/FE2/FFE - that would be completely acceptable, I would be surprised if anyone truly expected anything more.
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A lot of Beta testers did. And they moaned about it. That's the problem.

And people have a way of moving the goalposts. If Frontier did release an offline game with a static, empty galaxy, it would not take long before you'd get the grumbles: "Hey, the online galaxy has this and that feature, why can't the offline galaxy have that? I'm sure it could be done... Hey, the online galaxy gets preferential treatment over the offline one! That sucks! Frontier is trying to force us to play online!" etc.
 
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Jonbe54

J
Some of you people are truly funny.

My son is in the game design business as a script writer and I'm VERY aware of a lot of the mechanics and harsh realities of designing and implementing a viable commercial product because as an adult student I had to fund his - considerably - expensive education costs in a dedicated gaming college, so I took a very active interest in his courses and progress.

FIRSTLY promising a seperate offline game was IRRESPONSIBLE when you understand that the design and implementation process is an ongoing orgy of compromise and redirection that lasts for years.

SECONDLY having promised an offline game to that last wave of backers to get over the final funding hurdle they had a responsibility to HARD CODE that game into the procedural model ALL THE WAY THROUGH.

FINALLY FD and David Braben may well get away with their corporate rug pulling but the damage to the kickstarter reputation - which relies heavilly on investor confidence and the goodwill of the general public is currently taking a huge hit which will effect future potential kickstart projects and further play into the hands of the huge corporates who refuse to contemplate 'non-mainstream' funding.
 

Zuikaku

Z
I just can not help myself thinking that these hints about possible offline mode in the future are just another false promise an attempt to try to stop people from asking refunds. Few months after release, they might just say that there will be no offline since they are busy doing something else. I have backed the Elite and want to play it badly, at my pace and whenever I want (yes, that is offline solo) but I just find it hard to believe FDs now...

I guess there will be no refunds after release?
 

Papa Smurf

P
poet1960 said:
Please explain to me, how being online with a bunch of people, is somehow "better," than just playing a game offline? Why is it that people like you, automatically assume everyone wants, and must be required to play, the same way you do? Stuck in the 80's? You mean, play a game offline and have a blast playing by yourself for many many years?

Yeah, that sounds horrible. */sarcasm
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What really es me Peot1960 is that if the table was turned I would be support Online players if FD chose to remove that part of the game. Why because it is my believe that there is no need to BIBLETHUMP my way of playing on other players!!! The underling issue is not Online Player vs Offline players but FD choosing to pull this CRAP at the last moment after having our support and our cash almost 2 years !!!!!!!!!
 

Commander M.O.

Commander M.O.
Wow, just heard the news... I'm almost speechless.. Feels like I have been punched in the gut. I was really looking forward to having an offline version I could count on playing for years and years to come. Now, it's out of our hands. I certainly hope Mr. Braben makes good on his word that they would release the archived servers if they could not keep the game online.


I spent a lot of money on this game believing there would be some kind of offline version to ensure I could enjoy it however far into the future I chose to. BAH!

This is sad, sad news.
 

Zuikaku

Z
moonsword said:
What I see is that FD tries to listen and to deliver to the wishes and suggestions of its customers in a way I haven't seen it before.
Nothing emphasies this better than the DDF.
At least THEY are responsible for the quality of their product and therefore THEY need to decide if they need to change or decline a requirement and no one else.

If a promised feature of MANY already delivered promised features can not be deliverd because of technical reasons which were not feasible at the beginning but all the other features have already been deliverdy by the supplier and used by the customer, the supplier should have the right to decide how he treats this problem.

I am not a lawyer but for me there is no fraud by the supplier detectable.
The supplier was forced by technical reasons to change one of his promises or better say requirements of the product.
This is something usual and happens not even in companies but everywhere.
I do not see any sort of fraud or deception...
Click to expand...

This is not a feature. It is the way in which game can be played. this changes the nature of the game itself. A big difference.
 

Juniper

Juniper
Jonbe54 said:
Some of you people are truly funny.

My son is in the game design business as a script writer and I'm VERY aware of a lot of the mechanics and harsh realities of designing and implementing a viable commercial product because as an adult student I had to fund his - considerably - expensive education costs in a dedicated gaming college, so I took a very active interest in his courses and progress.

FIRSTLY promising a seperate offline game was IRRESPONSIBLE when you understand that the design and implementation process is an ongoing orgy of compromise and redirection that lasts for years.

SECONDLY having promised an offline game to that last wave of backers to get over the final funding hurdle they had a responsibility to HARD CODE that game into the procedural model ALL THE WAY THROUGH.

FINALLY FD and David Braben may well get away with their corporate rug pulling but the damage to the kickstarter reputation - which relies heavilly on investor confidence and the goodwill of the general public is currently taking a huge hit which will effect future potential kickstart projects and further play into the hands of the huge corporates who refuse to contemplate 'non-mainstream' funding.
Click to expand...

I said before that this whole episode will simply go down as a warning from history - with Frontier's name right at the top of it.

The damage to their reputation (and by proxy Kickstarter's, although I honestly fail to see why it is their fault) is pretty much irreparable. It doesn't matter how good E: D ends up being - people will remember that Frontier (and David Braben) took money under false pretences to get their project funded.

Whether that is actually true or not is largely irrelevant tbh, that's what people will end up remembering. You only have to mention SimCity or EA, or Diablo 3 and similar things come straight to mind.
 
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Deleted member 47764

D
Leo_Bartlet said:
Well if they wont refund you then take it a a cautionary tail that nostalgia shouldn't trump common sense.

This thread is nothing but a circular firing squad that long past any rational discussion or entertainment value, for many I suspect.
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Then don't read the thread, it doesn't have to be harder than that. At least you have a choice in your conundrum :)
 

Demosthien

D
I posted this in the refund thread but in case anyone here misses it (likely given how fast these threads move) I'm posting it here as well.

Demosthien said:
For those people in the UK looking to speak to someone in a legal capacity but without forking over boatloads of pounds.

You may join WHICH for a trial period by paying £1 and during that trial period you have access to their telephone legal advice service.

As WHICH is a consumer advocacy type group their lawyers are well placed to be able to give you advice on what you should be doing if you want a refund (I have posted links to some WHICH advice in this forum already).

Go, check it out... Pay your £1, get the trial and call their lawyer.

http://www.which.co.uk/about-which/what-we-offer/what-do-i-get-when-i-take-a-trial/#help-legaladvice
Click to expand...
 
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