Open PvE

[Robert Maynard]

Personally I am completely fine with a PVP and PVE mode customers/players should be able to play what they want. Switching between the 2 arbitrarily is wrong IMO. If you want to play PVP you should earn your credits and buy your ships in PVP. You should be forced to deal with the other griefers as you try to earn your way to the top in a dog eat dog PVP world. Playing in solo/PVE mode until you get a fully decked out battle ship then bringing it into PVP should not be an option. The two modes should have different saves.

There's a whole series of threads on the Solo vs Open vs Groups debate - here's the latest one. Please use that for comments on the three game modes and mode switching.

 

[Mouse]

With adequate cunning you can prevent from being a victim while remaining in open. If you don't carry the right weapons, there are absolute ways to escape without combat logging. I know. I've lived as a criminal for months on end and have had plenty of bounty hunters try and chase me down.

That's what is wonderful about Elite. If you have your wits about you and use your head, almost anything is possible.

So many take the easy path though--they go solo and that I feel is shortchanging yourself of an experience worth having.

And again.. you view anyone who doesn't think like you or play your way as wrong. Those that play solo are not shortchanging themselves, "THEY DON'T WANT THE EXPERIENCE YOU DO"

 

[Robert Maynard]

So many take the easy path though--they go solo and that I feel is shortchanging yourself of an experience worth having.

It's still their choice - and nobody else's - though.

 

[Dave1235]

Oh lately I've given up pirating. There aren't enough traders these days to make it worth my while. I kill for sport in small ships. It is a lot of fun and totally valid according to Braben's vision. As long as I don't grief (which I don't) it is well within the rules. Think of us as the "spice" of the galaxy. We add kick to an otherwise ho hum grind.

Did you never wonder why you are not seeing enough traders to make it worthwhile?

Carry on killing for sport, that will add to player retention in open I am sure.

 

[david6768]

Hi Hero

Back on the coward thing again, OFC you have no idea who you are adding that "label" to, that really **** me off.

Call someone a coward because you think they are worried about losing virtual money, in a game fighting someone else's pixels.

Add your RL medals to your sig then we can talk about hero's & cowards, actually don't bother I wouldn't believe you. I doubt you would be using the word "coward" in the context of a game if you really knew what a real coward or hero was in RL.

Personally taking offense to and defending yourself against a generally made statement in a video game forum that wasn't directed at you specifically in the first place! A little insecure are we?

 

[Jockey79]

With adequate cunning you can ....

If I want to have "cunning" gameplay - I'll load up Dishonoured and sneak around in shadows, not jump in a white Type 9 hauler and look like a beached whale.
Just like if I want to spend time thinking about tactics, I'll load up an RTS.

And that is the beauty of ED, I can relax in it with like minded people. Just like to can go pew pew all you like with like minded people.
It has something for everyone.

 

[Mouse]

Personally taking offense to and defending yourself against a generally made statement in a video game forum that wasn't directed at you specifically in the first place! A little insecure are we?

Nope, he's not insecure, just tired of those who equate actions in a video game to things like, "brave" and "Cowardice" when the twits using those words have very little understanding on what they mean.

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If I want to have "cunning" gameplay - I'll load up Dishonoured and sneak around in shadows, not jump in a white Type 9 hauler and look like a beached whale.
Just like if I want to spend time thinking about tactics, I'll load up an RTS.

And that is the beauty of ED, I can relax in it with like minded people. Just like to can go pew pew all you like with like minded people.
It has something for everyone.

aww but your a pretty beached whale

 

[Jockey79]

Personally taking offense to and defending yourself against a generally made statement in a video game forum that wasn't directed at you specifically in the first place! A little insecure are we?

Some of us have had comments thrown directly or indirectly at us for quite a while now.
The constant name calling because we don't want to play their way is irritating and uncalled for.

Some people have been put on the naughty step for it, but soon as they come back it starts again.
As proven here, first sign that there might be some traction for a PvE mode - out comes the "cowardice" comments, yet again.

 

[Mr_Blastman]

Did you never wonder why you are not seeing enough traders to make it worthwhile?

Carry on killing for sport, that will add to player retention in open I am sure.

I do actually wonder. I never kill traders for sport. I never killed them when I pirated them, either, unless they tried to run or fought back--and even then I'd sometimes re-interdict them two or three times in a row with ample warning before I finally killed them.

So no. Don't blame me.

When I fight for sport I only attack other armed ships and never attack sidewinders--I prefer ships my size or larger and check their loadout before interdiction.

 

[Roybe]

Because all oceans need sharks to keep the minnows from eating all the algae and small food. If the fish ate everything, there'd be nothing left and everything would die. The sharks keep the ocean alive. They provide balance. They keep the cycle of life in motion.

The pacifists need to be killed because if they are not, they will end up with nothing but a boring monotony that gets old.

Long live the sharks!

Well, if this game was designed with interpersonal PvP as a rewarded gameplay style I would agree. Unfortunately, it wasn't. What it is designed to do is to allow PvP to occur between groups of people by collecting PvE trophies. The side to collect the most...or beat the timers....wins.

Interpersonal PvP is there for no other reason than RP. All roles of the game should be carried out by killing NPC's. The complaint that Piracy makes less money through NPC's than PC's is a lack of balance...not a reason to kill PC's.

So...the predator/prey analogy...one that is valid and very important in a game where interpersonal PvP is condoned, does not apply here. The only proper PvP in this game is the race between groups collecting PvE trophies to make numbers change within the game.

I suggest taking a minute and think on the above. PvP oriented people have serious problems with 'groking' the idea. Interpersonal PvP is allowed....but not rewarded. The issue that you are discussing...is non-negotiable and irrefutably immutable. I do not mean to ignore, or in any way, disagree with you. You, and other PvP players have to understand that this is the devs base design decision...and no amount of logical discussion will change this.

 

[Majinvash]

Well, if this game was designed with interpersonal PvP as a rewarded gameplay style I would agree. Unfortunately, it wasn't. What it is designed to do is to allow PvP to occur between groups of people by collecting PvE trophies. The side to collect the most...or beat the timers....wins.

Interpersonal PvP is there for no other reason than RP. All roles of the game should be carried out by killing NPC's. The complaint that Piracy makes less money through NPC's than PC's is a lack of balance...not a reason to kill PC's.

So...the predator/prey analogy...one that is valid and very important in a game where intrapersonal PvP is condoned, does not apply here. The only proper PvP in this game is the race between groups collecting PvE trophies to make numbers change within the game.

I suggest taking a minute and think on the above. PvP oriented people have serious problems with 'groking' the idea. Interpersonal PvP is allowed....but not rewarded. The issue that you are discussing...is non-negotiable and irrefutably immutable. I do not mean to ignore, or in any way, disagree with you. You, and other PvP players have to understand that this is the devs base design decision...and no amount of logical discussion will change this.

Total rubbish!

You get better rewards from pirating a player character.

That pirate than gets a bounty up to a million, which is then a better reward for player character bounty hunter.

You can do it via dull NPC farming but saying their is no reward from inter player gaming is totally wrong.

Majinvash

 

[ianw]

Total rubbish!

You get better rewards from pirating a player character.

That pirate than gets a bounty up to a million, which is then a better reward for player character bounty hunter.

You can do it via dull NPC farming but saying their is no reward from inter player gaming is totally wrong.

Majinvash

I thought everyone was saying that the big bounty pirates jump to solo/private to avoid being hunted - or they let their mates pickup the prize?

 

[Roybe]

And you would exacerbate the existing problems with Solo and Open. Only with PvE Open, you would remove the one disadvantage Solo players have, and that's difficulty in tackling group content. So if everything else stays the same, even more people would be switching back and forth between PvE/PvP Open to gain an advantage.

Not to mention coding time needed to make it impossible for players to grief/kill each other. You'd need to disable player-player damage, including ramming. And if you disable collision damage, you enable the kind of griefing that's called "bowling", where you use large ships to bounce smaller ones around, preventing them from docking, passing through starport egress slots etc.




I must have missed it so far as I am fairly new to the game what is this "group content" you refer to? The only thing that I have seen that would be considered group content is the community goals.

There is a lot of group content. Most is unobtainable to Solo players. Want to flip a system...you need people. You want to make a difference, for good or evil, in PP...you need a group. You want to take on the harder USS's..you need a wing.

Obviously, none of this is 'necessary'. However, it does add other motivational reasons to continue playing the game. You can certainly play this game without a group and be the 'lone wolf' you desire. However, playing the 'lone wolf' does get lonely...and limits what you can do in this game.

Some will try this playstyle and love it. Others will try it and fall by the wayside as they find out they do desire some level of interaction within the game.

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I thought everyone was saying that the big bounty pirates jump to solo/private to avoid being hunted - or they let their mates pickup the prize?

They absolutely do...or they have so many healing potions that they can't lose...or high jump out as soon as they take any damage to their hulls!

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Total rubbish!

You get better rewards from pirating a player character.

That pirate than gets a bounty up to a million, which is then a better reward for player character bounty hunter.

You can do it via dull NPC farming but saying their is no reward from inter player gaming is totally wrong.

Majinvash

How many of those fancy million credit bounties have you been able to capitalize on? You are aware in the time it takes you to gather those meaty bounties...I can out pace that in a RES...or by trading. It is not worth the effort for folks to chase the ghosts. It's far easier to kill the NPC's.

 

[Majinvash]

Here you go, as you've obviously not actually read it yourself;

Frontiers Store Page
View attachment 54525

Steams Store Page
View attachment 54526

Please show me where it says player versus player is mandatory, or where it says any one player has to play alongside any other player.
Under Massively Multiplayer on the Steam page it states;

Experience the connected galaxy alone in Solo mode or with players across the world in Open Play

However a PvE mode does fit with the advertised Co-op play;
View attachment 54528

Aww person insults about my ability to read.. ... Cut me deep. This is from the MAIN ed page..

I have picked the bits that i could understand because there were some big words..

It reads as you will fight other players.. Some may become your deadliest enemies, some maybe even friends.

You do what you need to survive.

Now some of that surviving would be bounty hunting players with significantly larger bounties than NPC's and Pirating trader players running tonnes of palladium.

They then added wings and limited to 4 players, so that you couldn't overwhelm a player character with 20 ships.

You could blaze your own trail avoiding PVP even if Open but that is to much work for some. Some you might not be able to avoid, you might describe that as unpredictable characters.

What people don't like is being a victim. Well tbh tough. If you are going to rob someone, someone has to be a victim in that situation.

See its easy this whole post that bits that support your narative.

400 BILLION STAR SYSTEMS. INFINITE FREEDOM. BLAZE YOUR OWN TRAIL.

Starting with only a small starship and a few credits, players do whatever it takes to earn the skill, knowledge, wealth and power to survive in a futuristic cutthroat galaxy and to stand among the ranks of the Elite.

Experience unpredictable encounters with players from around the world in Elite: Dangerous’ vast massively multiplayer space. Fly alone or with friends in a connected galaxy where every pilot you face could become a trusted ally or your deadliest enemy.

 

[Roybe]

Total rubbish!

You get better rewards from pirating a player character.

That pirate than gets a bounty up to a million, which is then a better reward for player character bounty hunter.

You can do it via dull NPC farming but saying their is no reward from inter player gaming is totally wrong.

Majinvash

Oh and on another note...you do realize that the player carrying the bounties also has to pay the bounty amount + the insurance cost to get his ship back? Just another punishment to NOT get a bounty! The devs do not care about PvP...the community does not care about PvP. All the devs care about is creating more PvE content so players can have more things to be in conflict over...so they fight in bigger and bigger groups over the PvE trophies!

 

[Mouse]

Aww person insults about my ability to read.. ... Cut me deep. This is from the MAIN ed page..

I have picked the bits that i could understand because there were some big words..

It reads as you will fight other players.. Some may become your deadliest enemies, some maybe even friends.

You do what you need to survive.

Now some of that surviving would be bounty hunting players with significantly larger bounties than NPC's and Pirating trader players running tonnes of palladium.

They then added wings and limited to 4 players, so that you couldn't overwhelm a player character with 20 ships.

You could blaze your own trail avoiding PVP even if Open but that is to much work for some. Some you might not be able to avoid, you might describe that as unpredictable characters.

What people don't like is being a victim. Well tbh tough. If you are going to rob someone, someone has to be a victim in that situation.

See its easy this whole post that bits that support your narative.

400 BILLION STAR SYSTEMS. INFINITE FREEDOM. BLAZE YOUR OWN TRAIL.

Starting with only a small starship and a few credits, players do whatever it takes to earn the skill, knowledge, wealth and power to survive in a futuristic cutthroat galaxy and to stand among the ranks of the Elite.

Experience unpredictable encounters with players from around the world in Elite: Dangerous’ vast massively multiplayer space. Fly alone or with friends in a connected galaxy where every pilot you face could become a trusted ally or your deadliest enemy.

You do realize there is a big difference in stating that someone hasn't read something vs saying they can't read.. or you just wanting to play the "victim" again and claim everyone is insulting you so you can justify yours?

 

[david6768]

There is a lot of group content. Most is unobtainable to Solo players. Want to flip a system...you need people. You want to make a difference, for good or evil, in PP...you need a group. You want to take on the harder USS's..you need a wing.

Obviously, none of this is 'necessary'. However, it does add other motivational reasons to continue playing the game. You can certainly play this game without a group and be the 'lone wolf' you desire. However, playing the 'lone wolf' does get lonely...and limits what you can do in this game.

Some will try this playstyle and love it. Others will try it and fall by the wayside as they find out they do desire some level of interaction within the game.

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I bought an MMO so a lone wolf is not what I desired I just haven't ran across any USS that I had difficulty handling solo. I haven't encountered anyone in game having a hard time with USS's and inviting other players to their wing or asking for or needing assistance in any way. I ran across one guy once and we winged it up and followed the same trade route to get the extra 5% and I play with a friend and do the same when he is on or we bounty hunt together as that is the only team profit sharing thing we seem to be able to do together. The PP doesn't' seem very interesting to me at the moment, maybe I will give it a try later. I am mostly a trader and all the advice I have read said stay away from allying as a trader it just causes you more aggravation anytime you are not in your allied territory. Not to mention flipping a system isn't particularly interesting as a whole, the different "leaders" don't seem to effect gameplay much if at all so I don't really care if the empire expands or the federation expands. Maybe I am missing something as like I said I am fairly new, I have only been playing a month or so. I welcome any input to what I have been missing or what else I could get involved with. I have hit entrepreneur trading status and expert on bounty hunting so I have done a bit of both, I haven't tried mining but my friend did it for a while and didn't recommended it very highly and exploring totally sounds like a solo activity and not very interesting from the information about it I have read here on the forums, mist of it being a plea to revamp exploring.

 

[Majinvash]

How many of those fancy million credit bounties have you been able to capitalize on? You are aware in the time it takes you to gather those meaty bounties...I can out pace that in a RES...or by trading. It is not worth the effort for folks to chase the ghosts. It's far easier to kill the NPC's.

Back before it got broken it was a piece of cake and this isn't about if you can make more money in NPC.

This is about player interaction not being valid because there were no reward.

I regularly had a bounty in the millions in the New Caribbean from carrying 80 tonnes or so of stolen rares and then not caring when i got scanned by local authority.

I then regularly lost those bounties to the various players hunting me. It was great!

But the stealing of rares when people used to flock to rare runs is where i made my multi millions.

Yes it could have been done faster trading, but that wasnt my trail.

In that situation, I needed victims. But they didnt have to be there or in Open.

Majinvash

 

[Roybe]

Aww person insults about my ability to read.. ... Cut me deep. This is from the MAIN ed page..

I have picked the bits that i could understand because there were some big words..

It reads as you will fight other players.. Some may become your deadliest enemies, some maybe even friends.

You do what you need to survive.

Now some of that surviving would be bounty hunting players with significantly larger bounties than NPC's and Pirating trader players running tonnes of palladium.

They then added wings and limited to 4 players, so that you couldn't overwhelm a player character with 20 ships.

You could blaze your own trail avoiding PVP even if Open but that is to much work for some. Some you might not be able to avoid, you might describe that as unpredictable characters.

What people don't like is being a victim. Well tbh tough. If you are going to rob someone, someone has to be a victim in that situation.

See its easy this whole post that bits that support your narative.

400 BILLION STAR SYSTEMS. INFINITE FREEDOM. BLAZE YOUR OWN TRAIL.

Starting with only a small starship and a few credits, players do whatever it takes to earn the skill, knowledge, wealth and power to survive in a futuristic cutthroat galaxy and to stand among the ranks of the Elite.

Experience unpredictable encounters with players from around the world in Elite: Dangerous’ vast massively multiplayer space. Fly alone or with friends in a connected galaxy where every pilot you face could become a trusted ally or your deadliest enemy.

Yeah, well marketing and real life very rarely mean the same thing. If you want to play a bloodthirsty PC killer, by all means, continue to try. You will fail...but it's your right to bang your head whatever way makes you happy!

The proof of the pudding is in the eating. PvP as you envision it, is not in this game, the way you...and any PvP player wants it to be.

Sorry. I feel your pain. I, to wish it was different. The only way to come to grips with this is realize how PvP is meant to be played in this game...then you will understand how to play the game, as it is designed. Want to mess with someone? Hurt them badly? Take 5 or 10 players into a system and flip it...want to be dirty about it? Do it in Private modes. This is how the game is designed...this is why the modes exist. They give the PvE player ultimate freedom, and community, ultimate control over who plays the game the way the majority wants it to be played! The ultimate in Democratic decision making, the ultimate in Anarchy, the best design I've ever seen to add entropy to a system to prevent stagnation!

 

[Majinvash]

You do realize there is a big difference in stating that someone hasn't read something vs saying they can't read.. or you just wanting to play the "victim" again and claim everyone is insulting you so you can justify yours?

Oh noes.. Word play!