(Opinion) Fdev has messed up exploration

[VR SenseiMatty]

No I don’t think the game is doomed or anything like that. This is just my opinion and I’m sure many will disagree with me.

After traveling more than 250k light years during DW2 and, then heading around the galaxy to the Formidine Rift, in my opinion Fdev has totally wrecked exploration. There is almost nothing to find and the new discovery scanner just makes it a grind. All the planets look the same e.g almost all the ice worlds are solid white with the same hurricane looking clouds, all the HMC worlds are the same shades of brown and orange etc. each jump you have to throttle down and look at a chart that resembles a heart monitor printout. Then if you want to actually look at anything you have to waste time and play zoom simulator to see the same old thing. There is zero skill involved and basically they have managed to turn exploration into a grind.

There is also almost nothing to find. After 250k lys Ive found a single unexpected biological POI. I’ve found zero lagrange clouds or stellar POIs. All the biological POIs look the same and are just copy paste.

The new lighting system has messed up nebulas. Before landing on the dark side of a planet in a nebula was cool. The sky was brightly lit in vivid colors from all the starlight lighting up the nebula. Now, except for bright blue nebula, they just look faded and drab so there is no reason to visit them anymore. Also landing on planets above or below the galaxy used to be awesome, now it’s nothing special.

After DW2 I don’t see any reason to leave the bubble until the next update. Hopefully they will at least bring back the ADS so we are not always forced to use that awful zoom simulator when you just want a quick glance of what’s in the system.

I've got nothing against the FSS but it needs some improvement. For example the long scan waiting time to see geo/biological signals, the missing orbital lines in VR, asteroid clusters messages that block all next information messages and the grind in finding all moons around gas giants (too many zoom levels).
During the beta phase I liked the FSS but I was afraid that apart from planets, it would have been useless if FD didn't add new cool things to find in the galaxy.
Unfortunately my fears became true.
They indeed added some but they're terribly rare and they are quite similar! Unlike you, on the complete DW2 route, forth and back, I discovered ZERO lagarange clouds.

• The odds to find cool things needs to be rebalanced of a 10x factor minimum
• They need to add much more variety to the same feature
• They need to add new phenomena, but a huge number more, not just 10
• We need to see phenomena in Supercruise, the USS box concept is just garbage and the supercruise-normal flight transition kills the immersion.
• Where are supernovae and other stellar features?
• Why star flares are not dangerous?
• Where are the planet catastrophies? Colliding bodies, collapsing planets with unstable core (this is very sci-fi, and ED is sci-fi)
• Where are signs of other civilizations?
• Where are other NPC explorers in need?
• Is it possible that the only gameplay for explorers is only the FSS and wallpapers generator?
• Where are the misteries to be investigated in the various galaxy sector?
• Where are the outpost far in the black that need supplies?
• What about more gameplay on planets rather than just collecting materials?
• Where are the earthquakes?
• Where are the erupting vulcanoes?
• Where is the graphical improvements for the ice worlds?
• Where are the new SRV variants with new dedicated exploration tools?
• Where are the caves? You know, we have thargoid bases which actually ARE caves so no reason not to produce some more variants without aliens inside.
• Where is the planetary mining?

I could go on forever... I don't know why FDEV lack so much of imagination...

 

[VR SenseiMatty]

I would love to encounter something like this:

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMS32ddNscQ

There would not have to be life. Just a mysterious abandoned planet covered in mysterious structures.
I think every Elite player would fly there to experience it. The attraction would be huge.

Exactly this! The problem with FDEV is that they would make it so rare and difficult to find that you wouldn't even know it's in the game until some data miner find a way to spot it.
CAUGH raxxla CAUGH

 

[CmdMarty]

Went from everybody could explore easily, to now everybody has to zoom sim which i quit using a few weeks later do to boredom, eye strain and giving me headaches so now i rarely play.

 

[Iskariot]

Went from everybody could explore easily, to now everybody has to zoom sim which i quit using a few weeks later do to boredom, eye strain and giving me headaches so now i rarely play.

I love the new exploration tools.
Not saying they could not be immproved, but it is infinitely better than the simplistic honk mechanism. That was no gameplay at all.

 

[Iskariot]

Exactly this! The problem with FDEV is that they would make it so rare and difficult to find that you wouldn't even know it's in the game until some data miner find a way to spot it.
CAUGH raxxla CAUGH

For stuff like the fractal video rarity would be a given, but FDev could spread some rumors to put us on the trail.
There even is some kind of space rpg (don't remember the name) which uses some kind of rumor mechanic for discoveries.

 

[thistle]

I could go on forever... I don't know why FDEV lack so much of imagination...

Time, not imagination. Your list is hilarious, it's full of things YOU knew weren't there when YOU went on DW2. At time time your main gripe if I remember was the apparent disgrace that fdev hadn't given you a skin for your new phantom exploration ship. Which they then did.

Or are you suggesting they could have added all that between DW2 starting and now?

 

[Threeofseven]

I love the new exploration tools.
Not saying they could not be immproved, but it is infinitely better than the simplistic honk mechanism. That was no gameplay at all.

The problem is, the FSS is also no game play because it requires as much skill as opening a door. There is also no additional reward for using it as the planet models are exactly the same as before. The only thing you get is a headache.

 

[Riverside]

I love the new exploration tools.
Not saying they could not be immproved, but it is infinitely better than the simplistic honk mechanism. That was no gameplay at all.

I think you hit the nail on the head here, this may be the essence of the divide that the new stuff has created among the community.

With the old stuff, finding out the basic info about the system was easy. We know the total mass of the system before entering it, it is a part of the name of the system (for procedurally generated ones at least), it is the gravitational influence of that system. So when we enter the system & discover the main star (because it's right in front of us) our scanner knows what proportion of the total mass of the system is represented by that, and so can scan the system to find the rest of the mass. It quickly found clusters of bodies, representing each count briefly as it found them until the total mass was accounted for and we were presented with a list of targetable bodies and an overview of what they look like and their orbital relationships (the orbits stretches credibility). You then take an educated guess what it is & travel towards it for a closer look, with more detail being revealed after a pretty short but frustratingly canned delay.

To me, this makes sense, to you it is automated & too easy. Would this be a fair summary?


With the new stuff, we again already know the total mass of the system before entering it because that part hasn't changed. We are then presented on entry with a count of the number of bodies, but not where they are or what they look like - this is the added gameplay that means it is no longer 'too easy' to obtain the previously available and desirable top level info, and the game of hunting gravitational anomalies begins. This is the part that is, as you describe, less simplistic. For visiting a single system there is now gameplay and a feeling of achievement (or relief ) to be gained from finding all the stuff you want to find. You can then travel to it, already fully informed about exactly what type of body it is and whether or not there are any POIs etc nearby.

How does the scanner know how many bodies are there but not where they are? The waveform analysis is a simplified grouping of what type of body they are, which is the same information that was previously inferred from the sysmap, but without the location. To me, it doesn't make sense as a tool for exploration. I get that it adds gameplay, and I think that has opened up the wider galaxy to many players that saw no reason to get out there before, and that's great.
But as a tool it makes little sense to me. I do not wish to disparage the FSS, clearly there are people that like it because it's an entertaining game to reveal an individual system every so often.

I am exploring much less than I used to, I am tagging far more bodies than before and earned as much on a month-long test in January from selling exploration data as I had in the previous four years and 5,500 hours of play. I can certainly see why people like it.

But there is no sense of achievement for me, and little reward for tenacity. Scanning (what turns out to be) a dull system takes longer, but scanning an interesting system is much, much quicker. So a higher proportion of my exploration time is spent on the dross and less on interesting stuff than before. But that's just how I play.

I only map stuff now for two reasons - the tag/BGS value of the data, and to find a persistent POI to tick a codex box or farm it for mats. I barely drive my SRV any more, hunting for rocks or random non-persistent POIs seems pointless. I'd driven the SRV 16,000km before 3.3.

I don't mind the FSS, it's a useful tool for gathering BGS points and the basic idea of using a telescope as an alternative to moving closer is fine by me.

 

[Shinji Ikari]

Op,you are pvp-ier?right?Leave exploration to professionals,as explorers cant mess with your amazing combat abilities...

I'm a "pro" and the FSS sucks.

 

[metatheurgist]

Can I have a buxom Unicorn?

I did find a world were buxom Amazons ride space unicorns...but I'm keeping it to myself.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

I think I can hear some violins playing.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

No I don’t think the game is doomed or anything like that. This is just my opinion and I’m sure many will disagree with me.

After traveling more than 250k light years during DW2 and, then heading around the galaxy to the Formidine Rift, in my opinion Fdev has totally wrecked exploration. There is almost nothing to find and the new discovery scanner just makes it a grind. All the planets look the same e.g almost all the ice worlds are solid white with the same hurricane looking clouds, all the HMC worlds are the same shades of brown and orange etc. each jump you have to throttle down and look at a chart that resembles a heart monitor printout. Then if you want to actually look at anything you have to waste time and play zoom simulator to see the same old thing. There is zero skill involved and basically they have managed to turn exploration into a grind.

There is also almost nothing to find. After 250k lys Ive found a single unexpected biological POI. I’ve found zero lagrange clouds or stellar POIs. All the biological POIs look the same and are just copy paste.

The new lighting system has messed up nebulas. Before landing on the dark side of a planet in a nebula was cool. The sky was brightly lit in vivid colors from all the starlight lighting up the nebula. Now, except for bright blue nebula, they just look faded and drab so there is no reason to visit them anymore. Also landing on planets above or below the galaxy used to be awesome, now it’s nothing special.

After DW2 I don’t see any reason to leave the bubble until the next update. Hopefully they will at least bring back the ADS so we are not always forced to use that awful zoom simulator when you just want a quick glance of what’s in the system.

Personally, I have found exploration to be in the best place it ever has been. Sure I would like some more variations of things to find, but at least there are things to find.

As to the FSS, so far l, I have never found it to be a grind or a drag. The previous version though, that was just plain awful, mind numbingly boring, tedious and unexciting.

I haven't noticed an issue with the nebulas myself, they seem fine. Maybe you are landing your ship too close to the local star. I could be wrong and just not noticed.

 

[space voyager]

Personally, I have found exploration to be in the best place it ever has been. Sure I would like some more variations of things to find, but at least there are things to find.

As to the FSS, so far l, I have never found it to be a grind or a drag. The previous version though, that was just plain awful, mind numbingly boring, tedious and unexciting.

I haven't noticed an issue with the nebulas myself, they seem fine. Maybe you are landing your ship too close to the local star. I could be wrong and just not noticed.

Exploration is in the best place ever IMO, too, though it is far from where it should be in a game that has a whole galaxy as your playground.

DW2 was for me far more about hanging out with like-minded people than exploration. If I went for exploration, I'd turn around after base building at Sag-A. Sooner, more likely.

 

[Seizewell Warrior]

Must admit on my long journey to Beagle Point and back, I was beginning to regard FSS as the carpal tunnel simulator, especially trying to find those last couple of elusive celestial bodies. Must admit I preferred "honk" which gave you the basic structure of the system, then it was up to you if you wanted to fly closer for the intermediate scan or the full DSS.

The new DSS also feels like it was ripped off from Mass Effect 2, launching probes at random parts of the planet surface on a 2D screen.

 

[Crank Larson]

the missing orbital lines in VR

That's weird. I've seen this mentioned a few times, so I decided to look it up in the issue tracker. Turns out I don't have the problem - I see those orbit lines in VR.

 

[Shir]

There's something about the FSS i find extremely boring, as soon as i learned how to use it i knew i wouldn't play the exploration game anymore. Got about halfways DW2, no exploring just travelling and went back.. I wish they replace/retire FSS at some point, doubt it though..

 

[Hanerib]

I would love to encounter something like this:

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMS32ddNscQ

There would not have to be life. Just a mysterious abandoned planet covered in mysterious structures.
I think every Elite player would fly there to experience it. The attraction would be huge.

Adding it to the game would be just boring. But if you took an idea, carried it on for a new generation, so that they could make stuff like this, that is Raxxla.

 

[ThatSmileyGuy]

Hey OP - I guess you aren't aware there is already an anti-FSS thread. And that fdev have alraedy said it's staying.

I don't take this thread as another anti-FSS thread. The OP states his opinions on more aspects than just this one.

As for 'copy paste' - I suggest you lookup 'procgen' or 'procedural generation'- they didn't copy & paste most of the sites, it's far more technical

Agreed. The sites sure are generated in far more complicated ways than being copy pasted. However once we generate such places with positions where mounds / geysers / braintrees spawn then we populated them with not randomly generated assets which in turn are, indeed, copy paste. My friend once told me that "seen one, seen them all". With which i agree to an extent. Since POIs spawn on non-atmospheric planets which are only scarred with canyons / mountains and in most cases look almost the same.
Another point he raised is that if such was the case making finding them such a painite in the Asp was more rewarding and kept finding such sites not only more rewarding but less boring as well.

 

[Autoculto]

Hopefully they will at least bring back the ADS so we are not always forced to use that awful zoom simulator when you just want a quick glance of what’s in the system.

I totally agree with this but for another reason. I really struggle with the fss scanner due to being colour blind and have to rely totally on watching the arrows to locate a body. I can't even target a previously unexplored body in the nav panel and then turn my ship to face it so I can do a fss scan. I really don't think FDev have a clue when it comes down to colour blind customers, or maybe they do but just don't give a toss about them. People have been complaining for so long now but it just falls on deaf ears

 

[lenna]

The new lighting system has messed up nebulas. Before landing on the dark side of a planet in a nebula was cool. The sky was brightly lit in vivid colors from all the starlight lighting up the nebula. Now, except for bright blue nebula, they just look faded and drab so there is no reason to visit them anymore. Also landing on planets above or below the galaxy used to be awesome, now it’s nothing special.

Do you have any before and after images to illustrate your complaint?

Personally, I have found the lighting model ok - a planetary dark-side actually feels appropriately dark to me. I have not done much if any real exploration since 3.3 dropped because of FD essentially ruining the experience for me with the implementation of their new mechanics.

I am not 100% sure how I personally think the dark-side of a planet in a nebula should look & feel BUT providing the nebula does not inappropriately illuminate the terrain I have no real issue. If the planet is in a plasma cloud (for example) then some "dark side" illumination might be appropriate but also there should be at least some increase in ship/SRV temperature too.