Pandering to explorers

[777Driver]

Because explorers should be travelling large distances in SC to DSS objects (you know...exploring), W&T is thus the mechanic for limiting explorers; like ammo for weapons limiting combat orientated players.

Honk-Jump-Honk defeats this as the player is travelling almost no distance in SC and thus avoiding W&T.

Nobody honks and moves on to save W&T, that would be ridiculous.. You obviously have an OCD about W&T. It doesn't matter what you do on a long range trip, honk and move on or scan every icy body, W&T will eventually reach 100% by the time they get home, those that scan everything will hit 100% faster.

@Danny, I'm making 80,000 credits every few minutes in a Neutron field. Trading brings me in 800,000 every 8 minutes in a T9. If you have a starter ship up to a T6, exploration is one of the most profitable ways to make money (if you head towards a field). If you own a heavy freighter or T9, you will never match trade profits

 

[dannywhac]

@Danny, I'm making 80,000 credits every few minutes in a Neutron field. Trading brings me in 800,000 every 8 minutes in a T9. If you have a starter ship up to a T6, exploration is one of the most profitable ways to make money (if you head towards a field). If you own a heavy freighter or T9, you will never match trade profits

True - I'm not really looking too much at what I'm typing at the mo as I'm in a Neutron Field

Although a long while ago, hitting the rare route in a Cobra netted me more per hour than non NS exploration. Gave me enough to kit out a Clipper and Vulture for pew-pew and an Expl Asp.

 

[Rikk]

Because explorers should be travelling large distances in SC to DSS objects (you know...exploring), W&T is thus the mechanic for limiting explorers; like ammo for weapons limiting combat orientated players.

Honk-Jump-Honk defeats this as the player is travelling almost no distance in SC and thus avoiding W&T.

You missed the question and answered with your wallet not your head.

There is nothing limiting whatsoever in W&T for explorers. Why would we even care about W&T?

 

[Galten75]

First of all: Thanks for thinking of us lone wolf space jockeys out mapping the big black.

Every explorer are different. Some what to gain credits farming neutron fields, some are in it for the mileage and some are just wandering the stars. Regardless what floats you boat most are like to take in the sights and in the Explorer forum there are a few threads about what is wanted and most aren't about the money but for interesting stuff to see (and perhaps experience some manageable danger).

Here are a few threads in the Explorer forum about what some of us want (a few are a little outlandish but most are not that extravagant at all):

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=140949

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=141440

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=146688

// G

 

[Engadine]

I don't know, sometimes we like to complain:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAECTFU69g4

.....

.....

-- Pete.

Seriously... What the Frak!!

8 minutes to sell one page, or rather to watch the video printer churn out the 1st Discovered Bonus. Why for the love of all that is holly isn't there an in-game option to switch that off so it just presents a summary at the end :S

I'm so looking forward to having to endure that once I return from my 1st outing, currently have 878 Systems.

Please don't be offended Pete, but I chose not to watch the remaining 3:48:36

I dread to think what it must have been like before the Sell Page << Shudders >>

 

[Yomamas Fett]

*SNIP*
I'm sorry to say your dirty little secrets are dirty little missconceptions.

Starting a lot of sentences with "I" is a sign of inflated egos. So in my case, you may be on to something

Misconceptions?

Ok, then prove it, is your handed in data available to other players via the Purchase system info in the galaxy map?
That would be a No Ziggy.

Next, given that no data is shared between players exploring and any other players, can the Galaxy ever be mapped? No, you can send 1million peeps to Sag A or any other system, and they can all make money off that 1 system scan and the DSSs of that Scan. So misconception? That'd be a No Ziggy.

Is your tag given on the DSS or the ADS, we all know that noobs think it's the DSS (due to bad wiki and other info sources) but is that true? I'm going to hazard a NO Ziggy on this one too (but would be happy to be proven wrong).




To various parties: drop the claim that I want exploration to make more money I have my A rated Python and enough cash to buy it back many many times over, I have no desire to fly anything else, and no need for more money, I am exploring because I enjoy finding unregistered stations that are not on Thrudds or the Galactic map, there's often a good fight in getting that data out....If Pirate King missions weren't borked I'd probably be doing those instead/ as well.

I can think of nothing more boring than a trip to Sag A, Jump honk jump x1000....but to each his own.

 

[dannywhac]

Is your tag given on the DSS or the ADS, we all know that noobs think it's the DSS (due to bad wiki and other info sources) but is that true? I'm going to hazard a NO Ziggy on this one too (but would be happy to be proven wrong).




To various parties: drop the claim that I want exploration to make more money I have my A rated Python and enough cash to buy it back many many times over, I have no desire to fly anything else, and no need for more money, I am exploring because I enjoy finding unregistered stations that are not on Thrudds or the Galactic map, there's often a good fight in getting that data out....If Pirate King missions weren't borked I'd probably be doing those instead/ as well.

I can think of nothing more boring than a trip to Sag A, Jump honk jump x1000....but to each his own.

I think you're proving Ziggy's point about inflated egos with the use of 'noob' for a start.

Yes, you can't buy exploration data that others have found, you're wrong with the ADS tagging systems - if you just honk there's no tag. You have to use the DSS to get a tag. I don't think that due to wiki or bad info, but can look at systems that I've just honked in and already handed in the data. Guess what? No name. On anything.

Good for you that you've found a niche in exploration you enjoy.

 

[Mikey2305]

But there is an option to turn off 'first discovered by'... A novelty the first few times but that soon wears off

 

[jmg]

I don't know, sometimes we like to complain:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAECTFU69g4


Erm, no thanks, long exploration trips would be impossible if you knew that eventually the odds wouldn't work out in your favour and you'd be vaporised by an unlucky jump!


The last thing explorers want is yet another artificially long delay in letting them do what they're trying to do!


Nice idea, but this will reward all the early explorers who mapped the area direcctly around and inbetween known space, and no-one else!


See previous comment.

Sorry - but I have to disagree with you on these ideas!


-- Pete.

agreed. Love the sentiment, but the implementation needs a bit more refinement

 

[aws357]

Seriously... What the Frak!!

8 minutes to sell one page, or rather to watch the video printer churn out the 1st Discovered Bonus. Why for the love of all that is holly isn't there an in-game option to switch that off so it just presents a summary at the end :S

I'm so looking forward to having to endure that once I return from my 1st outing, currently have 878 Systems.

Please don't be offended Pete, but I chose not to watch the remaining 3:48:36

I dread to think what it must have been like before the Sell Page << Shudders >>

Yes, I just had to click on the youtube link sent by cmdr Pete (back home with wifi) and "eau de smeg" is that a big pile of poop to pass...

 

[Allitnil]

Is your tag given on the DSS or the ADS, we all know that noobs think it's the DSS (due to bad wiki and other info sources) but is that true? I'm going to hazard a NO Ziggy on this one too (but would be happy to be proven wrong).

This would take you 30 minutes or so to find out: head out 500 LY until you reach a totally undiscovered system (likely won't take as much as 500 LY but that pretty much guarantees you will come across one). Use the ADS, don't surface scan anything. Return & sell the data. Look at the system map and realise that the system is still totally undiscovered.

On the same trip you can easily check some of your other claims such as stating that ADS alone gives you the bulk of the available value from a system.

 

[Rikk]

When you quote me, would you mind awfully to respond to the points I'm making? (The part you replaced by *SNIP*)

Thanks a bunch!

All the best,

Ziggy.

But....but....but... answering real questions is ​hard work

- - - Updated - - -

To various parties: drop the claim that I want exploration to make more money

Snipped. Lots.

But you talk about wear and tear like it does affect your wallet when in reality an explorer doesn't care. You didn't answer my previous question and I am (maybe incorrectly) assuming you are dismissively lumping me in with these various parties you speak of.

 

[Yomamas Fett]

I never had any issue with W&T. I pay it exactly no mind at all.

I have traded, rares and regular, and your claim that exploring makes more is wrong, false, erroneous ... wrong!

I know a Buckyballer with twice the number of systems scanned than I have. I have made 4 times as many in exploring money than he did. Explain that.

*SNIP*

What points were you making? :

You don't pay attention to W&T, so you're tacitly supporting my point that currently Exploration needs some Dev Love....you should pay attention to W&T. It should be life and death for an Explorer. Maybe if W&T was based on jump-lengths and number of jumps taken rather than purely on SC distance travelled then it would make exploration less of a cake-walk?

Trading vs Exploration: Grab a Hauler and go trading then tell me that trading is more lucrative than exploration...others have made this point for me with a run in a hauler to a neutron field comments (see posts #45 and #46 above); I should have been specific and mentioned that I was referring to the early game, for that confusion I apologise.

Other than that I see no points to answer, and note that you have avoided answering any that were asked of you; which is unfortunate, rather than proving your position with reasoned argument you appear to have taken offence to avoid being proven wrong.

Misconceptions? The Dirty Little Secrets still stand I think.



EDIT: Almost forgot, As to the Buckyball run, I am also trying to figure out the inconsistencies in Explorer earnings and Rank Progression, so perhaps if you could provide numbers we can have some data to work with?

 

[Yomamas Fett]

But....but....but... answering real questions is ​hard work
*SNIP*
You didn't answer my previous question and I am (maybe incorrectly) assuming you are dismissively lumping me in with these various parties you speak of.

Sorry Rikk, yes I was just dismissing you, because the only question I noticed from you was along the lines "Why should W&T affect explorers"; so I just assumed you were a noob (or newbie if you view noob as an insult, I view both terms as interchangable myself).

 

[Pete]

8 minutes to sell one page, or rather to watch the video printer churn out the 1st Discovered Bonus. Why for the love of all that is holly isn't there an in-game option to switch that off so it just presents a summary at the end :S

Well to be honest once the "close" button is active you can press it. But then you miss out on the only screen where you can view your first discoveries. The only other way to see them is to click through each system and check.

There is so much more potential for explorers, most explorers love data (especially their own), so FDEV just need to make it available to us...
As I said in another thread I would love an interactive (and exportable? Make me dream!) list of discovered system and celestial bodies in game, with customisable headers including system name, main star type, breakdown of planets/stars per type with values such as coordinates/age/size/mass/rotation/etc, whether they have a terraformable flag, whether they were "first discovered" etc...
Of course also sortable by any of said headers.

If they did this, and also made data saleable as "sell all" or "sell x systems" (better to divide sales over different systems for rep gain) then I think just about all explorers would be over the moon with joy. Even if "sell all" took potentially some hours as a background server activity ("Your data will be processed within 24 hours, your records and credit account will be updated as soon as the process is complete").

-- Pete.

 

[Rikk]

Sorry Rikk, yes I was just dismissing you, because the only question I noticed from you was along the lines "Why should W&T affect explorers"; so I just assumed you were a noob (or newbie if you view noob as an insult, I view both terms as interchangable myself).

Well, I'm not a 'new explorer', in fact I have not docked for 90 days as of today.

My question was more a case of 'Why should explorers care about W&T'

I'm one who, like many, chooses not to do anything about W&T because I know repairing it adds no benefit to my exploration vessel. I am aware that my hull strength is down by 30% but that is of little consequence to me.

And I think that mechanic it working exactly as intended. I'm not sure how it could work any different and still allow for long exploration voyages.

 

[Yomamas Fett]

*SNIP*

Couldn't resist }8)

Dammit, everytime I see other folks data the entire mechanism just becomes more inexplicable. I'm on 2400 systems (so half your amount), 5750 DSS (mostly metals, gas giants, but probably around 1000 snowballs as I complete interesting systems) and 16.8m in profit (with about 500K worth of unsold), and still Pathfinder.

0 nametags (I assume they are listed as level 3 scans?), if I keep exploring in human-space I should avoid nametags and thus not have the raw data corrupted by them, a test sample if you will. All my exploring is since version 1.2.

What version did you start Exploring in, as I suspect that a lot of the inconsistencies might be explained with changes during patches?

Do you know how many tags you have and how many the unlucky Bucker (surely the correct term for a Buckyball participant? ). Nametags are what I suspect is creating the wildly varying results, as you'd expect blimps and anomalies to flatten out over thousands of scans.....but if anything things just get curiouser and curiouser.

 

[Cosmos]

I don't get why people only seek to identify themselves in one particular role. I think the game is best enjoyed, or should be, by taking part all it has to offer. When I think of exploring though I am a little miffed its been implemented as is because as hard as I try to get into it, I usually find myself bored out of my mind thousands of light years away from civilisation and wishing I hadn't left.

I also find it a tad disappointing that exploring is so easy and has so little jeopardy. As it stands I think every single Nebula or area of special interest has been tagged by other players, and since there little else to it, its something that just seems a little unfair for the majority of players. Not that I blame those who have gone off exploring, its more down to the way its been implemented.

Hopefully it will improve as things develop.

 

[Iori]

I'd like it if there was a chance that the friendship drive dropped you at a random object inside a star system, so its not the star every time.

I know, most massive object in the system lore blah blah blah, look, you can say that the FSD has inaccuracies in the exit stage or something like that. There is so much in the game that has no explanation of science that you can't just sacrifice a richer experience for the sake of some unimportant details.

 

[Bazil]

What would I suggest to fix this boring gameplay?

1: ADS and DSS are reversed in their rewardss; so ADS functionality stays the same, but if you want the lions share of a discovery then you have to travel to and surface scan a body.

I'd support this one idea. The more you put in, the more you get out.