Just make it so it won't work unless shields are down, and thrusters are out. Also, scramble spectrum doesn't quite make up a large enough window for the limpet to travel all the way to the target, especially if the target has pdcs or ecms.Sorry guv, that's not the spec i was given. I was told to make hatch breakers bring ships to a stop. So that's what I did.
Ok, i've changed it now so it only happens when the drives are disabled.
5 mins later
Hey, boss. Apparently when someone uses scramble spectrum and it disabled drives for a few seconds, it provides a window in which a hatch breaker can connect and bring a ship to a stop.
Its easy to declare you are are game designer. I've designed games as well. I've implemented features in games according to my own designs.
What is important in game design is thinking of edge cases and unitended consequences of making changes without thinking them through.
What i've suggested before (and maybe people can critique it) is NPC comms, where you can make demands for ships to submit. I mean, even an Elite NPC should be ready to stand down after you've taken down its shields, its weapons, and damaged its internals and hull. You've shown you have the capability to destroy it.
I find the fact that anything higher than Mostly Harmless will continue to reboot after its powerplant is destroyed ridiculous.
Piracy Ability
- Thread starter Sketch1982
- Start date
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- Tags
- piracy
I'd thought of this about 2 seconds after reading the objection, tooAs a game developer, i wouldn't have the limpet work on ships that arent already disabled.This would make it so it couldn't be used as an opener on a ship. This would just be a nice thing you could do for pve mostly, or when you have already knocked out a player. I don't think that is a hard thing as far as balance do you?
Piracy, as a whole hollistic process, has long been in dire need of a big overhaul. The need to bump slow inactive ships is just one of many things that could be done better with some thought. That said, because of the convoluted process, it is possibly one of the highest skill ceiling activities in the game.
Yet is one of the lowest paid.
Crime doesn't pay in Elite. And I think it's a massive shame (and I don't do it...)
Yeah. Let's face it, if I manage to blow out your drives, then finishing you off is just a case of sending a few more volleys of ordnance in the same direction.
Force shell cannons
A modification to allow firing of low explosive shells, designed to generate a propelling blast. Strikes to a target are capable of forcing ships off course, at the cost of shot accuracy.
Do not require you to touch the ship they do require you to use them correctly and with the correct ammo count to reverse the direction of the ship...
No bumping required... Spaceships do not have brakes they require opposite "force" applied to stop... Force shell cannon can apply that force if correctly applied...
Drag Munitions seeker missiles
Experimental munitions that disrupt engine exhaust flow on the target, temporarily preventing ENG power distribution from increasing thrust.
Missles can also be made to Stop a ship increasing with boosts if these missles are used the target ship can not boost at that time when that ship is a slow ship to start with they wont be able to run very fast...
Combine both with High speed shield removal weapons for pirate build...
There is no requirement to make it stop you just require it to be slow enough to allow collection limpets to catch up to your ship ~60 and lower…
A modification to allow firing of low explosive shells, designed to generate a propelling blast. Strikes to a target are capable of forcing ships off course, at the cost of shot accuracy.
Do not require you to touch the ship they do require you to use them correctly and with the correct ammo count to reverse the direction of the ship...
No bumping required... Spaceships do not have brakes they require opposite "force" applied to stop... Force shell cannon can apply that force if correctly applied...
Drag Munitions seeker missiles
Experimental munitions that disrupt engine exhaust flow on the target, temporarily preventing ENG power distribution from increasing thrust.
Missles can also be made to Stop a ship increasing with boosts if these missles are used the target ship can not boost at that time when that ship is a slow ship to start with they wont be able to run very fast...
Combine both with High speed shield removal weapons for pirate build...
There is no requirement to make it stop you just require it to be slow enough to allow collection limpets to catch up to your ship ~60 and lower…
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Sorry guv, that's not the spec i was given. I was told to make hatch breakers bring ships to a stop. So that's what I did.
Ok, i've changed it now so it only happens when the drives are disabled.
5 mins later
Hey, boss. Apparently when someone uses scramble spectrum and it disabled drives for a few seconds, it provides a window in which a hatch breaker can connect and bring a ship to a stop.
Its easy to declare you are are game designer. I've designed games as well. I've implemented features in games according to my own designs.
What is important in game design is thinking of edge cases and unitended consequences of making changes without thinking them through.
What i've suggested before (and maybe people can critique it) is NPC comms, where you can make demands for ships to submit. I mean, even an Elite NPC should be ready to stand down after you've taken down its shields, its weapons, and damaged its internals and hull. You've shown you have the capability to destroy it.
I find the fact that anything higher than Mostly Harmless will continue to reboot after its powerplant is destroyed ridiculous.
It's not a huge problem to solve.
Any amount of thrust from a ship breaks the limpets hold on the ship.
Done.
There is a point reached when the motivation to object to an idea becomes a little too obviously just status quo.
Discussing ideas and potential issues around them is fine. But, at some point, the forum design committee just needs to accept that some things can just be better and that it's really FDev's job to navigate the pitfalls of making an idea work.
Discussing ideas and potential issues around them is fine. But, at some point, the forum design committee just needs to accept that some things can just be better and that it's really FDev's job to navigate the pitfalls of making an idea work.
Because it's fun? Not the usual shoot and press easy button. It's out of ordinary, where else am I suppose to bump other ships in space to get them to stop?
There's force shell cannons, they work. Takes a lot of practice, but they do work.
I wouldn't call just pressing a button "cool" and certainly not "fun"
Umm...the whole game is a series of button presses...
Yes, but that wasn't the design i was given to implement. Which is why the gankers were loving it. Don't ask me, i'm only a dev, not a designer. I just what the designers tell me to do.
I’m fine with a series of button presses, where it allows for failiure. Where practicing that series of button presses makes you more efficient. That’s how games should be made.
What I’m not fine with, is the easy way that requires nothing but a button press and done.
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The bumping of ships to a stop thing.
I can (almost) guarantee the designers didn't intend for this to be the way it works. The design is that you use hatch breakers and chase stuff down, and grab what you can.
That's not satisfactory to many players (they want to drain every last cargo item, of course! who wouldn't!) but that's what they intend to happen. I find it extremely dubious they actually thought "Yeah, they'll knock out the drives, and then slowly try to match speed, and drift just towards them, to bring them to a stop in space, then start getting..."
It's so obviously not a designers idea of how their game should work it's laughable to think it is.
Some players may well enjoy it, and that's cool.
It is a terrible "mechanic" though
I can (almost) guarantee the designers didn't intend for this to be the way it works. The design is that you use hatch breakers and chase stuff down, and grab what you can.
That's not satisfactory to many players (they want to drain every last cargo item, of course! who wouldn't!) but that's what they intend to happen. I find it extremely dubious they actually thought "Yeah, they'll knock out the drives, and then slowly try to match speed, and drift just towards them, to bring them to a stop in space, then start getting..."
It's so obviously not a designers idea of how their game should work it's laughable to think it is.
Some players may well enjoy it, and that's cool.
It is a terrible "mechanic" though
i actually think, current method is the effect of various piracy and combat overhauls.
originally:
- hachbreaker don't work with shields up
- ships sit still when powerplant being shot out.
so (around 2016) it looked like that pve: attack trader, shoot out powerplant, eventually shoot out shieldgenerator, hatch break away.
to buff this, hullstrength of trader ships was upped
step 2:
- to make player-piracy more viable and make it possible to pirate without shooting down, hatchbreaker work through shields
- combat: to counter shooting out powerplants as meta they still keep 50% output, so ships don't sit still
- combat: explosives get very strong to destroy external modules (role for missiles)
so now, new meta is shooting out thrusters. but with zero thrusters, ships don't sit still, but float.
note, that most of the crucial changes weren't even on pve.piracy...
Yep, exactly. It's the resultant mess.
I still feel like shooting out of the thrusters is the coolest way to handle it though - so some method beyond this...(come on, even if you find it fun) - awkward bump stopping thing, to bring ships to a halt after they are disabled.
If it only works while the ship is unable to move, it'd be fine and not "exploitable by gankers" because you'd need to be unable to escape anyway.
It’s no more awkward than cooking yourself in order to dish out more damage and yet that’s the meta.
What would you propose then? Just interdicting and shooting out drives is way too easy for it to be interesting at all.
Why do it if you don’t like it? Combat now earns more anyway and it’s the usual shooting things down with no extra awkward steps.
When the missions they give us are to steal 130 tons of cargo from a type 7 that's carrying 130 tons, how else are we supposed to do it besides drain every last cargo item? Every last cargo item is literally the mission objective we're given.
None of this would be a problem if spilled canisters maintained momentum and limpets were able to move at decent speeds to keep up (maybe limited in acceleration or something so that they can still be left behind if you smash boost or change direction sharply)
the problem isn't the ship drifting off, it's the ship drifting off while you have to stop and collect its spilled containers which are mysteriously anchored in space
Yes, the missions are pretty dumb considering the mechanics.
Yes, agreed, limpet speeds are silly, also, them exploding if you are moving more than 30ms is dumb too.
Last night I got pirated for the first time by a Commander at a Community Goal. He was asking nicely, and I complied and dropped 2 times the requested amount, since I had plenty.
Looks like this can also be fun.
it was also my first direct message I sent to the pirate - I have to improve on those (the UI does not help my spontaneity).
To stop haplessly drifting ships I'd suggest we get some rocket controlled lasso module or some thrusting limpets to get it stabilised. No way I would support space magic tractor beam nonsense.