Please improve the functionality of "Report Crimes On/Off"

To be absolutely clear, as it's plain Sandro has already entirely taken on board, but for other forum posters/readers:

All we are talking about here is permitting those of us who like 'unscripted' PvP, and may welcome being attacked 'for no reason' the option - as the victim - of choosing to turn and fight our attackers without summoning police assistance.

Running 20 Ly away to the nearest anarchy in they hope they might follow wouldn't really achieve the same thing, I'm afraid. Neither does trying to agree terms with them. All we are asking for is the opportunity - as the victim - to choose to kill or be killed on the spot, no police required...!

Not entirely true. It would also affect PvE, but also in a good way (assuming this isn't implemented in a silly only if combatants are all players kind of way). There are times where NPC pirates will interdict you and they are clean. You may be smuggling or carrying a privacy sensitive passenger or something, so have report crimes off but are also clean. This option would allow you to return fire, without having cops show up and risking them scanning you which could ruin your day.

It's just a good idea that should be implemented. Perhaps an addition is we are notified if they call for assistance. Think of it as we hear the call so it shows in comms as something simple like [cmdr name]: requested assistance. Just so it's clear as to what's actually happening (currently we know assistance is coming because we get a bounty or it's increased, but we do know it's coming, with this we'll know we've been reported due to bounty, but also know they if they have/haven't requested assistance). Informed gameplay is better than guessing IMO.
 
What functions does the report crimes off do?

IMO this shouldn't even be in the game. If we had a more robust crime system then any action you carry out in a law abiding system would result in your crimes being reported.

I'm probably missing some element of the report crimes mechanic for this though. Even if you are smuggling stuff/passenger etc it should still report if you have a crime committed against you IMO. It's up to you then to get out of the situation if the local police intervene in your attack. Lets face it, it wouldn't be the first time a criminal was caught because police went to help them initially :)
 
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Not entirely true. It would also affect PvE, but also in a good way (assuming this isn't implemented in a silly only if combatants are all players kind of way). There are times where NPC pirates will interdict you and they are clean. You may be smuggling or carrying a privacy sensitive passenger or something, so have report crimes off but are also clean. This option would allow you to return fire, without having cops show up and risking them scanning you which could ruin your day.

Thank you, this is a really good point. Of course it would be equally useful to clean Cmdrs who wish to fight NPC's without authority assistance in some situations also.

It's just a good idea that should be implemented. Perhaps an addition is we are notified if they call for assistance. Think of it as we hear the call so it shows in comms as something simple like [cmdr name]: requested assistance. Just so it's clear as to what's actually happening (currently we know assistance is coming because we get a bounty or it's increased, but we do know it's coming, with this we'll know we've been reported due to bounty, but also know they if they have/haven't requested assistance). Informed gameplay is better than guessing IMO.

Yes, another good point. Ideally I also think that the Report Crimes status of a targeted ship should show up after basic scan in the left panel, alongside shield %, bounty value, etc.

What functions does the report crimes off do?

IMO this shouldn't even be in the game. If we had a more robust crime system then any action you carry out in a law abiding system would result in your crimes being reported.

The 'Report Crimes On/Off' toggle can be accessed from the right panel. By default, it is on. By switching it off, you choose that any crimes committed against your own ship (not anyone else's ship!) are not reported to the authorities - basically, they don't exist.

Hence, PvP-ers are able to carry out consensual duelling and wing fighting in any system without authority ships appearing to break up the party, because when we shoot each other, no police are summoned and (if clean) we say clean. No bounties are incurred.

Without the report crimes toggle it would be impossible to engage in consensual PvP outside of anarchies, meaning that, for example, Adle's Armada could not practice PvP outside of their home station of Cleve Hub, Eravate, and all rounds of the current Season 3 of the PvP league would have to be conducted in anarchies.

The issue the OP addresses is a proposal to add a degree of sophistication to the current system to deal with the situation where the victim of (what would have been) a crime in policed space wishes to deal with it themselves without any police being summoned.

This situation arises where the aggressor has report crimes 'on' - basically, in that situation, as the game stands, police will be summoned to attack the aggressor or to attack the victim, depending on whether the victim has report crimes on or off respectively. The proposal is to add a third option which would permit the victim to defend themselves legally yet alone.
 
OP also sparked up the discussion on reddit, and some good suggestions came up there. Here are some of the ones that seemed most interesting to me, to further the discussion:
- a "Call cops" button of sorts, suggested by CMDR John F Casey;
- a "Manually report crimes" 3rd option, as comms message to witch you can respond, suggested u/Fistandant1lus;
- some indication to a CMDRs "report crimes" status, requested u/ManOfFlesh101;
- ability to deploy some sort of Distress beacon, suggested u/whooo_me and CMDR Issues666.
- timeouts when switching to a higher sec. option, like OFF to "no assist"/ON and "no assist" to ON, say I :D
 
What functions does the report crimes off do?

IMO this shouldn't even be in the game. If we had a more robust crime system then any action you carry out in a law abiding system would result in your crimes being reported.

I'm probably missing some element of the report crimes mechanic for this though. Even if you are smuggling stuff/passenger etc it should still report if you have a crime committed against you IMO. It's up to you then to get out of the situation if the local police intervene in your attack. Lets face it, it wouldn't be the first time a criminal was caught because police went to help them initially :)

As it stands, it is necessary for smugglers as one wouldn't want the authorities to show up and perform a scan, no matter what.
The 3rd option from OP is a good solution.
 
Thank you, this is a really good point. Of course it would be equally useful to clean Cmdrs who wish to fight NPC's without authority assistance in some situations also.

Yes for that exact PvE reason I would welcome this.

I generally have report crimes turned off because I don't want the cops turning up, for various reasons, I mean carrying a UA, it's illegal galaxy wide.

But when I am interdicted for my big "out of system" bounty, the aggressor never becomes wanted so I can't fire back.

"Report Crimes against me but assistance not required" would be my (and I think most player's) preferred option, would get a lot of use I think by PvEers.
 
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Hello Commander Shadowdancer!

Yes, they are options, a "report this crime but refuse assistance" would make sense with the reputation of the Pilot's Federation, and I would imagine that the authorities would always be grateful when someone offered to do their job for free.

So this is the big C&P thing you guys are working on?
 
Well I have smuggled a fair bit and I've never turned report crimes off yet. If I get attacked and the cops show up I'm already on my way out.

To me this was always a placeholder for an increased functional C&P system. I'd rather have a 'dueling' mechanic than this silly toggle IMO.
 
Hello Commander Shadowdancer!

Yes, they are options, a "report this crime but refuse assistance" would make sense with the reputation of the Pilot's Federation, and I would imagine that the authorities would always be grateful when someone offered to do their job for free.

Hi Sandro, I hope you are well and version 3.0 is coming along nicely.

The Pilot's Federation, like other organizations in the game, needs a buff. Please do put KARMA on Pilot's Federation. It makes perfect sense and what I expected from the get-go. We might allow consensual PvP, but by and large Pilot's Federation members should not attack each other and offending guild members should of course, be ejected.

Cheers and Beers!
 
Related but not entirely related.

If I'm wanted via NPC kills in a system, and a clean player pulls and attacks me attempting to collect that bounty and I murder said player, how does work with this C&P system?

In my eyes they effectively started the altercation. I merely finished it. My concern here is if I'm flying a high credit rebuy ship, and decide I'd like to fly a say a Viper to entice lower level ships to engage me, would I still pay the higher rebuy even though I didn't start either fight, I'm playing well within the accepted "rules" of the game?
This has been my version of PvP and has been working well, I'm not attacking those not looking for it as they are coming to me....
 
Related but not entirely related.

If I'm wanted via NPC kills in a system, and a clean player pulls and attacks me attempting to collect that bounty and I murder said player, how does work with this C&P system?

In my eyes they effectively started the altercation. I merely finished it. My concern here is if I'm flying a high credit rebuy ship, and decide I'd like to fly a say a Viper to entice lower level ships to engage me, would I still pay the higher rebuy even though I didn't start either fight, I'm playing well within the accepted "rules" of the game?
This has been my version of PvP and has been working well, I'm not attacking those not looking for it as they are coming to me....

My guess is, if you are wanted when they attack you, then they will be clean when you shoot back at them. So killing them will lead to you having a PF bounty on your head.....on top of your other bounties.
 
My concern is the ship rebuy. If I happen to be flying an FDL and then jump in my Viper.
Am I paying the FDL rebuy?
My goal isn't to avoid being wanted. Just sometimes players don't bite on the FDL but are more than eager to go after the Viper.
But I'm not enthused about eating a 6.5 million rebuy.

I'm fine with the global bounty,
 
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My concern is the ship rebuy. If I happen to be flying an FDL and then jump in my Viper.
Am I paying the FDL rebuy?
My goal isn't to avoid being wanted. Just sometimes players don't bite on the FDL but are more than eager to go after the Viper.
But I'm not enthused about eating a 6.5 million rebuy.

I'm fine with the global bounty,

I *think* if you do your murdering spree in the FDL, then switch to the viper and get defeated, then yes, you'll pay the FDL rebuy.

Basically, it seems the PF Bounty will be semi-tied to the ship you commited the offence in.
 
I *think* if you do your murdering spree in the FDL, then switch to the viper and get defeated, then yes, you'll pay the FDL rebuy.

Basically, it seems the PF Bounty will be semi-tied to the ship you commited the offence in.

The above is my understanding also.

Anyway, in light of this thread here ...

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...ew-C-amp-P-improvements?p=5646693#post5646693

... I'd like to summarise the three proposals now under discussion:


1. Add a third option to Report Crimes: 'Report Crimes Against Me But Do Not Summon Assistance'

2. Make it impossible to toggle Report Crimes whilst in combat with another player
(such as by making the options variable only when docked, or not variable within a certain time of taking fire)

3. Make Report Crimes status of a target vessel visible upon completion of basic scan



Item 1 is my original proposal, in the OP of this Suggestions thread. It is devoted to permitting Cmdrs to have the option to defend themselves from PvP attack without unwanted help from NPC authority ships.

Items 2 and 3 are proposals made by another player, in the linked thread, which have my full support. They are devoted to saving consensual duellists from accruing unwarranted Pilots Federation bounties under the new C&P system because their opponent innocently or deliberately has Report Crimes On, when he has said it was Off, or as trolling switches Report Crimes back On mid-duel.

I hope all of this will be considered in the run up to and during Beta 2.4.

Thanks indeed,

Truesilver
 
The above is my understanding also.

Anyway, in light of this thread here ...

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...ew-C-amp-P-improvements?p=5646693#post5646693

... I'd like to summarise the three proposals now under discussion:


1. Add a third option to Report Crimes: 'Report Crimes Against Me But Do Not Summon Assistance'

2. Make it impossible to toggle Report Crimes whilst in combat with another player
(such as by making the options variable only when docked, or not variable within a certain time of taking fire)

3. Make Report Crimes status of a target vessel visible upon completion of basic scan



Item 1 is my original proposal, in the OP of this Suggestions thread. It is devoted to permitting Cmdrs to have the option to defend themselves from PvP attack without unwanted help from NPC authority ships.

Items 2 and 3 are proposals made by another player, in the linked thread, which have my full support. They are devoted to saving consensual duellists from accruing unwarranted Pilots Federation bounties under the new C&P system because their opponent innocently or deliberately has Report Crimes On, when he has said it was Off, or as trolling switches Report Crimes back On mid-duel.

I hope all of this will be considered in the run up to and during Beta 2.4.

Thanks indeed,

Truesilver

On Point 2.

This is unfair to PvE players. If as a PvE player I am interdicted then I have every right to alert the Police. That is literally what the "report crimes" system is for.

Even in the situation where I think I can put up a fight and so defend myself... I'm minding my own business and am interdicted, and if it turns out 10 minutes in I'm not up to it, I STILL should be able to call in the cops.

Again that's literally the role of the Police and why I can call them in, to protect someone innocent being killed by a criminal.
 
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1. Add a third option to Report Crimes: 'Report Crimes Against Me But Do Not Summon Assistance'

2. Make it impossible to toggle Report Crimes whilst in combat with another player
(such as by making the options variable only when docked, or not variable within a certain time of taking fire)

3. Make Report Crimes status of a target vessel visible upon completion of basic scan



Item 1 is my original proposal, in the OP of this Suggestions thread. It is devoted to permitting Cmdrs to have the option to defend themselves from PvP attack without unwanted help from NPC authority ships.

Items 2 and 3 are proposals made by another player, in the linked thread, which have my full support. They are devoted to saving consensual duellists from accruing unwarranted Pilots Federation bounties under the new C&P system because their opponent innocently or deliberately has Report Crimes On, when he has said it was Off, or as trolling switches Report Crimes back On mid-duel.

I hope all of this will be considered in the run up to and during Beta 2.4.

Thanks indeed,

Truesilver

1: Seems fair to me cant see any problem with that.

2: No cant agree with that at all as it would prevent a person turning it on if they were hunting wanted NPC's and didnt want assistance but then a player jumped in and attacked.

3. Makes no sense at all unless you have a kill-warrant scanner maybe then it would tell you.
 
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