PLEASE MAKE POWERPLAY IN "OPEN ONLY"

[Agony_Aunt]

My answer is to continue to bring this discussion up because that's all people can do to affect change, speak up. This original post has nothing to do with not doing research.

As long as you are fine with people repeating the same objections they have raised in the other posts.

There is a reason there used to be a common megathread for this topic called Hotel Califorina.

Perhaps its time to bring back the megathread!

Mods! Can we get Hotel California part deux?

 

[lenna]

Pretty much what i've suggested in the past, although 6 is interesting. They could add an alternate terrotiral game called PurePlay, which is 100% PvE mechanics, but better than Powerplay

Perhaps - personally, I think the amount of work required to ensure that no-one would lose out would not be worth the LOE involved and would necessarily hobble PP and essentially make it meaningless. Better for FD just to maintain PP as mode agnostic.

3 is almost- the only footprint between the BGS and PP in the proposal would be control systems

There would have to be ZERO interaction between the two.

5 is inferred (or that you are warned when swapping about merits / cargo held)

Not the same thing as what I am talking about. There would need to be not even a hint of PP's existence outside of open if it were to be made OO.

6 is called the BGS

False - PP and the BGS are different things with different gameplay.

 

[CMDR Cknarf]

This might have support if 69% of the power play community weren’t RP nerds in a private group.

Heyooooooooo

 

[Kaocraft]

Mods! Can we get Hotel California part deux?

You hate and fear this conversation so much that you demand it be shut down? It's not enough to either make good faith arguments or simply choose not to participate?

 

[Agony_Aunt]

You hate and fear this conversation so much that you demand it be shut down? It's not enough to either make good faith arguments or simply choose not to participate?

LOL, you're mistaken. I love these debates. Its not about shutting it down, its about bringing back the stickied megathread. You should be overyjoyed! It would be sticked to the top of the forum for everyone to see, especially all those who have never experienced the glory of an open only debate before.

They are something special.

 

[Agony_Aunt]

This might have support if 69% of the power play community weren’t RP nerds in a private group.

Heyooooooooo

Can i get a citation on that 69%? And who are you calling a nerd? Oh... right, carry on

 

[Rebel Yell]

....and INF+ only missions for BGS in solo / PG.

No effect on BGS whatsoever from bounty hunting, killing ships, trading, selling explo data etc.

 

[Rubbernuke]

There would have to be ZERO interaction between the two.


Not the same thing as what I am talking about. There would need to be not even a hint of PP's existence outside of open if it were to be made OO.


False - PP and the BGS are different things with different gameplay.

I'm simply going by what Sandro posted, which is broadly in line with your request- and is what I gauge FD are willing to do.

And the BGS now is miles better from a gameplay and variety perspective. Powerplay is haul and shoot rather anemic NPCs. In the BGS you have everything from missions plus freeform gameplay (trade / BM, BH / murder, explore (data), megaships, better CZs, regular tweaks).

You seem to want everything the same regardless, when in reality each feature should be unique and offer something the rest of the game cannot provide. I've argued long and hard that Open Powerplay would compliment (and not replace / displace) a multi mode BGS giving players more choice and not less.

 

[lenna]

I'm simply going by what Sandro posted, which is broadly in line with your request- and is what I gauge FD are willing to do.

And the BGS now is miles better from a gameplay and variety perspective. Powerplay is haul and shoot rather anemic NPCs. In the BGS you have everything from missions plus freeform gameplay (trade / BM, BH / murder, explore (data), megaships, better CZs, regular tweaks).

You seem to want everything the same regardless, when in reality each feature should be unique and offer something the rest of the game cannot provide.

I think you are missing the point...

I've argued long and hard that Open Powerplay would compliment (and not breplace / displace) a multi mode BGS giving players more choice and not less.

Except the point of fact is that by changing PP to be Open Only you would be REMOVING options from non-Open players. For some, playing in Open is not an option - the rationale behind that is many and varied but ultimately moot - that boat sailed years ago, and it is not right for FD to remove options from one player or another without good reason and there is no good reason for changing PP to being Open Only.

PP already offer unique gameplay on top of the BGS and complements it - Open Only is not required for that, further more I feel that PvP in general does NOT need to be rammed down people's throats like the Open-Only crowd seem to want. Be it Open Only PP or any other Open Only discussion the root argument is the same - some do not like the fact that PvP is entirely optional in ED and want to effectively try to force people into engaging in it.

That general principle is one I can never support and will oppose any suggestion that heads along those lines.

 

[Rubbernuke]

I think you are missing the point...


Except the point of fact is that by changing PP to be Open Only you would be REMOVING options from non-Open players. For some, playing in Open is not an option - the rationale behind that is many and varied but ultimately moot - that boat sailed years ago, and it is not right for FD to remove options from one player or another without good reason and there is no good reason for changing PP to being Open Only.

PP already offer unique gameplay on top of the BGS and complements it - Open Only is not required for that, further more I feel that PvP in general does NOT need to be rammed down people's throats like the Open-Only crowd seem to want. Be it Open Only PP or any other Open Only discussion the root argument is the same - some do not like the fact that PvP is entirely optional in ED and want to effectively try to force people into engaging in it.

That general principle is one I can never support and will oppose any suggestion that heads along those lines.

But what exact gameplay is missing from the BGS that is in Powerplay? I told you the gameplay loops involved, and in Solo / PG Powerplay they are very short and repetitive, do not reward, and creates frustration due to its mixed mode design. Powerplay is essentially in a catatonic state and has been outpaced with BGS / squadrons development. It needs a unique selling point otherwise what is it for? Module shoppers? Powerplay requires massive amounts of love for what people describe, FD don't want to invest that time, hence Sandro rolled the dice on Open to give Powerplay a reason to exist above and beyond what Squadrons and the new BGS give us.

There is a very good reason to swap to Open- ED does not currently have any (outside CQC) direct player on player / team v team gameplay, especially out in the bubble. Out of all the features in ED Powerplay is the one best suited to repositioning for this. You have clear pledges, powers, simple objectives (move this, shoot that) and these are easy to disrupt player on player. From this simple mix it creates dynamic situations you simply do not get anywhere else in ED. You would then have CQC for 1: 1 arena fights, Open Powerplay for co-ordinated team action, and the rest of the game for everyone as it is now. This is not forcing people to have interactions with others, its giving a new option to players- hence choice.

The BGS in comparison is ideal for multi modes because missions are essentially hidden from other players so you can't easily identify an agenda.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Mods! Can we get Hotel California part deux?

No need. We're still residents of part one. You can tell by the warm smell of colitas in here.

Anyway, I'm in favour of Open Only Powerplay, because:
1. It doesn't affect me.
2. I would like to see the surge of PvP players that was promised to me.
3. I'm already looking forward to the deflections when that strong surge doesn't materialise.
4. People have told me Open Only Powerplay would stop ganking. Since ganking is the biggest detriment to this game I am in favour of it.
5. I'm already looking forward to the deflections when ganking continues after OOPP.

So, here's what I'd like to see and will never get. Since the subject of OOPP is about people wanting to see something they'd never get.

OOPP is introduced, but when after 6 months the following conditions aren't met, it's revoked.
1. A significant structural increase of PvP players who regularly engage in PP.
2. A significant decrease in ganking activities.
3. Optional: world peace.

Let's face it, console players without mp access on their console internet plan who participate in power play is what...5 people?

I'm hazarding a guess you're not part of those 5 people?

It's easy to dismiss the downfalls of others isn't it?

On the other hand, the number of players that will return after OOPP is introduced is what ... 5 people?

If you disagree with my 5 people claim, I am sure you will object to it after you supported your 5 people claim

 

[CMDR KOBAL]

But what exact gameplay is missing from the BGS that is in Powerplay? I told you the gameplay loops involved, and in Solo / PG Powerplay they are very short and repetitive, do not reward, and creates frustration due to its mixed mode design. Powerplay is essentially in a catatonic state and has been outpaced with BGS / squadrons development. It needs a unique selling point otherwise what is it for? Module shoppers? Powerplay requires massive amounts of love for what people describe, FD don't want to invest that time, hence Sandro rolled the dice on Open to give Powerplay a reason to exist above and beyond what Squadrons and the new BGS give us.

There is a very good reason to swap to Open- ED does not currently have any (outside CQC) direct player on player / team v team gameplay, especially out in the bubble. Out of all the features in ED Powerplay is the one best suited to repositioning for this. You have clear pledges, powers, simple objectives (move this, shoot that) and these are easy to disrupt player on player. From this simple mix it creates dynamic situations you simply do not get anywhere else in ED. You would then have CQC for 1: 1 arena fights, Open Powerplay for co-ordinated team action, and the rest of the game for everyone as it is now. This is not forcing people to have interactions with others, its giving a new option to players- hence choice.

The BGS in comparison is ideal for multi modes because missions are essentially hidden from other players so you can't easily identify an agenda.

Very well said. I couldn't agree more.

 

[Commander Biscuit]

This might have support if 69% of the power play community weren’t RP nerds in a private group.

That 69% are actually just the ones that want to unlock the modules.

The RP nerds are the other 31% pretending that an inconsequential game feature is justification to shoot at other players.

This game doesn't require you to justify shooting other players. Take off your robe and wizard hat, go camp an engineer or CG and have at it.

 

[Knot2clever]

Stop people playing in open affecting my power play. All the work I do is undermined by people who are invisible to me undoing all my hard work.

 

[The Replicated Man]

Stop people playing in open affecting my power play. All the work I do is undermined by people who are invisible to me undoing all my hard work.

That's a Knot2clever request...

 

[Agony_Aunt]

No need. We're still residents of part one. You can tell by the warm smell of colitas in here.

Anyway, I'm in favour of Open Only Powerplay, because:
1. It doesn't affect me.
2. I would like to see the surge of PvP players that was promised to me.
3. I'm already looking forward to the deflections when that strong surge doesn't materialise.
4. People have told me Open Only Powerplay would stop ganking. Since ganking is the biggest detriment to this game I am in favour of it.
5. I'm already looking forward to the deflections when ganking continues after OOPP.

So, here's what I'd like to see and will never get. Since the subject of OOPP is about people wanting to see something they'd never get.

OOPP is introduced, but when after 6 months the following conditions aren't met, it's revoked.
1. A significant structural increase of PvP players who regularly engage in PP.
2. A significant decrease in ganking activities.
3. Optional: world peace.


I'm hazarding a guess you're not part of those 5 people?

It's easy to dismiss the downfalls of others isn't it?

On the other hand, the number of players that will return after OOPP is introduced is what ... 5 people?

If you disagree with my 5 people claim, I am sure you will object to it after you supported your 5 people claim

So, if i'm in favour of world peace, i must be in favour of OOPP? :O

I see it more like this:

OOPP happens: Gankers try to gank PPers
Since most easy targets have quit PP, its either combat fitted ships or haulers who know how to deal with gankers
Gankers go back to ganking soft targets because its not fair when people shoot back
FD look at results, say OOPP has caused PP to lose players, revert change
Gankers continue to gank soft targets
New thread on the forums explaining what went wrong with OOPP last time, but if FD do it again, but change something, it will definitely work this time.
FD do nothing
New threads appear with regularity for the next 5 years
FD do nothing
Star Citizen enters Tier 0 beta.

 

[CMDR KOBAL]

So, if i'm in favour of world peace, i must be in favour of OOPP? :O

I see it more like this:

OOPP happens: Gankers try to gank PPers
Since most easy targets have quit PP, its either combat fitted ships or haulers who know how to deal with gankers
Gankers go back to ganking soft targets because its not fair when people shoot back
FD look at results, say OOPP has caused PP to lose players, revert change
Gankers continue to gank soft targets
New thread on the forums explaining what went wrong with OOPP last time, but if FD do it again, but change something, it will definitely work this time.
FD do nothing
New threads appear with regularity for the next 5 years
FD do nothing
Star Citizen enters Tier 0 beta.

I think there is a lot more people who are interested in competitive combat than you're suggesting. And yes, competitive combat is going to be combat ships fighting combat ships, piloted by real people. Sure, there is plenty of ganking exploration vessels and haulers these days but I think a lot of that is a result of boredom as there just isn't anyone to play with. I agree, there will always be people who just only seem to want to destroy non-combat ships with combat ships. I'm just saying that I don't believe the people that want to only play like this are a smaller percentage of the pvp oriented crowd than you are implying.

Everyone wants to make such strong cases by saying that you can't take away features of the game for certain people. Well what about providing a feature in the game that is built on other people engaging each other in combat?
Does this segment of the population matter?

IT'S A GAME LARGELY ABOUT BUILDING SPACESHIPS AND WEAPONS.

Is it really so bad that there are people asking FDev for a feature in the game that promotes us using these ships and weapons against each other with strategic purpose behind it?

 

[Lestat]

I am reading this. To me, it only caters to PvP. Which is why the Op idea Fails.

 

[CMDR KOBAL]

I am reading this. To me, it only caters to PvP. Which is why the Op idea Fails.

OK. What feature exists in Elite to promote PVP with strategic purpose and affect the Galaxy we live in? I don't care if the feature is called POWERPLAY or anything else, (this is sarcasm, don't read this as me attacking you) we just want a feature that let's us play.

 

[Lestat]

No, Your idea is to force people who like playing powerplay into open right into the hands of PvP. Which you ignore people who play solo or private. Mostly are the older generation of Elite players. Who played the original Elite game that was made in 1984. Not everyone to be forced into any mode to do something they like.