Powerplay 2.0 “Open” Rewards

[Rubbernuke]

Interdiction wouldn't have to be involved. There's no rule that says it has to be. If anything, the general mediocrity of interdiction would push me to be more inclined to not have it involved at all.

Hauling is easy, by definition. That's basically one of the defining characteristics of the activity. If you don't want that, you basically don't want haulers to participate at all. You want pvpers to do hauling, which is completely different.

My ideal power play has a place and a time for all types of players, making them equal. Haulers can haul all day long if they want. If the combat players want to outcompete them, they would simply need to invest more time into combat. They cannot and should not be able to stop them from hauling via combat - and that includes via npc intervention.

The biggest problem of Power Play One is that hauling is the only activity. People should be able to do whatever they want, including pvp, and have that effort count.

But I see no compelling reason why players who just want to do hauling or mining should also be compelled to do PVP. Historically speaking, PVP(and, shall we say, combat as a whole) has been the least important aspect of power play. It certainly should not stay so completely irrelevant, but it also should not become the sole determining Factor of whether or not a power is Victorious. And that is exactly what your proposals would achieve.

Powerplay is meant to be a competitive activity, not a combat specific activity. I am willing to offer quite a bit to make it more enjoyable to players like you, but not so far as to make it unenjoyable to myself. And that's exactly what your proposals would accomplish.

Any proposal that entails requiring players to play in a way they don't enjoy is dead in the water, as far as I'm concerned.

Interdiction is a part of the game now. You have SCO, you have fast boot. You have well established ways to escape on top of being able to choose how, when and what with you engage in game. To not include it is to cut away large chunks of the game and what you have to do.

You make the mistake of thinking this hauling is in isolation. Outside of PP hauling is easy- its an unguided activity often for small rewards. Inside PP its different it how powers stay solvent- therefore it needs to be under pressure for powers to have weaknesses. V2 has this as well, and must be vulnerable to players and NPCs.

Powerplay acts as a wrapper to all activities inside it- its a competition between 11 powers for dominance. Combat has always formed a large proportion of that- all powers UM by combat as an example.

 

[Rebel Yell]

C'mon... combat & hauling have a place even in current PP 1.0 (if only...), a lot has been said by @Rubbernuke I'm just bringing a real-game example (as I read a lot of theorycrafting): when targeting an enemy system for a 100% uMMing, at the moment the best option is to opt for a "snipe" > enemy can "scout" the system for merits held but not yet delivered against a system > to avoid being uMMed the system just needs to be fort'ed (this translates into a cancel). Leaving aside the instancing/tz/blocklists/carebear-mode crappy excuses, in order to avoid fort'ing the attacker must set a blockade (station/SC depends on the power) > this is 100% combat PvP activity for the attacker, whilst defender must haul running the risk and/or using escorts/decoys etc.

 

[Darkfyre99]

Believe it or not that PvP happens now- the problem is the rules around it blunt an actual outcome.

I believe it. My skepticism is whether or not you’ll see more of it if the players currently in Solo/PG are coerced into Open to participate in PowerPlay.

If someone attacks a hauler (which is within the rules and expected) and the hauler logs, the latter can carry on seconds later as if that encounter had never happened with no penalty- thats not fair or logical.

In that scenario, where the player is under direct attack? I agree. But that’s the kind of player I’d rather have in Solo/PG, anyways. I’ve encountered blessedly few of that type of the few times I’ve gone “marauding,” which is more than I can say about past games. And they’ve all been in combat ships, rather than cargo haulers.

I’d ask why they were in Open, but I know the reason why. I was a bit amused by the fact they dropped out the instant they get a message from a G3 iCourier calling themselves a “Shield Inspector,” but they weren’t technically under attack, so it’s within the rules. If that was a daily occurrence though? I’d definitely be frustrated, and it’s that frustration of the past (plus currently limited time constraints) that has led to my indifference towards engaging in PvP today.

But a rule that causes you to lose merits if you log out when not under direct attack? That’s not fair, nor logical. That’s using a sledgehammer to push in a thumb tack. It’s penalizing the innocent in a vain attempt to punish the guilty.

People complaining about it being unfair forget its a team game, you can go elsewhere, you can change your build and compromise to the situation, or fight back. The choice of response is theirs but that choice has to be within gameplay.

It should also be a fun game, as well as a team game. And it’s a team game I want as many players as possible to participate in, irregardless of PvP inclination, motivation, or for that matter time. PowerPlay 2.0 looks to still be a PvE contest in the end, though we definitely need more info on what Frontier thinks PvP is going to involve. I suspect that we've already gotten that information, which is "defend the Stronghold Fleet from sabateurs and spies," and that isn't a scenario I've seen work well in the past. And it would pretty much fit Frontier’s “let’s not learn from the mistakes of the past,” MO thus far.

I’ve played far too many games of this nature where the pursuit of guarded PvP objectives don’t result in epic battles, but both sides avoiding them at all costs. It starts with a few bad actors and some hyper-competitive groups trying to optimize their efficiency to “win” at a game that isn’t designed to be won, only abandoned. More groups adopt those tactics to be competitive, and it snowballs from there.

It could very well be that this describes the state of PowerPlay 1.0 regarding Solo/PG, despite the near universal claims to the contrary. It could very well be that the PowerPlay community isn't more likely to be in Open vs the general playerbase, but less likely. Personally, I think it's the other way around, and the instancing is just that bad for this type of gameplay.

Frontier has many rules in this game that needlessly punish the time poor, to the point where I don’t play this game nearly as much as similar MMOs I’ve played in the past, which were much more accommodating. This is a game where, if I want to do anything besides explore, and perhaps trade, I need to have at least an hour of time that is likely to be uninterrupted, and that is a rare and precious commodity for me these days. It's even worse when it comes to on-foot gameplay, especially on-foot stealth missions. It's an unnecessary friction against engagement, much like how merit decay has always been a friction towards me more actively earning merits.

Frontier's changes to PowerPlay 2.0 removes that major friction against earning merits, and from the sound of things, it’ll be kinder to the time poor player as well as the more casual one. Ultimately, the true test will be when we get our hands on PP2.0.

Personally, I’ll be doing my thing in Open, and take my lumps fair and square. Whether I’ll be actively hunting Commanders or not really depends upon how well Stronghold FCs work as choke points, whether instancing is robust enough to instance me with the opposition, and whether they’re also willing to take their lumps fair and square.

 

[Rubbernuke]

In that scenario, where the player is under direct attack? I agree. But that’s the kind of player I’d rather have in Solo/PG, anyways. I’ve encountered blessedly few of that type of the few times I’ve gone “marauding,” which is more than I can say about past games. And they’ve all been in combat ships, rather than cargo haulers.

I’d ask why they were in Open, but I know the reason why. I was a bit amused by the fact they dropped out the instant they get a message from a G3 iCourier calling themselves a “Shield Inspector,” but they weren’t technically under attack, so it’s within the rules. If that was a daily occurrence though? I’d definitely be frustrated, and it’s that frustration of the past (plus currently limited time constraints) that has led to my indifference towards engaging in PvP today.

But a rule that causes you to lose merits if you log out when not under direct attack? That’s not fair, nor logical. That’s using a sledgehammer to push in a thumb tack. It’s penalizing the innocent in a vain attempt to punish the guilty.

By attack I mean you have hostiles (red) attacking you- which is in the game right now and has the timer. I would change the working to say any merits and PP cargo will be lost. When the coast is clear and no hostiles you can log out as much as you like and everything then has consistency and can't be gamed.

It should also be a fun game, as well as a team game. And it’s a team game I want as many players as possible to participate in, irregardless of PvP inclination, motivation, or for that matter time. PowerPlay 2.0 looks to still be a PvE contest in the end, though we definitely need more info on what Frontier thinks PvP is going to involve. I suspect that we've already gotten that information, which is "defend the Stronghold Fleet from sabateurs and spies," and that isn't a scenario I've seen work well in the past. And it would pretty much fit Frontier’s “let’s not learn from the mistakes of the past,” MO thus far.

I’ve played far too many games of this nature where the pursuit of guarded PvP objectives don’t result in epic battles, but both sides avoiding them at all costs. It starts with a few bad actors and some hyper-competitive groups trying to optimize their efficiency to “win” at a game that isn’t designed to be won, only abandoned. More groups adopt those tactics to be competitive, and it snowballs from there.

It could very well be that this describes the state of PowerPlay 1.0 regarding Solo/PG, despite the near universal claims to the contrary. It could very well be that the PowerPlay community isn't more likely to be in Open vs the general playerbase, but less likely. Personally, I think it's the other way around, and the instancing is just that bad for this type of gameplay.

Frontier has many rules in this game that needlessly punish the time poor, to the point where I don’t play this game nearly as much as similar MMOs I’ve played in the past, which were much more accommodating. This is a game where, if I want to do anything besides explore, and perhaps trade, I need to have at least an hour of time that is likely to be uninterrupted, and that is a rare and precious commodity for me these days. It's even worse when it comes to on-foot gameplay, especially on-foot stealth missions. It's an unnecessary friction against engagement, much like how merit decay has always been a friction towards me more actively earning merits.

Frontier's changes to PowerPlay 2.0 removes that major friction against earning merits, and from the sound of things, it’ll be kinder to the time poor player as well as the more casual one. Ultimately, the true test will be when we get our hands on PP2.0.

Personally, I’ll be doing my thing in Open, and take my lumps fair and square. Whether I’ll be actively hunting Commanders or not really depends upon how well Stronghold FCs work as choke points, whether instancing is robust enough to instance me with the opposition, and whether they’re also willing to take their lumps fair and square.

PvP would be fun if it had stakes and was consistent. Piracy the same- you can log out and the pirate gets nothing because the mugged feels its 'wrong' even when its breaking that playstyle. If Open is ever to have integrity it needs defined rules- they will chafe some, but then others will appreciate having a more consistent experience.

If this was done parallel to more solo centric gameplay then I'd be happy enough- its just keeping everything distinct and apart.

 

[Mrc_NorthEast]

In all the threads and posts about PP 2.0, I have seen alot of good ideas. I do hope Fdev is listening to all of these posts. I also hope they take the time to get it right the first time, and have meaningful game loops for all players and modes. Whether that be in Solo, Private Group or Open and whether it is new players or someone who has been playing for 5+ years.

Meanwhile when I think back over some of the more recent Fdev releases and the associated gameplay loops delivered. I see bugs that lingered for far too long, and not all the decisions matched what players wanted.

I do not envy Fdev for trying to keep everyone happy. I think the best we can hope for is everyone gets something, but definitely not everything they want out of PP 2.0.

 

[DemiserofD]

Interdiction is a part of the game now. You have SCO, you have fast boot. You have well established ways to escape on top of being able to choose how, when and what with you engage in game. To not include it is to cut away large chunks of the game and what you have to do.

You make the mistake of thinking this hauling is in isolation. Outside of PP hauling is easy- its an unguided activity often for small rewards. Inside PP its different it how powers stay solvent- therefore it needs to be under pressure for powers to have weaknesses. V2 has this as well, and must be vulnerable to players and NPCs.

Powerplay acts as a wrapper to all activities inside it- its a competition between 11 powers for dominance. Combat has always formed a large proportion of that- all powers UM by combat as an example.

I think you're missing the point. Power play is meant to appeal to all players, not just a small subset of players who currently enjoy power play. To make combat a requirement for participation dramatically cuts down the number of players who can enjoy the activity as a whole.

The absolute last thing they should do to an activity that's already niche, is make it less appealing to a wider audience. Interdiction should still remain a part of power play, to be certain, but specifically a part of open, not arbitrarily and pointlessly added to all activities for no reason other than to satisfy a small subset of players who want their particular activity to have dominance over all other forms of play.

 

[Rebel Yell]

I think you're missing the point. Power play is meant to appeal to all players, not just a small subset of players who currently enjoy power play. To make combat a requirement for participation dramatically cuts down the number of players who can enjoy the activity as a whole.

The absolute last thing they should do to an activity that's already niche, is make it less appealing to a wider audience. Interdiction should still remain a part of power play, to be certain, but specifically a part of open, not arbitrarily and pointlessly added to all activities for no reason other than to satisfy a small subset of players who want their particular activity to have dominance over all other forms of play.

Are we sure that there's a so broad audience that needs to be satisfied by certain activities?

I mean, I didn't enjoy/bother at all with:

• Thargoid stuff... may be I just visited the crashed mothership on XBOX ages ago and that's all
• Exobiology... no interest in walking on surface planets to find plants (never did that, no cares)
• Exploration... since the Earthlike trip I've done like in 2014 on XBOX, never travelled oustide the bubble except to go visit Colonia (on a FC) and unlock engineers

I've just module shopped other powers but have like 400+ weeks pledged with Delaine... attended the Guardian unlocks only for the modules and never enjoyed to go around their sites for finding artifacts, tablets etc

Hence, I know it's quite subjective, but that demonstrates that almost everything considered "mainstream" is in reality a niche in the game.

Just blaze your trail they said, yeah and we also like to blaze ships

 

[Rubbernuke]

I think you're missing the point. Power play is meant to appeal to all players, not just a small subset of players who currently enjoy power play. To make combat a requirement for participation dramatically cuts down the number of players who can enjoy the activity as a whole.

The absolute last thing they should do to an activity that's already niche, is make it less appealing to a wider audience. Interdiction should still remain a part of power play, to be certain, but specifically a part of open, not arbitrarily and pointlessly added to all activities for no reason other than to satisfy a small subset of players who want their particular activity to have dominance over all other forms of play.

Making a faceless grind race where everything is firewalled from each other is for me, dull. Anonymous abstraction is the enemy.

By all means have solo hauling, but don't mix it with PP style Open hauling or provide actual NPC enemies to make it have some semblance of competition and variation. If players want no risk then fine, the corresponding reward should be small as they are not doing anything especially skillful. As much as possible everything has to fit together with as little separation.

In the end making something to appeal to everyone will result in a bland compromise. At some point you need to add flavour to make it distinct.

 

[DemiserofD]

Are we sure that there's a so broad audience that needs to be satisfied by certain activities?

I mean, I didn't enjoy/bother at all with:

• Thargoid stuff... may be I just visited the crashed mothership on XBOX ages ago and that's all
• Exobiology... no interest in walking on surface planets to find plants (never did that, no cares)
• Exploration... since the Earthlike trip I've done like in 2014 on XBOX, never travelled oustide the bubble except to go visit Colonia (on a FC) and unlock engineers

I've just module shopped other powers but have like 400+ weeks pledged with Delaine... attended the Guardian unlocks only for the modules and never enjoyed to go around their sites for finding artifacts, tablets etc

Hence, I know it's quite subjective, but that demonstrates that almost everything considered "mainstream" is in reality a niche in the game.

Just blaze your trail they said, yeah and we also like to blaze ships

That's the thing; done properly, Powerplay could easily appeal to ALL players. Anyone who likes to mine, for example, could find a benefit from pledging to the mining power.

Like, if you like mining, then you pledge to the mining power. You do mining things, get mining rewards, and help out other mining players. That's all it really needs to offer for the common player.

But if it also leads to community, and couching your efforts in a larger narrative? That's the sort of thing that gives long-term replayability to the game.

 

[Rubbernuke]

That's the thing; done properly, Powerplay could easily appeal to ALL players. Anyone who likes to mine, for example, could find a benefit from pledging to the mining power.

Like, if you like mining, then you pledge to the mining power. You do mining things, get mining rewards, and help out other mining players. That's all it really needs to offer for the common player.

But if it also leads to community, and couching your efforts in a larger narrative? That's the sort of thing that gives long-term replayability to the game.

And miners attract pirates and you also have other powers who want to forcibly disrupt your mining- what then?

 

[DemiserofD]

Making a faceless grind race where everything is firewalled from each other is for me, dull. Anonymous abstraction is the enemy.

By all means have solo hauling, but don't mix it with PP style Open hauling or provide actual NPC enemies to make it have some semblance of competition and variation. If players want no risk then fine, the corresponding reward should be small as they are not doing anything especially skillful. As much as possible everything has to fit together with as little separation.

In the end making something to appeal to everyone will result in a bland compromise. At some point you need to add flavour to make it distinct.

So try to find a way that the game can be interesting to you personally WITHOUT compelling everyone else to be at your mercy. That's really the long and short of it. Nobody has the right to compel anyone else to play for their enjoyment, but that's exactly what open only really makes the case for.

I think the following could offer you significant enjoyment without the need for other players to act against their own enjoyment to satisfy your own:

Stronghold Carriers are treated by the server as a 'player', but are essentially an NPC that generates its own instances. This 'player' is logged into open at all times, and to see the carrier, you must instance with this 'player'. Once inside this instance, you can attack the local NPCs and capital ships, dealing damage to the power.

In order to attack OR DEFEND the stronghold, you must be not only logged into open, but instanced with the carrier, which only has a single instance. This means that network shenanigans is impossible. However, to avoid the possibility of collusion, player deaths in and of themselves should have no impact on the outcome. This means that it's better for ANY player, even a complete amateur, to join in, than for nobody to fight back against an attacking force. At the bare minimum, they'll waste time.

This creates a concrete and meaningful center for pvp to take place, without needlessly impacting other types of activity.

And miners attract pirates and you also have other powers who want to forcibly disrupt your mining- what then?

They don't see them, because they're in solo, like always. As it should be.

 

[Rubbernuke]

So try to find a way that the game can be interesting to you personally WITHOUT compelling everyone else to be at your mercy. That's really the long and short of it. Nobody has the right to compel anyone else to play for their enjoyment, but that's exactly what open only really makes the case for.

I think the following could offer you significant enjoyment without the need for other players to act against their own enjoyment to satisfy your own:

Stronghold Carriers are treated by the server as a 'player', but are essentially an NPC that generates its own instances. This 'player' is logged into open at all times, and to see the carrier, you must instance with this 'player'. Once inside this instance, you can attack the local NPCs and capital ships, dealing damage to the power.

In order to attack OR DEFEND the stronghold, you must be not only logged into open, but instanced with the carrier, which only has a single instance. This means that network shenanigans is impossible. However, to avoid the possibility of collusion, player deaths in and of themselves should have no impact on the outcome. This means that it's better for ANY player, even a complete amateur, to join in, than for nobody to fight back against an attacking force. At the bare minimum, they'll waste time.

This creates a concrete and meaningful center for pvp to take place, without needlessly impacting other types of activity.

Quite frankly its this compartmentalization which is what Powerplay is not supposed to be- or ED in general. Its you, in a ship, doing something while others (NPC or player) might come across you and sometimes push back. You can make PvP meaningful by keeping things exactly as they are- all you need to do is make logging on a timer forfeit your merits or cargo and that the corresponding activity in solo has INF muted. You have natural separation and people can do dangerous hauling in Open knowing its not replicated in solo- and that in solo you have tailored content that you can do as much as you want.

PP FCs are a thing in V2 anyway- and again the easiest way to prevent mode crossover is mute solo INF gained. This does not mean personal merits for tier progression are muted too- its just the UM.

They don't see them, because they're in solo, like always. As it should be.

No, I'm talking about NPCs. What opposition do you see?

 

[[VR] Bulbulunufus]

Believe it or not that PvP happens now- the problem is the rules around it blunt an actual outcome. If someone attacks a hauler (which is within the rules and expected) and the hauler logs, the latter can carry on seconds later as if that encounter had never happened with no penalty- thats not fair or logical. People complaining about it being unfair forget its a team game, you can go elsewhere, you can change your build and compromise to the situation, or fight back. The choice of response is theirs but that choice has to be within gameplay.

It certainly does happen now. Just this week Winters had 4 expansions and our haulers hauled a few hundred thousand merits. Two of the expansions saw significant PvP and our haulers were well harrassed, taking rebuys too (we operate exclusively in open for PP), with the Empire trying to lock down systems through PvP. There was a PvP response in kind and a struggle for control of the skies is then the norm. We even had a BGS war a couple weeks back that reached extreme threat in the Inara scores with 42% of registered PvP happening there. We used to complain a lot about the Empire doing their hauling in solo/PG but recent Imperial expansions have been much rhe same (although partly becauee Torval and Grom have gone back to sleep).

As ever the instancing gods hold court, but if you stuff a system well enough in open and there are few enough blocks in the way of instancing, stuff can happen.

 

[starman]

That is CQC

Could never find anyone on there

 

[DemiserofD]

Quite frankly its this compartmentalization which is what Powerplay is not supposed to be- or ED in general. Its you, in a ship, doing something while others (NPC or player) might come across you and sometimes push back. You can make PvP meaningful by keeping things exactly as they are- all you need to do is make logging on a timer forfeit your merits or cargo and that the corresponding activity in solo has INF muted. You have natural separation and people can do dangerous hauling in Open knowing its not replicated in solo- and that in solo you have tailored content that you can do as much as you want.

Says who? Everything about the current game is about compartmentalization, and Powerplay is just the aggregation(and socialization) of the game we have.

What open-only players really want is a completely different game; the one they've concocted in their mind, not the one we actually have. Honestly, the motivations in play feel a lot like the same motivations that drive people who want ship interiors; a vague and nebulous sense of wanting, without really considering what they want or what the consequences of what that wanting would be.

I totally agree that a game which plays the way you envision would be cool. It just is a completely different game from the one we have, and would require tearing down the game we have in order to build it. You would be better served trying to find ways that you can be satisfied in your own niche without requiring the complete rebuild of every other aspect of the game. It's a much more difficult challenge, I'll grant you, but also one more likely to be implemented. After all, if they had a good path towards open-only, they would have done it back when Sandro was in charge. The fact he failed is proof enough it can never work, even rough incentive systems like the ones you propose.

Which is why I propose my 'pvp arena' idea. Far more limited than the massive open-only concepts, yes - but as such, far more likely to be implemented, most notably because of how it intentionally avoids impacting vast swathes of the game, and instead compartmentalizes itself intentionally.

 

[Rubbernuke]

It certainly does happen now. Just this week Winters had 4 expansions and our haulers hauled a few hundred thousand merits. Two of the expansions saw significant PvP and our haulers were well harrassed, taking rebuys too (we operate exclusively in open for PP), with the Empire trying to lock down systems through PvP. There was a PvP response in kind and a struggle for control of the skies is then the norm. We even had a BGS war a couple weeks back that reached extreme threat in the Inara scores with 42% of registered PvP happening there. We used to complain a lot about the Empire doing their hauling in solo/PG but recent Imperial expansions have been much rhe same (although partly becauee Torval and Grom have gone back to sleep).

As ever the instancing gods hold court, but if you stuff a system well enough in open and there are few enough blocks in the way of instancing, stuff can happen.

rubs eyes

But I was told it was all a lie! PvP is impossible in PP! IMPOSSIBLE!

 

[Rubbernuke]

Says who? Everything about the current game is about compartmentalization, and Powerplay is just the aggregation(and socialization) of the game we have.

PP is the antithesis of the rest of the game. Its as near real time non aggregated gameplay as is possible in ED.

You have explicit pledges, cargoes, territory, merits that are not subject to S curve falloff, near real time feedback in the UI, station reports.

You can watch someone make a merit, register a bounty, follow them, watch them land and see that merit pop up in the UI to the minute. I can tell instantly what someone is doing by scanning them: carrying a cargo? Is it prep or fort cargo? Do they have a bounty? What territory are we in? Contrast that with the BGS where buckets fill buckets and everything is anonymized.

All of this takes place across the bubble- you can go where you like and have hot zones in any area- not tucked away.

After all, if they had a good path towards open-only, they would have done it back when Sandro was in charge. The fact he failed is proof enough it can never work, even rough incentive systems like the ones you propose.

Every PP proposal from FD has had Open in it. All of them. Sandro had two (one shared here, one shared on the dev facing discord), a weighted merits idea, and now this latest design has devs openly asking again- weighted or open? A new PvP ship, SCO, devs excitedly talking about direct player fights.

The irony of the old proposed changes is they were a whisker away from being started -FD changed the ED team resulting in a move away from Powerplay and then it was FCs (the first attempt), mining and exploration changes that were greenlit.

And like I keep on saying- if you separate out Open and solo tasks in Powerplay and play to each strength you will have a much better flowing game. Solo and PG with contained missions and POIs that suit NPCs as they are, Open for the catch and chase where players are better over bigger distances and thinking strategically.

 

[[VR] Bulbulunufus]

rubs eyes

But I was told it was all a lie! PvP is impossible in PP! IMPOSSIBLE!

It's somehow improved certainly, although I think it's partly our opponents feeling relatively secure these days, so the stakes are not the same as they might once have been. And as I imply, it remains patchy and depends who you face.

 

[DemiserofD]

PP is the antithesis of the rest of the game. Its as near real time non aggregated gameplay as is possible in ED.

You have explicit pledges, cargoes, territory, merits that are not subject to S curve falloff, near real time feedback in the UI, station reports.

You can watch someone make a merit, register a bounty, follow them, watch them land and see that merit pop up in the UI to the minute. I can tell instantly what someone is doing by scanning them: carrying a cargo? Is it prep or fort cargo? Do they have a bounty? What territory are we in? Contrast that with the BGS where buckets fill buckets and everything is anonymized.

All of this takes place across the bubble- you can go where you like and have hot zones in any area- not tucked away.

I don't agree. Pledges, cargoes, territory, merits, none of that does anything to disprove the general compartmentalization of Elite.

Here's the deal. People play Elite because they like Elite. They aren't going to play Powerplay if it's something completely different. Any powerplay that attempts to force players to play in a way they don't enjoy will fail. And that's exactly what your system describes. "It's hauling - but with pvp!" "It's mining - but with pvp!"

That's not mining or hauling. That's pvp with a cosmetic veneer. And that's simply not what I enjoy doing. And if you don't let me play the way I enjoy, I'm simply not going to participate.

 

[galahad2069]

That's pvp with a cosmetic veneer. And that's simply not what I enjoy doing. And if you don't let me play the way I enjoy, I'm simply not going to participate.

Good. Then don't participate. Those who do, will manage to survive your abscence, I'm pretty sure.

There are quite a few activities in ED I don't really like and therefore don't participate in. Those who do, seem to do it without me just fine.