Reducing distance costs by 50

[bitstorm]

It's instant via the backdoor? Hmmm

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What's making me laugh is seeing all the delay people being hypocrites.

They told us to accept FD's and the communities decision with transfer. Now that FD changed something, they are not accepting it.

What was that again? Something about salt and not accepting official decisions?

Seriously, can we sod off with the "the delay people are bad" talk.

 

[MVP_Bluntman]

What's making me laugh is seeing all the delay people being hypocrites.

They told us to accept FD's and the communities decision with transfer. Now that FD changed something, they are not accepting it.

What was that again? Something about salt and not accepting official decisions?

You're summing up my laughs today. I mean they always tend to nerf axe something too hard to find a good base, but I still think that nerfing the time limits a solid 15-20% would've been a better choice than a 50% logistical cost cut that will probably end up changing to 25%

I always supported the optional idea, but ofcourse the reasoning behind UI limitations are generally quite vast through out every new QoL mechanic added in this update. In general I was an instant guy with a serious logistical cost to make you actually think about where your money, your asset is going. I can settle with either way, but the time limit thats currently there where it would take me far longer to get something from a station the exact same distance away, than using a damn taxi conda with 55 ly jump range, not excluding synthesis/WD/NS boosts. Ofcourse fuel scooping could take up some time, but not when you have a 7A

 

[Ian Skippy]

What's making me laugh is seeing all the delay people being hypocrites.

They told us to accept FD's and the communities decision with transfer. Now that FD changed something, they are not accepting it.

What was that again? Something about salt and not accepting official decisions?

Exactly. FD does what you want? They are in touch with the community and care about the game. They do something you dont want? They caved in, dont understand their game, and soon all will be doomed. You can flipflop as often as you want and no consistency will be needed. For example, if in 2.2.02 they make it a bit longer, Ziljan will remove the slippery slope argument, rather than assume 'people will ask for longer and longer until it has no use anymore'. Make it shorter again in 2.2.03? Watch out for slipery slope 2.0.

 

[GraXXoR]

The developers have just saved you lots of money when using their QoL feature, and you're complaining? What the actual hell Ziljan? >_<


https://cdn.meme.am/instances/400x/65121661.jpg

His entire point is that making a feature cheaper means that the tendency to use it will increase. It will be used rather willy nilly, without thought. His thoughts go like this.

If a function can be used without forethought then those who tend to be more rash will use it. People who are rash tend not to plan so well... As such, they will order their vessel without thinking the delay time through and what to do in the meantime.

As such, they will sit in the station and twiddle their thumbs for 20 minutes.

Then they will get bored and post whingy whiny negative reviews online.

Worse, they may start demanding that the time be reduced, since it's such a commonly used function they spend most of their time waiting for their ships to arrive and no time playing...

Basically he's saying that although this will give a short term gain, in the long term, the game's image will suffer.

Rather insightful comment if you ask me... Moreover, he's more concerned about Elite's image than saving himself a few MCr which can usually be made back with a single AB trade run.

Sad that it needed explaining, TBH. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that you are the type of player who might actually end up thumb twiddling.

 

[Leo Sagan]

Well, I just hate the idea of ship transfers period, so yeah. Hell, if they were free and instant, but had a 500ly transfer limit, there'd be people moaning about it ruining their game because they couldn't teleport their battlevette to Colonia.

You'll always find a different opinion about anything on a gaming forum : you should probably get used to it because it's unlikely to change any time soon. It's actually quite logical given the number of players.

 

[DragoonKnight]

You are encouraging taxis as the default transport mode now. Ergo encouraging people to sit around waiting for their ships, until they're bored and complain that ED = a waiting game.

You are setting up ED for bad reviews going forward. And this direction of change is difficult to roll back, and will lead to increasing cries to make ship transfer times shorter and shorter, until they're irrelevant. Then the 30/70 ratio is going to increase to 50/50 and there will be larger scale unrest. So you're painting yourselves into a corner where more and more players will become unhappy about a QoL enhancement.

Please think this through, and consider your next step very carefully.

Slippery slope fallacy.
Ship transfer should be useful for more than just the small ships that you like to fly. Right now no one would consider transferring their Cutter or Corvette, especially with the reduced opportunities at making credits.

 

[GraXXoR]

What's making me laugh is seeing all the delay people being hypocrites.

They told us to accept FD's and the communities decision with transfer. Now that FD changed something, they are not accepting it.

What was that again? Something about salt and not accepting official decisions?

Why does that make you laugh. It's not only not funny, it's also not true...

 

[Crusina Luachra]

It's instant via the backdoor? Hmmm

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Seriously, can we sod off with the "the delay people are bad" talk.

If you can't realize I'm not literally saying EVERYONE then I do not know what to say. It's just easier to say it in that manner rather then typing out something like "Some people in particular who supported delays are being hypocritical"

How about you stop being salty first? That was also something I was told by people who supported delay, all the time.

Exactly. FD does what you want? They are in touch with the community and care about the game. They do something you dont want? They caved in, dont understand their game, and soon all will be doomed. You can flipflop as often as you want and no consistency will be needed. For example, if in 2.2.02 they make it a bit longer, Ziljan will remove the slippery slope argument, rather than assume 'people will ask for longer and longer until it has no use anymore'. Make it shorter again in 2.2.03? Watch out for slipery slope 2.0.

Except I have never argued anything other then my opinion and I have never said anyone was wrong to disagree with me. Keep trying though. (Or maybe look what up the word "Read" means because maybe you'll find out it means something different like you did last time)

If you "read" my posts you'd have noticed that while I may argue against people, I have never said their opinion didn't matter as much as mine or that everything had to go my way. You just made that up.

FYI, I am content with how it is now. Sure I think the delay itself is to long but whatever, I got a small concession in a reduction in price and I'm now fairly happy overall. It's not everything I wanted but I won't feel like it's such a waste if I do decide to move one of my smaller ships. Still 100% pointless to ever move a large ship but oh well.

 

[CMDR Ash]

Completely Agree Ziljan!

 

[Nick Sticks]

you can tell a good compromise when nobody is happy!

I need to remember that one!
.

 

[Ziljan]

The developers have just saved you lots of money when using their QoL feature, and you're complaining? What the actual hell Ziljan? >_<


https://cdn.meme.am/instances/400x/65121661.jpg

"Yay ship costs are reduced! This can only mean good things, right?"

Humans are short sighted by nature. The costs are there as an immediate pain-surrogate for people who have a hard time envisioning the consequences of transfers that cost time.

But without a sufficient cost to keep this feature from being used as the default travel mode, the time delay effects become more obtrusive, and the whole thing falls apart.

 

[DragoonKnight]

The cheaper it is, the more people will use it, the more people will fly otherwise-useless fast taxis, and wait for their main ships rather than play the game... Then complaints about waiting will follow.

Its a domino effect. People look at the first domino fall like they won something, but don't think about that last domino.

OMG! A feature is being used. How awful [/sarcasm]

If they dont want to wait then they will fly the actual ship. I hope FD realizes that the only people against this proposal are those who are completely against ship transfer and some salty explorers like you. Stop trying to sabotage a QoL feature for large ship pilots.

 

[Obnoxious_Gamer]

His entire point is that making a feature cheaper means that the tendency to use it will increase. It will be used rather willy nilly, without thought. His thoughts go like this.

If a function can be used without forethought then those who tend to be more rash will use it. People who are rash tend not to plan so well... As such, they will order their vessel without thinking the delay time through and what to do in the meantime.

As such, they will sit in the station and twiddle their thumbs for 20 minutes.

Then they will get bored and post whingy whiny negative reviews online.

Worse, they may start demanding that the time be reduced, since it's such a commonly used function they spend most of their time waiting for their ships to arrive and no time playing...

Basically he's saying that although this will give a short term gain, in the long term, the game's image will suffer.

Rather insightful comment if you ask me... Moreover, he's more concerned about Elite's image than saving himself a few MCr which can usually be made back with a single AB trade run.

Sad that it needed explaining, TBH. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that you are the type of player who might actually end up thumb twiddling.

Given that most of that time would be spent slightly moving the mouse and hitting "J" anyway, I think that's more of a gameplay problem that's been highlighted. Many have said this before, but what's considered to be "gameplay" in Elite isn't looked at as such in other games. Other games have fast-travel for a good reason.

 

[MVP_Bluntman]

OMG! A feature is being used. How awful [/sarcasm]

If they dont want to wait then they will fly the actual ship. I hope FD realizes that the only people against this proposal are those who are completely against ship transfer and some salty explorers like you. Stop trying to sabotage a QoL feature for large ship pilots.

I feel like you have read nothing I said to the OP to support him in his matter as a Large Ship Pilot.

I always supported the optional idea, but ofcourse the reasoning behind UI limitations are generally quite vast through out every new QoL mechanic added in this update. In general I was an instant guy with a serious logistical cost to make you actually think about where your money, your asset is going. I can settle with either way, but the time limit thats currently there where it would take me far longer to get something from a station the exact same distance away, than using a damn taxi conda with 55 ly jump range, not excluding synthesis/WD/NS boosts. Ofcourse fuel scooping could take up some time, but not when you have a 7A

 

[GraXXoR]

Other games have fast-travel for a good reason.

Which is why a lot of other games suck eggs.

 

[Obnoxious_Gamer]

OMG! A feature is being used. How awful [/sarcasm]

If they dont want to wait then they will fly the actual ship. I hope FD realizes that the only people against this proposal are those who are completely against ship transfer and some salty explorers like you. Stop trying to sabotage a QoL feature for large ship pilots.

Exactly. The number of people I've seen arguing that cheaper transfers will "make the Corvette OP" is sickening.

 

[Ian Skippy]

His entire point is that making a feature cheaper means that the tendency to use it will increase. It will be used rather willy nilly, without thought. His thoughts go like this.

If a function can be used without forethought then those who tend to be more rash will use it. People who are rash tend not to plan so well... As such, they will order their vessel without thinking the delay time through and what to do in the meantime.

As such, they will sit in the station and twiddle their thumbs for 20 minutes.

Then they will get bored and post whingy whiny negative reviews online.

Worse, they may start demanding that the time be reduced, since it's such a commonly used function they spend most of their time waiting for their ships to arrive and no time playing...

Basically he's saying that although this will give a short term gain, in the long term, the game's image will suffer.

Rather insightful comment if you ask me... Moreover, he's more concerned about Elite's image than saving himself a few MCr which can usually be made back with a single AB trade run.

Sad that it needed explaining, TBH. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that you are the type of player who might actually end up thumb twiddling.

Right, because right now the feature is used exclusively by us: the highly-intelligent supreme examples of the human race. Only the true intellectual elite can have the forethought to succesfully use ship transfer as it currently stands. But if you reduce the time with a few minutes, all those willy-nilly, dirt-for-brains, never-thinking-things-through peasants will start to use the feature too. And we all know how these people are, am I right?

And lets face it: right now all reviews of this game are glowingly positive. Espescially the easily-bored people LOVE this game. So it makes perfect sense that if you would make them wait a bit less the image of this game will absolutely be destroyed. I think its fair to say that if FD doesnt revert this, there probably wont even be a 2.3 anymore.

 

[Badben]

I'm still of the opinion transfers should be instant, and cheaper.

 

[Obnoxious_Gamer]

Which is why a lot of other games suck eggs.

Oh, hey, I can fast travel in Just Cause 2. That must mean it sucks, right? And Red Faction: Guerilla? And GTA V? And (insert basically every other successful open world game ever)?

 

[Ziljan]

OMG! A feature is being used. How awful [/sarcasm]

If they dont want to wait then they will fly the actual ship. I hope FD realizes that the only people against this proposal are those who are completely against ship transfer and some salty explorers like you. Stop trying to sabotage a QoL feature for large ship pilots.

You're advocating using this as a taxi feature for large ships. Yet you do not see the next domino?

I look forward to your complaint posts about waiting for your big ship to arrive. In exactly 3, 2, 1...

Please prove me wrong.