Requirements for building a Coriolis starport

Ps if anyone is bereft of company on these things.... And wants to be part of a group effort to do bonkers stuff with new colonisation... You could always come and be a Hutton Trucker. The crew are bagging their own as part of team efforts, there are much shenanigans (including getting shot at by one of our own bases), much scouting ahead and much learning about all the values of things like development level, tech level etc.

Many carriers full of stuff. Much loading and unloading. Ships coming and going in a big chain. Day and night shifts from a Ross the globe from Australia through Europe and west to the Merkin people over the other side of the Atlantic.

People can do as much or as little as they want AND have company while doing it.

We've even got spreadsheets ...
 
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Nope. It's intended as solo play. The update page says:
"the power to claim and expand your very own Star Systems is in your hands"
"We can't wait to see you place your flags in the history of Elite Dangerous' world"
"Once you've found the perfect system and selected the primary port, it's time to stake your claim!"
"You will also receive a small discount to ships and outfitting"
And they literally say in the FU video that it's meant to be hard. You can continue to misinterpret words all you like. You're wrong.
Aside from the statements on the website, in all the Frontier twitch streams they have repeatedly said this was all achievable by solo players.
And very difficult. Stop omitting facts to suit your own argument
There was nothing about it being difficult.
Good lord mate, I literally gave you the reference to this.

Arf: I think it's good to point that the primary starport colonisation in itself is a big undertaking if you're doing this as a single player or as a group, this is no mean feat.

Maybe you don't understand the phrasing? That literally means "This will be a lot of effort and difficult for single players and groups".... and it's impossible for something to be hard for a group.
not only a few by the vast minority of grouped up players.
Citation required. Show me proof the vast minority of players are grouped?

I'll wait. Otherwise, you're just trolling and lying through your teeth at this point.
 
Well I thought I’d see what all the fuss is about and went and staked a claim with an outpost.

Went on INARA for my nearest CMM Composite site. I’m filling up my T8 with them until I no longer have a full hold and then topping up with other needed commodities. Im currently running at about 5% progress an hour.

It really doesn’t seem insurmountable to solo it in 4 weeks, even for a casual player. I wonder if part of the problem is people sitting waiting for stocks to replenish because they’re only running back and forth between a carrier and the surface?

I’m only on hour 4 so my experience so far may not be any indication of how things are generally.
Likewise, I decided to give the new content a fair go myself (Open mode but solo player, no FC), after holding off initially when presented with the commodity requirements, prior to the CMM boost.

It made me realise that the UI really isn't fit for purpose, and so very minimum effort in terms of functionality and design that I once again end up using Inara as a crutch, as much as I'd prefer to do tasks like finding appropriate markets in-game. The UI just makes this much more frustrating that it should be. Not great for a company whose area of expertise is management games.

The other realisation is that beyond the initial star port I'm not going to pursue Colonisation further. The grind (and it is a grind in the true sense of the word, even if doable as a solo player in the time window required, at least for an outpost) of even just a single outpost will put me off A>B hauling for a long time, and the mere thought of having to put the effort in multiple times that for even just a single Coriolis fills me with dread. Not something I'd expect in a computer game that's supposed to entertain me.

Thankfully I picked both an outpost as the initial one, and in a system that only offers 3-4 build slots so no risk of falling into the dreaded "one more go" OCD trap.

The next update (Squadrons rejig) already sounds like a complete dud for me personally, as was PP2.0 as I just unpledged for good. These new additions to the game seem to be designed to keep players in a mindless hamster wheel for the sake of jacking player engagement KPIs at Frontier. I get others like it but for me they distract from the core game, as opposed to enrich it. YMMV obviously.

Not much else to look forward to for the foreseeable. Though I'm curious how Colonisation will fare (and the Galmap will look like) once other players eventually come to the same conclusions unless Frontier improves things drastically.
 
Show me proof the vast minority of players are grouped?
I thought this would be easy, but it turns out that the maximum possible size of all known PC squadrons combined is 18 million players, which is actually higher than the total confirmed player count of 13 million, so it's not actually completely provable without more effort than it's worth :)

Using estimates of how big squadrons actually are, since they're clearly not all at the 500 cap, gives an estimate of about 300,000 squadron members on PC.
This actually gets a bit more interesting - there are very few really large squadrons, but of course if you have one squadron of 500 and 500 solo players, still half the players are in the big squadron.

So you get, roughly:
- a third of players in squadrons at all are in a large one (100+ players)
- another third are in a medium-sized one (10-100 players)
- the remaining third are in a small one (1-10 players)
(with the modal squadron size being "2" and the second most-common being "1")

But of course that doesn't estimate what proportion of lone players haven't bothered creating a personal-use squadron. (To which the real answer is as usual "are you counting people who play for 50 hours and move on or not?" - if yes, then most certainly most players aren't in a group! - but can we do better than that to at least consider those who might be interested in Colonisation in the first place?)

Going back to the squadron leaderboards, those show that at least 10,000 squadron-affiliated players are active in any 8-week season (and this is of course a substantial underestimate, because it's only counting each of those 100+ squadrons as a single player, and they probably have at least two or three people active), with about half the total active in any given week.
On the other side, recent CGs (recent colonisation-related CGs, even) have had turnouts in the 10k-20k range.
Estimates of the number of active Powerplay-affiliated players come in at about 10k/week too; Inara then estimates slightly under half of players are pledged.
There are around 12,000 pending claims detected via EDDN, which will be an underestimate but sets a definite floor on the number of players interested in Colonisation

Still, based on all of that, if we're considering "forum-level" players - the sort who might be interested enough to take part in advanced features like CGs, Powerplay, Colonisation, etc. rather than basic features like "buying a D-rated FSD for their Freewinder" or "surviving long enough to reach a second system" - there's probably about 20-30,000 active at any time, and probably about half of them are in a "medium" squadron or larger.

Linking that back to the commodity requirements to establish a system...
Initial station tierCommodities (incl. "first station" tax)Single top 50% CG playerSingle top 25% CG playerSingle top 10% CG playerSingle top 10 CG player5-person squadron25-person squadron100-person squadron
1 (outpost)~20kNo3-4 weeks1 week<1 day1 week1 dayseveral per day
2 (coriolis)~70kNoNo3-4 weeks2-4 days4 weeksa few days1 day
3 (orbis)~250kNoNoNo1-2 weeksNo2 weeksa few days
Using the CG mean as the average hauling rate for a squadron member here.

One major thing to note here is that there isn't a clean distinction between a "solo" feature and a "group" feature anyway. The top individual player can haul faster than an average 25-person squadron can (and with 25 people, on average they'll almost always be average). A top 10% CG player (of which there are over a thousand) can haul faster than most small groups.
 
Is there a thread where people can
What a cliff hanger :D I assume you're suggesting to leave this in the feedback thread (if not I'm even more curious now).

After all these years and observing Frontier's rather predicable MO, I'm treating feedback threads started by Frontier the same way as I do with the Suggestions Forum. I remember them creating the engineering revamp one, plenty of great ideas were provided but they ended up merely changing spawn multipliers and removing RNG when applying them to recipes.
I can’t argue with you there, that’s always been an issue with ED.
Only to add ... it's a lot worse playing with a controller (like I do) as they don't seem to set proper button sequencing (hope it's clear what I'm talking about) for navigating their UI with a dpad, with a surprisingly high probability of soft locking the game unless you use your mouse. Clear indicator that they're not testing this properly before pushing it out into the wild. It's hard work playing Elite that way, and yes it was always somewhat of an issue in the past but really got much worse since the UI revamp with Odyssey.
That’s fair enough. Space Trucking isn’t for everyone.

There’s no time limit after the first station, though. Personally I’ll start the second one and just chip away when I fancy a bit of hauling.
Yeah, I thought about that (start a large port in the spot closest to the star, taking my time) but the fact remains that A>B hauling for me is probably the dullest activity in the game. I can tolerate it in small doses as a palate cleanser but not as the one-and-only option.

Though I'm not yet clear yet how/where those commodity trader contacts work - meaning I could possibly break up the hauling with some mining - but I'm also looking at the payoff and unless I'm getting a chunky bit of passive credits income (to fund a FC for example), I'm not so sure it's there. I might then have created another flyover system that barely anyone will visit... it's "mine" to the extent that I had some hand in where a couple of stations sit and are named (somewhat).... beyond that? Hmmm.
It was never going to be “my thing” but I was curious as to how much of a grind it actually was. I think some people can’t help but make it a grind.
Yes I think the CMM bit was the biggest hurdle for me, but a neighbouring system spawns 630 per visit so that's no issue for me now. The bigger problems are the Titanium and Steel requirements, and only because the numbers involved require me to make dozens of trips in a T9 (more if in another ship) and I absolutely hate flying that ship. But it's the biggest cargo hauler I have access to. And a round trip saved is my own free time saved. But it sure ain't enjoyable.
I think it will be like PP2.0, it’ll calm down but there will be people who like it.
Agreed... though I do think that PP2.0 does offer more variety in terms of activities involved. If only Colonisation wasn't just hauling and literally nothing else. I'd probably spend more time with it going forward.

what I might do is once FDev release their inevitable cosmetics for stations is to go sightseeing for those... hope they offer a decent variety of skins and stuff that players who still believe macrotransactions in Elite are fairly priced will kit their systems out with.
 
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I'm also looking at the payoff and unless I'm getting a chunky bit of passive credits income (to fund a FC for example), I'm not so sure it's there.
Reading through the blurb, passive income up to 5 mill each week, any more than that earned gets 'taxed' (governmental theft) to provide further colonisation effort, or something with golden sands, free-flowing drinks and warm sea...
 
I built my Coriolis myself, took me almost 2 days. I can unload my carrier at 10,000 tons per hour with optimal placement next to the colony ship, and load my carrier at a little over 5,000 tons per hour. Estimate 20-ish hours with these numbers. I use a shieldless Cutter with 784 tons capacity. For the smaller tier 1 installations I'll use a Type 8 with 400 tons of cargo capacity.
 
Reading through the blurb, passive income up to 5 mill each week, any more than that earned gets 'taxed' (governmental theft) to provide further colonisation effort, or something with golden sands, free-flowing drinks and warm sea...
Up to, eh? Am curious to see how my minimum effort Colonisation project will 'live on' post completion but honestly don't expect much at all beyond a decent chuckle perhaps.

I used to 'adopt' a backwater system a few years back, where I tried to dabble in the BGS a little. Gave up eventually but the system, HIP 57080, despite its lack of unique characteristics, remained close to the heart. Maybe my Colonisation system will end up similarly, if nothing else.

I can't see myself starting another one though mainly because of the timed completion requirement for the first station, so visiting other players' attempts at it might have to suffice (not sure if the Galmap highlights player architect systems, will need to check after the weekly tick).
 
Reading through the blurb, passive income up to 5 mill each week, any more than that earned gets 'taxed' (governmental theft) to provide further colonisation effort, or something with golden sands, free-flowing drinks and warm sea...
hmmmm so my hope of passive base income funding a fleet carrier passively was unrealistc then? iirc that is only around (edit less than!) 20% of the maintenance costs of a fully loaded fleet carrier.
 
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And bearing in mind that the OP has already completed his Coriolis, it can’t be that big an undertaking.
Nope

Took me three days to grind an outpost, stopped after that. Not grinding a Coriolis on my own

Also stopped playing because I can't move my carrier
 
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Not grinding a Coriolis on my own
With a little help from my friends, we finished our station Saturday evening.
Screenshot_0529.jpg

Then I gave it a new name...
station1.jpg
 
hmmmm so my hope of passive base income funding a fleet carrier passively was unrealistc then? iirc that is only around (edit less than!) 20% of the maintenance costs of a fully loaded fleet carrier.
Is that 5 mil pretax total or per system?
Also how progressive is the tax? Like if your system "makes" 10 million, you get 5mil and then what percentage of the remaining 5 million? Do you get something lame like 5.5 million or is it closer to, say, 9mil?
 
Really. So everything should be easily completed by someone who gets less than (an average) of an hour a day within a short period of time?

So what’s there for those who play maybe 3 hours a night? I’m not even taking into account the many who spend far more time than that.
More systems is whats in it for people who play more. You do realise the ceiling shouldn't be a single system, rather multiple.
It is intended as a multiplayer feature. They’ve said that. They also said it would be achievable for a solo player, but it would be difficult.
They may "intend" it as a multiplayer feature, but it doesn't play like one for all the reasons I've said before (about how the role and profits of the system architect is locked to a solo player) Its not designed as a multiplayer feature, or they would've held off for vanguards before releasing it.
Straw manning much? And don’t call me delusional, especially when it’s a scenario you just made up.
The term straw manning is such an overused term by people who don't even know what it means ... My point is that its not that much of a stretch considering how much you hate fun lol.
 
It's not a solo-centric feature, so your arguments are based off a false premise. That the system architect role is exclusive to a single player is irrelevant to the repeatedly stated vision by FD that this is a group activity and would be very difficult for solo players. FD could make colonisation exclusive to solo mode and still call it a multiplayer collaborative activity thanks to the shared universe.

Making the same flawed argument repeatedly doesn't make it true.
If its a group activity - why not restrict it to groups then? If its not a solo-centric feature why is there very little incentive to contribute to other's colonisation efforts (beyond being charitable/powerplay reasons).
 
I have no problem with a bit of grind and I don't want everything to come too quickly.
I agree with this - its all about balance however. I feel like the scale is and always has been tipped a bit too far towards the grind with ED.
one for them to look to balance better in ED2 perhaps?
Hopefully
That said....... I do think your attitude towards those who disagree with you is pretty poor tbh. I dont have a huge amount of time any more to play elite, all of my mates have moved on and i dont tend to play with randoms so i AM on my own., There are things i absolutely would change (I would love hirable npc wingmates and what not and indeed we were meant to get them - beyond our SLF pilot)
This game almost died after Odyssey because of this really toxic mindset towards anyone speaking against the status quo ... something a lot of members on this forum consistently seem to have. This complacency and argument that everything Fdev does is gospel caused this game to sink to its darkest time - even going as far as gaslighting other members of this forum into the actual state of Odyssey on release. ED is one of the best games of all time imo and its just disgusting seeing people ruin its reputation.
Remember it is still officially in beta and may have some balancing.
Exactly. You may need to repeat that a bit louder for certain individuals that consistently shoot down any legitimate feedback given towards this game, especially for features in Beta. I guess ED has a high proportion of players that are afraid of change?

It's strange because people, myself included, have been suggesting for years to reduce the engineering grind, only to receive the usual passive-aggressive responses on this forum. But when FDev finally agrees and makes the change, those same people suddenly praise it / or remain silent. It just feels really toxic and very anti-community.
 
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Isn't an either/or case. There's content BOTH for groups and solo players AND for large groups and 'me and my mate Bob'
never said it was an either/or case. I've said that the material requirements are suited for groups, while everything else about colony management is designed for solo. Conflicting game design - Solo players are generally unhappy with the material requirements, while groups would prefer for better joint colony management
 
The grind (and it is a grind in the true sense of the word, even if doable as a solo player in the time window required, at least for an outpost) of even just a single outpost will put me off A>B hauling for a long time, and the mere thought of having to put the effort in multiple times that for even just a single Coriolis fills me with dread. Not something I'd expect in a computer game that's supposed to entertain me.

The next update (Squadrons rejig) already sounds like a complete dud
for me personally, as was PP2.0 as I just unpledged for good. These new additions to the game seem to be designed to keep players in a mindless hamster wheel for the sake of jacking player engagement KPIs at Frontier. I get others like it but for me they distract from the core game, as opposed to enrich it. YMMV obviously.
This is an awesome (if edited for quote) post
 
Hi
sorry if a silly question but....,. do we get paid delivering goods to the colonisation ship or is it a total credit sink?
A mate has offered to help me haul.some stuff but just wondering if he will get paid or if I need to cover his costs.
I am currently loading my fleet carrier . playing for orbital platform but if he is prepared to put in some time hauling I may chance a coriolis


taaa
 
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