Actually that isn't quite true from what I can tell. There is much honor and glory in PVP and many who enjoy the playstyle, it is those who insist that everyone needs to PVP even if they want to. To force them to do so by sneaking into PVE groups, by attacking ships they know have no chance of even harming their own. They don't PVP... they use the excuse of PVP for their own entertainment of making the game miserable for others. Against these... Solo and PG's are a godsend. And sadly for some... make others not want to deal with any PVP pirate. So it isn't the modes themselves that are an issue.. but again those who cannot play well with others.
I am not asking for everyone to do PvP.
I am asking a PvP playstyle to be an equally valid choice to a non PvP playstyle.
This respecting the vastly bigger difficulty involved.
I do agree that players sneaking into PvE groups with the intent of harrassing mostly harmless Cmdrs are a shame.
Solo and PG's are a godsend... Solo I get, but I do not quite understand the PG part, because isn't the problem that you have hostile Cmdrs within a PG?
The game is based on the PVP between groups (on different platforms, with different levels of personal interaction with others, etc.) through the movement of PVE trophies.
This type of gameplay is distasteful to a lot of people. It is advised that those people should not purchase this game.
True, but the the argument can be made for direct PvP in the same manner.
The aspect you mention is just one part of was proclaimed within the Kickstarter campaign.
Kickstarter said:
Its dog-eat-dog out there – you need to keep your friends close, and your enemies closer.
Whether you want to trade for profit between systems, take part in multiplayer co-op mission alliances, free-for-all group battles and team raids to bring down planetary economies, even tip the balance of power in the galaxy (for your own advantage, of course..), or simply explore the wonders of the galaxy (and who knows what you’ll find out there..) is up to you.
From what I've read in this thread this isn't going to happen.... ever.
Could we get this thread renamed Hotel California 3.0?
True, I have to agree given this conversation it seems more than unlikely.
Yet there is still other options to achieve similar results.
What if it would be possible to pull Cmdrs fulfilling certain criteria that are considered hostile out of PG/Solo into Open?
creating special combat zones and develop it into something meaningful
You could also take the second one regarding 'political' mechanics to identify the enemy faction and develop a system that would accomplish the possibility of fighting back against these types of attacks, not just defending, but fighting back, but through the same tactics and not simply blowing up ships.
Then you'd have a complete PvP system implemented, that wouldn't bother anyone, in fact lots of PvE-only people would be interested and possibly wanted to try it, without the need to merge the game modes..
I do like the idea. At least it opens an option for PvP activities being impactful, but the issue I was talking about still remains:
If you want to defend your home system against a dedicated attack from players acting out of Solo/PG you are forced to do the same.
Just because this fits quite well here:
It's not a PvE vs PvP debate.
It's a discussion about currently implemented PvP mechanics and the lack thereof.
Given Sandro's comments on the topic of enhanced PvP over the years, my opinion is that Open was suffering a population issue in Frontier's opinion and it was decided that something had to be done to encourage players back into Open.
The latter reflects my impression as well.
My feedback aims to support that goal.
Rewarding PvP will likely increase its occurrence. Some of those encounters will be with PvP disinterested players - who may then move out of Open.
Whether or not a player initiates direct PvP is entirely up to the player.
My point was that UO moved away from a single PvP realm and offered a PvE (with optional, consensualm, PvP) realm - that'd be like Frontier adding a PvE (with optional, consensual, PvP) game mode.
Players have been asking / demanding that Frontier buff Open / nerf Solo / Private Groups for years, much longer than the Engineers have been released.
.... because Frontier hasn't capitulated to the subset of players that prefer direct PvP - so the requests / demands / solutions keep coming.
Unreasonable kills are heavily penalized at the moment and that is kind of how it should be, I do enjoy that development.
The rewards for justified kills, let's say killing the griefer attacking haulers and noobwinders may be on par, but the griefer can't be allowed to continue the game in the comfort of Solo/PG.
He chose to initiate direct PvP versus a weaker opponent and as a result should loose the priviledge (at least for some time) to avoid direct PvP.
To some extent we got this with the rework of C&P, Cmdrs are forced into Open to reduce their notority.
The recent design choices reflect already a modification of the game modes, as for the moment there is one thing you can only do in Open that also affects strict PvE/PG players!
Maybe flagging those people on the galaxy map was considered to be too harsh.
But it would certainly help to spot and hunt notorious killers in the galaxy as well as support anyone trying to avoid them.
The option of the notorious killer being to stop the hunt by going PG/Solo remains an issue.
I would love to see a mechanic allowing Cmdrs to pull them out of PG/Solo.
I am a bit ashamed to bring another Ubisoft example to the table ^^
The Division is a mostly PvE style game with optional PvP elements.
I do enjoy how the optionality of the PvP part was implemented, maybe that could serve as an impression.
Once you kill a player you get flagged and a marker points towards you also showing the distance.
It's called a manhunt and the flagged player is a justified KOS.
What do you think about a similar mechanic in ED?
Just had to skip to the end of this rant. Paragraph after paragraph means you have nothing to say.
Given the quality of your comment I do not expect you to understand my argumentation.
Yawn. Age old topic that usually ends with someone mentioning the simple fact that due to the P2P structure of the game it's pretty easy to play in 'pseudo Open'...
If FDev implements mechanics that rely on Open, such issues should be looked into as well.
It certainly is cheating when a player goes onto a killing spree and avoids the penality of notority by being in pseudo open.
