Serious discussion on proper fleet mechanics

[Sunsol]

I wouldn't mind so much, but Harley's aren't even that good. Need a trailer to keep all the bits in that fall off.

Fortunately I wouldn't know xD I tend to stay away from screaming death traps

 

[Asp Explorer]

Fortunately I wouldn't know xD I tend to stay away from screaming death traps

They don't scream. They just blat a bit, wobble the neighbours windows, and happily vibrate themselves apart

And then of course you need another tool kit to put them back together again

 

[CMDR Aengus]

They don't scream. They just blat a bit, wobble the neighbours windows, and happily vibrate themselves apart

And then of course you need another tool kit to put them back together again

That's not too much of a problem. Its mostly factory line 'custom' bolt on parts.

Bit like Lego
:-D

 

[Jaiotu]

Oh my lulzbucket filleth over.

If groups/guilds/whatever are already in game - as some people claim - then what more do you want?

I want minor faction tags. For one thing it lets me see who my allies are when I'm in my home system. For another I think it would be a great tool for Frontier to see what we players are doing in the game because they could track activities by group participation. Right now there is a discussion of Colonization efforts around Jaques Station to create a "2nd Bubble" and talk about letting the community "vote" who gets a colony. Totally inorganic and turns the whole process into a popularity contest IMO. If we had fleet tags (and these don't even have to be visible to other players) then Groups that want to colonize the 2nd Bubble could simply show their dedication by delivering materials to Jaques. Frontier could measure this activity by Minor Faction allegiance and grant colonization status based on this participation.

The only people "blocking" anything are the developers as they are not implementing features that they don't appear to want in their game.

Which is great. If the developers don't want social tools or fleet tags in the game then they simply won't implement them. What is wrong with some of us simply stating our case that some group-centric changes to the game might be beneficial?

Nobody is afraid of big groups - no matter how big groups want to be feared

I know I fly in Open when I feel like it - big groups or murderhobos don't make the slightest difference to me.

I fly in Open all the time and, on the occasions where I've encountered "big groups" (like the Code back in the early days) I had tons of fun interacting with them.

 

[CMDR Aengus]

Just curious. I'm friendly, allied with many different minor factions. As probably are many players.

Do we have a tag for all of them? Drop down menu to choose? The one with the most reputation ranked up?

Me personally, as a freelancer, I don't want any tags. So an on/off switch would be nice.

But as this argument has gone round the block since before an ape picked up a bone and smacked somebody around the head with it. Let's cover some basics.

1. Generally accepted by most parties for more in depth comms tools.
2. Generally accepted by most parties for fleet management tools.
3. That's it.

And an on/off switch for obvious play it your own way choices.

Anything else usually degrades into open v solo v PvP v PvE. Which is a bigger argument that breaks into the fundamentals of the game and it's associated gameplay as contained within the peer to peer network.
I.e. Ain't gonna change unless the network changes and / or FD sells the franchise to Blizzard or EA.

So why are we still arguing.

 

[Sandmann]

Okay. Some background. I'm not a gamer. I've never played an "MMO" that wasn't Elite: Dangerous. I don't really care about how other games define player groups and any distinction between Elite's Player Minor factions and any other games concept of "guilds" or "Fleets" is completely lost on me.

I'm an Elite player. I started playing Elite back in 1985 and it was this latest incarnation of that game that prompted me to spend thousands of dollars on a new computer, HOTAS, eye tracker, life-time pass, merchandise, books and whatever else I can get my hands on.

I'm not really sure what that has to do with anything, but if it helps you've pretty much describes me too. I started playing elite with a pirated copy on an amiga 500, and frontier was the first game I ever legally bought. I however am aware of how the whole guild thing operates from friends who play wow and eve, and from various reading. Fleets are fleets... regardless of being space pixels or battleships and cruisers.

- - - - - Additional Content Posted / Auto Merge - - - - -

It is a shame that I can not even bring a little humor into this discussion.

You can... just as soon as you learn to distinguish humour from insult.

 

[William J Smith]

It´s silly though that people think they are not in a disadvantage against a group of 2 or more people at any time. you are at a disadvantage almost always in:
- wing fights, where more player means they can project more damage into you than you can, assuming you are not in a vastly superior ship
- BGS manipulation, as more people are simply able to do more in the same time
- If bases are accessible to anyone (which they should be, if you manage to scrape the mats together) then you will objectively be at a loss against a group, who will expand faster, build things faster, and react to your movements faster and in more force

Unless there are some artificial or extraordinary circumstances, you will always be at a disadvantage against a group, unless I´m missing something major here.

I'm always at a disadvantage here, because I am a lone elite player, I flit from place to place doing jobs for factions, it does'nt really worry me that I'm not part of a faction/pp
I do my own thing... hauling cargo mostly(we'll leave the legal status of my cargo for another time ok), I may bounce into a RES, be polite to anyone whos there before me etc etc.

But when I see those hollow squares on the scanner, I think ot oh and try and work out who they are and if they are liable to use me for target practice (it all adds to the dangerous bit in the game title)
I wont play in solo, because NPC interaction is boring, private group eg mobius.... nawwww... open is where it is for me.
Having faction tags would be a boone for the likes of me being easily able to see what hollow squares are what, and if I'm going to get a cheery wave and message or a face full of laser fire.

Bill

Plus it makes it more sociable when you see a faction tag and you know other players in the faction.

 

[Sandmann]

I wouldn't mind so much, but Harley's aren't even that good. Need a trailer to keep all the bits in that fall off.

Fortunately I wouldn't know xD I tend to stay away from screaming death traps

They don't scream. They just blat a bit, wobble the neighbours windows, and happily vibrate themselves apart

And then of course you need another tool kit to put them back together again

That's not too much of a problem. Its mostly factory line 'custom' bolt on parts.

Bit like Lego
:-D

Hey now... credit where it's due. HD's are lovely looking bikes... they make great statues and fit onto trailers really well. And when people attach those silly ape hanger handlebars to them they make great gymnastic equipment! I just happen to prefer a bike that can do things like accellerate... turn corners... stop in less space than it takes an oil tanker... and which I don't need earplugs to ride. To each their own though, as a fellow rider he's allowed to ride whatever he likes, regardless of how questionable his choice. If he WANTS to ride a tractor with two wheels, that's entirely up to him, and we'll just go around him and let him be.

 

[Jaiotu]

Hey now... credit where it's due. HD's are lovely looking bikes... they make great statues and fit onto trailers really well. And when people attach those silly ape hanger handlebars to them they make great gymnastic equipment! I just happen to prefer a bike that can do things like accellerate... turn corners... stop in less space than it takes an oil tanker... and which I don't need earplugs to ride. To each their own though, as a fellow rider he's allowed to ride whatever he likes, regardless of how questionable his choice. If he WANTS to ride a tractor with two wheels, that's entirely up to him, and we'll just go around him and let him be.

What do you call an ad hominem attack if the attack is against a motorcycle brand and not a person?

 

[Asp Explorer]

What do you call an ad hominem attack if the attack is against a motorcycle brand and not a person?

If it's on two wheels it's all good

Unless it's a Ural

 

[DukeIronHand]

If you read my OP would have seen I did not want this discussion to be about the HOW I want it to be about the WHY.
But what I would like to see is fleet tags it would be nice to be able to distinguish ourselves from those who don't belong to the fleet a fleet beacon would be nice so that fleet mates can come to the aid of each other without having to be winged up. And I think fleet chat and fleet mail is self-explanatory. As far as meaningful ways to be connected to our PMF I would think it would be nice if the stations that we own would recognize members so that we don't have to ask for landing right if we could just fly up to them and they would grant us landing permission. As well as reward us with discounts if the PMF is in boom state and make everything cost more in war states or a turmoil state like outbreak or famine that would encourage us to manage our PMF's state more closely.

Like I said it is about better organizational tools and more meaningful ways to interact with our PMF
And ranks within the fleet would be nice as well.

I like it. Great idea.

 

[Sandmann]

What do you call an ad hominem attack if the attack is against a motorcycle brand and not a person?

Ad cycular?

- - - - - Additional Content Posted / Auto Merge - - - - -

If it's on two wheels it's all good

Unless it's a Ural

I was in Sydney the other day (I live.in Brisbane) and saw they had a Royal Enfield dealer tbere - had no idea we were selling them here. Was very tempted to buy one, just.because.

 

[Sunsol]

I'm always at a disadvantage here, because I am a lone elite player, I flit from place to place doing jobs for factions, it does'nt really worry me that I'm not part of a faction/pp
I do my own thing... hauling cargo mostly(we'll leave the legal status of my cargo for another time ok), I may bounce into a RES, be polite to anyone whos there before me etc etc.

But when I see those hollow squares on the scanner, I think ot oh and try and work out who they are and if they are liable to use me for target practice (it all adds to the dangerous bit in the game title)
I wont play in solo, because NPC interaction is boring, private group eg mobius.... nawwww... open is where it is for me.
Having faction tags would be a boone for the likes of me being easily able to see what hollow squares are what, and if I'm going to get a cheery wave and message or a face full of laser fire.

Bill

Plus it makes it more sociable when you see a faction tag and you know other players in the faction.

With guilds you also get people actively policing each other. People always look to the negatives of things but never the positives. If a Guild is against their members murdering players of a certain rank(Ganking basically) nine times out ten they're going to be consequences. I mean there will be whole guilds built on protection in the bubble. More so than Ganking which would be interesting and viable gameplay. Some systems would be protected some not etc

 

[CMDR Aengus]

Hey now... credit where it's due. HD's are lovely looking bikes... they make great statues and fit onto trailers really well. And when people attach those silly ape hanger handlebars to them they make great gymnastic equipment! I just happen to prefer a bike that can do things like accellerate... turn corners... stop in less space than it takes an oil tanker... and which I don't need earplugs to ride. To each their own though, as a fellow rider he's allowed to ride whatever he likes, regardless of how questionable his choice. If he WANTS to ride a tractor with two wheels, that's entirely up to him, and we'll just go around him and let him be.

Indeed. You could be riding a c90 for all I care. Two wheels is two wheels... You'll still get a nod, a grin and a wave from me.
... It's just a shame most Harley riders (I've met or come across) don't share that same sentiment.

 

[CMDR Aengus]

Ad cycular?

- - - - - Additional Content Posted / Auto Merge - - - - -



I was in Sydney the other day (I live.in Brisbane) and saw they had a Royal Enfield dealer tbere - had no idea we were selling them here. Was very tempted to buy one, just.because.

Pretty sure there is an Enfield dealership in Brisbane (Qlder here). I'm waiting for the new Enfield scrambler to be imported.

For the money you can't go wrong, and they look great. I've been tempted for awhile now.

 

[Mavisreed]

You really should watch the video I (obliquely) referenced before mocking what you patently don't understand.

I saw the video.
I did not care for it at all.

Developers change their "vision" constantly, as long as they receive constructive feedback from the community.

User Victore Beskor has made very valid points. Most players who oppose better group management don't really have anything to say. They are biased against anything that might be against this obtuse and mysterious "vision" that only they seem to be aware of.

 

[Sunsol]

I saw the video.
I did not care for it at all.

Developers change their "vision" constantly, as long as they receive constructive feedback from the community.

User Victore Beskor has made very valid points. Most players who oppose better group management don't really have anything to say. They are biased against anything that might be against this obtuse and mysterious "vision" that only they seem to be aware of.

Exactly man you get it. Makes these forums so toxic.

 

[lefty1117]

I'd like to see some form of fleet gameplay, maybe restricted to membership in pre-existing minor factions, but I'm not sure that I see the point of it when Solo and Open share the same servers. The point of forming player guilds is to make your mark on the game, but when people can bypass it by just going Solo to avoid that blockade etc, it just doesn't seem worth it. So why bother? This is one of my core issues with Powerplay. It's a damn shame they didn't make this game a real MMO instead of this worst of both worlds single/multi hybrid with tiny player instances. I would even have preferred if they went with single-player only and put a real campaign & story into it.

 

[Sandmann]

Pretty sure there is an Enfield dealership in Brisbane (Qlder here). I'm waiting for the new Enfield scrambler to be imported.

For the money you can't go wrong, and they look great. I've been tempted for awhile now.

Really? Was unaware. I ride a Triumph America which is great on the highways here but I'm moving to South East Asia soon and it's too big for the roads there. I already own a little 100cc Bajaj (Indian Kawasaki) there but it's too small, especially when I'm two up. I noticed there's an RE dealership where I'm going so thinking that would still be small enough for the roads, big enough to be comfortable on, and still have some style. As you point out, the price is definitley right too.

Indeed. You could be riding a c90 for all I care. Two wheels is two wheels... You'll still get a nod, a grin and a wave from me.
... It's just a shame most Harley riders (I've met or come across) don't share that same sentiment.

Hear hear. We're all brothers on the road. Some people just think a brand name makes them superior.

I saw the video.
I did not care for it at all.

Oh well. I read his "points" and also "did not care for them at all". I will stick with what the creators want, which was the reason most of us bought the game in the first place. Buying a game because you want it to be completely different is a silly idea.

 

[BigBANGtheory [VR]]

I like the idea of proper fleet mechanics, I think in the case of ED (vs other space sims most notably X Universe) it's nowhere near ready for that yet i.e. a lot has to happen before fleet mechanics makes any kind of sense because its all about you currently and you cannot make any real impact on the persistent universe atm. For me this is a solid long term ambition for 2018+