Ship cost scaling in this game needs to be leveled out.

[Defacto]

The plan I had for my own ship progression was that I was going to work hard, get my shiny Cobra III with smell of new spaceship, and then, as I play and explore the world, slowly fit her until she is the most badass Cobra III in the galaxy.
Well, it's been a month since release, and now I have all of it. So much for slow ship progression. At this rate, I think that Pythons and Clippers are going to be atleast as common as Cobras in a year. According to traffic reports, Cobras alone already outnumber Sidewinders,Haulers,Adders and Eagles together.

There is something really depressing with knowing that you can get access to practically any ship if you just grind around for long enough. If ship price scaling is to be lowered, I think income needs to be reduced too. If actually earning a profit is a challenge, it would be fine with lower ship prices.

 

[KellyR]

Well, it's not all grind. At least not trading grind. To buy a federal drop ship, you have to have an ensign's rank or better. To buy an imperial clipper, you have to have the rank of baron or better. They don't care how much money you have, so long as you have enough. Without the rank, you can have 5 billion and they still won't sell it to you. And I LIKE what I see of the clipper.

 

[KellyR]

I agree whole-heartedly. I love to bounty hunt. My Viper is pretty well maxed out, so I'd like to get a better fighter, maybe a dropship or a Python. But it would take literally hundreds of hours to save up enough money for either of those just by bounty hunting. So I just got a Type 6 hauler and have found a really good run that I can do quickly and make 230,000 Cr per lap... But even at that price it would take me well over 200 laps to buy a pyton. 200! I don't want to do that. That sounds boring as hell. I know some people like to trade, but I don't. And I feel like I'm being forced to if I want a better ship, and I was told that I could do any play style I want. Its a little crazy that a Python costs literally 100x as much as a Viper, and I get the feeling it won't be 100x more powerful. MAYBE twice as powerful.

So yeah, I think they either need to fix the prices on the ship, or provide a way to make more money from bounty hunting, probably through missions. I've never seen more than 150,000 for an assassination mission. I'd like to see a 2 Million credit bounty for an elite anaconda or something. MAYBE then I could make as much hunting as trading.

If you buy a car, you have to work for it. If you buy a motorcycle you have to work for it. Why should ED be any different? Just cause it's a game? What we receive too easily, we esteem too lightly. If it was the way you wanted it, it would get boring in a hurry for most people.

 

[Trixi]

Its a little crazy that a Python costs literally 100x as much as a Viper, and I get the feeling it won't be 100x more powerful. MAYBE twice as powerful.

You can buy 20 years old Volkswagen in quite good condition for 300 euro or Lamborghini Veneno for 3 million. This is similar difference as between Sidewinder and Anaconda. Sure, Lamborghini has some advantages over 20 years old Volkswagen, but can you honestly say it is ten thousand times better? It is not 10.000 times faster nor 10.000 times more comfortable and it wouldn't break 10.000 times less and is by no any means more economic. But somehow many people would prefer Lamborghini if they only could aftord it. Why? Because of prestige, nothing else. By having luxury car, you show people you are rich enough to have it. And this is, I suppose, the exact reason to have Python or Anaconda in Elite. So they have to be outrageously expensive, otherwise they won't be prestigious at all. And these ridiculous prices are exactly as reasonable and realistic as 3 million for a car. If you want to show others how big yours is, then you have to invest a lot of time to have it. If you don't need to boast, you probably don't need a Python at all.

And by the way, I think trading is really too easy and should be made either less profitable, or (I'd prefer this) more dangerous and less predictable, by some changes in supply-demand system. But it's a different thing.

 

[Solospirit]

Another perspective....Which is going to earn you more money...A Tank or a Truck?...A fighter jet or a Cargo jet?...A Battleship or a huge Oil tanker?...The dedicated cargo vehicles will always make more money than a combat vehicle.
i actually like the fact, that for once a game lets the folks that put time, sweat, and hard thinking into kitting out and running a good trade business will earn more and be able to progress to bigger ships and equipment than the pure hardworking, but more aggressive combat fliers can...it makes a refreshing change...not so? I have long term goals of being able to kit out ships to do both...a dedicated fighter, and a dedicated trader...i intend to get the most from this game, funding the combat with the trading...as i think may have been the intention all along.
If you really don't like trading, that is fine...but please, if you don't enjoy the most profitable and advantageous route to progress in the game..don't complain or try to get it nerf'd for those who do...Folks who like to trade for once have the advantage.

 

[KellyR]

Another perspective....Which is going to earn you more money...A Tank or a Truck?...A fighter jet or a Cargo jet?...A Battleship or a huge Oil tanker?...The dedicated cargo vehicles will always make more money than a combat vehicle.
i actually like the fact, that for once a game lets the folks that put time, sweat, and hard thinking into kitting out and running a good trade business will earn more and be able to progress to bigger ships and equipment than the pure hardworking, but more aggressive combat fliers can...it makes a refreshing change...not so? I have long term goals of being able to kit out ships to do both...a dedicated fighter, and a dedicated trader...i intend to get the most from this game, funding the combat with the trading...as i think may have been the intention all along.
If you really don't like trading, that is fine...but please, if you don't enjoy the most profitable and advantageous route to progress in the game..don't complain or try to get it nerf'd for those who do...Folks who like to trade for once have the advantage.

This.

Criminal activity may be fun, and may make you enough to repair/refuel/rearm your ship. But it won't make you rich. At least no in ED. Bounty hunting may do the same, but you are still working for someone else; an independent contractor, perhaps, but you are still working for the man. The man, in this case being the authorities.

When you trade, you work for yourself. And that's the only way you can get rich. Hard work, sometimes boring, but you'll appreciate the stuff you buy a whole lot more.

And I think trading is just exactly right the way it is. Getting the Hauler wasn't that bad since I pre-ordered and had an Eagle I could sell. But after that, it has been pure work; and as well it should be. I've seen games where you could go from a starter ship in to the biggest cargo hauler in the game in about 3 or 4 hours. In those games, it's not hard if you understand trading. That is not the case here. And I find it very refreshing.

 

[cpy]

I make about 5-10M a day in my L7 and i only play after my work hours and full weekend earns much more, i don't see big problem with earning money, i see big problem with only 1 way of earning money.
Also mining is being my own man and that still does not pay much.

 

[scoda]

Seriously.. All I hear is "wah wah waaah.... I want the biggest ship now... Boo hoo its too expensive.."

Harden Up Princesses and work for it like the rest of us have... Feel that sense of accomplishment.. Put in the hard yards!

 

[Amaze]

Seriously.. All I hear is "wah wah waaah.... I want the biggest ship now... Boo hoo its too expensive.."

Harden Up Princesses and work for it like the rest of us have... Feel that sense of accomplishment.. Put in the hard yards!

I would love to "put in the hard yards" but in this case it puts me to sleep

 

[Defacto]

Another perspective....Which is going to earn you more money...A Tank or a Truck?...A fighter jet or a Cargo jet?...A Battleship or a huge Oil tanker?...The dedicated cargo vehicles will always make more money than a combat vehicle.
i actually like the fact, that for once a game lets the folks that put time, sweat, and hard thinking into kitting out and running a good trade business will earn more and be able to progress to bigger ships and equipment than the pure hardworking, but more aggressive combat fliers can...it makes a refreshing change...not so? I have long term goals of being able to kit out ships to do both...a dedicated fighter, and a dedicated trader...i intend to get the most from this game, funding the combat with the trading...as i think may have been the intention all along.
If you really don't like trading, that is fine...but please, if you don't enjoy the most profitable and advantageous route to progress in the game..don't complain or try to get it nerf'd for those who do...Folks who like to trade for once have the advantage.

I think a lot of these problems might be solved is the game just is to become harder.
It would make sense that the most profitable trade routes go through unstable systems, since most traders would avoid these areas, making the needs worsen and the production surplus increase. If things actually were so hard that you had to get escorts if you were a trader visiting the area, that might add a bit more purpose to a combat-oriented player. Maybe your friend has a Type 7 and wants someone to help him transport 200 tonnes of luxury goods and technology into that unstable feudal system, for example.

 

[Kyokushin]

This is game for years, not weeks. Prices should not be smaller and profit from trade should not be much larger.

If you want anaconda, outfitted python or L9 - you need a play, not one-two days, but months, weeks.

Everybody wants everythin now now now now and for free. It WONT HAPPEN. Play hard, earn for effect.

 

[KellyR]

I make about 5-10M a day in my L7 and i only play after my work hours and full weekend earns much more, i don't see big problem with earning money, i see big problem with only 1 way of earning money.
Also mining is being my own man and that still does not pay much.

There is not only 1 way of making money. There is only 1 way to get rich; and it doesn't matter if it's in Elite: Dangerous or in real life. The only way to get rich, in real life or in ED, is to work for yourself. The only way to work for yourself in Elite: Dangerous is to trade. Not trading missions, but to actually buy goods from one station and sell them to another station for a profit. When you trade like this, you work for yourself. No one (but you) tells you to take such and such cargo to such and such place for such and such pay.

It would be nice if there were another way to work for yourself, but unfortunately the only way to work for yourself is to either buy and sell or manufacture goods for sale. Manufacturing goods are not within the scope of the game so we're left with trading.

And mining is working for yourself, but unless you own a mining company, employing others to mine, you won't get rich at it. Unfortunate, but that's the way the world wags.

 

[Sts]

This is game for years, not weeks. Prices should not be smaller and profit from trade should not be much larger.

If you want anaconda, outfitted python or L9 - you need a play, not one-two days, but months, weeks.

Everybody wants everythin now now now now and for free. It WONT HAPPEN. Play hard, earn for effect.

I totally agree. I have paid 40 quid for this game. I don't want to get to the top in a few hours and then get bored. I want it to last for a long time so I am working my way up slowly ignorring he website trade calculators.

I made it to Elite twice on the BBC micro. I will probably never make it there on ED partly because the game is so much bigger and partly because I no longer have the reflexes of a 12 year old.

S.

 

[FluorescentBlack]

Perhaps players should not be looking at the top ships in the shipyard or on the wikis. Perhaps they should be looking at the mission BBS in front of them and playing the game.

 

[thro]

Not everyone wants to invest in an asp and intensively mine for hours upon hours on end per day for months (to kit a large ship for combat, you'll need far more than the initial cost of the ship itself). Bounty hunting? Fahgetaboudit. Missions? Nada. Exploration? Naw. Missions in particular are horribly implemented in this game, since they don't scale well (if at all) in terms of credits, tasks, and difficulty. Thus, they're worthless beyond faction rep.

I think perhaps your expectation of the time-frame for playing this game is out of whack. I started playing Frontier Elite 2 in '94, and will still occasionally fire it up and start out in the eagle.

Why?

Because i like playing the game.

Doesn't matter so much what ship you are in, playing the game is the point. High end rewards and equipment will take time. This is not a game you should expect to "beat" in 30-40 hours.

Serious question. Why is 100 million + Cr ridiculous?
-
In one month I have progressed from a Sidey to an Asp worth about 11 million and I have 5 million in the bank. This was all done without much difficulty, and I am sure others have progressed much further because I haven't really been trying these last two weeks since I got the Asp. Just found a nice system for mining and I reckon if I pushed it I could make 4 million a day (so 100 million in less than a month), but I've got more interesting things to do once I have enough money for a few rebuys.
-
With these numbers in mind it seems to me that no player will be "prohibited from having the prestige of operating a giant vessel" if they are prepared to put in the hard yards for it. OK, the post-release players may still be finding their feet but I confidently expect some of them to overtake me in their Clippers, Dropships and Type 9s while I am still in the Asp. Sure they need to have a financial plan in place to support such a big ship, but that's a fundamental aspect of the game and just dropping the ship prices to make things easier isn't the way to go in my opinion.
-
The permit to operate that you suggest is a good idea and I think FD intends to implement it in the form of faction standing restrictions on access to top level hardware. I don't think it's in place yet though.

Pretty much.

Please don't dumb this game down. There are plenty of "easy-win" games out there, the old-timers/adults amongst us want something with rewards that are actually meaningful.

You want a capital ship? You work your way up to it. In the mean time, enjoy the game for the game and worry less about how many credits you have and how long it is going to take to get whatever ship you have your eye on.

I've spent most of my time so far running courier missions, exploration and mercenary work. You can do any of that in the sidewinder. Focusing so much on getting the big ship you will miss out on all the nuances in the gameplay for the smaller ship and not enjoy the game so much. Even back in Elite 2, once i got the panther clipper it usually resulted in going back to an Asp to do other more interesting things than grinding trade runs or getting my Elite rating up by just sitting in space with a bunch of shield generators waiting for pirates to crash into me and die, or fly into the path of my plasma accelerator...

 

[SquidgyB]

I think the most important thing is that the returns per hour (roughly) for mining, bounty hunting, missioning and trading are more or less the same - though I'm well aware there will be lots of different reasons and opinions on this - it's certainly not a hard and fast rule.

The simple fact right now is that if you want to make the £££ you'll have to go trading - and not everyone wants to (or should *have* to) do that. Any other line of nusiness just doesn't make the same amount of cash, no matter how good you are at it. I'm not saying trading needs to be nerfed, far from it - but the other routes need some buffing up, that's for sure.

Point in fact - I player through Gamma and through to last weekend doing nothing but bounty hunting/missions and crawled my way up to a nicely fitted Cobra in, what, a month?

Last week I turned to the darkside. Got a Type-6 and decided to do some trading (I haven't used Thrudds or any other trading tool, btw). Figured out where to buy/sell and noticed some little tips and tricks of my own on the way... I had an Asp in a matter of hours. A couple more days I had a Clipper. Tonight I'll have a Python. 3mil an hour in an Asp seemed like it was raining gold. I expect 5-6mil or more per hour from the Python.

I play a lot, that's true, but at the same time at these rates I could have an Anaconda next week...

tl:dr I reckon ship costs are fine, it's the money to be made from anything other than trading that needs to be buffed a bit.

 

[FluorescentBlack]

I'll sit and play Gran Turismo with my wheel. I may not be driving a Ferrari at the time but I enjoy the driving part and the track. The car is not near as important much of the time.

With more ships on the way it may be that the gaps between ships are big. I'm certain they will be filled in a bit. Just enjoy the car your in. Better yet, do what I do when I pick up a new game. Play the imagination fast forward game and say you have all the money and all the ships. What will you do now? Go get started on that now.