Should we be that angry or annoyed about carriers? game development has changed!
- Thread starter Muzz UK
- Start date
He seems to be winning them every day recently.
This board should not necessarily be indicative of the thoughts of most people playing the game. Many don't come on here, many read but dont post. Clearly there will be disappointment with the latest news, that's understandable - but the vitriol and brain dead comments I've read about devs are just little keyboard warriors with nothing better to do. Sit them in the pub with some devs and see if they're quite so forthright - I suspect they'd be far more polite in person.
And you are also wrong in turn.
The players do that all the time. Just read the forum posts. We want this, we want that, FDev should do this or the game will die and so on and so on ad nauseam.
What would the gamers do if all announcements from FDev said it this way?
"We like to bring you these features in Q4 but we're not certain that any of them will make to the final product as it depends on a number of factors that we have no control over".
[Sarcasm alert]
You're in construction eh?
Bunch of amateurs really, my Granddad could do better. Buildings go up and they're never right. Builders & construction companies can't do a job right and then have the gall to charge the customer to put their mistake right. And it's never their fault. They blame the weather, the architects, Brexit, the exchange rate, the suppliers, any one else but not themselves.
I've never know a building to be built on time, on budget and that had no problems when built.
I guess you're not really one to talk.
Glass houses and stones and all that.
[Sarcasm off]
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Yeah
I read an earlier comment about how players feel it is not as good as they'd wished but not so bad they can stop playing; read in one of the patch notes 'over 1000 bugs fixed', that is nothing to sneeze at.
Personally I feel pretty good about the occasional bug as long as they are not game-breaking, and if they are they usually gets fixed within a day or two - surely one can be without Elite a day or two?
I wish for allot more gamewise in Elite and I am extremely happy that management are continuing next year with still more updates and a payed for DLC which surely has to have some compelling reasons to be bought, why else release a payed for expansion?
Should we get angry or annoyed? No. At the end of the day it's just a computer game, and we all really should focus our energies into the parts of our lives that give them real meaning, like friends, family, loved ones, and continually pestering for hula-girl bobbleheads.
Is it okay to express irritation and give sometimes uncomfortable feedback? Yes of course, but we also need to remember the 90:8:2 rule of forums, with that being (very broadly) the ratio of game owners who- don't read : read : post in, forums.
Is it okay to express irritation and give sometimes uncomfortable feedback? Yes of course, but we also need to remember the 90:8:2 rule of forums, with that being (very broadly) the ratio of game owners who- don't read : read : post in, forums.
The problem is how do you define or quality control early access.
I've played early access games that have little to no content and some that were £9.99 and I got more enjoyment and fun than a £40 title.
Sorry but we are in the age where development is always technically early access or ongoing! These breed of multiplayer games are never finished. Frontier have never not delivered a feature just some are delayed. You don't pay for specific content you pay to support a seasons worth. I'd rather wait 3 months for fleet carriers that they work than have them now.
You get far more game for £40 than you did in 1999 but people are still unhappy!
I also suspect that Valve and EA are responsible for early access rather than developers and publishers... Oh holy Gabe is a clever man put all games on one platform then charge people to alpha and beta test them, we'll take a small cut but not quality control it.
I bet half the people moaning about Elite Dangerous and carriers have already had 500+ hours for less than £40.00. If you break the cost down thats 12p an hour. Look at most shooters from the 90s and early noughties you paid £30-£40 for what 4-5 hours play through.
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Yeah
I read an earlier comment about how players feel it is not as good as they'd wished but not so bad they can stop playing; read in one of the patch notes 'over 1000 bugs fixed', that is nothing to sneeze at.
Personally I feel pretty good about the occasional bug as long as they are not game-breaking, and if they are they usually gets fixed within a day or two - surely one can be without Elite a day or two?
I wish for allot more gamewise in Elite and I am extremely happy that management are continuing next year with still more updates and a payed for DLC which surely has to have some compelling reasons to be bought, why else release a payed for expansion?
Thanks, everyone here will readily admit that there are aspects of the game that are either lacking or need major improvement. But the majority are still happy with the game, it is playable, I personally find it highly addictive and enjoyable, in fact I have put more hours into this game than any other game I have played since the mid 80's. As for bugs, every game has bugs, in fact every program has bugs, and some are big, some are minor. Strangely it is often these small bugs that set these people off, even if it doesn't stop them playing the game.
Unfortunately, there are some who either get bored with the game, or some small aspect of the game mechanics will get under their skin to the point of utter frustration. In this situation, most sane people would realise that they aren't enjoying the game anymore and move onto whatever takes their fancy. But a small but very vocal minority here think that everyone needs to know what they perceive is wrong with the game and will insist on telling their tails of woe time and time again.
This little bit right here tells me that your crowd has the same problem, across three platforms no less, as Frontier. That is lack of communication with the community that is their customer base.
If you only talk to the customers when you need to perform damage control, you cannot manage their expectations because you let the customers create them in the void of your lack of communication.
You see that day in and day out in this forum. Frontier releases some "pretty", with NO actual information, and speculation runs rampant. Then, when the material doesn't match the speculation, there is massive disappointment which was entirely avoidable.
Nope...
Let FD sort out design/develop issues/schedules as necessary.
The past 2-3yrs have been a bit of a schedule/design mess IMHO. There were delays and seemingly issues with designs, and the content released over the past 2-3 seems to reflect that.
All I'm interested in now, is that FD start adding some content of true depth and significance to ED. I don't care in what order or when...
But, if we get content like the past couple of years, then I suspect "angry" and "annoyed" might be the outcome.
Let FD sort out design/develop issues/schedules as necessary.
The past 2-3yrs have been a bit of a schedule/design mess IMHO. There were delays and seemingly issues with designs, and the content released over the past 2-3 seems to reflect that.
All I'm interested in now, is that FD start adding some content of true depth and significance to ED. I don't care in what order or when...
But, if we get content like the past couple of years, then I suspect "angry" and "annoyed" might be the outcome.
And many players want more updates, more often whilst demanding "deep gameplay" but then they don't stop to think that the more "deep" something becomes, the more time it takes, the more complex it can become, the more problems can arise, the more testing is required etc.... Then people whine about "how buggy it is", "why it is late again!?", "Dev time is really slow" and in the worst case scenario "why has it been dropped?"
This Hits the Nail on the head!!!
Ah sure Jasus, at least they're trying I guess. I think expecting perfection from others is a waste of time. Maybe it's because I work in healthcare but I operate under the principle that not all things are possible.
If a person gets diagnosed with incurable cancer and dies it's usually not because the medics were lazy, poorly managed or had their treatment on maintenence mode. It tends to be because you just can't save everyone.
I have no reason to believe that software Dev is any different. Some things just don't work out, this isn't necessarily indicative of a lack of effort.
I feel that it would be easier to be more understanding with Fdev if they were more forthcoming with information. Then again, they're in this boat because of talking about things they wanted to add but ultimately couldn't, I'm not sure the solution to that problem is to talk about more things that you may or may not ultimately be able to add.
Maybe a clear post that outlines the sort of challenges that they faced with those features would go some of the way to making this right. It'd go a long way towards silencing the people who claim: "it's impossible for 100 people to have worked for 12 months and only produced this"
As for the people claiming Fdev are incompetent. Well factually, to the best of my knowledge, they are the most competent developer to have ever produced a game world that consists of over 400 billion star systems.
People have become more demanding, intolerant and entitled in general, it's not just gamers. Just look at politics right now. Hell even my job, you've got people who think nothing of eating, smoking and drinking themselves into terminal chronic disease and yet when they have to wait in an A+E department for an extra 90 minutes they complain at you like it's the NHS' fault that their feet are necrotic.
At the end of the day, Fdev will do Fdev. I really love this game but I really dislike the:
Greetings CMDRs,
We cant talk about REDACTED right now but we assure you it will be REDACTED,
all our REDACTED and best REDACTED,
FDev
style of communicating. It really hasn't grown on me over the years and I don't think it has the effect that Fdev think it does.
If a person gets diagnosed with incurable cancer and dies it's usually not because the medics were lazy, poorly managed or had their treatment on maintenence mode. It tends to be because you just can't save everyone.
I have no reason to believe that software Dev is any different. Some things just don't work out, this isn't necessarily indicative of a lack of effort.
I feel that it would be easier to be more understanding with Fdev if they were more forthcoming with information. Then again, they're in this boat because of talking about things they wanted to add but ultimately couldn't, I'm not sure the solution to that problem is to talk about more things that you may or may not ultimately be able to add.
Maybe a clear post that outlines the sort of challenges that they faced with those features would go some of the way to making this right. It'd go a long way towards silencing the people who claim: "it's impossible for 100 people to have worked for 12 months and only produced this"
As for the people claiming Fdev are incompetent. Well factually, to the best of my knowledge, they are the most competent developer to have ever produced a game world that consists of over 400 billion star systems.
People have become more demanding, intolerant and entitled in general, it's not just gamers. Just look at politics right now. Hell even my job, you've got people who think nothing of eating, smoking and drinking themselves into terminal chronic disease and yet when they have to wait in an A+E department for an extra 90 minutes they complain at you like it's the NHS' fault that their feet are necrotic.
At the end of the day, Fdev will do Fdev. I really love this game but I really dislike the:
Greetings CMDRs,
We cant talk about REDACTED right now but we assure you it will be REDACTED,
all our REDACTED and best REDACTED,
FDev
style of communicating. It really hasn't grown on me over the years and I don't think it has the effect that Fdev think it does.
To the OP, I fully agree.
I am neither angry or annoyed. I am not even disappointed as Frontier didn't say they were dropping Fleet Carriers and changes to Ice Planets, they basically said they were delayed. So we have to wait a bit longer, it's not that big a deal to be honest. If one feels those 2 features are going to "save" Elite: Dangerous then you could be in for disappointment when they do come.
I do, however, think Frontier should change the way they announce planned features. Instead of saying "We are planning to add ...", they should say "We are planning to add ... , however, no promises". I know they sometimes say "No ETA's, no guarantees" but actually stating they aren't promising anything might kill off the "But Frontier promised" posts if they decide to delay that feature.
Also, I think if the community want to avoid or reduce disappointment, they need to stop looking into what's coming in the long term and instead concentrate on the immediate future (i.e the update which is just about to be released).
So when watching a stream, for example, on the upcoming 3.3 update, ask questions about 3.3, not about "Space Legs" or "Atmospheric Planets". It gets tiring, people asking about those topics, when it's obvious Frontier won't talk about them unless it's a special stream dedicated to announcing those features.
I am neither angry or annoyed. I am not even disappointed as Frontier didn't say they were dropping Fleet Carriers and changes to Ice Planets, they basically said they were delayed. So we have to wait a bit longer, it's not that big a deal to be honest. If one feels those 2 features are going to "save" Elite: Dangerous then you could be in for disappointment when they do come.
I do, however, think Frontier should change the way they announce planned features. Instead of saying "We are planning to add ...", they should say "We are planning to add ... , however, no promises". I know they sometimes say "No ETA's, no guarantees" but actually stating they aren't promising anything might kill off the "But Frontier promised" posts if they decide to delay that feature.
Also, I think if the community want to avoid or reduce disappointment, they need to stop looking into what's coming in the long term and instead concentrate on the immediate future (i.e the update which is just about to be released).
So when watching a stream, for example, on the upcoming 3.3 update, ask questions about 3.3, not about "Space Legs" or "Atmospheric Planets". It gets tiring, people asking about those topics, when it's obvious Frontier won't talk about them unless it's a special stream dedicated to announcing those features.
Why? He was right. A casual browse through the kickstarter and dev diary vids shows a lot of talk that hasn't and probably isn't going to happen.
But winter is coming!
My honest opnion on the topic.
Before to have a rant about the missing squadron carriers and icy planets improvement you
should read carefully what Zac said in the official comunication.
They are postpounded for the next expansion's reason.
what does it means ? I think it means that we will have squadron carriers but not how we can expect ..
a new, most playable and logic, form to gather players into a personal guild.
Something more articolate and logistic when the new expansion will arrive.
If you plan to build a wodden charriot when someone next to you is building a Ferrari you should consider the charriot already silly before starting to build it for real.
Same thing for the airless ice worlds improvements: if Devs plan to build atmospheric icy planets then using two different team to develop the same final result is an error.
SO i guess that airless Ice planets will benefit of automatically graphic improvements once the new expansion will arrive.
Before to have a rant about the missing squadron carriers and icy planets improvement you
should read carefully what Zac said in the official comunication.
They are postpounded for the next expansion's reason.
what does it means ? I think it means that we will have squadron carriers but not how we can expect ..
a new, most playable and logic, form to gather players into a personal guild.
Something more articolate and logistic when the new expansion will arrive.
If you plan to build a wodden charriot when someone next to you is building a Ferrari you should consider the charriot already silly before starting to build it for real.
Same thing for the airless ice worlds improvements: if Devs plan to build atmospheric icy planets then using two different team to develop the same final result is an error.
SO i guess that airless Ice planets will benefit of automatically graphic improvements once the new expansion will arrive.
Again this raises my point of expectation and the era we are in. I can name you loads of mass multiplayer games that are "work in progress".
We all expected Elite as a game to launch with epic space combat, several careers, working multiplayer with atmospheric planets, walking around and an amazing universe to follow quickly. This is what Star Citizen has promised us and look where that is. In essence look at No Mans Sky that's taken over a year or so to get near it's promised content. Games like this launch as a shell now.
World of Warcraft took 2-3 years to have good working PvP. I could reel off loads of games that haven't taken years to get near the level they wanted. Star Trek Online... uh Grand Theft Auto 5 Online... Minecraft had no working multiplayer on launch. Literally any online multiplayer game takes years to make. This is why I feel as gamers and customers we expect too much and get far to angry and disappointed. If you want a finished product you pay for a single player game if you go online you're supporting a project or company to deliver long term.
None of the games above had amazing development cycles did they? GTA 5 launch was horrendous.
A lot of that is probably wishful thinking tbh..