Squadrons and Proper colonization mechanics

[M00ka]

Can you go into details how you think this would work? Or if you have covered it already in a previous post, can you point me to it? For PP at least, it would add to the area you need to control, and presumably in a direction away from existing colonized areas, meaning further from your capital, meaning harder to maintain, and PP is already a game where you have to run harder to stay in the same place the more you expand.

For the BGS... well, if you are set up out on the edge, perhaps, but then, i don't think there is much competition for systems out on the edge anyway.



How could it be blocked? And why would anyone want to block it. So, you're looking to colonize a system out on the edge of a bubble. Why would anyone care? Go right ahead, be my guest.

Therein lies the crux of the matter, the location of these fiefdoms. Whilst those who want them will say on here that they are quite content to be out on the edge of nothingness what they really want is to carve out their little bit of space in the bubble. Unless they can interact with everyone, proclaim their sovereignty over the system, who will know they exist! Rest assured they want to be right in the middle of everything, you don't build the biggest most fortified castle where no one can see it!

Just look at the OP's credentials: He is the Sky Marshall of the Earth Defence Fleet. Why Earth, it isn't home to any of the major faction capitals, heck the system is permit blocked, there is nothing to defend. But it sits right in the middle of the bubble, lots of traffic to exert their power over, can't do that when you are stuck on a rock 10,000 lys from the nearest populated system!

 

[Vicktore Beskor]

Therein lies the crux of the matter, the location of these fiefdoms. Whilst those who want them will say on here that they are quite content to be out on the edge of nothingness what they really want is to carve out their little bit of space in the bubble. Unless they can interact with everyone, proclaim their sovereignty over the system, who will know they exist! Rest assured they want to be right in the middle of everything, you don't build the biggest most fortified castle where no one can see it!

Just look at the OP's credentials: He is the Sky Marshall of the Earth Defence Fleet. Why Earth, it isn't home to any of the major faction capitals, heck the system is permit blocked, there is nothing to defend. But it sits right in the middle of the bubble, lots of traffic to exert their power over, can't do that when you are stuck on a rock 10,000 lys from the nearest populated system!

Your assumptions of my intentions could not be farther from the truth. And the why and how we became the EDF is also very wrong. You make assumptions on things you know nothing about.
So let me give you the most simplest explanation on the how and why.
1- All of the founding members of the EDF fought on the Federation side of the Lugh war against the Crimson State Group.
2- Earth is the cradle of humanity and we are loyal commanders of the Federation
3- When FDev first introduced PMF we where one of the first ten PMF and we choose our home system because how close it was to Earth. Our home system is Okinura by the way. And if you would like to know more about our RP story read the information of Okinura on the Galaxy map in game.

So if I was you I would stop making assumptions without all the information.
As far as my feelings behind asking for suggestions about on a way to block a colonization of a minor faction it is because I feel for every action there needs to be a opposite and equal reaction. That way it is a fare gameplay mechanic.

 

[Agony_Aunt]

Your assumptions of my intentions could not be farther from the truth. And the why and how we became the EDF is also very wrong. You make assumptions on things you know nothing about.
So let me give you the most simplest explanation on the how and why.
1- All of the founding members of the EDF fought on the Federation side of the Lugh war against the Crimson State Group.
2- Earth is the cradle of humanity and we are loyal commanders of the Federation
3- When FDev first introduced PMF we where one of the first ten PMF and we choose our home system because how close it was to Earth. Our home system is Okinura by the way. And if you would like to know more about our RP story read the information of Okinura on the Galaxy map in game.

So if I was you I would stop making assumptions without all the information.
As far as my feelings behind asking for suggestions about on a way to block a colonization of a minor faction it is because I feel for every action there needs to be a opposite and equal reaction. That way it is a fare gameplay mechanic.

Ok, and i think its unfair to focus on your faction when we are discussing a general mechanic that could be of interest to many.

But it would be interesting to hear what your faction would do with this mechanic should it be implemented.

I mean, for my faction, its pretty useless. We are also well within the bubble, so nowhere really to colonize. But for me as an explorer and miner, i might be interested in colonizing somewhere outside the bubble. A home away from home as it were.

 

[Vicktore Beskor]

Ok, and i think its unfair to focus on your faction when we are discussing a general mechanic that could be of interest to many.

But it would be interesting to hear what your faction would do with this mechanic should it be implemented.

I mean, for my faction, its pretty useless. We are also well within the bubble, so nowhere really to colonize. But for me as an explorer and miner, i might be interested in colonizing somewhere outside the bubble. A home away from home as it were.

I use the EDF because it is the faction that I am most familiar with. As far as PCM I feel all minor faction should be able to use the colonization mechanics. I feel it should be added to the BGS as an option a long side of expansion. The only difference I feel it would make for a great Squadron type mission.
I all feel that the distance any minor faction can colonize should be based on the factions Net Worth. And the Net Worth should be based on all of the assets the minor faction controls.
I also like to add that colonization needs very specific criteria. Like the minor faction needs to hit 90% influence in the minor factions home system. Also the systems that are being colonized in need specific criteria as well. That way players can not colonized any where they want and any time they want. This way there are some controls over the PCM.

 

[Agony_Aunt]

I use the EDF because it is the faction that I am most familiar with. As far as PCM I feel all minor faction should be able to use the colonization mechanics. I feel it should be added to the BGS as an option a long side of expansion. The only difference I feel it would make for a great Squadron type mission.
I all feel that the distance any minor faction can colonize should be based on the factions Net Worth. And the Net Worth should be based on all of the assets the minor faction controls.
I also like to add that colonization needs very specific criteria. Like the minor faction needs to hit 90% influence in the minor factions home system. Also the systems that are being colonized in need specific criteria as well. That way players can not colonized any where they want and any time they want. This way there are some controls over the PCM.

No, you misunderstand me. I think its unfair of others to focus on your faction when its of use to many. I understand why you are looking at it from the perspective of your faction.

As for distance... yeah, makes sense, although its a killer for my faction, i don't think we could make it to the next system with out net worth. We might be able to afford to colonize a pebble

But i'm still not getting what you would actually use it for and what benefit you hope to get from it.

 

[Vicktore Beskor]

No, you misunderstand me. I think its unfair of others to focus on your faction when its of use to many. I understand why you are looking at it from the perspective of your faction.

As for distance... yeah, makes sense, although its a killer for my faction, i don't think we could make it to the next system with out net worth. We might be able to afford to colonize a pebble

But i'm still not getting what you would actually use it for and what benefit you hope to get from it.

Let’s look at it from a Power Play perspective the EDF Government type is Corporation. If PCM was in the game we could colonize into enemy Territory in an attempt to raise fortification course of an enemy powers control zone.
And if we look at it from an RP perspective the EDF is a Federation minor faction we could use PCM to get a foot hold in let’s say empire space.
One last one idea. If we wanted to use PCM to expand the EDF out of the bubble and make a new EDF bubble somewhere else in the Galaxy map.


And as far as your faction is concerned you could use PCM to raise your factions Net Worth by colonizing new systems.

 

[Deareim]

OP : Do you mean actual content ?

 

[Vicktore Beskor]

OP : Do you mean actual content ?

I feel that if we the players have the tools and abilities to colonize unpopulated Star systems it would bring a sense of the living Galaxy to the game. PCM would be an innovative and evolving gameplay mechanic that I feel is the next logical step for elite dangerous

 

[Captain Willard]

You can paint a pretty picture. Put a dress and lipstick on a pig, it's still a pig. You are wanting to create another eve online.
So my vote is a definite no

 

[fu9ar]

No player bases in ED. Hope, wish and pray.

The Colonia Expansion Initiative (and the existence of player directed megaships like The Gnosis) would like a word with you.

 

[Vicktore Beskor]

You can paint a pretty picture. Put a dress and lipstick on a pig, it's still a pig. You are wanting to create another eve online.
So my vote is a definite no

I am sorry to see that so many commanders are so close minded about new and fresh ideas.
Nothing I suggested is anything like eve online, don’t fear the unknown embrace it and accept the challenges it provides.

 

[Mohrgan]

I am sorry to see that so many commanders are so close minded about new and fresh ideas.
Nothing I suggested is anything like eve online, don’t fear the unknown embrace it and accept the challenges it provides.

New and fresh? I can't imagine how any of this is anything like new. These ideas amount to inserting the game play of decades old games, that I can go and play at any time, into E|D. Say no to the bloat.

 

[Kaocraft]

Hello commanders
Now that we are soon to have squadrons entered into the game many commanders are asking the questions what are they going to do and why do we need them. Well I would like to make a suggestion. Assuming That squadrons will be able to pledge to the minor factions that they support there is a lot that they can accomplish as a group. And one of those goals could be colonizing unpopulated systems with said minor faction. I am going to attempt to outline what I think would be interesting gameplay mechanics.

1-Squadron buys a colonization permit from universal cartography and or the superpower that they plan to colonize in
2-they buy a colonization module from an engineer
3- they use there Carrier to transport the module to the system they wish to Colonize
4- they place the module on a planet suitable for colonization
5- once this is done they can start to build the colony

Building the colony can take place in stages.

1- you start by building a simple land base.
2- as time goes by the land base can grow to a spaceport
3- once a spaceport has been built you can build an simple outpost in space
4- as time goes by the outpost grows into a space station
5- once the space station is completed the system enters into the greater BGS system wherein other minor factions can expand into.

Now this is the most simplest explanation of the mechanics I am suggesting I wanted to leave it open for debate. That being said in my humble opinion this is the type of gameplay that gives squadrons a lot of options. And if done right it dose not have to be gated off from solo commanders. If a solo commander wants to put the time and hard work it would take to accomplish this type of goal it should be open to them as well.

Thank you
Sky Marshal Vicktore Beskor (EDF)
Fly Strong

Lost me at "buys a permit."
It ain't colonialism if you have to ask permission.

Here's a nice big open-ended alternative idea: FDev please add some mechanism to the BGS for increasing and decreasing populations in inhabited systems, with some way for players to participate in affecting the outcome.

 

[Bryan K]

OP, I think this idea would be better suited for NMS, where base-building is an intended mechanic. ED was never meant to be that kind of game. You’re barking up the wrong tree here.

Lost me at "buys a permit."
It ain't colonialism if you have to ask permission.

Here's a nice big open-ended alternative idea: FDev please add some mechanism to the BGS for increasing and decreasing populations in inhabited systems, with some way for players to participate in affecting the outcome.

You mean like genocide?

 

[Han_Zen]

You mean like genocide?

I hope he meant migration. If not, I'm a little skeptical of the rapid population increase mechanics. :O

 

[Cmdr Eratosthenes]

NPBIE

 

[lenna]

Hello commanders
Now that we are soon to have squadrons entered into the game many commanders are asking the questions what are they going to do and why do we need them. Well I would like to make a suggestion. Assuming That squadrons will be able to pledge to the minor factions that they support there is a lot that they can accomplish as a group. And one of those goals could be colonizing unpopulated systems with said minor faction. I am going to attempt to outline what I think would be interesting gameplay mechanics.

Short version - absolutely on no uncertain terms should players ever have "absolute" ownership nor direct control of a base of operations - other than the already proposed carriers that is.

That been said, the idea of limited support for helping NPC factions establish new bases is not completely unreasonable but I do not think it is a good idea for ED.

[EDIT]It is not a particularly new idea either, but ED is not and should not become about (nor facilitate) 4X type gameplay IMO.[/EDIT]

 

[Saool]

I am sorry to see that so many commanders are so close minded about new and fresh ideas.
Nothing I suggested is anything like eve online, don’t fear the unknown embrace it and accept the challenges it provides.

I don't think people are being closed minded about new ideas. It's they are not in fact, new ideas. It's that, if I am reading your ideas, across various posts, correctly, at the core of what you want, is player owned infrastructure, leading to player owned stations, ports and systems. Which is why people draw analogies to EvE so much. Many people post about minor factions like they own them. I have put four minor factions in Elite so far. I don't own one of them. Yes I can ask for some, limited changes to them, within a set of rules, but they are not mine. I can't stop others flying for them, or speaking for them. The stations still talk to me like I am an independent Commander. No-one says 'welcome home' or calls me Sir. And that is one of the ways Elite differs from EvE. The Devs have said that is intentional and people like it like that.

Squadrons is Fdev's way of getting more group tools into the game. Of making it easier to fly with your friends. But it is about those tools, not ownership of things. There has been, so far, no confirmation of any link between squadrons and minor factions (although they have said it is being considered). The carrier, to me, looks like Fdev's bone they are throwing to people who want player owned infrastructure. And sure, I would also like an asset that you can never lose (but we will be too small to own one I suspect), but it is not the same as owning stations. And whist you have not talked about owning systems and stations (in this thread) you are again linking squadrons to the BGS. Which is why people keep talking about EvE Dangerous. Different game, and one a lot of us don't want here. I did my 7 years there. If I want to do that again I will just re-install it.

 

[M00ka]

I am sorry to see that so many commanders are so close minded about new and fresh ideas.
Nothing I suggested is anything like eve online, don’t fear the unknown embrace it and accept the challenges it provides.

Well I am sorry you are so closed minded that you can't realise that not everyone shares your view of how the game should develop. Proposing a radical change in the direction of the game is one thing, dismissing anyone who doesn't share your view is another.

 

[Vicktore Beskor]

Allow me to clear this up never once in my OP did I mention player ownership. My intention with this thread is to offer future gameplay mechanics that would take advantage of Squadron gameplay. As far as the negativity from others on this forum my I remind you all that many commanders were very negative towards proper fleet mechanics and now we have squadrons on our doorstep. And let me say I am looking for the possibility that will come with Squadrons. And I look forward to hearing more information from FDev about what we can expect from the Squadron gameplay.
To say that proper colonization mechanics would not fit in Elite Dangerous or that it is all about empire building is just fear mongering and just being a negative Nelly. I can except a intelligent debate about the how and why of PCM but to just to come out and say “NO” because I said so is just being closed minded.
So I ask the question and I challenge some to explain to me why PCM would not work in Elite Dangerous by making an intelligent argument. Not just because I said so or just “NO”. Plus not just fear mongering.