And I deeply love how the inner thought is parented to the bartender, so it's constantly moving. Stellar UI/UX design. Never done before (this way - but anyone with a pinch of common sense can imagine why)
Game Discussions Star Citizen Discussion Thread v12
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Not sure if you have played Morrowind by Bethesda but it has NPC that behave exactly the same. You have to time your quests right otherwise the NPC quest giver or target is at the pub, gone home etc. The game gives you a way to speed up time such that you don't have to wait out normal game time for the next time they are available. Morrowind is a 2002 game and I cannot recall the NPC standing on the seats nor the tavern bartender not giving you a drink.
Forerunner to the radiant system for NPC I guess. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radiant_AI
It's been in everything from Shenmue to Fable (which also had NPC characters that reacted to your smell/state, but nobody cares because it just came across as cartoonish)
Heck, The Great Escape on the spectrum had NPCs going about routine jobs and day/night cycles
Oh yes, we should. Tesla has been recently fined in Germany for selling car autopilots and suggesting autonomous driving capability by using flashy and misleading promotion. Consumers get crapped on every day by corp doublespeak if you don't guard against it and what CIG and the Ant do is no different.
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P.S.Double post I guess I have 2 many drinks......
I have no confidence that CIG will get done ALL their promises. Just read what I though about the server meshing. I have confidence that CIG will TRY to get done their promises and will get done fully SOME of them. For the promises that fails, they will simplify the mechanics to get the job done for the release.
The actual AI showed by the bartender is ugly when it bugs. I like it for the videos with no bugs, not perfect but a good start. I don't care about bugs because it's alpha and alpha/beta are made to get rid of them. The alpha show stuff bugged and CIG works on it, nothing more for me. Whatever will be SC at its release, the vast majority of bugs will be gone... and also a few of the features they show us now and since the beginning.
CIG is not innovative, they don't revolutionize technology. Every thing they do in the alpha has been seen in another games
Yes my tolerance and the tolerance of a lot of backers are insanely high for this project. That's the main thing you don't understand from us : we have no other choice offered. The main reason why I am insanely tolerant is because there is no other project like SC that I can buy/fund in the gaming industry atm that try to do such a game. If I want to fund now another project with such a scope, I can't, there is not one with : space+planets+beautiful graphics+ships with walkable interiors+dogfight+flight in space+flight atmo+EVA+FPS+FPS combats+Trade+Delivery+Roleplay (and some more). This list is the SOLE reason why I am insanely patient and funding CIG. I am 50 years old and will be still able to game perhaps for the 20 next years. What can I do if I want to play such a game ? Wait the next 20 years to see if EA or Epic will make such a game ? Not one chance to see it coming in near future from the AAA game industry when a project of the scope of SC can only be done by the AAA game industry.
Just give me a link to another project with this scope and I will give it the double I gave to SC just to have a good competitor to SC.
It's one of the reason I bought Elite with the Odyssey's announcement. Having a good competitor to CIG is good for both CIG and FDev. I know FDev will not check all points in my list of features but I dream they will check enough of them for me to enjoy Odyssey like I enjoy the actual SC alpha.
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Oh that's simple: because the tiny teams on tiny budgets actually do those things, whereas CIG has artists render a never-ending stream of art assets that get refused, reworked, approved, unapproved, and finally released only to immediately be slated for redesign and rework all over again. Over and over and over.
Because someone in charge has no clear and coherent vision, next to zero imagination, and no sense of priority between the details and the whole, yet harbours a compelling need to micro-manage the visuals to the exclusion of anything and everything that actually matters to creating a game.
Again: Everquest 2, back in 2012. It's been mentioned over and over again, so it's getting to the point where it almost seems like you're clinging to a last straw the way you keep "not recalling" it.
The problem is that they're not struggling with the full-scope complexity. They're struggling with the trivialities of each and every individual detail to a laugable degree, even (especially) things that are long-since solved problems.
There's probably a good reason for that.
And that just leads us back to that age-old question: what would it take for you to stop doing that? At what point does it become evident to you that, no matter how much time and funding is afforded them, they will not be able to deliver what you're asking for? Given that they have consistently failed at everything they've ever attempted, how much more failure would be needed before a pattern is established where you conclude that they are no more (and possibly far far less) capable of achieving that scope than the AAA developers who have already chosen not to pursue it?
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Ah, but here it's the "autonomous driving" that (rightfully) got them in trouble, so the implied performance level of the "AI" (which, in this case, is heavily relying on deep neural networks), not the precise nature of the algorithms. Just like in gaming, it's the point of the AI that matters: whether it can or can't drive the car by itself to a satisfying degree of performance and safety, not the number of layers in the model. Same with the bartender, the tech behind it doesn't matter apart for a weird minority thinking it's a point scoring exercise, what matters is whether it works satisfyingly/convincingly or not.
I agree that some terms shouldn't be misused, but AI has been a vague one since the 80s. If you want to throw me into a rant, ask me about the current misuse of the term "roguelike".
(or not as I'd catch a ban for profanity and off-topic)@CMDR Dizzy Yeah, played a lot of Morrowind, and it's close-ish, but still not quite U7 levels imho. The interaction of NPCs with props and items pushes it that bit further: put a candelabra with spent candles from your backpack onto the tavern table and the staff will put fresh candles on it, just because it's there for example. I feel it's a sad indictment that so few games bother with that as it's relatively low-tech but damn effective at getting a convincing life going on. We'll see what Bethesda come up with in their space thingie and TES6!
Yeah as mentioned a few times, EverQuest did FOIP in 2012.
Eventually dropping support for it.
Ah, but here it's the "autonomous driving" that (rightfully) got them in trouble, so the implied performance level of the "AI" (which, in this case, is heavily relying on deep neural networks), not the precise nature of the algorithms. Just like in gaming, it's the point of the AI that matters: whether it can or can't drive the car by itself to a satisfying degree of performance and safety, not the number of layers in the model. Same with the bartender, the tech behind it doesn't matter apart for a weird minority thinking it's a point scoring exercise, what matters is whether it works satisfyingly/convincingly or not.
I agree that some terms shouldn't be misused, but AI has been a vague one since the 80s. If you want to throw me into a rant, ask me about the current misuse of the term "roguelike".
@CMDR Dizzy Yeah, played a lot of Morrowind, and it's close-ish, but still not quite U7 levels imho. The interaction of NPCs with props and items pushes it that bit further: put a candelabra with spent candles from your backpack onto the tavern table and the staff will put fresh candles on it, just because it's there for example. I feel it's a sad indictment that so few games bother with that as it's relatively low-tech but damn effective at getting a convincing life going on. We'll see what Bethesda come up with in their space thingie and TES6!
Yeah, "roguelike" is just another example of this practice. I regularly screen Steam for that category and often frown what landed in the shelves under that tag.
You learn me something. Thanks for the info, I've edited my post.
Stop what ?
- it cost me nothing (0 €) atm
- I enjoy testing the alpha even with the bugs atm
- the fun is improving patch after patch atm
- no other game offer me, with the same level of pleasure, what I like to do in the current alpha atm
Because you're prone to be misled and exploited for cash.
Being "insanely patient and funding CIG."
No, the real question is what it would take you to stop. You know, the question you chose to try to deflect by not answering it and instead offering a completely diferent one...
Not one chance ! I've bought the minimal pack and It cost me now 0 € each years.
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So in other words, you have been misled and exploited for cash. The amount being a small one doesn't really change that.
I've stopped funding CIG several years ago because I've only bought the starting package, nothing more.
I will not stop beeing insanely patient because no choice (see my last post about it).
Well, while being patient you disseminated SC yollocks to others. It's like a pandemic - and the naive are the ones who pay the price. It is a social quality to not spout CIG's nonsense unfiltered out.
You have plenty of choice. What you said in that post doesn't mean you have no choice - it means you've chosen not to... yet. And I'm asking at what point you'd re-evaluate that choice.
What you're saying here is essentially that even if SC was released as a P2W mobile candy-crush clone and then proptly abandoned forever, you would still be patient with it. Is that really how extreme your willingness to forgive CIG is, or is there an actual limit to it?
Anyone can browse through recent SC Twitch clips for some great content.
Top SC clips in the last 24 hours
Example: Myre stuck (Twitch clip)