Newcomer / Intro Starting up with trading...but not sure if I'm doing it right!

[TickTockRob]

Some permits are links to navy ranking in Federation and Empire, some are locked by a local faction (like Alioth) and others are just locked for reasons only the Devs know. In the example of Alioth you need to gain reputation with the controlling faction. This faction is present in one of the nearby systems so you do missions for them to improve your reputation to gain the permit. You'd have to do a search for details as it was a while ago when I got mine.
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For what it is worth my taxi Hauler just got destroyed by interdiction (Cobra + wingmate)...annoying but not the end of the world.

ahh I didn't realise permits worked in a local fasion too. Interesting! I may try to get that going...I like how they've permitted off Sol though, as I imagine everyone would head there from the off. I'm looking forward to seeing it.

And what a pain! At least you didn't lose too much

 

[TickTockRob]

this is describing heat mechanic/smuggling/targeting from devs perspective: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=68069&page=5&p=1158586&viewfull=1#post1158586

Thank you for that!

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Look at the right of your dashboard. Above the fuel gauge is a wiggly thing like the graphics equaliser on a hi-fi. This your heat signature. When your ship is cool it's almost flatlining, When you bork a fuel scooping attempt and heat rises this meter gets spikier than a hedgehog party.

Ahh I see this now...not obvious at all if you don't know what you're looking for!

 

[ar1976]

I am doing a lot of smuggling in imp slaves. Actually don't even think about getting scanned. Just approach from planet side, keep speed high by boosting and make sure you reach the mail slot soon.
Actually it helps hitting the walls of the mail slot to lose some speed to speed up docking. Running o low weight conda with 5a power and 7d thrusters, 4a docking shield.
I don't recall ever being scanned and if you're after profit/h you need to dock quick in any case.
Btw. I started sidey, then hauler, cobra, type 6, type 7, type 9. The type 9 is a pain really. No surprise. But as to the 6 and 7 I could evade most interdictions without trouble in those. Agree with previous posters, don't upgrade when you just got the money for the base ship. Keep your old ship for safety, upgrade the new ship FSD to A spec (and obviously the cargo racks), at least d thrusters, too. Keep enough money for the insurance and take care.
I haven't tried 3rd party tools for trading though I admit I coded a little to gather my own price data and derive some multi-hop routes. I spent days exploring and finding some good routes which was a big motivator for me.
Whenever I get bored of running the same route all over I head off somewhere else to ease the itching question of whether there is a better route out there... trust me, every time I started off I finally found one

Another one: Respect player pirates. If they interdict you and you got no means to fight, yield. They have a codex. They will let you get away with your ship (and possibly some cargo). And it adds to the gameplay, I really loved some of the encounters. Don't combat log.

If you ever get killed on sight without any roleplay, move somewhere else for a while. You can't completely avoid it without soloing (which would kill the fun) as there are some players without manners or honour out there. Calculate the loss and be prepared. Avoid player infested areas like CG if you are alone in a weak ship or are low on funds. Happened to me only twice since I started the game (I was in in beta), most of the players I met were quite nice guys.

Safe trading, mate.
See you out there.

 

[TickTockRob]

I am doing a lot of smuggling in imp slaves. Actually don't even think about getting scanned. Just approach from planet side, keep speed high by boosting and make sure you reach the mail slot soon.
Actually it helps hitting the walls of the mail slot to lose some speed to speed up docking. Running o low weight conda with 5a power and 7d thrusters, 4a docking shield.
I don't recall ever being scanned and if you're after profit/h you need to dock quick in any case.
Btw. I started sidey, then hauler, cobra, type 6, type 7, type 9. The type 9 is a pain really. No surprise. But as to the 6 and 7 I could evade most interdictions without trouble in those. Agree with previous posters, don't upgrade when you just got the money for the base ship. Keep your old ship for safety, upgrade the new ship FSD to A spec (and obviously the cargo racks), at least d thrusters, too. Keep enough money for the insurance and take care.
I haven't tried 3rd party tools for trading though I admit I coded a little to gather my own price data and derive some multi-hop routes. I spent days exploring and finding some good routes which was a big motivator for me.
Whenever I get bored of running the same route all over I head off somewhere else to ease the itching question of whether there is a better route out there... trust me, every time I started off I finally found one

Another one: Respect player pirates. If they interdict you and you got no means to fight, yield. They have a codex. They will let you get away with your ship (and possibly some cargo). And it adds to the gameplay, I really loved some of the encounters. Don't combat log.

If you ever get killed on sight without any roleplay, move somewhere else for a while. You can't completely avoid it without soloing (which would kill the fun) as there are some players without manners or honour out there. Calculate the loss and be prepared. Avoid player infested areas like CG if you are alone in a weak ship or are low on funds. Happened to me only twice since I started the game (I was in in beta), most of the players I met were quite nice guys.

Safe trading, mate.
See you out there.

Thanks for all this - great info there!

Yes, I'm working out my trade routes now, and have had some success! I haven't really used third party tools, but sometimes I'll use one that will display the commodity market, so I don't have to actually visit there...just to save time!

I did sell some slaves early doors, but haven't for a while now. Perhaps I should! but I'm basically getting around 1k avg for each trade route I do, and am now in an Asp Explorer with 118t capacity. I'm buying a Vulture next for combat, but will be saving up for a Clipper after that. Have to up my ranking to get it of course!

I didn't know about these codes of play...I'm not sure if they'll be present on the Xbox though, where I play...!

I'm loving the game though, it's great! And I think I'll be on the PC as well at some point, as I got it cheap off of Steam.

Thanks for your help with this - I'm going to try to make a trade route to Imperial territory, from around Sol, so I can then level up my Imperial ranking as I get in there...should be fun to do!

 

[Rob_the_Sparky]

You should be looking for a round trip profit of 2k+ for a good trade route, or a short round trip distance (ideally both of course). Just remember that when trading gets boring (it will) then go do something else for a while, don't submit to the grind. Also, it is easy to avoid pirates, it is all about choosing location. I used a trade route in the sticks when I could not really afford to loose my ship (I had insurance but not much left if I had to use it). There are good routes out there but I settled for an OK but safe one...

 

[TickTockRob]

You should be looking for a round trip profit of 2k+ for a good trade route, or a short round trip distance (ideally both of course). Just remember that when trading gets boring (it will) then go do something else for a while, don't submit to the grind. Also, it is easy to avoid pirates, it is all about choosing location. I used a trade route in the sticks when I could not really afford to loose my ship (I had insurance but not much left if I had to use it). There are good routes out there but I settled for an OK but safe one...

Yes, I'm managing to avoid pirates now *touches wood* so far so good!

And I'm managing to get a good route going...not a circle as yet, but it works by doing A -> Z -> A which is just as good (although you do have to tweak it slightly).

Very happy with that!

Now I'm just in Uibath or whatever it's called doing the CG. Not sure it'll actually be worth it! Well, I'd make a lot more money doing regular trading I think..I'm getting about 1 million an hour or so...something like that anyway.

Thanks to yours and everyone's help of course!

Hopefully about to buy a Vulture next so I have a combat ship...could upgrade the Asp, but I think I'll leave it for trading for now.

Also, now I'm in Imperial space, I hope to rank up there so I can get a Clipper...long way to Baron though!!!

 

[Rob_the_Sparky]

CG profit can be good if they hit a high tier, but terrible if they do not. I am ranking up from Baron at the moment with a long term aim of a Cutter so am also in Imperial space. Good thing it is a long term goal as I'm looking at low single figures % per mission for smuggling and only ~1% for 2,000,000 credits of legal delivery missions. I know that there are other more optimal mission types for doing this but I'm not looking to grind it and not logging in/out to get more missions. Good luck with getting the Clipper, it is worth it.
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The Courier is also a fun ship, Vulture like shields, cheaper than a Vulture and a fast small target. It does have a small power plant though so is power limited and runs hot. Also less agile than a Vulture. Both are good ships though.

 

[ErikMaintainer]

If you are trading slaves in order to boost your trading profit then try to find a trade route that involves delivering to an outpost (if you cannot find a good route that involves delivering to a station that accepts slaves on the legal market). Delivering illicit cargo to outposts is far easier than to the large stations, due to the lack of security forces. One of my main trade routes is to an outpost with a black market, with that particular round trip netting me approximately 400k credits per trip, with a round trip lasting about 10 minutes. That's 2.4m credits and hour, and sometimes more of I am really 'on it'.

 

[TickTockRob]

CG profit can be good if they hit a high tier, but terrible if they do not. I am ranking up from Baron at the moment with a long term aim of a Cutter so am also in Imperial space. Good thing it is a long term goal as I'm looking at low single figures % per mission for smuggling and only ~1% for 2,000,000 credits of legal delivery missions. I know that there are other more optimal mission types for doing this but I'm not looking to grind it and not logging in/out to get more missions. Good luck with getting the Clipper, it is worth it.
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The Courier is also a fun ship, Vulture like shields, cheaper than a Vulture and a fast small target. It does have a small power plant though so is power limited and runs hot. Also less agile than a Vulture. Both are good ships though.

Yes, the CG I did the other week was pretty poor in regards to turnover (osmium mining I think it was). But the one recently concerning freeing slaves has gone great! I was in the top 30% for that tone, so hopefully it's about 15 million. I managed to get to the first rank of the Empire, but have a way to go!

I managed to see a smuggle run too that gave me 1.5 million credits too, so that was nice!

I'll look into the Courier...I hadn't considered it...but I think the Vulture still has a lot of allure.

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If you are trading slaves in order to boost your trading profit then try to find a trade route that involves delivering to an outpost (if you cannot find a good route that involves delivering to a station that accepts slaves on the legal market). Delivering illicit cargo to outposts is far easier than to the large stations, due to the lack of security forces. One of my main trade routes is to an outpost with a black market, with that particular round trip netting me approximately 400k credits per trip, with a round trip lasting about 10 minutes. That's 2.4m credits and hour, and sometimes more of I am really 'on it'.

Thanks for this! Yes, I noticed the difference between these. I've had a few illicit runs now, and managed okay...I have some heat sinks which help a lot!

I'm not sure I'll go for slaves on a regular basis, as I prefer just to keep things simple and not have variables in that could affect the route. It'll be pretty straight forward of course, so perhaps I'm going too far, but still.

 

[happyfunball]

Thanks for this! Yes, I noticed the difference between these. I've had a few illicit runs now, and managed okay...I have some heat sinks which help a lot!

I'm not sure I'll go for slaves on a regular basis, as I prefer just to keep things simple and not have variables in that could affect the route. It'll be pretty straight forward of course, so perhaps I'm going too far, but still.

You can always go to Imperial space and trade in legal Imperial Slaves. You can find nice and easy hops that can net 15k/ton/hr or more.

 

[TickTockRob]

You can always go to Imperial space and trade in legal Imperial Slaves. You can find nice and easy hops that can net 15k/ton/hr or more.

Are Imperial slaves legal in Imperial space?

I'm there now, around Atlantis, setting up a trade route. Good fun! with which I hope to rank up my Imperial Rank so I can get a clipper!

Ironically, I can now afford one, but don't have the rank to get one! By the time I do have the rank, I'll probably have the money for a Cutter haha

 

[ErikMaintainer]

Are Imperial slaves legal in Imperial space?

Yes, so you can buy them from the commodities market at an Empire-controlled station and sell them to another Empire station without any problem. If you want to sell them at a non-Empire station then you will need to find a station with a black market to sell to and you will need to get into the station without being scanned.

 

[TickTockRob]

Yes, so you can buy them from the commodities market at an Empire-controlled station and sell them to another Empire station without any problem. If you want to sell them at a non-Empire station then you will need to find a station with a black market to sell to and you will need to get into the station without being scanned.

Ahh I didn't know that! Thanks. I get the impression they'll still have high returns, black market or not.

I'm adding them into my trade calcs, so hopefully will get a lucrative route going.

 

[Rob_the_Sparky]

Imperial slaves can generate a high profit on legal trade runs, not sure on illegal runs as I've not tried it and you can't see black market prices.

 

[MagicTofu]

Imperial slaves can generate a high profit on legal trade runs, not sure on illegal runs as I've not tried it and you can't see black market prices.

It's been a long time since I smuggled anything, but when I did, commodities were sold about half the regular market price. It may have changed, but it probably still won't be profitable to buy commodities legally to sell them on the black market.

Also, be careful with imperial slaves (or any other potentially illegal commodities), even in imperial systems, there could be non imperial stations where they could be illegal. Better check everytime you drop to a station and make sure you don't have the 'Illicit cargo' mention above your ship's heat signature to avoid a surprise fine.

 

[ErikMaintainer]

Imperial slaves can generate a high profit on legal trade runs, not sure on illegal runs as I've not tried it and you can't see black market prices.

In terms of finding the black market price I think it comes down to some trial and error, to be honest. I happen to have found a system/station where they can be bought on the commodities market, with a federation station one jump away (30ly) where the sale price to the black market there gives me a profit of around 3,600-3,800 per slave. As the journey both ways only involves a single jump, and the stations are both within 1,000ly of each star, the round trip over the course of an hour can generate upwards of 2.4m/hr.

That is a much higher return than I have been able to find trading them legally between two imperial stations within similar jump ranges.

 

[TickTockRob]

Imperial slaves can generate a high profit on legal trade runs, not sure on illegal runs as I've not tried it and you can't see black market prices.

ahh thanks for this! I'll not discount it after all then!

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In terms of finding the black market price I think it comes down to some trial and error, to be honest. I happen to have found a system/station where they can be bought on the commodities market, with a federation station one jump away (30ly) where the sale price to the black market there gives me a profit of around 3,600-3,800 per slave. As the journey both ways only involves a single jump, and the stations are both within 1,000ly of each star, the round trip over the course of an hour can generate upwards of 2.4m/hr.

That is a much higher return than I have been able to find trading them legally between two imperial stations within similar jump ranges.

Wow, that's amazing...ugh, a pain it's not so easy to spot/find. But I'll definitely keep it in mind and try to find somewhere that will give a good offer like this!

I've been doing a lot of smuggle/heat sink runs lately...going quite well!