If people can have emotional distress over being blown up then i'm sure the PK'ers will have some emotional distress over their target running away / combat logging / legal logging. therefore they are breaking the rules.
News Support update - Reiteration of player harassment rules
- Thread starter Zac Antonaci
- Start date
If people can have emotional distress over being blown up then i'm sure the PK'ers will have some emotional distress over their target running away / combat logging / legal logging. therefore they are breaking the rules.
100% agree. Players annoy me all the time by combat logging but in the past I've used COMMON SENSE to not think that they were harassing me but NOW I've realized that this is considered harassment by FDEV and I'll start reporting people not only for them exploiting, but for them harassing me too. Thanks for the clarification.
I agree
Probably the latter. What they're calling 'harassment' is so vague and open to interpretation that it will be impossible to enforce fairly. Or at least the part about posting stuff to incite anger or interrupting streams; I'm all for taking action against people for circumventing blocks to infiltrate private groups.
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This is definitely a very serious problem with the game. If Frontier wants anything meaningful to ever come of player factions then this is a far more pressing issue than some people 'disrupting' streams.
If you require further clarification, look at the OP from FDev, it doesn't get any clearer. If you feel you're in the right, you have nothing to worry about.
I also have to say the negativity that people put out is exaggerated greatly in comparison to the positive that gets highlighted. For instance, this forums is up in arms over what four people did in one night in Mobius. Those people have raised such a stink that frontier is changing their approach to Player interaction. Well, over on Reddit we have four stories just this last week of players interacting with SDC that had so much fun they took the time to post about it. Two of those players were stepping foot for the first time into open play. SDC is a group of content creators. When we do something we go all out given players the most fun experience they have had in game. Their words not mine. If you ever watch my stream when you see me pull up my friends look list take a look at it. Those are all people that I have blown up at some point or another. These people here complaining are people I've never even met before. This is a video game, in the end it's all about having fun. SDC is built around that.
Those stream snipes, did you bother to mention the ones that thanked us after we join their stream to snipe them? Not making this up they're there, on those videos that you want to ban. It boils down to again, this is a video game, some people know how to have fun, some people don't. If you are in the video game business you might want to pay more attention to the people that do know how to have fun and less attention to the people that spend 99% of their time on these forums complaining. Of all these complaints, how many have experienced what they are complaining about direct? The whole mobius incursion? 15, 15 people get blown up in a game and how much time has been spent whining about it?
Sort your priorities folks. That includes you Zac.
Those stream snipes, did you bother to mention the ones that thanked us after we join their stream to snipe them? Not making this up they're there, on those videos that you want to ban. It boils down to again, this is a video game, some people know how to have fun, some people don't. If you are in the video game business you might want to pay more attention to the people that do know how to have fun and less attention to the people that spend 99% of their time on these forums complaining. Of all these complaints, how many have experienced what they are complaining about direct? The whole mobius incursion? 15, 15 people get blown up in a game and how much time has been spent whining about it?
Sort your priorities folks. That includes you Zac.
If you mean that stating my opinion, where I don't agree with your statement is proving your point I would caution you that simply making a statement that those reacting a certain way to what you post, does not prove any point around the subject, only proves that you know your point is not shared by some. Doesn't really say anything about your point being right or wrong...
I personally haven't mentioned if or if not SDC stream snipe, only the act in general.
also "I hunt them because I'm a murder" is a bit of a weird statement when playing in a game where you effectively cannot die, and thus you as a murderer can't never be removed, where you as a "murderer" can keep killing to your hearts content left right and center, you will never really be able to lose, where the only ones that will lose is your victims.
But that is why frontier is creating a proper crime and punishment/consequence system,
Main difference though, is one is an aggressive action and one is a defensive action, one is an action, the other a reaction.
A grief (overwhelmingly more powerful then B) kills B - B gets upset, B in the future combat logs to avoid griefing.
B combat logs before A can destroy them. - A gets upset and rightly reports B for breaking rules.
Combat logging is already against the rules, so reporting should be done, but A is still the one that starts the episode that might lead to it, A could instead chose to attack a target that they are not overwhelmingly more powerful then, on more equal ground the likelihood of someone combat logging is less, (though yes I know, the risk of it is still there)
Sure but in the example all the players just by coincidence happened to be doing the same charity stream.
It can be claimed that wasn't the motivation, but let's be honest most folk aren't that naive. I don't think Frontier will be anyway.
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I'm with AA who are mortal enemies with SDC and can not remember the last time I attacked a player who was not wanted so this has nothing to do with with defending my own actions.
"look at the OP from FDev, it doesn't get any clearer."
I could hardly make it less clear if I tried. Frontier have set this up to be so vague that they can pretty much just decide to take action against whoever if they prove to unpopular with the community or some subset of the community.
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Way to contradict yourself. You tell people they can be banned for deliberately disrupting a live stream (as if you have any competent means of determining motives) and then turn around to say live streaming in Open invites disruption. You're right about the ladder and that alone. What kind of community manager so blatantly picks sides on such a polarizing issue? You basically imply that you would ban things that are legal if you could because you personally don't approve of them.
If you catch people trying to reenter private groups they've been banned from, are you seriously going to take action against this while you guys impotently allow anyone who cheats by means of hacking and combat logging to get away with it? Because that's what happens. Meanwhile you're too busy trying to passively get the point accross that you sympathize with a crowd of players that views literally every non consensual interaction with other players as "griefing" (it is what it is and that's what they do. That's why they want PvP removed in any way possible).
So what's it gonna be Zac? Are you guys going to get a grip and start fixing what's wrong with your game and find an impartial stance to stick with about gameplay the way any successful Dev does or are you going to keep trying to force the singleplayer/coop peg through the MMO hole?
SPOILER ALERT: It won't fit.
This reply was completely pointless. Contribute to the discussion by explaining your point or don't post at all.
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Amen but good god your text color gave me the brain pains.
1: please don't colour your text makes viewing on certain themes tricky, specifically elite's default one
2: Frontier is not changing anything, they are clarifying what is already there, they haven't changed the wording or anything, they are making it clear, because apparently to some people it was unclear....
There was made a 'stink' over it as you call it, because it was a deplorable action, and SDC has exactly the same tools available to them, the tools the game is based around to fight back against those attacking their/your faction, the background simulation, now if you don't want to use those tools, which are part of the game you are playing, that is no one elses fault or choice but yours.
3: SDC are not the first nor unique in the actions done, your group simply did something that made the kettle boil over, on matters that already exist and are an issue, heck there's several threads about the consequences of griefers in open, namely people seeing less people in it, especially those that want to find pvp targets for piracy, so yeah....it is an issue that's been ongoing, but SDC became the last straw.
4: SDC is build around fun, cool, but then I would think that you would know that when that fun is one-sided that is a potential problem?, in general if one party is having fun at the expense of another, that party will eventually have to find ways of having fun alone? and it isn't even that hard to create good interactions and fun for everyone, and no it doesn't need to be care bear or such as gets thrown around not one bit, there just needs to be 'more' to it then, interdict boom, interdict boom.
Edit: and to clarify, there will yes, always be people that want no risk at all to what they do in their gameplay, but I think you will find as creators that the vast majority isn't like that, or at least that's my continual impression on this matter on the forum and with others I've talked to.
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The problem with laws and similar constructs is that sometimes they have to be vague in order to cover the eventualities (GluttonyFang probably would tear this apart without even breaking a sweat...). In a flexible environment, you just can't draw the line and say 'if you do this and this, it's forbidden, but if you do this and that, it's allowed'. Which is why FD instated a law and a court, and just now has reminded everyone of this fact.
I don't get what point you're trying to make here.
Sure SDC have done some stuff Frontier don't want in game, they've also done some stuff Frontier DO want in game. I'm pretty sure Frontier would admit this.
I don't think Zac's post is targetting SDC specifically, more general behaviour which SDC have recently exhibited.
We've even had SDC members in recent threads saying they don't agree with some of SDCs recent actions then going on to explain SDC is a group of individuals.
I also think I'd say the folks who carried out these actions were well aware it would generate negative publicity - that was the bloomin' point!
To turn round and then complain about the negative publicity, just seems a bit..... eh?
Well let's just say I don't get where you're coming from.
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1: please don't colour your text makes viewing on certain themes tricky, specifically elite's default one
2: Frontier is not changing anything, they are clarifying what is already there, they haven't changed the wording or anything, they are making it clear, because apparently to some people it was unclear....
There was made a 'stink' over it as you call it, because it was a deplorable action, and SDC has exactly the same tools available to them, the tools the game is based around to fight back against those attacking their/your faction, the background simulation, now if you don't want to use those tools, which are part of the game you are playing, that is no one elses fault or choice but yours.
3: SDC are not the first nor unique in the actions done, your group simply did something that made the kettle boil over, on matters that already exist and are an issue, heck there's several threads about the consequences of griefers in open, namely people seeing less people in it, especially those that want to find pvp targets for piracy, so yeah....it is an issue that's been ongoing, but SDC became the last straw.
4: SDC is build around fun, cool, but then I would think that you would know that when that fun is one-sided that is a potential problem?, in general if one party is having fun at the expense of another, that party will eventually have to find ways of having fun alone? and it isn't even that hard to create good interactions and fun for everyone, and no it doesn't need to be care bear or such as gets thrown around not one bit, there just needs to be 'more' to it then, interdict boom, interdict boom.
Edit: and to clarify, there will yes, always be people that want no risk at all to what they do in their gameplay, but I think you will find as creators that the vast majority isn't like that, or at least that's my continual impression on this matter on the forum and with others I've talked to.
[h=3]Can I get an amen? AMEN![/h]
You can't possibly believe that this thread isn't 100% about SDC. He literally went through the last 3 big things we've done lol.
there's no main difference according to original post, it's just harassment, it doesnt say "well this one is worse so it's their fault"
Also FD doesnt ban combat loggers, there is a known station rammer and noob killer at stations that continuously combat logs when he gets close to dying and every CG i still see him.
also on your response to chance, we die a lot, and have rebuys in the 100s of millions per month
You're making it WAY TOO EASY for me. This is the exact same argument against combat logging! You have the EXACT SAME tools to use to run away/fight back but instead people go around and promote combat logging because they were "being griefed". Also, it's not about the actual in game targeting of our faction it's the fact that they are allowed to target our faction on the forums BY NAME.
Sure fine. But OP doesn't actually mention SDC it talks about behaviour.
If you want to make it all about SDC again then that's cool.
But it seems totally bizarre on one hand you'd do that while on the other you'd complain about getting bad publicity.
I mean one or the other right? Which is it?
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