Surely its time to drop base game customers

If people aren't willing to spend £8 on Horizons, why give it away for free? .. It seems that everyone thinks that keeping the base game updated is somehow hard for FD to do. If the likely updates are what people are expecting (Legs and Atmos, based on being on the road map from the start) it's easy to lock people out of that content.

The likely (IMO) course of action is to bundle Horizons/Beyond into whatever the NEXT paid DLC is. That way they can have only 2 versions of the game (Base and updated)
 
You are female, so when has there ever been a prerequisite to actually be right?

Right now, I'm just a ball of pain, trying to avoid light and noise and filling myself up with anti-migraine meds. Once it finally clears, I plan to get some of the sleep I missed out on last night.
At this point, being right is a luxury I can't afford to concern myself with.
 
  • Like (+1)
Reactions: ilo
Realistically players not bought into horizons are freeloading.

And how would you justify that? Frontier sold access to an MMO with no recurring payments, so clearly they were okay with people "freeloading" by only paying once if they weren't interested in further expansions. For a game that was clearly advertised as a long term project, cutting access to your customers just 3 years after release for no good reason would be pretty bad PR.

Of course one could imagine Frontier giving away Horizons for free to existing players and including it in future purchases of the game game for the sake of having to update just one version of the game and to keep their product lineup clear and simple.
 
I know there was something about Horizons that kept Mac players from playing it, but I don't recall what it was.

That said though, just like Mac occupies the #2 OS position, ahead of Linux, I have to wonder what percentage of the player base is Mac-based. I'm guessing 2.8%.

Correct me if I am wrong but the problem with the Mac is the incompatible native graphics software. As far as I recall, it's not that FDev don't want to support the Mac but they can't, or it's way too much development effort for little reward.

Something like that...
 
Realistically players not bought into horizons are freeloading.
Why do you call players who bought and perhaps even backed (some up to £5,000) the game "freeloaders"?

its time to drop support for base game sans horizons

In the case of backers: they payed for a game which could be played offline, after dropping offline mode you now ask FDEV to drop online mode too?

So basically you encourage rent-seeking by FDEV (except to those who have a LEP).
 
Last edited:
It seems that everyone thinks that keeping the base game updated is somehow hard for FD to do. If the likely updates are what people are expecting (Legs and Atmos, based on being on the road map from the start) it's easy to lock people out of that content.

The problem isn't keeping the base-game updated.
The problem is ensuring that owners of the base-game don't accidentally get screwed over.

We've already had minor examples of this where, for example, there's been CGs that are supposed to be open to everybody but which require things that can only be found on planet surfaces and (unless I'm mistaken) non-Horizons players can still meet up with Thargoids but they don't have the same access to AX anf Guardian tech that Horizons players do.
And, of course, at it's most basic, a base-game player (with no access to engineers) can still get attacked by fully engineered opponents.

The simplest solution is to ensure that all expansions are "exclusive" (in the sense that they're all completely separate from each other) but that means each expansion is likely to be rather narrow in scope, which is a shame because it means FDev will never be able to create an iteration of the game that showcases all the expanded content.

For example, we already have Horizons.
Let's say FDev (by some miracle) manage to add atmo' landings and space-legs.
If they want to avoid forcing players to purchase all 3 expansions, they won't be able to create any space-legs content that takes place on planet surfaces and they won't be able to create any surface content that requires space-legs.

That means, you're never going to get the "full experience" of dropping out of orbit, flying to a city and getting out of your spaceship and walking around to complete some objective.

Course, with 3 or 4 years left before FDev can ED, they're probably just thinking in terms of 3 or 4 minor paid-expansions and that's your lot.
 

Achilles7

Banned
Why do you call players who bought and perhaps even backed (some up to £5,000) the game "freeloaders"?

[haha] Are you joking?! To whom is that implied scenario relevant?

Ahem - let's recap then; those devoted, Elite-obsessed backers currently own the base game only...errrr because the aforementioned ~£5k outlay caused them to file for bankruptcy & they couldn't afford the £30 for Horizons?! What a bummer...worst investment decision evaaaar!
 
They won't do anything with the base game for the for seeable future is my guess. Any and all new expansions sold will include all the previous ones rolled into it. Thereby only needing to maintain the base game and the game with all the expansions. This is a smart move because they can sell the base game at a cheap rate, and then if the person who picks it up and likes it will buy the latest expansion and pick up all the ones that came before it. Good marketing ploy, and no reason to change it unless some future release makes it impossible for the base game to be playable. One other very valid reason, to give it away now, after maybe someone just bought it on that Black Friday sale, may cause people to get upset and demand a refund that will cost more to process then the sale price. They won't risk that. Also imagine the boards lighting up. I paid a fortune for Horizons (2 years ago), and now you gave it away for free.... I can see it now.
.
Calebe
 
Simply put if we are dropping mac customers when 3.3 / chapter 4 (covering both nomnecultures) then its time to drop support for base game sans horizons. Horizons has been on sale for £8 during the black friday sales, and its been on the market for three years. Realistically players not bought into horizons are freeloading.

This is a troll post right?

Why would anyone suggest dropping support for the base game other than to create some aggravation in the forum.
 
I'm mostly serious about dropping the base game, It was launched four years ago, and was meant for the purchase price to encompass a year long "season". Then the "Dangerous" season was followed by "Horizons" which was meant to be another year long season but due to development difficulties this over ran by nearly a year. Then we have had a free season with "Beyond", but even though the base game is now two seasons old, and three years outdated, its still receiving developer attention drawing developer resources that could otherwise have been put onto some of the big "but it will be so difficult" features like Atmospheric Landings of Legs.

Let me put it another way, would it be fair if base game players continued getting free content upgrades from the next season pass? Or worse, should the next seasons content be divided into base game and horizons branches? This would mean that players with Horizons + [Next Season] wouldn't be getting 100% value for money as there would have to be compromises made to accommodate those who are for various reasons are unable to, chose not to, or simply refuse to, buy the patches the rest of us have bought that are required to keep their client up to date.
 
I'm mostly serious about dropping the base game, It was launched four years ago, and was meant for the purchase price to encompass a year long "season". Then the "Dangerous" season was followed by "Horizons" which was meant to be another year long season but due to development difficulties this over ran by nearly a year. Then we have had a free season with "Beyond", but even though the base game is now two seasons old, and three years outdated, its still receiving developer attention drawing developer resources that could otherwise have been put onto some of the big "but it will be so difficult" features like Atmospheric Landings of Legs.

Let me put it another way, would it be fair if base game players continued getting free content upgrades from the next season pass? Or worse, should the next seasons content be divided into base game and horizons branches? This would mean that players with Horizons + [Next Season] wouldn't be getting 100% value for money as there would have to be compromises made to accommodate those who are for various reasons are unable to, chose not to, or simply refuse to, buy the patches the rest of us have bought that are required to keep their client up to date.

Utter rubbish.

When I bought horizons, nowhere did it say that I was buying a year long license, which is what you are implying.

Same applies to those with the base game only.
 
They should have a build support schedule that keeps up to one season behind fully supported (and legacy Seasons would no longer be sold), and when that expires, everyone is upgraded to the next Season for free.

The incentive for people to buy the most recent Season when they already have a past product would be to have access to new features and content a year or more before it became a free upgrade.

Realistically players not bought into horizons are freeloading.

They are playing the version of game they licensed.

If Frontier wants to give out free Horizons upgrades, that'd be great, but dropping support of the base game in favor of a paid expansion wouldn't sit well with me.

And for the record, I'm a LEP holder who has been playing Horizons since it was in Beta.

However, what of 32bit players who for whatever reason can't upgrade? Do we abandon them?
What next? Abandon non-VR players?

Not equivalent at all.

It's one thing to cease development of an extreme minority platform (you need a CPU more than ten years old at this point to not have x86-64 capability) and quite another to push a minority feature that need not be exclusive (VR is stereoscopic vision and head tracking, and there is nothing in ED that is not workable without these).

I think the Demo (i.e. Single Player Combat Training) is still 32bit - I have not fired up my really old 32bit PC since the main game dropped it so can't confirm.

It's a throwback to the pre Horizon builds. Quite interesting to be able to play some of those old scenarios.

Also, you can confirm simply by running it and looking at the executable in task manager.
 
I'm mostly serious about dropping the base game, .......

I'm mostly serious about calling you out for trolling.

I mean nobody in their right mind is going to say OK you bought that car 4 years ago now you are not allowed to get into it ever again. It is just stupid to say that people in the base game only can't play their game any more.

It isn't as if it is actually a separate game anyway, everything in the base game will still be there so your idiotic idea is just trolling to my mind.


(Strike-out only because I don't really want an infraction, doesn't stop it being true. ;) )
 

sollisb

Banned
Simply put if we are dropping mac customers when 3.3 / chapter 4 (covering both nomnecultures) then its time to drop support for base game sans horizons. Horizons has been on sale for £8 during the black friday sales, and its been on the market for three years. Realistically players not bought into horizons are freeloading.


You don't know much about commercial law do you?

In the commercial environment in which you dwell, how long exactly do the games companies support the product they sold the client for ? 3 months? 6? 9?

Again, how exactly, are players freeloading, when they paid, you know money.. For the game?

I'm sorry, but I find the theory as postulated, complete nonsense.
 
To be serious momentarily, I think at this point they may as well offer a free update so they don't have to bother about differing versions.Those still playing will probably purchase something from the shop in gratitude, or dormant customers who return may do the same if they feel well treated.

I suspect at least a subset of hangers-on are hoping for this exact thing.
 
Simply put if we are dropping mac customers when 3.3 / chapter 4 (covering both nomnecultures) then its time to drop support for base game sans horizons. Horizons has been on sale for £8 during the black friday sales, and its been on the market for three years. Realistically players not bought into horizons are freeloading.

Surely it's time for you to stop posting ridiculous non sequiturs. Your off-handed deprecation of an entire segment of players is self-entitled and repulsive.
 
[haha] Op, I really hope you're trolling!

I couldn't care less if someone paid 8p, never mind £8 for their copy of the game, they paid into a game I'm lucky enough to still play. They're hardly 'freeloading', they've been locked out of a ton of content, some of it literally game changing- AX weapons, engineering, visiting some of the coolest finds in the game , like Jameson's crash site, the list goes on.

I'm extremely grateful they decided to make that purchase and I hope they're enjoying the product as much as I am. If they decide to throw down some additional coin to unlock Horizons and what follows then great, I wish them well. If they decide that the base game is sufficient for their gaming needs then I'm happy to support that decision, too.

I really can't see how any of that impacts the way you play in any way, shape or form.

What on Earth gave you the idea to type up that OP?
 
The only way to 'drop base game customers' is to offer a free upgrade to Horizons. I'd personally be fine with that, and I paid E50 for it. But you cant just kick out paying customers because they refuse to give you more money than they need, that is borderline criminal.

The problem isn't keeping the base-game updated.
The problem is ensuring that owners of the base-game don't accidentally get screwed over.

We've already had minor examples of this where, for example, there's been CGs that are supposed to be open to everybody but which require things that can only be found on planet surfaces and (unless I'm mistaken) non-Horizons players can still meet up with Thargoids but they don't have the same access to AX anf Guardian tech that Horizons players do.
And, of course, at it's most basic, a base-game player (with no access to engineers) can still get attacked by fully engineered opponents.

The simplest solution is to ensure that all expansions are "exclusive" (in the sense that they're all completely separate from each other) but that means each expansion is likely to be rather narrow in scope, which is a shame because it means FDev will never be able to create an iteration of the game that showcases all the expanded content.

For example, we already have Horizons.
Let's say FDev (by some miracle) manage to add atmo' landings and space-legs.
If they want to avoid forcing players to purchase all 3 expansions, they won't be able to create any space-legs content that takes place on planet surfaces and they won't be able to create any surface content that requires space-legs.

That means, you're never going to get the "full experience" of dropping out of orbit, flying to a city and getting out of your spaceship and walking around to complete some objective.

Course, with 3 or 4 years left before FDev can ED, they're probably just thinking in terms of 3 or 4 minor paid-expansions and that's your lot.

You can go for stacked expansions: you cant buy the 'ELW' expansion before buying the 'atmo planets' expansion.
 
FDev is not going to do something that will ultimately decrease revenue. Apple support was costing the company profit, non-Horizons players still earn profits for FDev.
 
Back
Top Bottom