We should clear all the Alerts, it's not as bad as last week when we had Njorog.
Thargoid invasion - Next target systems?
- Thread starter Aleks Zuno
- Start date
If it continues at ~12% per day with the weekend covering for the gap, it could work, but leave little margin for finishing any stragglers in case sampling estimates were off slightly. Which can likely be covered for in advance, if doubt persists, so…
Still no cause for concern here yet, I would say.
Peripheral progress has definitely changed again, and it is getting quite disheartening now—making plans and using the time of others then having the feasibility change in ways which would have modified the plan or abandoned the idea.
2222 rescues gave barely a percent, at which point the entire peripheral progress system only works if everyone stops whatever they think they were going to achieve elsewhere and attacks the Maelstrom which is actually at its final stage and has everything prepared! I cannot tell any Commander to do that though, only show what is occurring—
Peripheries at 08:00 17th November 3309:
Seven systems with 13.3% — Taranis 5–11 Ly, 1 matrix + 3 inhabited, 9620–101.6k strength
Six systems with 6% — Indra 19–21 Ly, 3 inhabited, 1204–4300 strength
Five systems with 2% — Thor 18–19 Ly, 1 inhabited, 1463–6893 strength
Ten systems with 2% — Raijin 23–27 Ly, 1 matrix + 3 inhabited, 392–2643 strength
Aside from the obviously close distance capturing all remaining systems, that strength is a measure of what each percent is worth; 1% at M. Taranis is worth over twenty times more than 1% anywhere else with activity visible¹! Approximately half of that activity is occurring away from where it has a worthwhile effect, noting that every reduction of said effect restricts further the threshold for being worthwhile.
With respect to those at M. Indra, I look at those strengths and consider how much easier it would be if we just clear it all away normally. I could not ask for that, though; the response would be to question why is the apparent price of congregating everyone a weekly strike at M. Indra, and that we should not engage with that over clearing the now-disjoint sections of M. Leigong.
I was using 384 cargo for the rescue vessel, but I will change it to be the SNPX special 512 cargo and do what I can!
1. Including other Maelstroms, M. Leigong and M. Oya then compete of course!
Acknowledging that the day (as defined by 07:00) was not quite complete at the time, if it were 8% then I would be discussing a transfer away of all of our M. Taranis payloads!
Something I forgot to mention earlier—without having checked, Col 285 Sector PM-B b14-0 likely is one of the strongest ever empty Alerts, and along with HIP 29226 upcoming in probably two weeks they form a quite heavy surface which cannot really be weakened without making it worse longer-term. While everything would be smoother at present if it can be stopped, I would not want to ask for it or expect it necessarily!
As a bridge pair they ought to be nicer than the attacks which were occurring before, and definitely nicer than if we had left Col 285 Sector VN-Z b14-0 to become Control again.
2222 rescues gave barely a percent, at which point the entire peripheral progress system only works if everyone stops whatever they think they were going to achieve elsewhere and attacks the Maelstrom which is actually at its final stage and has everything prepared! I cannot tell any Commander to do that though, only show what is occurring—
Peripheries at 08:00 17th November 3309:
Seven systems with 13.3% — Taranis 5–11 Ly, 1 matrix + 3 inhabited, 9620–101.6k strength
Six systems with 6% — Indra 19–21 Ly, 3 inhabited, 1204–4300 strength
Five systems with 2% — Thor 18–19 Ly, 1 inhabited, 1463–6893 strength
Ten systems with 2% — Raijin 23–27 Ly, 1 matrix + 3 inhabited, 392–2643 strength
Aside from the obviously close distance capturing all remaining systems, that strength is a measure of what each percent is worth; 1% at M. Taranis is worth over twenty times more than 1% anywhere else with activity visible¹! Approximately half of that activity is occurring away from where it has a worthwhile effect, noting that every reduction of said effect restricts further the threshold for being worthwhile.
With respect to those at M. Indra, I look at those strengths and consider how much easier it would be if we just clear it all away normally. I could not ask for that, though; the response would be to question why is the apparent price of congregating everyone a weekly strike at M. Indra, and that we should not engage with that over clearing the now-disjoint sections of M. Leigong.
I was using 384 cargo for the rescue vessel, but I will change it to be the SNPX special 512 cargo and do what I can!
1. Including other Maelstroms, M. Leigong and M. Oya then compete of course!
Acknowledging that the day (as defined by 07:00) was not quite complete at the time, if it were 8% then I would be discussing a transfer away of all of our M. Taranis payloads!
Something I forgot to mention earlier—without having checked, Col 285 Sector PM-B b14-0 likely is one of the strongest ever empty Alerts, and along with HIP 29226 upcoming in probably two weeks they form a quite heavy surface which cannot really be weakened without making it worse longer-term. While everything would be smoother at present if it can be stopped, I would not want to ask for it or expect it necessarily!
As a bridge pair they ought to be nicer than the attacks which were occurring before, and definitely nicer than if we had left Col 285 Sector VN-Z b14-0 to become Control again.
A fair amount of the progress might well be put down to "people are having fun with the new spire activity wherever it may be" rather than any coordinated attempts - other than Taranis and Indra, no-one else was seeming to be aiming to do it for its strategic value last week. It may well be that Indra also counts for a lot of that - it's fairly central, has readily accessible spires (if slightly less so than it had last week), and so on.
(Put another way: how much did Indra's spires end up overkilled last week? There's not necessarily much actual gain of extra people for Taranis even if Indra's periphery was completed by conventional means as a "price")
At the time of posting, yes. It was at around about 11-12% when I checked around ~8 AM(CET, locally).
And a progressive increase in difficulty as spire sites requiring defense around a Titan diminish in number could well be intended. Consolidation of forces and all that.
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I would say that whoever is evidently hanging around in Hupang and HR 1737 could be getting more out of their efforts by doing that same activity (providing it is killing Thargoids) at the remaining spire. I mean, what’s 2/3% in each for those systems worth relative to the spire? (How much would it have progressed if that effort took place in HIP 25654)
Tricky one - the problem with assessing this is that under most scenarios, their actions there are literally worthless towards the plan being considered here, regardless of the method being used or how easy it is for them, because of how the spire cap interacts with everything else, and because the samples to finish off the remaining 15% are already largely collected. So we can assume that they're just doing their own thing for other reasons.
The only case in which pre-85% progress would be useful in those systems I can think of is:
- the spires aren't going to reach 85% by the end of the week (or will get there too close to the end to risk delivery of the stored samples)
- but with the added boost, both Hupang and HR 1737 will get there in time to do a delivery
and one of
- there's also a similar boost to push the two Hyades Sector ones next to Hupang to 85%
- the above situation is realised quickly enough that some additional sampling is done to achieve the shortfall on those two as well
- it's decided that guaranteeing clearing Hupang and HR 1737 is worth wasting the (intermingled) Hyades Sector samples already collected
...as at least the first two would allow trimming Taranis down to just the Swahku/Spire cluster, which can only place 1 Alert/week on average so most of the time pressure goes away.
In terms of general efficiency where that consideration doesn't apply, I don't know if we have good data on the conversion rates for control systems. Using Cmdr Carpets' data for Alerts, a typical interceptor kill is worth about 1/4 sample, and an Orthrus kill is worth about 4 samples. Those systems are (very approximately) 70000 samples each to complete, so 17500 Orthrus kills (which would probably only generate about 15% progress acrosss all systems) is actually a reasonable trade ... but I'm not sure how easy it is to find Orthrus in Control systems. If the choice is between killing Orthrus at the spire or killing other targets at Hupang, the spire is probably by far the most effective at this stage.
I’m not sure they exist in controls, or anywhere outside of alerts, at all.
And I merely thought that effort in Hupang and HR would be much better placed at the spire site, because - as you mentioned - any of that pre-85% progress is kind of wasted on them. Yet, if it is a (certain level of) uncoordinated action*, there’s not much to be done about it.
*A certain level because I’m not that sure it is an entirely random effort to make visible progress on two inhabited controls within the 10 ly distance to a Titan.
Already calculated, as the closest ever unpop to a Titan I wanted to know exactly what would clear it so I measured it first thing yesterday;
Col 285 Sector PM-B b14-0 - 12.11 Ly - 3388 samples.
Some other updated figures for Populated Alerts;
Scythia - 20.23 Ly - 2169 samples.
Col 285 Sector KM-V d2-69 - 23.67 LY - 1995 samples.
Indeed the Hupang system and its two little friends ought not survive this week if possible! For at least one pleasing thought, I just considered what extra it would require to clear them from 80% rather than 85%, and concluded that it would be a very close match with running Titan rescues to obtain that same amount.
If one includes the effect on Swahku and HR 1737 it makes the Titan rescues a clear winner—but only at M. Taranis of course! Almost everywhere else, the correct option is to do a bit of reaping of our own instead.
That is a quite interesting question, and I am not quite sure how to interpret the activity information! We had:
Thank you ever so much for the swift attention! By chance the lower Alerts amount this week ought to offset that a bit, and after M. Taranis it will be our foremost mission to do that more deliberately, even if it means clearing M. Leigong down to its two Matrix systems and nothing else.
If one includes the effect on Swahku and HR 1737 it makes the Titan rescues a clear winner—but only at M. Taranis of course! Almost everywhere else, the correct option is to do a bit of reaping of our own instead.
That is a quite interesting question, and I am not quite sure how to interpret the activity information! We had:
- M. Taranis started the week just above 50% and ended at 144%, a 94% gain.
- M. Indra had one surplus Matrix system which reached 148%, but ultimately three started anew and gained 118%.
Thank you ever so much for the swift attention! By chance the lower Alerts amount this week ought to offset that a bit, and after M. Taranis it will be our foremost mission to do that more deliberately, even if it means clearing M. Leigong down to its two Matrix systems and nothing else.
Victories in HIPs 21125 and 9137, Col 285 Sector EA-Q c5-8, Hyadum II and Pegasi Sectors HH-U b3-2, MN-S b4-0 and MN-S b4-2!
Very reassuringly and by a concerted strike for which I am indescribably thankful, M. Taranis pulls ahead! It started around a percent behind one-seventh daily; it is now around a half-percent behind one-sixth daily, which was my admittedly arbitrary level for comfortable completion, but its 2% over a seventh puts it ahead and we need only that to continue!
For anyone catching up at the start of the weekend, said strike is the Spire site at HIP 25654 with on-foot missions from Telin, and supported by Titan rescues from Hyades Sector FB-N b7-6.
Peripheries at 08:20 18th November 3309:
Seven systems with 32.5% — Taranis 5–11 Ly, 1 matrix + 3 inhabited, 7434–78.6k strength
Ten systems with 12% — Raijin 23–27 Ly, 1 matrix + 3 inhabited, 352–2373 strength
Six systems with 12% — Indra 19–21 Ly, 3 inhabited, 1127–3998 strength
Alerts:
Aowicha Alert 54% *54.2% — Oya 24 Ly, 4350 Ls starport, 1760 Ls planet, Peripheral system
HIP 7338 Alert 10% *11.7% — Oya 19 Ly, 2426 Ls outpost, 986 Ls planet, Peripheral system
Luggerates Alert 10% *10.3% — Oya 22 Ly, 14k Ls outpost, 339 Ls planet, Peripheral system
Evictions:
97 i Tauri Control 68% — Indra 21 Ly, 1256 strength, Peripheral system
Lei Hsini Control 64% — Indra 21 Ly, 1421 strength, Peripheral system
Clean-up:
71 Tauri Alert 98% *98.7% — Indra 15 Ly
Col 285 Sector ZE-P c6-15 Alert 98% — Cocijo 18 Ly
Col 285 Sector UN-H b11-3 Alert 98% — Cocijo 19 Ly
Cephei Sector DQ-Y b1 Alert 96% *96.5% — Oya 18 Ly
Trianguli Sector CA-A c22 Alert 64% — Taranis 15 Ly, Peripheral system
Col 285 Sector VS-Z b14-0 Alert 36% — Hadad 19 Ly, Peripheral system
HIP 25654 Matrix 32% *32.5% — Taranis 10 Ly
Continuing a little bit of progressive improvements to the rescue Cutters from a few weeks ago—
Noting that B-rated Collector limpets have much more range than A-rated, and that their shorter life matters less when engaging in a battle with Scythe collectors, what would be the general opinion of switching to B-rated including the 3B Operations multi-limpet rather than the 3C Mining?
This configuration seems to work at least as well, and ought to have fewer cases of limpets chasing a moving Storage capsule and exceeding the range!
Very reassuringly and by a concerted strike for which I am indescribably thankful, M. Taranis pulls ahead! It started around a percent behind one-seventh daily; it is now around a half-percent behind one-sixth daily, which was my admittedly arbitrary level for comfortable completion, but its 2% over a seventh puts it ahead and we need only that to continue!
For anyone catching up at the start of the weekend, said strike is the Spire site at HIP 25654 with on-foot missions from Telin, and supported by Titan rescues from Hyades Sector FB-N b7-6.
Peripheries at 08:20 18th November 3309:
Seven systems with 32.5% — Taranis 5–11 Ly, 1 matrix + 3 inhabited, 7434–78.6k strength
Ten systems with 12% — Raijin 23–27 Ly, 1 matrix + 3 inhabited, 352–2373 strength
Six systems with 12% — Indra 19–21 Ly, 3 inhabited, 1127–3998 strength
Alerts:
Aowicha Alert 54% *54.2% — Oya 24 Ly, 4350 Ls starport, 1760 Ls planet, Peripheral system
HIP 7338 Alert 10% *11.7% — Oya 19 Ly, 2426 Ls outpost, 986 Ls planet, Peripheral system
Luggerates Alert 10% *10.3% — Oya 22 Ly, 14k Ls outpost, 339 Ls planet, Peripheral system
Evictions:
97 i Tauri Control 68% — Indra 21 Ly, 1256 strength, Peripheral system
Lei Hsini Control 64% — Indra 21 Ly, 1421 strength, Peripheral system
Clean-up:
71 Tauri Alert 98% *98.7% — Indra 15 Ly
Col 285 Sector ZE-P c6-15 Alert 98% — Cocijo 18 Ly
Col 285 Sector UN-H b11-3 Alert 98% — Cocijo 19 Ly
Cephei Sector DQ-Y b1 Alert 96% *96.5% — Oya 18 Ly
Trianguli Sector CA-A c22 Alert 64% — Taranis 15 Ly, Peripheral system
Col 285 Sector VS-Z b14-0 Alert 36% — Hadad 19 Ly, Peripheral system
HIP 25654 Matrix 32% *32.5% — Taranis 10 Ly
Continuing a little bit of progressive improvements to the rescue Cutters from a few weeks ago—
Noting that B-rated Collector limpets have much more range than A-rated, and that their shorter life matters less when engaging in a battle with Scythe collectors, what would be the general opinion of switching to B-rated including the 3B Operations multi-limpet rather than the 3C Mining?
This configuration seems to work at least as well, and ought to have fewer cases of limpets chasing a moving Storage capsule and exceeding the range!
Thank you very much for sharing your configuration. I'm going to change those modules and make a test.
I took one mission from Telin to poison the spire site in HIP 25654 and I had two contaminated spire compounds from before, from last week, and I went there (in open mode) and did what was needed and that twice but the mission was not solved . I don't know what the problem is, is it a bug?
Should one particular bin be poisoned, or any?
I did those missions a couple of times last week, just to try, and everything was fine!
The spire missions can be very glitchy in open, e.g. if someone has already poisoned the same part of the spire without the instance being reset. Parts of the spire also don't seem to sync between players, they can see different nerve clusters being active and the state of the console (open/closed/object inserted) can appear differently.
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Thanks for answer, next time I'll do it in solo.
Update - I went there again to collect goods for the next missions, and an hour later, after relog, a message suddenly appeared that the mission was solved.
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Victories in Pegasi Sector JH-U b3-8, 71 Tauri and Col 285 Sectors SS-H b11-5, SM-C b13-0, NG-E b12-4, ZE-P c6-15, UN-H b11-3 and JA-G b11-3!
While it was a bit more gradual than a sudden jump at M. Taranis, indeed that became a very successful 30% in one day, bringing the average well past one-sixth and actually above one-fifth daily! Alongside that, Operation Deleted has now stored payloads for all but that weakest system we are leaving until all others are confirmed complete, which becomes 97% by total amount required. If that rate continues today, some of those payloads will be clear to deliver a bit later!
Thank you most kindly to everyone joining; it means a lot to me that preparing such a novel and important opportunity is met with so much support to realise it, against odds which have become so dramatically more steep.
Peripheries at 08:40 19th November 3309:
Seven systems with 62% — Taranis 5–11 Ly, 1 matrix + 3 inhabited, 4154–43.9k strength
Six systems with 18% — Indra 19–21 Ly, 3 inhabited, 785–3660 strength
Ten systems with 14% — Raijin 23–27 Ly, 1 matrix + 3 inhabited, 344–2319 strength
Alerts:
Aowicha Alert 88% *88.6% — Oya 24 Ly, 4350 Ls starport, 1760 Ls planet
Luggerates Alert 28% *29.1% — Oya 22 Ly, 14k Ls outpost, 339 Ls planet, Peripheral system
HIP 7338 Alert 16% *17.1% — Oya 19 Ly, 2426 Ls outpost, 1660 Ls planet, Peripheral system, Invasion invited
Chinas Alert 14% *15.4% — Raijin 17 Ly, 1760 Ls outpost, 1208 Ls planet
Evictions:
97 i Tauri Control 80% — Indra 21 Ly, 785 strength, Peripheral system
Lei Hsini Control 72% — Indra 21 Ly, 1106 strength, Peripheral system
Clean-up:
Col 285 Sector ZE-P c6-16 Alert 98% *98.6% — Cocijo 19 Ly
Cephei Sector DQ-Y b1 Alert 96% *96.6% — Oya 18 Ly
Trianguli Sector CA-A c22 Alert 84% *85.9% — Taranis 15 Ly
HIP 25654 Matrix 62% *63.9% — Taranis 10 Ly
Col 285 Sector VS-Z b14-0 Alert 40% — Hadad 19 Ly, Peripheral system
79 b Tauri Alert 38% — Indra 19 Ly, Peripheral system
While it was a bit more gradual than a sudden jump at M. Taranis, indeed that became a very successful 30% in one day, bringing the average well past one-sixth and actually above one-fifth daily! Alongside that, Operation Deleted has now stored payloads for all but that weakest system we are leaving until all others are confirmed complete, which becomes 97% by total amount required. If that rate continues today, some of those payloads will be clear to deliver a bit later!
Thank you most kindly to everyone joining; it means a lot to me that preparing such a novel and important opportunity is met with so much support to realise it, against odds which have become so dramatically more steep.
Peripheries at 08:40 19th November 3309:
Seven systems with 62% — Taranis 5–11 Ly, 1 matrix + 3 inhabited, 4154–43.9k strength
Six systems with 18% — Indra 19–21 Ly, 3 inhabited, 785–3660 strength
Ten systems with 14% — Raijin 23–27 Ly, 1 matrix + 3 inhabited, 344–2319 strength
Alerts:
Aowicha Alert 88% *88.6% — Oya 24 Ly, 4350 Ls starport, 1760 Ls planet
Luggerates Alert 28% *29.1% — Oya 22 Ly, 14k Ls outpost, 339 Ls planet, Peripheral system
HIP 7338 Alert 16% *17.1% — Oya 19 Ly, 2426 Ls outpost, 1660 Ls planet, Peripheral system, Invasion invited
Chinas Alert 14% *15.4% — Raijin 17 Ly, 1760 Ls outpost, 1208 Ls planet
Evictions:
97 i Tauri Control 80% — Indra 21 Ly, 785 strength, Peripheral system
Lei Hsini Control 72% — Indra 21 Ly, 1106 strength, Peripheral system
Clean-up:
Col 285 Sector ZE-P c6-16 Alert 98% *98.6% — Cocijo 19 Ly
Cephei Sector DQ-Y b1 Alert 96% *96.6% — Oya 18 Ly
Trianguli Sector CA-A c22 Alert 84% *85.9% — Taranis 15 Ly
HIP 25654 Matrix 62% *63.9% — Taranis 10 Ly
Col 285 Sector VS-Z b14-0 Alert 40% — Hadad 19 Ly, Peripheral system
79 b Tauri Alert 38% — Indra 19 Ly, Peripheral system
For SNPX, I can say that we have always focussed primarily on Oya. But we are now in a phase of the war where we are perhaps seeing the beginning of the end (with a lot of hope in our thoughts). However, we can only achieve this together and must join forces and coordinate our efforts.
Your work and that of many others here in the forum contributes to this in an impressive way and makes the hopeful success of Taranis possible in the first place.
Speaking personally, it is not only a matter of course for me to help with Taranis, it is an honour to do so!
@Aleks Zuno: The B-Limpet version of the cutter turns out to be very useful, thanks again for that.
I experimented a bit with module prioritisation in my version (prerequisite: weapons are not automatically activated when the fire button is triggered). As soon as I switch off the weapons on the Titan, all modules that are not needed switch off, which is good for the temperature of the ship.
Your work and that of many others here in the forum contributes to this in an impressive way and makes the hopeful success of Taranis possible in the first place.
Speaking personally, it is not only a matter of course for me to help with Taranis, it is an honour to do so!
@Aleks Zuno: The B-Limpet version of the cutter turns out to be very useful, thanks again for that.
I experimented a bit with module prioritisation in my version (prerequisite: weapons are not automatically activated when the fire button is triggered). As soon as I switch off the weapons on the Titan, all modules that are not needed switch off, which is good for the temperature of the ship.
Alright, looks like it's only Hyades Sector BV-O b6-2 that needs samples to be collected, and only 1700 at that?
If that's the case, I'll put the buy order up on my carrier, LLV Negotiator, and park it in a nearby system before I start running collections myself.
Sell samples for Hyades Sector BV-O b6-2 to
Carrier: LLV Negotiator (V1J-L0K)
Parked in: Hyades Sector QN-T c3-13
Currently held: 0
If that's the case, I'll put the buy order up on my carrier, LLV Negotiator, and park it in a nearby system before I start running collections myself.
Sell samples for Hyades Sector BV-O b6-2 to
Carrier: LLV Negotiator (V1J-L0K)
Parked in: Hyades Sector QN-T c3-13
Currently held: 0
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Wonderful; thank you, and indeed also for Hyades Sector FB-N b7-0 earlier—added that new order to Operation Deleted! I was leaving that harvest until some of ours are delivered and we have more Carrier space, but this ought to be perfect. Remembering to deliver it after everything else shows cleared, you can expect that order to be complete this evening!